You do not have luxury that Blizzard does Eric.

[robertthebard]

Robert, it’s pretty simple: Every major game system is monetized on top of our subscriptions, either directly or indirectly. That includes gearing, crafting, and progression. It devalues our subscriptions when our QoL is sabotaged to incentivize additional microtransactions.

 

I understand you don’t care, that ‘free’ grinds are available, and that there are worse offenders out there.

 

None of that erases the existence of monetized mechanics on top of a sub. It’s a problem.

 

Actually, they're monetized by our subscriptions, not on top of. As a sub, we don't have to spend any cash to do any of that, that we aren't already spending for our subs. So no, it's not any more devalued now than it was when the gearing scheme was adopted for subs, however many years ago that was.

 

This means that I'm not getting any popups saying that I could have/use this gear if I purchased an unlock, because it's unlocked via my sub. What's more, if I equip it, and let my sub lapse, I can still use it. So I'm not sure what you're talking about when you talk about gearing. Crafting is completely unlocked through the sub as well, so again, not sure what you're talking about with crafting. Progression is also unlocked through our subs, so again, what are you talking about with "on top of our subs", when our subs cover all of that?

[FlatTax]

Actually, they're monetized by our subscriptions, not on top of. As a sub, we don't have to spend any cash to do any of that, that we aren't already spending for our subs. So no, it's not any more devalued now than it was when the gearing scheme was adopted for subs, however many years ago that was.

 

This means that I'm not getting any popups saying that I could have/use this gear if I purchased an unlock, because it's unlocked via my sub. What's more, if I equip it, and let my sub lapse, I can still use it. So I'm not sure what you're talking about when you talk about gearing. Crafting is completely unlocked through the sub as well, so again, not sure what you're talking about with crafting. Progression is also unlocked through our subs, so again, what are you talking about with "on top of our subs", when our subs cover all of that?

 

Real money leaks into these systems all kinds of places: RXP and XP boosts affect progression and feed Tech Frags, companion levels affect crafting and combat, character legacy perks affect progression, comp gifts, crafting crits, and put up a soft paywalls for all kinds of sabotaged QoL. The number of places where cash can affect a subscriber's game mechanics probably numbers close to a hundred.

 

Yes, I understand there are 'free' grinds for these things. No, that doesn't erase the fact these systems are monetized, with all the QoL implications that comes with that.

Edited May 23, 2021 by FlatTax

[TheVoyant]

Robert I'll be honest you went off in a direction that holds little relevance to my positions. But I can break one of em down for you.... The "not listening" remarks are based off the fact you can log in and see pretty much every collective saying the same things over and over:

 

"Want engaging new story content"

"1-74, 75 PvP brackets are a bad idea"

"Give us an actual expansion"

"Needing 3 versions of gear sets to be optimized for sub 75, 75+, and PvP is absurd."

"Please give us more customization of our characters/skill trees"

"Please fix basic clipping issues"

"Please fix the chat channel commands that haven't worked since launch"

 

And so on, you can find the majority of these said outloud on fleet, in forum posts, on twitter responses for ages.

 

Not listening as in, common complaints that should be fixed. There's no excuse for clipping still existing in the game for example. Yet they can come out with a new way to monetize and draw income that no one really asked for?

 

Its the same problem a lot of developers are facing atm, finding new ways to exploit their base by very minimal efforts vs. giving people the commonly requested items.

 

It's just a bad way to business, as you might get a momentary influx of revenue but you ultimately diminish the value of your brand over all.

 

Galactic Seasons has done far more harm then good. It has watered down a good percentage of PvP unranked matches or GSF where people are just tanking to get the Seasons objectives done. It bottlenecks people into certain tasks versus rewards them for playing the way they want to.

 

Simple fixes like "you can earn your daily points by achieving ONE of the three: Play Unranked Warzone Matches & Gain 8 medals total. Complete Heroics On ________, Get 10 kills in GSF."

For example. I'm sure there are other ways to fix it, but simply not trying to force non PVP or non GSF players into content that doesn't work for them.

 

I see a lot of people making excuses for the development team and that's about the same issue as the original poster had. It's not constructive.

 

I want the team to succeed and feel good about their successes and I know the internet is full of people who are never happy. But I think if they focused their energy more on fixing the common complaints and less on going off and spinning the wheel for awhile. Everyone would benefit and profits would go up as well.

 

Do I need the developers to listen to me individually, absolutely not, could care less. But I do want them to do a better job listening and communicating with their base overall. I'd say hire a community manager but I think they'd fall into the same disconnect that previous community managers of their other titles have fallen into.

 

Still ultimately constructive criticism and communication is paramount to achieving the highest level of success, dismissing or writing off complaints is bad business. The greats in any field learn from their failures, own it, and move forward from it.

[robertthebard]

Real money leaks into these systems all kinds of places: RXP and XP boosts affect progression and feed Tech Frags, companion levels affect crafting and combat, character legacy perks affect progression, comp gifts, crafting crits, and put up a soft paywalls for all kinds of sabotaged QoL. The number of places where cash can affect a subscriber's game mechanics probably numbers close to a hundred.

 

Yes, I understand there are 'free' grinds for these things. No, that doesn't erase the fact these systems are monetized, with all the QoL implications that comes with that.

 

I have literally thrown away hundreds of xp boosts that I got for completing story missions that were bound to the character that got them. They give them away like candy, so it's not like there's a "grind" for them. My Legacies have been capped for ages, but I don't recall having to spend any money at the CS to do it, what item is it, exactly, that locks me out of capping a Legacy if I don't buy it? Comp gifts can be purchased for credits, or you can trade in fragments for them. I honestly don't recall where I got the fragments I have, but I haven't felt the need to use them, since comp gifts now come as standard "drops" from hitting a Conquest target on a sub 71(?) character, not to mention all the gifts you can send comps out to get from the various professions.

 

So what I'm seeing here is "Cash shop bad", because none of what you're listing actually affects anyone that's paying a sub. The sub is the more egregious offender there. I won't play if I'm not subbed, and not because I can't post on the forums w/out it. However, I can and often do play w/out the CS. I don't buy the loot boxes, although I got a free one today, from a level on GS. I have loads of comps that aren't 50 influence, I don't even have one 50 influence on every toon, although a lot of them do have one. So my gathering and crafting missions take longer, oh well. They've been taking longer regardless, and having a sub means that I can craft more items at once, even if each proc takes longer to get, and crits are easier to get on a 50 influence comp.

 

My QoL is better now than it was whenever they added the influence gain on gathering missions as well, since comp influence will level w/out the need for any gifts, albeit it's slow going, it's still going, where it used to not be.

 

Robert I'll be honest you went off in a direction that holds little relevance to my positions. But I can break one of em down for you.... The "not listening" remarks are based off the fact you can log in and see pretty much every collective saying the same things over and over:

 

"Want engaging new story content"

"1-74, 75 PvP brackets are a bad idea"

"Give us an actual expansion"

"Needing 3 versions of gear sets to be optimized for sub 75, 75+, and PvP is absurd."

"Please give us more customization of our characters/skill trees"

"Please fix basic clipping issues"

"Please fix the chat channel commands that haven't worked since launch"

 

And so on, you can find the majority of these said outloud on fleet, in forum posts, on twitter responses for ages.

 

Not listening as in, common complaints that should be fixed. There's no excuse for clipping still existing in the game for example. Yet they can come out with a new way to monetize and draw income that no one really asked for?

 

Its the same problem a lot of developers are facing atm, finding new ways to exploit their base by very minimal efforts vs. giving people the commonly requested items.

 

It's just a bad way to business, as you might get a momentary influx of revenue but you ultimately diminish the value of your brand over all.

 

Galactic Seasons has done far more harm then good. It has watered down a good percentage of PvP unranked matches or GSF where people are just tanking to get the Seasons objectives done. It bottlenecks people into certain tasks versus rewards them for playing the way they want to.

 

Simple fixes like "you can earn your daily points by achieving ONE of the three: Play Unranked Warzone Matches & Gain 8 medals total. Complete Heroics On ________, Get 10 kills in GSF."

For example. I'm sure there are other ways to fix it, but simply not trying to force non PVP or non GSF players into content that doesn't work for them.

 

I see a lot of people making excuses for the development team and that's about the same issue as the original poster had. It's not constructive.

 

I want the team to succeed and feel good about their successes and I know the internet is full of people who are never happy. But I think if they focused their energy more on fixing the common complaints and less on going off and spinning the wheel for awhile. Everyone would benefit and profits would go up as well.

 

Do I need the developers to listen to me individually, absolutely not, could care less. But I do want them to do a better job listening and communicating with their base overall. I'd say hire a community manager but I think they'd fall into the same disconnect that previous community managers of their other titles have fallen into.

 

Still ultimately constructive criticism and communication is paramount to achieving the highest level of success, dismissing or writing off complaints is bad business. The greats in any field learn from their failures, own it, and move forward from it.

 

I didn't write an exhaustive list, because when I compared it to what's in the OP, and similar stuff, I figured it would be pretty clear. You can bet the OP is going to go on and on about how "they didn't listen" if none of the brilliant ideas they laid out for GS are implemented.

[AkidaBushido]

I have literally thrown away hundreds of xp boosts that I got for completing story missions that were bound to the character that got them. They give them away like candy, so it's not like there's a "grind" for them. My Legacies have been capped for ages, but I don't recall having to spend any money at the CS to do it, what item is it, exactly, that locks me out of capping a Legacy if I don't buy it? Comp gifts can be purchased for credits, or you can trade in fragments for them. I honestly don't recall where I got the fragments I have, but I haven't felt the need to use them, since comp gifts now come as standard "drops" from hitting a Conquest target on a sub 71(?) character, not to mention all the gifts you can send comps out to get from the various professions.

 

So what I'm seeing here is "Cash shop bad", because none of what you're listing actually affects anyone that's paying a sub. The sub is the more egregious offender there. I won't play if I'm not subbed, and not because I can't post on the forums w/out it. However, I can and often do play w/out the CS. I don't buy the loot boxes, although I got a free one today, from a level on GS. I have loads of comps that aren't 50 influence, I don't even have one 50 influence on every toon, although a lot of them do have one. So my gathering and crafting missions take longer, oh well. They've been taking longer regardless, and having a sub means that I can craft more items at once, even if each proc takes longer to get, and crits are easier to get on a 50 influence comp.

 

My QoL is better now than it was whenever they added the influence gain on gathering missions as well, since comp influence will level w/out the need for any gifts, albeit it's slow going, it's still going, where it used to not be.

 

 

 

I didn't write an exhaustive list, because when I compared it to what's in the OP, and similar stuff, I figured it would be pretty clear. You can bet the OP is going to go on and on about how "they didn't listen" if none of the brilliant ideas they laid out for GS are implemented.

 

We get it you don't care what company does , it doesn't affect you, then why are you here and not playing this wonderful game? I'm just tired of distance no listening from Bioware.

Since Onslaught they have gone down more of Blizzards path to solving issues and doing less work for content then they originally did when the game was coming out and being hyped up.

Even remastered Mass Effect shows this that its focused only on Shadows for the graphics upgrade.

So i get it you and some don't care, that's fine. The go play, there is nothing for you hear listen to. But for people who do care, we need start standing up and letting them know. This is not acceptable and it is not right way to handle game or its fanbase.

Because in the end there will come time when it will effect you people who don't care, when they come to time decide to shutdown or face EA's wrath for not keeping Subscription numbers.

[FlatTax]

I have literally thrown away hundreds of xp boosts that I got for completing story missions that were bound to the character that got them. They give them away like candy, so it's not like there's a "grind" for them. My Legacies have been capped for ages, but I don't recall having to spend any money at the CS to do it, what item is it, exactly, that locks me out of capping a Legacy if I don't buy it? Comp gifts can be purchased for credits, or you can trade in fragments for them. I honestly don't recall where I got the fragments I have, but I haven't felt the need to use them, since comp gifts now come as standard "drops" from hitting a Conquest target on a sub 71(?) character, not to mention all the gifts you can send comps out to get from the various professions.

 

So what I'm seeing here is "Cash shop bad", because none of what you're listing actually affects anyone that's paying a sub. The sub is the more egregious offender there. I won't play if I'm not subbed, and not because I can't post on the forums w/out it. However, I can and often do play w/out the CS. I don't buy the loot boxes, although I got a free one today, from a level on GS. I have loads of comps that aren't 50 influence, I don't even have one 50 influence on every toon, although a lot of them do have one. So my gathering and crafting missions take longer, oh well. They've been taking longer regardless, and having a sub means that I can craft more items at once, even if each proc takes longer to get, and crits are easier to get on a 50 influence comp.

 

My QoL is better now than it was whenever they added the influence gain on gathering missions as well, since comp influence will level w/out the need for any gifts, albeit it's slow going, it's still going, where it used to not be.

 

All that reduces to you saying you don't care the systems are monetized, and then strangely implying they aren't monetized because you don't care.

 

I never said legacy perks were behind a hard paywall; they're behind a soft paywall, holding our QoL hostage behind ugly grinds, which we can ransom ourselves out of... on top of our subscription.

 

You seem to be missing what's going on here:

 

Monetization 101: The 'free' grind in any monetized system is always tuned to incentivize financial transactions. I.e., to be frustrating.

 

That frustration-by-design is sabotaged QoL, which we all endure on top of our subscriptions.

 

Whether or not these mechanics is exist and are a problem is a binary question (the answer to which is an incontrovertible 'YES'), and not some subjective matter of degree, as you seem to think.

 

We all get that you don't care. That response isn't hitting the ball over the net.

Edited May 23, 2021 by FlatTax

[robertthebard]

All that reduces to you saying you don't care the systems are monetized, and then strangely implying they aren't monetized because you don't care.

 

On the contrary, I said they are monetized by our subs. You have made the claim that they are monetized on top of our subs, and I have asked you for proof of this. The proof you gave is XP boosts, etc.

 

I never said legacy perks were behind a hard paywall; they're behind a soft paywall, holding our QoL hostage behind ugly grinds, which we can ransom ourselves out of... on top of our subscription.

 

...and yet you included them in your list, for some reason? Then you wonder why I question what you've provided?

 

You seem to be missing what's going on here:

 

Monetization 101: The 'free' grind in any monetized system is always tuned to incentivize financial transactions. I.e., to be frustrating.

 

Yes, completing class missions is well and truly frustrating, and is also a primary source of XP boosts. No, I'm grasping your point all too well.

 

That frustration-by-design is sabotaged QoL, which we all endure on top of our subscriptions.

 

Whether or not these mechanics is exist and are a problem is a binary question (the answer to which is an incontrovertible 'YES'), and not some subjective matter of degree, as you seem to think.

 

We all get that you don't care. That response isn't hitting the ball over the net.

 

Except that you claim it's eroding our experience, or support the idea that it is, and yet, my experience hasn't been eroded, and you can bet there are thousands of players that are so unaffected that they have never come here to complain.

 

However, the arguments I've seen you produce so far are the same arguments laid out in GW 2 in support of GW 2 being P2W. Here's something that may shock you, I feel like the sub here is P2W. Instead of requiring us to lay out extra money for unlocks, it provides them to us as part of the package. It's ironic that you want to point everywhere else for your argument, claiming that the existence of these boosts erodes our experience, but ignore the blatant concepts of what our sub provides.

 

Can players buy unlocks for crafting? Yes. Does that affect what we get as a sub? No. Can players buy XP boosts? Yes. Does that affect what we can do as subs? No, and it won't provide them with Rested XP either. Can they buy equipment unlocks? Yes. Does it affect what we can equip? No. So far, there's nothing there that's having any affect on my experience, except for whether or not my sub is active. Things that make me go "Hmm".

[robertthebard]

We get it you don't care what company does , it doesn't affect you, then why are you here and not playing this wonderful game? I'm just tired of distance no listening from Bioware.

Since Onslaught they have gone down more of Blizzards path to solving issues and doing less work for content then they originally did when the game was coming out and being hyped up.

Even remastered Mass Effect shows this that its focused only on Shadows for the graphics upgrade.

So i get it you and some don't care, that's fine. The go play, there is nothing for you hear listen to. But for people who do care, we need start standing up and letting them know. This is not acceptable and it is not right way to handle game or its fanbase.

Because in the end there will come time when it will effect you people who don't care, when they come to time decide to shutdown or face EA's wrath for not keeping Subscription numbers.

 

So, for Conquest, there's an objective called Story Time. It is awarded for completing story missions, including class missions and side objectives there-in. What's the reaction on the forums? "Instead of giving us new content, they just rehash old content". All of your "suggestions" in the OP are shades of this example. So, when/if none of them are implemented into GS, you're going to be all over "but they don't listen" and rage quitting, because surely, since it was your idea, instead of the dev's idea, the community will embrace it with open arms?

[FlatTax]

On the contrary, I said they are monetized by our subs. You have made the claim that they are monetized on top of our subs, and I have asked you for proof of this. The proof you gave is XP boosts, etc.

 

 

 

...and yet you included them in your list, for some reason? Then you wonder why I question what you've provided?

 

 

 

Yes, completing class missions is well and truly frustrating, and is also a primary source of XP boosts. No, I'm grasping your point all too well.

 

 

 

Except that you claim it's eroding our experience, or support the idea that it is, and yet, my experience hasn't been eroded, and you can bet there are thousands of players that are so unaffected that they have never come here to complain.

 

However, the arguments I've seen you produce so far are the same arguments laid out in GW 2 in support of GW 2 being P2W. Here's something that may shock you, I feel like the sub here is P2W. Instead of requiring us to lay out extra money for unlocks, it provides them to us as part of the package. It's ironic that you want to point everywhere else for your argument, claiming that the existence of these boosts erodes our experience, but ignore the blatant concepts of what our sub provides.

 

Can players buy unlocks for crafting? Yes. Does that affect what we get as a sub? No. Can players buy XP boosts? Yes. Does that affect what we can do as subs? No, and it won't provide them with Rested XP either. Can they buy equipment unlocks? Yes. Does it affect what we can equip? No. So far, there's nothing there that's having any affect on my experience, except for whether or not my sub is active. Things that make me go "Hmm".

 

Again, you're not hitting the ball over the net.

[robertthebard]

Again, you're not hitting the ball over the net.

 

Of course not, and I wouldn't expect to. You have your beliefs firmly entrenched, and that's fine. My feedback on what you're posting isn't intended for you, but for anyone else that may read it, and come away with erroneous conclusions about the game, especially from the perspective of already being subbed, or looking to sub.

 

If I had to buy Artifact Equipment unlocks for my Legacy or characters despite being subbed, you might have a point.

 

If I didn't get rested xp, despite being subbed, you might have a point.

 

If I had to purchase crafting slots, despite being subbed, you might have a point.

 

However, none of that is true. The monetization scheme here pushes one to sub, but it doesn't adversely affect those that are already subbed, despite what you claim. This is why I respond to these posts.

[FlatTax]

Of course not, and I wouldn't expect to. You have your beliefs firmly entrenched, and that's fine. My feedback on what you're posting isn't intended for you, but for anyone else that may read it, and come away with erroneous conclusions about the game, especially from the perspective of already being subbed, or looking to sub.

 

If I had to buy Artifact Equipment unlocks for my Legacy or characters despite being subbed, you might have a point.

 

If I didn't get rested xp, despite being subbed, you might have a point.

 

If I had to purchase crafting slots, despite being subbed, you might have a point.

 

However, none of that is true. The monetization scheme here pushes one to sub, but it doesn't adversely affect those that are already subbed, despite what you claim. This is why I respond to these posts.

 

Subscribers are bombarded by almost uncountable solicitations to pay our way through monetized (and therefore sabotaged) game mechanics. Every Cartel Coin push-button we see is itself proof subscribers live in a land impoverished by EA's desire to re-monetize us.

 

I can understand you don't feel it's negatively impacting you, but it's quite another to deny the system's existence.

 

It exists.

Edited May 23, 2021 by FlatTax

[MotorCityMan]

Many on the forums are wrestling with concepts of "monetization".

 

I can recommend the book "The Attention Merchants: The Epic Scramble to Get Inside Our Heads".

 

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/28503628-the-attention-merchants

 

PS I am not involved in any way in writing or publishing of the book, and do not receive any "monetization" or consideration for someone using the link or purchasing the book.

Edited May 23, 2021 by MotorCityMan

[robertthebard]

Subscribers are bombarded by almost uncountable solicitations to pay our way through monetized (and therefore sabotaged) game mechanics. Every Cartel Coin push-button we see is itself proof subscribers live in a land impoverished by EA's desire to re-monetize us.

 

I can understand you don't feel it's negatively impacting you, but it's quite another to deny the system's existence.

 

It exists.

 

As do television commercials, and the "Impulse Buy" racks at supermarkets. I also hate ads on YouTube, it's not like I'm going to buy anything from a company that interrupts my video viewing to try to sell me something. So when are we going to rail against those, because they are the same principle as what happens here, only they are 1000 times less frequent here. As it stands right now, I get a pop up ad the first time I log a toon in for the week, or at the daily reset, while I'm subbed, anyway. We don't get the messages about gear we can't use, because there's no such thing, so long as we meet the level requirements. Pref/F2P do. Oh yeah, pushing one to sub.

 

So despite all the things you've claimed take away from our experience, they really don't. There's no mystical unlock we have to buy to get our max number of comps out crafting the max number of items as a sub. But you've claimed that crafting is affected above and beyond what our sub does. Which item is that? Just like with your Legacy example, that you dropped so fast it must have been hot when asked for what it was that was monetized beyond a sub, it doesn't exist. However, you claim that it does. These are the types of things I claim don't exist, and up until this example, you've proven me right by backpedaling on the one example I had asked for until this post.

 

I get it, "but EA is bad", and yeah, they certainly have been. They've been called out, and caught out in games that I'd never play anyway, for being "bad", or greedy. But this? You've already had to backpedal on one claim, I expect you'll be backpedaling, or deflecting on the item I've asked for here, and I expect you'll also be backpedaling when I ask which Item I have to buy as a sub to unlock my character progression. You have already claimed that it is monetized beyond our subs, so I'd like to know what item that is. If it's "but XP boosts and Renown Boosts", don't bother. I see a whole different argument with those than what you're intending, P2W. As I said earlier, I've seen this very argument used before in GW 2, off the top of my head, and it's likely that it's been used here, and even more likely that it's been used by you. I seem to remember having this exact conversation with you before, either that, or it's the strongest example of Deja Vu I've ever experienced.

[Eli_Porter]

Galactic Seasons literally gives you coins if you play the game. You also can't pay to win conquest anymore after the crafting nerfs.

 

Bioware is going in the opposite way of greed.

[FlatTax]

As do television commercials, and the "Impulse Buy" racks at supermarkets. I also hate ads on YouTube, it's not like I'm going to buy anything from a company that interrupts my video viewing to try to sell me something. So when are we going to rail against those, because they are the same principle as what happens here, only they are 1000 times less frequent here. As it stands right now, I get a pop up ad the first time I log a toon in for the week, or at the daily reset, while I'm subbed, anyway. We don't get the messages about gear we can't use, because there's no such thing, so long as we meet the level requirements. Pref/F2P do. Oh yeah, pushing one to sub.

 

So despite all the things you've claimed take away from our experience, they really don't. There's no mystical unlock we have to buy to get our max number of comps out crafting the max number of items as a sub. But you've claimed that crafting is affected above and beyond what our sub does. Which item is that? Just like with your Legacy example, that you dropped so fast it must have been hot when asked for what it was that was monetized beyond a sub, it doesn't exist. However, you claim that it does. These are the types of things I claim don't exist, and up until this example, you've proven me right by backpedaling on the one example I had asked for until this post.

 

I get it, "but EA is bad", and yeah, they certainly have been. They've been called out, and caught out in games that I'd never play anyway, for being "bad", or greedy. But this? You've already had to backpedal on one claim, I expect you'll be backpedaling, or deflecting on the item I've asked for here, and I expect you'll also be backpedaling when I ask which Item I have to buy as a sub to unlock my character progression. You have already claimed that it is monetized beyond our subs, so I'd like to know what item that is. If it's "but XP boosts and Renown Boosts", don't bother. I see a whole different argument with those than what you're intending, P2W. As I said earlier, I've seen this very argument used before in GW 2, off the top of my head, and it's likely that it's been used here, and even more likely that it's been used by you. I seem to remember having this exact conversation with you before, either that, or it's the strongest example of Deja Vu I've ever experienced.

 

I haven't walked away from anything. 'Have to buy' is a straw man argument. Pay-not-to-wait transactions absolutely constitute mechanic-affecting monetization of core systems, on top of our subscriptions. All my previous examples stand unchallenged.

Edited May 25, 2021 by FlatTax

[robertthebard]

I haven't walked away from anything. 'Have to buy' is a straw man argument. Pay-not-to-wait transactions absolutely constitute mechanic-affecting monetization of core systems, on top of our subscriptions. All my previous examples stand unchallenged.

 

Interesting. So, what item do I have to buy from the CS in order to equip Artifact or higher equipment as a sub? This would be required in order to monetize it beyond what I already pay as a sub. I asked several posts ago, it seems like, and yet, I have received no response.

 

You backpedaled to "I didn't say it was hard monetized", paraphrasing there, for Legacy. You can, and always have been able to, buy any perks with credits, and, for example, it only costs 160k credits to unlock all of the perks for comp influence gain, dialog and gifts. HK 51 has always been 1 million credits, or 300ish coins to unlock, I'm not sure, any more what Treek cost to unlock now, she's been unlocked for years on my Legacy, but there's a contract available on the fleet for 1 million credits. Credit costs aren't monetization beyond our subs. Yeah, there's a CC option, but it's none of my business if you'd rather use CC, than get some credits together.

 

What item do I have to buy in order to send out the max number of comps making the max number of items, on top of paying for my sub? This would also be required for crafting to be monetized beyond what I already pay for a sub. You see, it's not that your ideas have gone unchallenged, it's that you've chosen to ignore things that are inconvenient to your agenda. If it's "but you can buy an item to max out comp influence", comp influence being maxed isn't required for crafting. I've been crafting for years w/out it, and I'm sure I'm not alone.

 

You've claimed that progression, gearing and crafting are monetized beyond our subs, and I've asked for concrete examples, and you've failed to provide any. There's a reason, of course: There aren't any. "But you can make crafting go faster" isn't the same as "you can't craft w/out it". Unlike what happens when you're not a sub, and each comp can only craft 1 item. You've yet to address what gear I can't equip if I don't pay more than what I pay for my sub either, and you haven't addressed how my progression is blocked beyond my sub, if I'm not paying extra. I've asked for all of this, but your ideas haven't been "challenged"?

[FlatTax]

Interesting. So, what item do I have to buy from the CS in order to equip Artifact or higher equipment as a sub? This would be required in order to monetize it beyond what I already pay as a sub. I asked several posts ago, it seems like, and yet, I have received no response.

 

You backpedaled to "I didn't say it was hard monetized", paraphrasing there, for Legacy. You can, and always have been able to, buy any perks with credits, and, for example, it only costs 160k credits to unlock all of the perks for comp influence gain, dialog and gifts. HK 51 has always been 1 million credits, or 300ish coins to unlock, I'm not sure, any more what Treek cost to unlock now, she's been unlocked for years on my Legacy, but there's a contract available on the fleet for 1 million credits. Credit costs aren't monetization beyond our subs. Yeah, there's a CC option, but it's none of my business if you'd rather use CC, than get some credits together.

 

What item do I have to buy in order to send out the max number of comps making the max number of items, on top of paying for my sub? This would also be required for crafting to be monetized beyond what I already pay for a sub. You see, it's not that your ideas have gone unchallenged, it's that you've chosen to ignore things that are inconvenient to your agenda. If it's "but you can buy an item to max out comp influence", comp influence being maxed isn't required for crafting. I've been crafting for years w/out it, and I'm sure I'm not alone.

 

You've claimed that progression, gearing and crafting are monetized beyond our subs, and I've asked for concrete examples, and you've failed to provide any. There's a reason, of course: There aren't any. "But you can make crafting go faster" isn't the same as "you can't craft w/out it". Unlike what happens when you're not a sub, and each comp can only craft 1 item. You've yet to address what gear I can't equip if I don't pay more than what I pay for my sub either, and you haven't addressed how my progression is blocked beyond my sub, if I'm not paying extra. I've asked for all of this, but your ideas haven't been "challenged"?

 

You're persisting with a straw man argument.

 

Pay-not-to-wait schemes infest our core systems, and absolutely turn cash transactions into improved game mechanics, on top of our subscription costs. The option to relentlessly grind for those improvements doesn't erase this reality, and I'm puzzled why you seem to believe it does.

 

Again, my examples stand, unchallenged.

Edited May 26, 2021 by FlatTax

[Savej]

I don't know why BW waits so long to announce incoming xpacs/patches. When people know they are coming and they have something to look forward to they will stick around through quiet times like we have at the moment. But BW -is- working on something significant for the 10y anniversary which is probably going to arrive in less than ~5 mos. If you want to take a few months off between now and the xpac to reset your burnout, more power to you.

[jimmorrisson]

My demands are simple.

 

- Streamline and slim down 6.0 which includes making the two "new" kitbashed flashpoints optional

- Remove excess NPCs which have flooded the game since 4.0

- Remove social advertising bar and pop menus

 

- Bonus: Relocate datacenters to west coast

Edited May 27, 2021 by jimmorrisson

[robertthebard]

You're persisting with a straw man argument.

 

Pay-not-to-wait schemes infest our core systems, and absolutely turn cash transactions into improved game mechanics, on top of our subscription costs. The option to relentlessly grind for those improvements doesn't erase this reality, and I'm puzzled why you seem to believe it does.

 

Again, my examples stand, unchallenged.

 

The strawman here is not my own.

 

What item is it that allows me to "pay not to wait" to equip artifact grade equipment? You have claimed that gearing is monetized beyond our sub, so it should be simple to provide the item/items I need to buy, right?

 

There is obviously an unlock for F2P/Preferred players, but what unlock does a sub have to buy to equip artifact grade equipment?

 

What item do I have to buy, as a sub, to unlock my comp's full potential, in so far as the max number of items they can craft when I send them out? Note: This is not affected by comp influence, so an item that caps influence has no effect on the number of items they can craft at one time.

 

As I mentioned earlier, the "grind" for XP boosts is atrocious. How dare they make me have to finish class story missions to get XP boosts for free??? The horror that is that grind, right? But I'm the one arguing from a strawman?

[Falensawino]

Many of you are missing the forest for the trees. Whatever you think of the OPs tone, or whether or not he's adequately made his case, he's responding to something real: the systematic devaluing of our subscriptions by monetized game systems.

 

Period.

 

Our 'PREMIUM' experience (all-CAPS theirs, not mine) is collapsing, and it's a problem worth talking about.

Ok, let's talk about it. So let's guess, the first thing you're going to list is "but you can buy your way out of playing GS", right? Something to that effect? You can. You are not required to. There's a big difference there, but we have to ignore that.

 

Period.

 

My "PREMIUM" experience hasn't changed with the introduction of GS. I spent 300ish coins, that I got for simply playing the game through GS, unlocking HK 51 on one of my newer alts that didn't have him yet. Wait. That means that my experience did, in fact, change because I didn't have to use my stipend coins to do it. But, that would mean that my "PREMIUM" experience has changed for the better, maybe I better not post that, someone might be mad, right?

 

Other than that, my experience is exactly the same as it was before GS fired up.

 

So how, exactly, is my experience being eroded? Because someone else can? It doesn't phase me a bit. Just like the existence of loot boxes, it's not something I'm going to be doing anything with, so I don't care. I don't care how Joe Casual, or Fred Elite plays, or how much either one of them spends, although I'm glad to see money going into the coffers, it helps keep the game running. Nobody is running a bot, or series of them, that's interfering with my questing, so more power to 'em.

FlatTax has a point, our subs are going down in value next to the paying cartel coin skipper.

 

Previously, our one month sub used to mean something, it meant we could have a companion subscriber preorder bonus in the mail just for subbing for one month at the right date. Now it's devalued to the point, we need to maintain a sub for (up to) 5 months for one companion reward.

 

your old 1 month sub is now worth 5 months galactic season subscription. the sub time is devalued. one month is worth much less

 

On top of the devalued subscription, they are NOW targeting the skippers who would pay extra for some peace of mind. Imagine losing out on 5 months of rewards, but you don't want to grind out 5 months of daily and weekly objectives, I can skip ahead. up to 10,000 cartel coins for the peace of mind that you wont miss a single "monetized game system" reward. It's more egregious when you look passed the current flavor called galactic season and their dreaded Priority Objectives.

 

scheduling rewards is a phrase not used before

 

our previous instant subscriber rewards are being scheduled on a slow drip

 

Galactic Seasons is just one "monetized game system," and 2 months ago, It didn't exist. it was just recently conjured up. Expect future monetized game system schemes and slow drip scheduled reward systems.

 

6.0 gearing is a slow drip system, and its the worst gearing system this game has had by far. I only started playing September 2012. I didn't experience the original fifty million different commendations to unlock gear system. but for me, 6.0 takes the cake as one of thee worst.

 

Instead of increasing subscriber numbers, Bioware is focused on targeting increasing monetization of the whales/skippers, people who have already spent and maybe even willing to spend more if the new "monetized game system" compels them to even more than before.

 

Some free to play players, simply will not spend. They can't. Unable to.

 

Our 'PREMIUM' experience (all-CAPS theirs, not mine) is collapsing, and it's a problem worth talking about.

 

 

I have

Shae Vizla

Master Ranos

Darth Hexid

Niko Okarr

Paxton Rall

 

all rightfully unlocked by meeting the subscription deadline during the original promotional period. I feel like my sub is devalued with galactic seasons.

 

When people cried for a way to earn old timed subscription unlock rewards, I don't think galactic seasons is what they had in mind.

When people cried for a way to earn old timed subscription unlock rewards, I don't think galactic seasons is what they had in mind.

Edited May 26, 2021 by Falensawino

[ExarSun]

I don't know why BW waits so long to announce incoming xpacs/patches. When people know they are coming and they have something to look forward to they will stick around through quiet times like we have at the moment. But BW -is- working on something significant for the 10y anniversary which is probably going to arrive in less than ~5 mos. If you want to take a few months off between now and the xpac to reset your burnout, more power to you.

 

Yes, they are working on a new event and a new astromech pet.

[Screaming_Ziva]

Previously, our one month sub used to mean something, it meant we could have a companion subscriber preorder bonus in the mail just for subbing for one month at the right date. Now it's devalued to the point, we need to maintain a sub for (up to) 5 months for one companion reward. (Influence 50 Altuur zok Adon) (Altuur zok Adon has to be influence 50 to be unlocked in collections for all your toons, so a full season unlock is required. again up to 5 months of PO grind)

There is ZERO grind required for unlocking Altuur and, outside of the 5 to unlock him for all of your characters, it takes zero additional cartel coins.

 

Craft 3 Dark Projects, and pay 4,250,000 credits at the Conquest vendor for a Commander's Compendium. Level him to 50 and you can now unlock him on all of your characters. What's even better is that now that you have unlocked him, you can buy his gifts for credits at the seasons vendor. Including crafting time, this takes under an hour which is much much less than the 5 month grind you are complaining about.

[Falensawino]

Previously, our one month sub used to mean something, it meant we could have a companion subscriber preorder bonus in the mail just for subbing for one month at the right date. Now it's devalued to the point, we need to maintain a sub for (up to) 5 months for one companion reward. (Influence 50 Altuur zok Adon) (Altuur zok Adon has to be influence 50 to be unlocked in collections for all your toons, so a full season unlock is required. again up to 5 months of PO grind)

There is ZERO grind required for unlocking Altuur and, outside of the 5 to unlock him for all of your characters, it takes zero additional cartel coins.

 

Craft 3 Dark Projects, and pay 4,250,000 credits at the Conquest vendor for a Commander's Compendium. Level him to 50 and you can now unlock him on all of your characters. What's even better is that now that you have unlocked him, you can buy his gifts for credits at the seasons vendor. Including crafting time, this takes under an hour which is much much less than the 5 month grind you are complaining about.

 

Thanks for clarifying. I was told Altuur could only be leveled from the exclusive gifts given through out the season, gifts found in the vendor, and that it would take all those gifts claimed on just 1 alt to reach 50. I assumed that information meant a Commander's Compendium wouldn't work. I removed my parenthesis text based on this new information.

Edited May 26, 2021 by Falensawino

[Eranis]

Pay-not-to-wait schemes infest our core systems, and absolutely turn cash transactions into improved game mechanics, on top of our subscription costs. The option to relentlessly grind for those improvements doesn't erase this reality, and I'm puzzled why you seem to believe it does.

 

That's my biggest gripe. This horrible "free"-mobile-phone-games mechanic creeping into this game. Yes, the moment they want to incentivise you to pay more money (pay-to-progress), it will affect the gameplay experience they provide ("play the way you want at your own pace" does not cut it then).

 

On top of that: we know that they have limited resources. As a subscriber I'd prefer them not using their limited resources to produce boring game mechanics like this casual-unfriendly-pay-to-progress-crap. So even if I ignore it, they are using valuable resources to produce it.