MaceTowani Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Warhammer had phenomenal reviews when it released. Look it up. All 4's and 4.5's out of 5 stars, 8.9 metacritic after its first month. So did LoTRO. Hell, even AoC had high scores. Reviewes always love the first 20 levels of an MMO, because that's where developers put the most attention. Reviews mean almost nothing. You're right, 1.5 million subs in less than a month mean so much more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samy_Merchi Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Well, sales, not subs, but still a big number. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunryu Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Forget it, this game is sooooooooooo new and inovating OMG the story is is so amazing there is just nothing wrong with this game at all! Damn people who see nothing wrong with the game are going to be it's downfall just like every other MMO that has come out lately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GalaxyDude Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 KOTOR-Online is what I longed for, therefore: /thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tikigit Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) I must admit I didn't read the OP after they started off by saying the objective is to 'beat WoW'... that is never the objective for a commercial project.... any producer who decides their goal is to "Beat WoW" is likely going to be replaced very quickly before the game even sees the light of day. The objective is to make the publishers money, and keep the developers in jobs, and to sustain that for as long as it remains profitable within acceptable limits. But to answer the much shorter title question... for me yes, story is what I want from a MMO. To me a MMO typically isn't a online Epeen gallery, nor a micro-community guildies-only social experience... it's a opportunity to connect to a persistent online world and experience stories, be they developer made, community made or just internal narratives I add to repeatable tasks. Sometimes I like to have a single person story experience but with other players around me having their own experiences at the same time. Other times I like to socialise with a group of players and make larger scaled adventures in that we're not just "Killing Z3-X7 because the mission log tells me too", but because that damn droid is at the forefront of a noble families defence network and taking it down is all part of taking down the family stronghold. Stories be they personal ones or wider scoped pre-defined ones set out by the game to me are at the core of MMOs, even for those that aren't interested in role playing or immersion and just want to be the biggest badarse in the land with their 'epix lewt'. Edited January 2, 2012 by Tikigit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mannic Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) Yes, people will leave, lets say a milion leave, thats alot, right? Going on the figures by Crowley that would leave this game at nearly 1.5 milion players...If you think that anyone will laugh at that well..ok then. Crowley said it would have 1.5 million subs for its first 6 months. It almost sounded like he was taking that for granted (always dangerous, since NO other MMO besides WoW has maintained even 1 million subs for more than a month or two.) At this point its pretty clear TOR doesn't even have 1.5 million UNIT SALES, much less will it retain 1.5 million subscribers after 1/20. Crowley's projections are wrong. The game is not nearly as popular at this point as many (including myself, in fact) expected it to be at this point. Even I thought 2 million unit sales in the first week was a virtual guarantee--espcially given the supposedly "record breaking" number of preorders. I never bought the 3 million or 4 million number that fanboys kept throwing out there, but I thought 2 million for sure just based on the number of Bioware and Star Wars fans out there. To this point the only number we've heard from Bioware is "over 1 million." That's not a great sign, IMO. I'd be happier to hear "nearly 2 million," or "over 1.5 million," not the same "over 1 million" number two different times. What is "over 1 million," anyway? 1.2 million? Because that's Warhammer numbers right there. Edited January 2, 2012 by Mannic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myrmedus Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) Forget it, this game is sooooooooooo new and inovating OMG the story is is so amazing there is just nothing wrong with this game at all! Damn people who see nothing wrong with the game are going to be it's downfall just like every other MMO that has come out lately. Here we go, now we'll try to play the hyperbole or exaggeration card and hope that works. Look, the reason I laid into you originally was because of the way you phrased your post. I don't think anyone here in their right mind is saying that this game is faultless because it's not, but then again I think most reasonable people were completely prepared for that since it's only 2 weeks since it launched. However, when it comes to story trying to knock this game is insane. It is, at the moment, the pinnacle of marrying story and MMO together and it's still incredibly young which means it'll only get better. Now, it has some weak points in its internal mechanics such as ability activation delays and class balance (I can solo equal level 4-player heroic and group quests on my Sith Sorcerer for example). Additionally, the ability to skip the entire cutscene of any quest dialogue is missing (which, while I personally am not bothered about since I enjoy story, I can understand if others want if they're repeating the same Q 10-15 times), but these are minor things. At the moment it's simply impossible to tell if the game is great or not...it's just too young. All we can say is that it's promising! Edited January 2, 2012 by Myrmedus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaceTowani Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Forget it, this game is sooooooooooo new and inovating OMG the story is is so amazing there is just nothing wrong with this game at all! Damn people who see nothing wrong with the game are going to be it's downfall just like every other MMO that has come out lately. People who see EVERYTHING wrong with the game are the REAL problems. Just play the damn game and enjoy yourself, whatever problems you come across report them and go on your merry way. Also, remember, for every problem you experience, there is someone who ISN'T experiencing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunryu Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) Here we go, now we'll try to play the hyperbole or exaggeration card and hope that works. Look, the reason I laid into you originally was because of the way you phrased your post. I don't think anyone here in their right mind is saying that this game is faultless because it's not, but then again I think most reasonable people were completely prepared for that since it's only 2 weeks since it launched. However, when it comes to story trying to knock this game is insane. It is, at the moment, the pinnacle of marrying story and MMO together and it's incredibly young. Now, it has some weak points in its internal mechanics such as ability activation delays and class balance, in addition to the ability to skip the entire cutscene of any quest dialogue (which, while I personally am not bothered about since I enjoy story, I can understand if others want if they're repeating the same Q 10-15 times), but these are minor things. At the moment it's simply impossible to tell if the game is great or not...it's just too young. All we can say is that it's promising! Really? I can't remember half of my story and no I don't spacebar my way through the game, it's just forgettable..........you have a nemesis you are out to put down and meet people along the way to get the nemesis and help others while you are doing it, it's not new it is the same old same old and I don't even remember 3/4 of the names of npcs I meet. Oh and in case you haven't noticed most games go belly up VERY fast lately in the MMO world because you only get 1 chance at a first impression. Edited January 2, 2012 by Gunryu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myrmedus Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 If people want to argue about the negatives of the game that's fine but what I have an issue with in this thread is people trying to lynch the game for trying something new with introducing storytelling. Why on Earth would you discourage attempts at innovation and trying to evolve and improve the MMO formula? If it's not your cup of tea, fine, but there is alot more to the game than just story so just go and enjoy those aspects instead, and if you feel the game lacks in those departments then comment on that rather than the story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaceTowani Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Really? I can't remember half of my story and no I don't spacebar my way through the game, it's just forgettable..........you have a nemesis you are out to put down and meet people along the way to get the nemesis and help others while you are doing it, it's not new it is the same old same old and I don't even remember 3/4 of the names of npcs I meet. Oh and in case you haven't noticed most games go belly up VERY fast lately in the MMO world because you only get 1 chance at a first impression. LOL This game isn't for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevlarto Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I have been a fan of Bioware single player games since Baldur's Gate, I have played mmo's for 14 years, I enjoy the story it is a nice break from the shallow games on the market today, and being a Star Wars fan, I enjoy the immersion the story brings to the game, to go back to another mmo without depth and vo's, would not cut it for me any longer, but thats just my own opinion for my play style, to answer your question, for me yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wahala Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Lest we forget, this is an MMORPG. I (in my OPINION) think the story part adds humongously to the RPG part. It makes me want to do the quest to see where the story goes next. It makes me want to continue to see if the bad guy gets it. It keeps me from wandering aimlessly ... /lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunryu Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I have been a fan of Bioware single player games since Baldur's Gate, I have played mmo's for 14 years, I enjoy the story it is a nice break from the shallow games on the market today, and being a Star Wars fan, I enjoy the immersion the story brings to the game, to go back to another mmo without depth and vo's, would not cut it for me any longer, but thats just my own opinion for my play style, to answer your question, for me yes. The only reason I dislike the voice overs is I like to go at my own pace, having to sit through talking (or chirping or gargling) to get to the "story" when I can read faster (and yes I do mean read not "Oh here is a quest skip reading it") and get to the PLAYING THE GAME is quite frustrating, I bought and pay for a GAME not a movie! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dinams Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Once you figure that all the side quests have pointless backgrounds (with the exception of a minority) you just spacebar your way through Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freakuancy Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Is it not okay for SWTOR and WoW to offer two different experiences? If you don't want story, play something else. Why do people think its okay to come on here and try and tell SWTOR it needs to be something different than what it is? Is it just because its Star Wars, so fans feel entitled to ***** that it's not the Star Wars game they want? Get over the self-entitlement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myrmedus Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) Really? I can't remember half of my story and no I don't spacebar my way through the game, it's just forgettable..........you have a nemesis you are out to put down and meet people along the way to get the nemesis and help others while you are doing it, it's not new it is the same old same old and I don't even remember 3/4 of the names of npcs I meet. Oh and in case you haven't noticed most games go belly up VERY fast lately in the MMO world because you only get 1 chance at a first impression. Well, firstly, what BW excels at is turning a generic story into an engaging one through good script and plot development. To be honest, if you break apart most stories into basics they are usually one goodie, one baddie, and a war. What makes them great is the development of said story and conflict, the way it's told, and I would suggest that even if you weren't pressing spacebar you probably weren't paying full attention. Of course, it could also be that such storytelling isn't your cup of tea...which is fine but don't deride the rest of us for enjoying it alot, and don't mistake it for being a blemish on the game because in actuality it's an addition. If there are issues elsewhere in the game then comment on those instead . And to be honest, most MMOs go belly up because the vast majority have been half-arsed attempts that at their core were pretty poor - I've played the ones I mentioned earlier to you at some length and I've also played AoC. I can safely say those games were not developed with half the quality, production value and attention that WoW or this game were. Why? Because they were mainly produced with the intention of making money, which is unfortunately a big motivation for many developers these days to create MMOs, rather than WoW and TOR that I believe were developed to simply make a great MMO experience. Also, kind of different subject but TOR is also aided, I think, by the considerable negative reception to WoW's MoP (let's face it, WoW is the big fish that TOR will need to sink if it wants to dominate market share). After Cata, WoW really needed something great to reinvigorate itself and MoP wasn't exactly that, haha. Edited January 2, 2012 by Myrmedus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunryu Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Is it not okay for SWTOR and WoW to offer two different experiences? If you don't want story, play something else. Why do people think its okay to come on here and try and tell SWTOR it needs to be something different than what it is? Is it just because its Star Wars, so fans feel entitled to ***** that it's not the Star Wars game they want? Get over the self-entitlement. Ok honestly it isn't the "story" that bugs me it's the voice acting pure and simple, read my post on the last page as to why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThuaThal Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 It amazes me why people who are not in to story choose to play a story driven MMO in the first place? Why not play one of the other games that they clearly think are better? Personally I can say that I wouldn't play the game if it wasn't for the story and probably neither if it wasn't Star Wars too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myrmedus Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) Ok honestly it isn't the "story" that bugs me it's the voice acting pure and simple, read my post on the last page as to why. I have to admit I don't understand this, but it may be a case of "to each his own". I can understand in certain situations lacking the ability to fully skip a quest's cutscene(s) may be annoying...I personally haven't experienced this because I choose not to repeat the same quests over. However, generally I find one of the biggest negatives to MMOs generally is they're, well, silent. I mean, I know there are sound effects from attacks and usually some background music but apart from that their soundscape is very boring, to the extent that many players simply listen to music in WinAMP or WMP while playing them. That suggests to me that the sound medium is not being used to anything close to its potential in MMOs, and it does lead to an often disengaging experience IMO. The sheer fact people sit on Vent or TS when playing WoW, even when they're not raiding or diving into group PvP, just shows how little they pay attention to the audio of the game and its a channel there to be used and exploited. Edited January 2, 2012 by Myrmedus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark_Stormy Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I am loving the whole storey line as a Sith Assassin I am turning into a ****** and i like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samy_Merchi Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Ok honestly it isn't the "story" that bugs me it's the voice acting pure and simple, read my post on the last page as to why. I don't know if this would help, but I think in preferences there's the option to adjust voice volume, maybe you could turn that to zero to mute the voice acting? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uben Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Is it not okay for SWTOR and WoW to offer two different experiences? If you don't want story, play something else. Why do people think its okay to come on here and try and tell SWTOR it needs to be something different than what it is? Is it just because its Star Wars, so fans feel entitled to ***** that it's not the Star Wars game they want? Get over the self-entitlement. Because they are Star Wars fans trying to get the ONLY Star Wars MMO out at the moment to be what they love. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myrmedus Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I don't know if this would help, but I think in preferences there's the option to adjust voice volume, maybe you could turn that to zero to mute the voice acting? Yep, there is, you can turn off voice acting and just have silent script. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunryu Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I have to admit I don't understand this, but it may be a case of "to each his own". I can understand in certain situations lacking the ability to fully skip a quest's cutscene(s) may be annoying...I personally haven't experienced this because I choose not to repeat the same quests over. However, generally I find one of the biggest negatives to MMOs generally is they're, well, silent. I mean, I know there are sound effects from attacks and usually some background music but apart from that their soundscape is very boring, to the extent that many players simply listen to music in WinAMP or WMP while playing them. That suggests to me that the sound medium is not being used to anything close to its potential in MMOs, and it does lead to an often disengaging experience IMO. The sheer fact people sit on Vent or TS when playing WoW, even when they're not raiding or diving into group PvP, just shows how little they pay attention to the audio of the game and its a channel there to be used and exploited. Not only do I enjoy listening to my music while playing keeping sound effects on and a games music off, but I also like chatting in vent or teamspeak not telling everyong "Ok quiet now, I gotta hear the story!" again..........I want a game not a movie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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