The five stages of grief

[hillerbees]

During the week, I came across a series of short videos on mental health and wellbeing. One of the short videos was about grieving and it raised the interesting point that grief is not always about the loss of a loved one, it can also be the loss of a friendship or a possession or any other thing that is important in your life.

 

SWTOR has been an important part of my life for the last 10 years. I've played almost every day during that period, sometimes a lot, more recently, a little. At first I was putting it down to burn out but thats not really the case as my love of Star Wars is as strong as ever. So when I heard the 5 stages of grief it really got me thinking.

 

The stages are:

Denial

Anger

Bargaining

Depression

Acceptance

 

Since 7.0 was touted and then "launched" I have gone through most of these stages at various times. I also see many people in these forums definately go through most of these stages too. I spend a lot of time here trying to bargain for better and certainly a good deal of time being either angry or depressed about the state of the game or the lack of communication.

 

I am just now wondering will I ever face acceptance of where the game is at and if so, will I learn to accept it for what it is or will I finally bring myself to let it go.

 

I know this might seem melodramatic to some but I have had good times here and I had hoped those times would come again. For now I'm uncertain and I hope rthe devs can prove that its not time for me to bury this game and move on and that there is something in it worth holding on for.

[Ardrossan]

Try this piece summarizing radical acceptance, a foundational concept of Dialectical Behavioral Therapy and could be very helpful to you.

 

https://hopeway.org/blog/radical-acceptance

[Falensawino]

while you're watching vids on the holonet

 

two automatic responses in your nervous system

 

(i'd ignore the title and just focus on the two nervous system responses)

(most of this stuff I've known since middle school, there's new vocab and a few new additions since 7th grade "science" class (mix of biology, chemistry, physics) )

 

-alert response

-calming response

-- -- -- > the parasympathetic response slows your heart rate, lowers your blood pressure, it turns back on digestion, your muscles loosen, your eyes soften

 

rest and digest

also happens to be the Operative-class channel self heal ability, Rest and Recuperate

 

people need time off a galactic season, to digest what just happened

rest and recuperate

prepare

 

instant gratification

delayed gratification

deferred gratification

 

postponing galactic season 3 is a good idea

 

seasons passes shouldn't be always go go always on on all the time.

 

---------------------------------------------

 

---------------------------------------------

 

people need time off a galactic season, to digest what just happened, process off through the excess dopamine, return to levels of calm.

 

Those guys in other threads complaining, wondering, threatening to unsub over seasons never allowing time off, to relax and do something else in the game. They're probably the ones most in need of a break. I like to think of Bioware as a company even in the midst of game industry where the motto is "to game, and gaming gamers." The foundational values from the founding doctors probably left some degree of consciousness, to Armor, Shield, or Tech us players away from most of the predatory practices of the game industry. PHD Med school graduates, instead of setting up a practice and treat a few client patients, why not start a video game company and heal on rather mass scale.

 

battlepass dopamine fiends

 

gaming dopamine fiends aren't as bad as the instant gratification twitter handlers that tweet something the second they come into contact with it, tell everyone about it, then forget all about it 5 minutes later. Next day follows, "no idea what my brain did yesterday." They're took business never thinking, swimming for their life, flooded in constant stream of notifications, alters, beeps, unread message indicators, status flags, red icons with messages clamoring for their attention. Click me, Feed me, retweet me.

 

there's a very real need in this world to turn off devices and allow offline, alone times, process, assess

 

some people don't have the luxury of turn off devices, or unplug[*1] from the matrix or a matrix in whatever form the come appearing as today [swtor.com]

[*1][sWTOR Central Network nails it with latest (possibly last?) YT vid]

Edited July 11, 2022 by Falensawino

[SteveTheCynic]

The stages are:

Denial

Anger

Bargaining

Depression

Acceptance

This list is mostly ... um ... the stuff that exits from the rear end of a male bovine.

 

Or I'm weird.

 

Somewhere in 2014, Mrs Cynic began, without intending it, a kidney cancer of exotic nature. OK, on the scale of cancers, *all* kidney cancers are exotic (largely immune to radiation and "classic" chemotherapy...), but even on the scale of kidney cancers, hers was exotic. In the end, the diagnosis was too late, and it metastasised, and it finally did her in somewhere in July 2015.

 

Since then, about the only "stage" I've noticed in my head was "Acceptance", mostly because there's no point in wallowing in any of the other stages.

[ReveredDead]

Yeah then you get people who are Bioware apologists saying the game is perfectly fine *cough* Swtorista. Then you see people like Central Network who have been telling it like it is and Bioware banned him from their influencer program and private forum. Imagine that, if you critic the people who are supposed to make you a product worth buying and they in turn screw you over. That means said producer has gotten to big for it's own head and needs to be humbled big time. Cause if Star Wars Eclipse or another Star Wars MMO was to appear on the internet tomorrow. Swtor would die almost overnight and subs would be cancelled in droves. Edited July 6, 2022 by ReveredDead

[SteveTheCynic]

Yeah then you get people who are Bioware apologists saying the game is perfectly fine *cough* Swtorista. Then you see people like Central Network who have been telling it like it is and Bioware banned him from their influencer program and private forum. Imagine that, if you critic the people who are supposed to make you a product worth buying and they in turn screw you over. That means said producer has gotten to big for it's own head and needs to be humbled big time. Cause if Star Wars Eclipse or another Star Wars MMO was to appear on the internet tomorrow. Swtor would die almost overnight and subs would be cancelled in droves.

Yeah, because obviously, naturally, negging the thing you're supposedly an "influencer"(1) for is the mostest obviousest way to win that thing's producer's support.

 

(1) This word makes me want to spit.

[Samcuu]

Swtor is a 10 year old game. Might be time to maybe adjust ur expectations vs reality. Swtor will never be a content locust game. When I was able to play games quite a bit I would get burned out on swtor because the lack of content. A break from the game can do wonders for ur appreciation of it. There aren't many mmos like swtor which are easy to pick up and play and aren't massively grindey. Now that I have adult responsibilities, swtor is perfect as a 1 or 2 hour per day thing. Conquest, seasons, casual pvp. I've also made it a game to see how many credits I can make. Lots of reasons to play swtor, but yeah it's not the 10 hour a day time sink it used to be and some mmos still are.

[JediQuaker]

The stages are:

Denial

Anger

Bargaining

Depression

Acceptance

The problem I see is the lack of 'perspective' in these things. It's normal, of course, if a loved one or pet dies or gets seriously sick, or if something major happens, like your home being destroyed, for people to go through these stages. But, many people on here remind me more of those kids you see on Tic Tok or Instagram, crying into the camera because their favorite pop idol has quit their favorite pop group - oh the horror! "How can I live without Jason Beeber" 😂😂

 

Let Steve tell you about his wife's death, or let me tell you about my step-daughter dying in a car accident 2 days before her 16th birthday, to get a feel for 'real' grief, 'real' pain. Then you'll maybe get the sense that 'Acceptance' over SWTOR is more than enough. 😥

Edited July 7, 2022 by JediQuaker

[hillerbees]

Hi guys, thanks for the feedback.

 

I guess what I was just looking to share here was that I just felt, a penny dropped for me that an awful lot of what gets posted in the forums isn't just people blowing off steam or venting about stuff.

 

A lot of people, myself included are mourning the game that we started out with or mourning the lack of input by EA / Bioware over the years and in failing to celebrate 10 years adequately.

 

When you look the movie franchises that have captured people's imagination over the years only maybe LOTR or Marvel have come close to Star Wars fandom levels. Then you look at MMO rankings and you see SWTOR at number 18...it doesn't add up.

 

The game launched with over a million subscribers..it was always going to lose some after the initial interest died off but its time now to ask how this game is 18th most played mmo despite the raft of movies and tv series that in the main have done well at the box office or in the tv ratings.

 

The grief is totally understandable but the lack of a real effort to do something about it, I cannot understand. I don't blame the dev's that clock in and do their job to the best of their abilities but I do blame those who hold the purse strings...its like they have the keys to the candy store but don't know what to do with them.

 

I am finding it hard to find acceptance of that fact.

[Aghasett]

Yeah, because obviously, naturally, negging the thing you're supposedly an "influencer"(1) for is the mostest obviousest way to win that thing's producer's support.

 

(1) This word makes me want to spit.

 

Yes can we all agree to do away with the term "influencer" when applied to SWTOR youtube shills? They influence no one. They're unpaid employees shilling for access who occasionally provide useful tips and news updates, but mostly offend in their blatant obsequiousness. Please and thank you.

Edited July 8, 2022 by Aghasett

[Ardrossan]

 

I am finding it hard to find acceptance of that fact.

 

As I said, have a look online at DBT, radical acceptance is a real thing, not a punchline. It's often used for borderlines, who have trouble letting go, but it can be helpful to anyone. Mindfulness is another avenue that many people find helpful.

 

Let Steve tell you about his wife's death, or let me tell you about my step-daughter dying in a car accident 2 days before her 16th birthday, to get a feel for 'real' grief, 'real' pain. Then you'll maybe get the sense that 'Acceptance' over SWTOR is more than enough. 😥

 

I hate that 'real' pain. Pain isn't a competition. It's fine if you don't feel it Quaker. For that matter, it's fine if you want to be an obnoxious contrarian in every thread. It's not fine to minimize pain that other people you don't know are experiencing.

[vfreelancerv]

During the week, I came across a series of short videos on mental health and wellbeing. One of the short videos was about grieving and it raised the interesting point that grief is not always about the loss of a loved one, it can also be the loss of a friendship or a possession or any other thing that is important in your life.

 

SWTOR has been an important part of my life for the last 10 years. I've played almost every day during that period, sometimes a lot, more recently, a little. At first I was putting it down to burn out but thats not really the case as my love of Star Wars is as strong as ever. So when I heard the 5 stages of grief it really got me thinking.

 

The stages are:

Denial

Anger

Bargaining

Depression

Acceptance

 

Since 7.0 was touted and then "launched" I have gone through most of these stages at various times. I also see many people in these forums definately go through most of these stages too. I spend a lot of time here trying to bargain for better and certainly a good deal of time being either angry or depressed about the state of the game or the lack of communication.

 

I am just now wondering will I ever face acceptance of where the game is at and if so, will I learn to accept it for what it is or will I finally bring myself to let it go.

 

I know this might seem melodramatic to some but I have had good times here and I had hoped those times would come again. For now I'm uncertain and I hope rthe devs can prove that its not time for me to bury this game and move on and that there is something in it worth holding on for.

 

I have worse problems than you.

[Mubrak]

Grief is too melodramatic. Let's face it, it's a toxic relationship. It's gone sour long ago, but we stick around because of the fun we once had. Even at the breaking point we are eagerly waiting for any gesture of goodwill.

 

And yeah, sometimes it's nobody's fault, and you simply grow apart from each other, but Swtor is ghosting us for half a year now, it's a matter of self-respect to show them that there are other fish in the sea who would be happy to have us.

Edited July 8, 2022 by Mubrak

[SteveTheCynic]

Yes can we all agree to do away with the term "influencer" when applied to SWTOR youtube shills?

I actually meant that the word makes me want to spit no matter what the context is.

[DeannaVoyager]

Grief is too melodramatic. Let's face it, it's a toxic relationship. It's gone sour long ago, but we stick around because of the fun we once had. Even at the breaking point we are eagerly waiting for any gesture of goodwill.

 

And yeah, sometimes it's nobody's fault, and you simply grow apart from each other, but Swtor is ghosting us for half a year now, it's a matter of self-respect to show them that there are other fish in the sea who would be happy to have us.

 

Toxic relationships describes perfectly at least my relationship to the game. But grief also comes from long time friends quitting the game and moving on because of the state of the game. Even if we'd find another game to hang around, it's not gonna be the same and not everyone will move on to the same game.

 

If the new ops is only going to be doable for the hard core nim raiders, we will see another mass exodus. Right now myself and some other raider friends are only waiting for that. If we can't clear the first boss in a reasonable amount of time, that will be it. Not getting better gear means no harder content (even if it's the old nims) and I don't see the point of sticking around for months of EV and KP with pugs.

[Samcuu]

To the OP, I get what ur saying about the penny dropping. I guess I don't completely relate because I came to terms that swtor is what it is years ago. Probably around the time of Ilum world pvp where I realized the hero engine was never going to work out. A Star Wars mmo should have endless possibilities and be ripe with content, but once the devs realized that the hero engine can't support an mmo like this, they've been dumbing down ever since.

 

Elimination of 8 v 8 ranked, the phasing out of world pvp and discouragement of anyone trying to play it through the level sync system and no more temp enemy flags/segregation of pve/pvp instances. The game has turned into a single player game with occasional group content because that's what the engine can handle. 16 man raids are barely viable, again because of the engine, there won't even be an option for 16 man R-4 (I'm speaking from a pvp standpoint I don't pve but I'm told that even in an instance a 16 man raid gets insane lag and is almost unplayable).

 

Then probably the nail in the coffin for me was when we were all waiting for content to drop around 4.0, and we were given the DvL event which was basically grinding all the old content for rewards. A lot of my friends left around that time. So the dmg has been done for a while imo. My main point was once u come to terms with what swtor is, then u can appreciate if more and get as much fun out of it before the servers are shut down. Guarantee most ppl here complaining will miss it when it's gone, cuz even with the lack of content it's still a top mmo.

Edited July 8, 2022 by Samcuu

[Aghasett]

I actually meant that the word makes me want to spit no matter what the context is.

 

Yes I realize that, however, much as we might want it, we're not going to be eliminating it from the lexicon entirely. But I'd be perfectly delighted if the SWTOR "influencer" program was permanently retired. It's no different than those obnoxious weenies who shill for Disney's Galactic Failcruiser - more repulsive than attractive.

Edited July 8, 2022 by Aghasett

[hillerbees]

Guarantee most ppl here complaining will miss it when it's gone, cuz even with the lack of content it's still a top mmo.

 

I agree the game will be missed once gone.

 

I have had many good times here. Still have a few. But I still feel more could be done even within the parameters of the engine etc. that is not being done. I miss the camaraderie of the forums when Musco was at the helm and though it was not perfect you at least felt there was a bond of friendship there. The changes since have promised a more open and honest way of communicating but I haven't seen that happen aside from an attempt at shutting down some of the more toxic carry on in the game. The current level of silence from the devs is oppressive.

[Samcuu]

This thread and my sentiments in it made me think about when the game started slipping in regards to content. Today I watched a 2017 swtor year in review YouTube video that mentioned the devs were terrible at communicating their plans even back then. He also mentioned that the once robust dev team had been scaled back massively. Dec 2016 is when we got the last real substantial story content with KOTET. And 2017 is the year where for the God's Of the Machine operation, they could only get two bosses out and pushed the other two bosses back another year to 2018.

 

You are 100% right it could be so much more than it is, but I think that ship sailed years ago unfortunately.

[ReveredDead]

This thread and my sentiments in it made me think about when the game started slipping in regards to content. Today I watched a 2017 swtor year in review YouTube video that mentioned the devs were terrible at communicating their plans even back then. He also mentioned that the once robust dev team had been scaled back massively. Dec 2016 is when we got the last real substantial story content with KOTET. And 2017 is the year where for the God's Of the Machine operation, they could only get two bosses out and pushed the other two bosses back another year to 2018.

 

You are 100% right it could be so much more than it is, but I think that ship sailed years ago unfortunately.

 

Seriously we have had no live stream or nothing. There are MMO's out there where the devs give monthly streams and updates. People who say Swtor is maintenance mode are lying to us. Swtor is in survival mode and it's slowly dying. It's very depressing.

[Nickodemous]

When did STWOR players become doctors?

 

OP....go get some help....don't ask for help in the forums.....are u kidding me?