Look for people in general to PvP with... wouldn't that essentially be the same thing as solo queueing?

Translation: I don't want to do the work because then I'd have to get gear at 50, and that's no fun. Here, I can max my gear at 49, have a ridiculous amount of HP and power, and go back to squashing level 10s without any challenge. And if anyone complains about what I'm doing, I'll just tell them "get to level 49 or stop playing."

Melee knockdown works if you are specced for it in tank. A knockback's usability is not limited to the distance it launches people. I use it a lot of the time to break up crowds and interrupt spellcasting. It is possible to do a combination of pull, stun, knockback to send the person where you need them to go if you really need them to go get pushed off that badly. The post after mine points out something I missed to refute: Whitebar = nothing works on them except warrior roots. And just like PvE, there is at least one cookie cutter spec that you have to go if you want to be successful. Going full DPS spec seems silly to me as you are playing in a game where you are going to get attacked and you have the weakest armor available. Essentially, if you are not as or more equipped than a scoundrel/op you will just be their handicapped cousin. You also have a stance that turns that into the equivalent of heavy armor. Being a tank spec does not limit you to just damage reduction as you can tell you have a couple of major DPS boosts in the tank tree like permanent regen increase and shock procs.

http://bit.ly/zYEgPh

People don't want to play over a week of games to get a chance to get gear. So as long as people are killing each other, everything's okay. Evidently, if this was such a big PvP problem, another group of 50s in protest could go to Ilum and attack one of the two colluding teams to troll the other one.

I'm trying to reconcile removing a debuff just so people can get topped more quickly versus everyone's ability to use control and mitigation to win battles. I see games all the time where healers go uninterrupted. You're giving people too much credit for being able to focus healers because just as often as it does happen, it doesn't, and it's what makes a small team defeat a larger one.

I get so much hate in Huttball because of the very high utility of this class when properly specced into tank & madness. Enemy just recovered the ball on their half and is making a trip back to center. Grip them into a pyre and stunlock them. Get ball back and sprint without opposition to the goal. I'm about to get stunned or gripped or knocked back at what would be a very inopportune moment for me. Cloak of Skill Fire. Rooted. Force Speed (with tank talent) Knockback is down but enemy is just standing on the edge of a platform. Spike out of combat boots them off almost comedically. These are just a few examples of all the bastardly things you can get away with as a Shadow/Assassin. And any time I hear complaints about sorcerers or missile spam I imagine that these people are either specced incorrectly or they do not have the gear for the firepower.

Come on, guys! If we try a little harder, we can come back from this 5 point game with 5 minutes left! All we have to do is- [[YOU ARE DEAD]] (Release to the closest medcenter) Yes, any narrowly losing game easily gets flipped. I have to do it all the time. I just hate joining games that're already lost because our team was full of bads or they had a premade. Get rid of those two things and I won't care if deserter's added.

And sadly, BioWare or any other company will always side with them because of one reason that trumps them all, "$15 a month, bro."

BioWare does not negotiate with terrorists.

When I see a guy drop down into the pit, I (and hopefully any other player who's done this map over a hundred times) think: That guy is going to attempt to pass to a buddy of his. I better knock the receiver off the catwalks or kill the carrier in a stunlock right now. So if you're well experienced on this map and you still have trouble... it's not the game's fault.

In the context of any other game: Wild west environment where all your problems are solved through sending the enemy to the graveyard. In the context of this game: To grief lowbies. That's about it.

Feral druids are better at bursting people down with DoTs and ridiculous backstabbing in a stun since Cataclysm.

Why can't you get champion gear, too?

Whenever I grip the enemy ball carrier into fire or our spawn.

You could say the exact same thing with the title "The effects of the roll back are already starting to show." You'd just be saying it a day later.

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#200bIMokrskZZf0cRrMz.1 The most utility you're ever going to get out of that class is right here.

You know what the game you will be going back to has, though? Gold! GOLD! PRECIOUS GOLD!

You're thinking of the Sage's move. He's talking about the Shadow tank's Force Pull. In rateds, it would be a good idea to have it score when they break the plane of the goalline as it just seems ridiculous to have that kind of work nullified. In PUGs right now... my team might be incredibly stupid and I might have to carry them which means doing whatever it takes to get a win. If that means being cheap and pulling an unsuspecting carrier, so be it. I wouldn't be surprised that if in both game types they disabled stealthing in the protected spawn area, though. Nobody can foresee something like that nor can they counter it as people in stealth can't get the ball.

Survivability only counts if a shield or a defense occurs in that knockdown which it never seems like it does. Utility is nullified as you can't pop a tanking CD if caught by surprise.

I'm well aware that there's another class that has stealth and very high utility as far as control goes. I'm agreeing that operatives are definitely going to need a boost after this, but there has to be an alternative that's better than killing people in very little time (which nullifies all that utility) by yourself just because the moment was opportune. I just think it's rather silly to ask a question like that since nothing really changes in relation to running a Huttball. You will still be providing a distraction for the person you are attacking during plays, whether or not you do kill them before it's too late for them to do anything to your carrier.

What were they doing before that got the ball from point A to point B that nobody else could do?

There's something in this game called Crowd Control. You should look into it.

I got trolled here. I thought the title question was actually a serious one, then I realized that none of the nerfs going on correspond with anything else besides their opening burst. Not their out-of-stealth CCs, not their offensive/defensive CDs, and not their mobility. But I guess it was a useful red herring to try to make it sound like operatives and scoundrels are being told to sit in the corner by the BioWare dev team and were told, "Sit here and don't do anything until we figure out what to do with you." And their fear is that will take several months.

That's one of the major banes of the PTR right now is they are not allowing that yet and it's pretty clear how imperative that is after seeing the failed revamp of Ilum slip through the cracks. On the current subject, I still wonder how people can look at the patch notes and not see clearly what the reasoning for the nerf was: And I laugh when people claim that BioWare doesn't have their own internal systems of running numbers and tracking everything or that their dev team got lazy and just read the first page of the forums. At the same time, we kept hearing the echo of their plan that they did not want these battles to be decided in an extremely short amount of time. There is a valid concern coming up, though, on the class' usability after this next patch. I'm sure they'll add something in but unfortunately it might not be soon enough... or maybe it will be with their responsiveness track record. It's just a safer move right now to keep people from mass departing before people rerolled just to have an easier time killing everyone else.