Is the pvp healing...

[BobaFurz]

...with hots almost useless at 50 like at lvl ~35-40 ? After 17lvls I tried the healing spec for some battleground rounds and it is not really what I did expect. Edited December 30, 2011 by BobaFurz

[Sabbathius]

Pretty much, yeah.

 

First, in PvP healing is reduced by approximately 30%. Compared to PvE.

 

Second, HoTs are weak to begin with, even fully talented. They're something to give an extra few seconds' grace if your target runs out of range or line of sight. But it's not like a WoW druid where you can put 3 HoTs on a guy and walk away for 15 seconds knowing full well there's no way in holy hell he'll die to anything less than 3 peoples' focus fire.

 

Also some bad news, you WILL get screwed on medals, and thus receive far fewer commendations (which you use to buy stuff). As a healer, you get 1 medal for 2.5k heal, 1 medal for 75k healing done...and that's it, I think. Now compare that to DPS, where they get 1 for a kill, 1 for solo kill, 1 for 10 kills, 1 for 20 kills, 1 for 75k damage done, 1 for hit for 2.5k damage, etc. And if you are a tank, add one for absorbing 2.5k damage, 10k damage without dying, etc.

 

In other words, picture this:

 

A friendly is fighting 2 people, and getting his butt kicked. You ride up on the white horse and start spamming heals on him. The people he's fighting are blind, deaf and dumb, and so he kills them both. What happens?

 

Well, he gets credit for 2 kills (towards his 10 or 20 kills medal), YOU do not! That's right, unless you damaged them, you get diddly squat.

 

He also might get credit for solo kills, Not sure, but again if he's the only one doing the damage, I believe it counts as solo kill).

 

If during the fight he landed a hit for 2.5k or more, and you landed a heal for 2.5k or more, you each get a medal. And you each got some points towards your 75k damage/healing done.

 

Bottom line? He gets 3-4 medals. You get 2. At the end of the match, he'll likely have 5-7 medals, you'll likely have 4. He'll get 70+ commendations, you'll get ~50. And NONE of this would be possible for him without your help!

 

That's what you have to look forward to as a healer in warfronts. Enjoy!

[BobaFurz]

Thx for the long post...well I make it short:

 

I did change back to a dmg build , dont see much more significant survival with 4-5 hots on me or for others. Looks different if you meet other healers, they are hard to take down.

Edited December 30, 2011 by BobaFurz

[Tamanous]

Healers are expected to do damage in pvp. With healing reduced, damage is needed to make up for the loss. When you damage someone ... they die faster. When they are dead ... they don't do damage to you. Pretty simply concept.

 

A healer is fighting an uphill battle when their healing has a flat reduction. At best it is more mitigation anyway in this game. There are indeed some great healers out there but when the game ends I always look to see which did the most damage on top of healing ... those are the good healers. Many times I have seen two players with similar heal totals yet one did many times the damage of the other as well. Which player is better?

 

As for hots, my kolto droids still make a big difference overall. At the very least they keep me alive MUCH longer. The difference is mind blowing actually. Another huge benefit is to ensure your gear is very good. To compete against higher levels you need to be in all up to par blue enhanced gear or your bolster does little. At 38 I have gone toe to toe against some 50's and lived. You want power, power, power along with our crit.

 

It's a rough game with bolster but I am finding I like the mix for the most part. I am currently all for keeping a bolster mix as long as pre-mades are kept out. Perhaps later a 50 pre-made only division can be added.

 

My play style is hybrid. Some matches my damage is way higher than my heals. Other matches my heal is much higher.

Edited December 30, 2011 by Tamanous

[BobaFurz]

When I go tow to tow against a melee and tanking his dmg with heals, full hots on me I die quickly...Iam lvl 36 and I dont believe that you can tank a lvl 50 melee class dmg with just 500 heal ticks... Edited December 30, 2011 by BobaFurz

[DrekorSilverfang]

HoTs give TA which fuels SP, combine with shivs for more SP's.

[KarioMart]

Healers don't really get screwed on medals, the kills? all you need is to participate in their death, so using any CC or even a quick AoE like frag grenade will get you all kinds of credit. Also 75k damage even as healing spec is easy between heals.

 

Also with 300+ expertise it is very hard to get soloed while healing. While I would admit sorc/merc are better than Ops at this because of their single target skills whilst Ops have more Healing to go around. Besides what other healing spec only spend 24 points in healing then can go have DPS goodies?

[Ultratron]

When I go tow to tow against a melee and tanking his dmg with heals, full hots on me I die quickly...Iam lvl 36 and I dont believe that you can tank a lvl 50 melee class dmg with just 500 heal ticks...

 

 

How many different cry threads can you possibly make when every single one of them comes down to, "I got killed by a level 50 on my level 17-30, THIS CLASS BLOWS."

 

Seriously just stop...

[Cerasuolious]

I am level 50, healing spec. Specced all the way to the instant group heal. My bots will crit heal in pvp for 500+ per tick and my gear at the moment is not great. Considering you can stack two, potential for 1000+ ticks is pretty good. The real benefit of the bots is to get the 30% chance of TA from the ticks.

[BobaFurz]

How many different cry threads can you possibly make when every single one of them comes down to, "I got killed by a level 50 on my level 17-30, THIS CLASS BLOWS."

 

Seriously just stop...

 

What is about crying...you cant tank high dmg from lvl 50ies with good gear as a lvl 36, when 4-5 hots ticking for just 500 altogether.

Edited December 30, 2011 by BobaFurz

[Sabbathius]

Healers are expected to do damage in pvp. With healing reduced, damage is needed to make up for the loss. When you damage someone ... they die faster. When they are dead ... they don't do damage to you. Pretty simply concept.

 

See, I don't mind the idea of healing and doing DPS. I really don't. Except other classes are way better equipped for it.

 

As an Operative, the bulk of your damage still comes from melee attacks. Means you have to be in the thick of it to be any good. And being in the thick of it AND being a healer? That's like having two bulls eyes painted on you - one on the front and one on the lower back.

 

There are indeed some great healers out there but when the game ends I always look to see which did the most damage on top of healing ... those are the good healers.

 

Not always. Don't quote me on this one, but I believe the Sorcerer's bubble, for example, counts as a heal. I slap that on people as I run by, and get great healing on top of already great DPS, and I'm DPS spec. At least that's what I think is happening.

 

Many times I have seen two players with similar heal totals yet one did many times the damage of the other as well. Which player is better?

 

Just lucky. Some matches I top 300k healing quite easily, when the enemy team is too retarded to focus fire me down. I just stand there and freecast on whoever needs it. Meanwhile another guy next to me tries to do the same, and gets dropped like a sack of potatoes on his first heal. Just luck.

 

Class also matters. Sorcerer heals are practically invisible, Operative heals are low visibility and Merc heals are high visibility. Your survival scales accordingly. Shooting people (heat-free heal on a Merc) is like painting a giant arrow to yourself saying "HERE I AM! Come kill me!"

 

As for hots, my kolto droids still make a big difference overall.

 

It's not THAT big. I don't remember exact numbers, but it's between 500-800 a tick in Warzones. Most people have 12-15k HP. And it takes two GCDs to stack the HoTs. It does make a difference, but not nearly enough.

 

EDIT: Just checked for you. At my level, the HoT heals for 650 over 18 seconds. In other words, 6 ticks of 251 healing, happens every 3 seconds.

 

Now consider the talent in Concealment, which heals for 4% HP every 3 seconds when you use Stim Boost. My current HP is 6.2k, which means 248 healing, every 3 seconds. See? Your two proble HoTs add up to practically the same healing as you could get PASSIVELY with a Concealment spec, just for popping Stim, which you do anyway to keep your energy up.

 

Point is, HoTs don't heal for all that much. It's all in your head.

 

At the very least they keep me alive MUCH longer. The difference is mind blowing actually.

 

If you can buy yourself some breathing room and kite/LOS to regen while the other guy is still taking damage from your shots/sting, sure. But that pretty much implies the other guy already screwed up pretty bad.

 

 

Another huge benefit is to ensure your gear is very good. To compete against higher levels you need to be in all up to par blue enhanced gear or your bolster does little. At 38 I have gone toe to toe against some 50's and lived. You want power, power, power along with our crit.

 

Yeah, and I've beaten level 50s of my exact class (in Huttball) when I was 11. So what? They were horrible players.

 

My play style is hybrid. Some matches my damage is way higher than my heals. Other matches my heal is much higher.

 

Well, I'm not a hybrid. I'm a pure healer. ALL my points are into healing. If all I do is healing, I should be getting the exact same medals as the guys who spec into DPS and ALL they do is DPS. But that's just not the case, and I feel it's broken and needs fixing.

Edited December 30, 2011 by Sabbathius

[Ultratron]

What is about crying...you cant tank high dmg from lvl 50ies with good gear as a lvl 36, when 4-5 hots ticking for just 500 altogether.

 

My point is (which it's sad that I have to explain this):

 

Everyone of your cry threads are about you being 20+ levels under someone else who just killed you.

 

I don't know how to break this sad news to you but, Bolster or not, if you're 20 levels under someone they will *gasp* HAVE A HUGE ADVANTAGE OVER YOU (better talents, better gear, etc).

Asking advice is one thing but all of your threads just result in you saying this class is underpowered against people who have a massive level advantage over you. If you want to cry at least wait till you're 50 and on somewhat of an even playing field. Otherwise you're just spreading a lot of mis-information and illogical rage.

Edited December 30, 2011 by Ultratron

[BobaFurz]

My point is (which it's sad that I have to explain this):

 

Everyone of your cry threads are about you being 20+ levels under someone else who just killed you.

 

I don't know how to break this sad news to you but, Bolster or not, if you're 20 levels under someone they will *gasp* HAVE A HUGE ADVANTAGE OVER YOU (better talents, better gear, etc).

Asking advice is one thing but all of your threads just result in you saying this class is underpowered against people who have a massive level advantage over you. If you want to cry at least wait till you're 50 and on somewhat of an even playing field. Otherwise you're just spreading a lot of mis-information and illogical rage.

 

O really ? I have a battleground ranking 33, I think i have some expirience. You are probably one of those who did powerlevel or leveled up by questing, I did a lot just with battlegrounds for over 10 lvls.

 

Do you think I dont know that higher lvls have an advantage, you can not even read and recognize that another person did talk about lvl 50 and not me...

 

For how long did you stay in the battlegrounds at lower levels....you can probably find only a few here which did play for longer in a certain lvl range.

Edited December 30, 2011 by BobaFurz

[Qonnor]

When I go tow to tow against a melee and tanking his dmg with heals, full hots on me I die quickly...Iam lvl 36 and I dont believe that you can tank a lvl 50 melee class dmg with just 500 heal ticks...

 

Because you can't. I'm unclear as to why you believe someone with a 14 level advantage over you, shouldn't be able to bring you down.

 

1. You're a medium armor wearing class, you can't tank jack squat anyways.

2. PvP is all about burst burst burst. HoTs are about sustained damage.

3. If you die within 5 seconds, you aren't playing correctly, plain and simply. Getting low? Pop flashbang and heal up. Low on energy, oh look you have a probe for that. Still dying? Good thing you have debilitate. Wait this is an unwinnable fight? Ok stealth generator overload and get the hell out. You have multiple ways to stay alive, and yes good pvpers will be able to take you down if you don't play as well as them.

 

The issue at hand is not "operative hots are underpowered derp derp can't live vs level 50s", it's I can't play my class and think I should be able to live like a Druid in the days of WotLK because I have hots like them. Seriously, think before you post this crap.

[Oghier]

How to get medals in PvP:

 

1) You have to do some damage. Tag groups of enemies with grenades. Use your corrosive dart on singletons. Ninja a kill with a backstab-shiv combination. Shiv is useful for healing, as well, as it grants you TA.

 

2) HoT's are useful if you play a mobile healer (and you really need to be mobile). Use them to top people off as you or they run by. In some zones (e.g., Huttball), they won't be in your line of sight long enough to use a long cast anyway.

 

3) HoT people up, yourself included, just before combat. Whoever is closest to the enemy will be the target of most tab-targeting bad guys. You will be the target of most skilled enemies.

 

4) Stealth makes you an excellent healer for node defenses, as the other team's stealthers can't open up combat by disabling or killing you. Hanging near nodes grants defender penalties.

 

5) Don't die. Learn to kite, and take advantage of our instant heals. Hide behind stuff out of enemy Line of Sight to heal (especially in Voidstar).

 

Unless your team gets steamrolled, it is pretty reasonable to expect five+ medals per match (2.5k heal, 75k healing, killing blow, 10 kills, defender). A good tank or DPS will do better, but you can narrow the gap.

 

If your plan is to do nothing but heal, as you're a 'pure' healer, you've decided to gimp yourself. Damage is darn useful, too, both for medals and for winning the match. Even fully heal-specced operatives retain some decent damage capabilities.

[Jooji]

If your plan is to do nothing but heal, as you're a 'pure' healer, you've decided to gimp yourself. Damage is darn useful, too, both for medals and for winning the match. Even fully heal-specced operatives retain some decent damage capabilities.

 

If you're in a competitive, even match then doing damage is gimping your team. My "close" games if I stop healing usually allies die and that means we might lose. The medal system is ****ed. And yes I can get 8-10 medals if it's a blowout win, but throwing a frag grenade instead of healing is just stupid.

[Rishara]

Yep, if you are full heal specc'd, you get completely and utterly screwed on medals. Unless of course you want to let your teammates die so that you can get some damage dealing in.

 

By the way, you get another medal when you hit 300k healing. Some compensation, right?

 

I get on my low level commando who I SUCK at playing in PVP and walk away with 3 times the medals that my kick-*** healer gets. It's really starting to disgust me.