Credit Transfer limits to SV

[FrontLineFodder]

9 minutes ago, TrixxieTriss said:

That would need a central server setup for the trades to go to & from. Because even though the servers are in the cloud now, they are still physically in seperate geolocated regions. Problems would 100% arise if they tried cross server trades without a central server to run them from. But honestly, even though this is an intriguing thought bubble, it’s a bit off topic. 

It's probably already a seperate SQL database for each server, with the code in the game servers (it's not all running on 1 pc, each "server" will be running on multiple nodes)

having a single central GTN database service would be doable, it could be hosted anywhere in the world, as I said, it's not the NASDAQ, not needing nanosecond response.

 

edit: Although it is over a decade old with patch on patch on patch, so yeah, who knows.

though seeing as it just went through a revamp, it could have been cleaned up significantly

Edited January 21 by FrontLineFodder

[TrixxieTriss]

1 minute ago, Dylanof said:

So you are actually advocating for broadsword to wholesale raise prices across the board as credit sinks. because the value of a credit on the other servicers is much less and the other server needs to raise it's prices in parity with SV.

Wow, that isn’t even close to what I said. 

The current service fees are already extremely high to combat the inflation on the other servers. It’s why they would either need to lower the fees for SV (which we know they won’t do) or listen to the players who are telling you that they need “x amount” of credits for the service fees for repairs & other things. 
 

That’s what you categorically refusing to understand. That the service fees are designed specifically to remove large sums of credits on the other servers. But BS haven’t taken that into account when opening SV. They’ve opened it with exactly the same service fee structure to combat hyperinflation where there is no hyperinflation. 

It’s why we are saying you’re idea to drastically limit characters credits so low in a transfer is out of balance with the reality of the service economy charged BS have in place on SV. 

As soon as you realise that BS aren’t going to spend more money & resources to setup SV with different service fees, the easier it will be to understand what we are trying to tell you. 

[Dylanof]

1 minute ago, TrixxieTriss said:

Wow, that isn’t even close to what I said. 

The current service fees are already extremely high to combat the inflation on the other servers. It’s why they would either need to lower the fees for SV (which we know they won’t do) or listen to the players who are telling you that they need “x amount” of credits for the service fees for repairs & other things. 
 

That’s what you categorically refusing to understand. That the service fees are designed specifically to remove large sums of credits on the other servers. But BS haven’t taken that into account when opening SV. They’ve opened it with exactly the same service fee structure to combat hyperinflation where there is no hyperinflation. 

It’s why we are saying you’re idea to drastically limit characters credits so low in a transfer is out of balance with the reality of the service economy charged BS have in place on SV. 

As soon as you realise that BS aren’t going to spend more money & resources to setup SV with different service fees, the easier it will be to understand what we are trying to tell you. 

Because the measure put in place are keeping a tight reign on the inflation that can build up atm.

 

We seem to be going around in circles. I feel you dont understand basic economics and why the measures are in place i would suggest you look at Germany issue with hyper inflation before the second world war as an example or even Argentina running at 123% inflation and see what measures these economies put into place with either the new mark or removal of the central bank.

 

Something drastic has to be done to reduce these very hot economies as had to be done here. Yes we are paying more than the other servers but the measures in place from broadsword are having a deflationary effort on our economy and most likely will not see the issue the other servers have faced if a reasonable measured amount was to be imported. I realize i lost the battle for no transfers of credits but i am putting forward numbers which and reasons behind those numbers which none of you have done so far.

 

[FrontLineFodder]

4 minutes ago, TrixxieTriss said:

Wow, that isn’t even close to what I said. 

The current service fees are already extremely high to combat the inflation on the other servers. It’s why they would either need to lower the fees for SV (which we know they won’t do) or listen to the players who are telling you that they need “x amount” of credits for the service fees for repairs & other things. 
 

That’s what you categorically refusing to understand. That the service fees are designed specifically to remove large sums of credits on the other servers. But BS haven’t taken that into account when opening SV. They’ve opened it with exactly the same service fee structure to combat hyperinflation where there is no hyperinflation. 

It’s why we are saying you’re idea to drastically limit characters credits so low in a transfer is out of balance with the reality of the service economy charged BS have in place on SV. 

As soon as you realise that BS aren’t going to spend more money & resources to setup SV with different service fees, the easier it will be to understand what we are trying to tell you. 

yep, and if it the service fees are a problem on SV they are a problem on all servers, except there they have the credits to throw at the problem.

Leave the GTN and it's player economy aside for a moment, a new player, regardless of the server they are on, as they play the game they are dealing with the same service fees as everyone else. if they are too high for SV they are too high for any server.

[DeannaVoyager]

21 hours ago, AFadedMemory said:

Not having enough credit to participate in the game does increase the urgency, for some players, to buy credit. Repair cost that are 100k generates less urgency then then the 2-30 million needed for end game armor components. If you’re spend 100k on repair without have end game gear,  why?

Can you add/remove/fix whatever word, words or syntax you may have left out because I have no idea what you are talking about. 

[TrixxieTriss]

5 minutes ago, Dylanof said:

Because the measure put in place are keeping a tight reign on the inflation that can build up atm.

 

We seem to be going around in circles. I feel you dont understand basic economics and why the measures are in place i would suggest you look at Germany issue with hyper inflation before the second world war as an example or even Argentina running at 123% inflation and see what measures these economies put into place with either the new mark or removal of the central bank.

 

Something drastic has to be done to reduce these very hot economies as had to be done here. Yes we are paying more than the other servers but the measures in place from broadsword are having a deflationary effort on our economy and most likely will not see the issue the other servers have faced if a reasonable measured amount was to be imported. I realize i lost the battle for no transfers of credits but i am putting forward numbers which and reasons behind those numbers which none of you have done so far.

 

I understand more than you I think. 

Let me try this one more time as basically as I can. If you can’t get an understanding after this time, I’ll leave you to argue with others who might be able to explain it better than me.

Service economy = fees, taxes & purchases made from vendors in the game. Players have no choice but to interact with the service economy to progress in the game.

Player economy is now mostly cosmetics since they stopped developing crafting in the game 4+ years ago. With the exception of maybe Augments & the mats to craft them, players DONT NEED ANYTHING in the player generated economy to progress in the game, not really even augments. 

Credits on ALL servers are generated exactly the same now.

Service fees & taxes are exactly the same on ALL servers 

Therefore 1 credit generated on SV is same as 1 credit generated on SF or any other server when it comes to the service economy.

If play A does raids on SV or SF, the repair costs are the same. If play A buys things from a vendor on SV or SF they are exactly the same. 

The current fees & taxes were setup to combat excessive credits that were generated during the 5.x & 6.x periods of the game. They weren’t designed with a fresh server in mind. That’s why we said for many months that they are obnoxious to new & returning players (BS don’t care). It’s something we’ve been trying to explain to the devs since they did it. But they can actually see it live on SV, so maybe they’ll change some. 

Now their immediate choice they have to make is, do they spend more money on a server that they’ve “accidentally” setup to fail with higher than needed service fees. Or do they allow players to transfer enough of their wealth that it doesn’t harshly impact their fun. 

BS have done this to themselves & the players are paying the price. They can’t have it both ways. It’s either a fresh start server or it’s a regional server. It can’t be both & make it a healthy server. It’s already failing because of this poor implementation. 

If it’s a fresh start server then they need to reduce the service fees specifically for this server. Especially for things like repairs. But they won’t do that because that’s throwing more money down the drain for no monetary return.

If it’s a regional server and they are keeping the service fees the same (to save dev costs), then they need to allow players to transfer a reasonable amount of credits so they can pay those fees without feeling like they are starting fresh. 

[AFadedMemory]

19 minutes ago, DeannaVoyager said:

Can you add/remove/fix whatever word, words or syntax you may have left out because I have no idea what you are talking about. 

Basically I’m saying I agree that people not having enough credits to buy/do what they want will increase the desire for some people to break the TOS. However the high cost caused by inflation (and the increase time/money to get the credit) will/does dwarf the high cost of repairs. Meaning inflation will more likely cause a greater increase in tos breaking sales than high repair costs.

[TrixxieTriss]

35 minutes ago, FrontLineFodder said:

Leave the GTN and it's player economy aside for a moment, a new player, regardless of the server they are on, as they play the game they are dealing with the same service fees as everyone else. if they are too high for SV they are too high for any server.

100% this 👆.

[TrixxieTriss]

2 minutes ago, AFadedMemory said:

Basically I’m saying I agree that people not having enough credits to buy/do what they want will increase the desire for some people to break the TOS. However the high cost caused by inflation (and the increase time/money to get the credit) will/does dwarf the high cost of repairs. Meaning inflation will more likely cause a greater increase in tos breaking sales than high repair costs.

Not as a fresh start player it doesn’t. If you do enough raids, you’ll quickly realise the service fees for repairs are just as out or balance as the inflation is for cosmetic items. 

On the old servers it’s currently a 3 speed economy. On SV it’s one speed & it’s a slow slog that is draining people fun or time to pay excessive fees designed to remove excess credits on the other servers. 

The more I hear about other people’s experiences with raids, the more I’m inclined to say they shouldn’t restrict credits in the transfer or that the restricted amount should be much higher than my original 10 million I posted back in November. 

[Dylanof]

13 minutes ago, TrixxieTriss said:

Not as a fresh start player it doesn’t. If you do enough raids, you’ll quickly realise the service fees for repairs are just as out or balance as the inflation is for cosmetic items. 

On the old servers it’s currently a 3 speed economy. On SV it’s one speed & it’s a slow slog that is draining people fun or time to pay excessive fees designed to remove excess credits on the other servers. 

The more I hear about other people’s experiences with raids, the more I’m inclined to say they shouldn’t restrict credits in the transfer or that the restricted amount should be much higher than my original 10 million I posted back in November. 

However the price of services in the other server did not rise to counteract the amount of credits in the economy. creating the disparity.

 

The service prices on SV we pay a premium compared to the other servers however the only thing maybe some higher than normal repair bills that are easily counter balanced through heroic daily content or crafting and sales.

[TrixxieTriss]

24 minutes ago, Dylanof said:

However the price of services in the other server did not rise to counteract the amount of credits in the economy. creating the disparity.

 

The service prices on SV we pay a premium compared to the other servers however the only thing maybe some higher than normal repair bills that are easily counter balanced through heroic daily content or crafting and sales.

Did you just return to the game since SV was opened? 

Because if you have, then you can be excused for not knowing that last year, the devs implemented all these new & updated higher fees across the game to combat inflation. 

And if you’ve been here all along through the changes, then shame on you for being disingenuous with your argument. 

Edited January 21 by TrixxieTriss

[FrontLineFodder]

6 minutes ago, Dylanof said:

However the price of services in the other server did not rise to counteract the amount of credits in the economy. creating the disparity.

uhh yes they did. service prices have increased directly to reduce the credits in the economy.

 

7 minutes ago, Dylanof said:

The service prices on SV we pay a premium compared to the other servers however the only thing maybe some higher than normal repair bills

No, the service prices are exactly the same, quick travel, repair, companion gifts everything is identical.

SV players are not paying a premium to repair their items.

12 minutes ago, Dylanof said:

are easily counter balanced through heroic daily content or crafting and sales.

Heroics pay the same on every server

When you are talking about crafting and sales you are referring to the player economy, yes you can sell items on the GTN, if a player is willing to buy them.

BS have little to no control of the Player economy (GTN & Trades) outside of tax. increase the tax rate and sellers increase the prices. prices will always rise to a point buyers will no longer buy them.

As I posted earlier, if you want to look at GTN prices, include items you can sell for credits not just how difficult it is to earn that number of credits via heroics. For example OEM's were selling for 1/10th the price of an augment 77, on both SS and SV. so there is no difference there.

[Dylanof]

3 minutes ago, TrixxieTriss said:

Did you just return to the game since SV was opened? 

Because if you have, then you can be excused for not knowing that last year, the devs implemented all these new & updated higher fees across the game to combat inflation. 

And if you’ve been here all along through the changes, then shame on you for being disingenuous with your argument. 

I played during 7.0 and 7.1 and was off in gw2 for a time and starfield but i always come home.

 

The trade fees, GTN travel and repair rose yes. I'm saying the incidentals like purple comp gifts did not rise. Upgrading noble or columi didnt rise that is all still standard and did not change or am i wrong ?.

 

[AFadedMemory]

1 hour ago, TrixxieTriss said:

The more I hear about other people’s experiences with raids, the more I’m inclined to say they shouldn’t restrict credits in the transfer or that the restricted amount should be much higher than my original 10 million I posted back in November. 

Steam Charts states that the average amount of people playing SWTOR in December was around 4500 players. If you had 1 billion credits you could give that many players 200,000 credits and still have a million left over. If the average repair cost is 100,000 credits you can buy 10,000 repairs. Requesting high credit limit is not about recovering from damage but maximize profit 

Edited January 21 by AFadedMemory

[FrontLineFodder]

1 minute ago, AFadedMemory said:

Steam Charts states that the average amount of people playing SWTOR in December was around 4500 players. If you had 1 billion credits you could give each of those players 200,000 credits and still have a million left over. If the average repair cost is 100,000 credits you can buy 10,000 repairs. Requesting high credit limit is not about recovering from damage but maximize profit 

you mean this ?

https://steamcharts.com/app/1286830

you realise that is average players, there were not only 4500 players playing non stop across the whole of December.

nor did those 4500 players only log into one character (or server for that matter)

 

So disingenuous

[Dylanof]

9 minutes ago, FrontLineFodder said:

uhh yes they did. service prices have increased directly to reduce the credits in the economy.

 

No, the service prices are exactly the same, quick travel, repair, companion gifts everything is identical.

SV players are not paying a premium to repair their items.

Heroics pay the same on every server

When you are talking about crafting and sales you are referring to the player economy, yes you can sell items on the GTN, if a player is willing to buy them.

BS have little to no control of the Player economy (GTN & Trades) outside of tax. increase the tax rate and sellers increase the prices. prices will always rise to a point buyers will no longer buy them.

As I posted earlier, if you want to look at GTN prices, include items you can sell for credits not just how difficult it is to earn that number of credits via heroics. For example OEM's were selling for 1/10th the price of an augment 77, on both SS and SV. so there is no difference there.

Just finished two heroic planets Taris and Corellia no bonus 400k, 40 minutes of content hanging out with a friend.

 

The augment system incentivizes you to craft. It has been simplified since 7.0 not having to do pvp to get the item you can now just buy it for tech frags which means you need to push more content. and again pushes you to craft your own equipment. you also have the option to buy it through the GTn where someone else has put their time into crafting that item for you.

 

Heroic content has more value due to the limited server economy you play you get rewarded well for your time. People need to understand your not going to have gold augs instantly its something to work towards. This is the real crux of the issue. People want to transfer in all this so they don't have to spend time building, progressing and achieving.

 

 

 

[Dylanof]

5 minutes ago, TrixxieTriss said:

So disingenuous, got it. Im done, go argue with others. 

Well now that is rude and insulting. Possibly a breach of the Rules of conduct and the ToS.

[AFadedMemory]

7 minutes ago, FrontLineFodder said:

you mean this ?

https://steamcharts.com/app/1286830

you realise that is average players, there were not only 4500 players playing non stop across the whole of December.

nor did those 4500 players only log into one character (or server for that matter)

This doesn’t really justify more credits though 

Also fixed the original post. Hope it’s now less triggering for ya.

Edited January 21 by AFadedMemory

[FrontLineFodder]

1 minute ago, Dylanof said:

Just finished two heroic planets Taris and Corellia no bonus 400k, 40 minutes of content hanging out with a friend.

Congrats, no one is saying doing heroics does not pay

1 minute ago, Dylanof said:

The augment system incentivizes you to craft. It has been simplified since 7.0 not having to do pvp to get the item you can now just buy it for tech frags which means you need to push more content. and again pushes you to craft your own equipment. you also have the option to buy it through the GTn where someone else has put their time into crafting that item for you.

ok ?

2 minutes ago, Dylanof said:

Heroic content has more value due to the limited server economy you play you get rewarded well for your time.

Heroic content has the same value, same XP, same rewards, same credits as any other server. what do you mean ?

3 minutes ago, Dylanof said:

People need to understand your not going to have gold augs instantly its something to work towards. This is the real crux of the issue. People want to transfer in all this so they don't have to spend time building, progressing and achieving.

This is the crux of it.

Shae Vizla is an APAC Regional server first, It started off with a fresh economy as the developers wanted / needed to see how much the credit initiative was doing without whales and their billions, and you know what, for end game content it sucks.

It was not supposed to be a server with an economy reset to zero.

[Dylanof]

2 minutes ago, FrontLineFodder said:

Heroic content has the same value, same XP, same rewards, same credits as any other server. what do you mean ?

No. Heroic content is more valued on this server because of what the value of the credit is.

 

But we have gone completely off topic. The topic is what do YOU think is a reasonable amount to transfer in. per toon or per legacy

 

How did you come to this figure and give a detailed breakdown.

[TrixxieTriss]

1 minute ago, Dylanof said:

No. Heroic content is more valued on this server because of what the value of the credit is.

 

But we have gone completely off topic. The topic is what do YOU think is a reasonable amount to transfer in. per toon or per legacy

 

How did you come to this figure and give a detailed breakdown.

1 Billion credits per character. 

[Dylanof]

1 minute ago, TrixxieTriss said:

1 Billion credits per character. 

ok and what is the breakdown for this figure.

[TrixxieTriss]

Just now, Dylanof said:

ok and what is the breakdown for this figure.

1 Billion credits per character. That is my break down 

[FrontLineFodder]

4 minutes ago, Dylanof said:

No. Heroic content is more valued on this server because of what the value of the credit is.

 

But we have gone completely off topic. The topic is what do YOU think is a reasonable amount to transfer in. per toon or per legacy

 

How did you come to this figure and give a detailed breakdown.

4 Billion and change

1 Billion for my Guild

1 Billion for gifts

1 Billion for my characters

1 Billion for my future characters

 

SV should not be treated as a special Server, It was not when it was announced, It should not be now.

[Dylanof]

1 minute ago, FrontLineFodder said:

4 Billion and change

1 Billion for my Guild

1 Billion for gifts

1 Billion for my characters

1 Billion for my future characters

 

SV should not be treated as a special Server, It was not when it was announced, It should not be now.

ok and what about the people who have mained on SV ? Started on SV ? lived in this economy for over 2 months ?

Grown this economy.

 

A few questions for you. Asked to gauge what effort you have placed into the SV community.

What's your gear score ? 

Rough estimation of the value of your legacy ?

Have you opened any strongholds ?

Do you currently have Augs if so what color?

How many toons have you leveled on SV ?