If subscriber rewards now repeat over time, then time to introduce Veteran Rewards

[xordevoreaux]

We had to wait, subscribed, every month, to get bits and pieces of Nico.

The gun.

The hat.

The NPC.

 

Our reward for being loyal subscribers.

Now, the value of that loyalty has been erased by Nico's reintroduction.

 

Therefore, now that the SWTOR gaming community knows, demonstrably, that there are, in fact, NO subscriber time-driven rewards, but rather things that just pop up every once in a while and you can sub when you want, loyalty be damned...

 

...then it's time to introduce loyalty rewards, because, obviously, the sub rewards now repeat.

 

Everquest 2 has veteran rewards. You get those rewards over time for the time you put in. One the first week, one the first month, one after 6 months, and then a reward (excuse me, a collection of 3 to 6 rewards) on every anniversary thereafter.

 

Time for SWTOR to do the same, so that truely loyal subscribers who never break their subscription are rewarded.

Everything else, now, we know, are not subscriber rewards. They are cyclical rewards for the fickle who quit and quit and quit over and over again. Oh look! I'll subscribe this month, get that, then unsubscribe until something else I want from days gone by makes an appearance.

 

Fine. Bioware has made its choice in this matter, the decision is done.

 

So now, Bioware, turn your attention to your truly loyal subscribers, and reward them, and there's only one way you can do that -- by tracking their uninterrupted subscriptions, and rewarding accordingly. Over time.

Edited March 29, 2018 by xordevoreaux

[Lunafox]

I like this idea very much and support it. I'd like to see it implemented.

[Damask_Rose]

This would be a much better solution than randomly handing out rewards to only some subscribers. The 5 year anniversary statue that was limited to 1 copy, didn't feel like much of an acknowledgement for 5 years continuous subscription and we didn't even get a little statue for 6 years continuous sub. 6+ years of accrued Veteran Reward points would certainly make me feel more valued than being snubbed with this month's subscriber reward.

[Tashia]

 

Everquest 2 has veteran rewards. You get those rewards over time for the time you put in. One the first week, one the first month, one after 6 months, and then a reward (excuse me, a collection of 3 to 6 rewards) on every anniversary thereafter.

 

 

 

 

 

I like the idea of veteran rewards --- but for clarification --- even Daybreak ( after they bought Sony) has stopped veteran rewards for EQ2 -- and NO we are not happy either .... so it is not all roses and rainbows over there even ....

I know --- I was a continuous subber for over 8 yrs before I gave up on them

[xordevoreaux]

I like the idea of veteran rewards --- but for clarification --- even Daybreak ( after they bought Sony) has stopped veteran rewards for EQ2 -- and NO we are not happy either .... so it is not all roses and rainbows over there even ....

I know --- I was a continuous subber for over 8 yrs before I gave up on them

I subbed from 1999 - 2014, between EQ1 and EQ2, between Sony and DB. No break.

 

I got everything up through the 12-year EQ2 veteran reward. SWTOR can do it, too.

Edited March 29, 2018 by xordevoreaux

[Kirameki]

I like this idea. FFXIV has this system as well. (So do some other games but FFXIV is one of the games that does it well)

[Monumenta]

+1 Signed

Everyone should be able to get everything in this content starved game. Id like to get one of those bowcaster pistols from ranked season 3 or 4 lets get those out again while you're at it.

[SteveTheCynic]

Everyone should be able to get everything in this content starved game. Id like to get one of those bowcaster pistols from ranked season 3 or 4 lets get those out again while you're at it.

The sarcasm here seems misplaced. xor isn't asking for "everything". He's suggesting an alternative subscriber incentive reward system, since the old one's strength has been invalidated.

 

(Think of it this way: I already had both Nico and Shae for being subscribed on the right dates in the past. Now just one subscribe-on-this-date date gets someone who wasn't subscribed back then BOTH of them, and I get NOTHING for my loyalty this time around.)

 

And yes, I agree that a veteran-subscriber reward system would be a better way of doing it.

[BRKMSN]

The sarcasm here seems misplaced.

I hate to tell you, but that wasn't sarcasm.

 

The floodgates have been opened up.

[SteveTheCynic]

I hate to tell you, but that wasn't sarcasm.

 

The floodgates have been opened up.

I'm well aware that the floodgates are wide open, but the remark about PvP rewards was not really justified by the circumstances.

[BRKMSN]

I'm well aware that the floodgates are wide open, but the remark about PvP rewards was not really justified by the circumstances.

I understand and agree, but that poster is serious. Now that constant forum spamming has paid off for the sub rewards, the next step is to go after the pvp rewards people didn't earn. You'll see. The arguments will be that in game items shouldn't be walled off by playing style and people didn't really "earn" them anyway since win trading is a thing. The other recycled "appeal to pity" arguments will also flood the discussions.

[SteveTheCynic]

I understand and agree, but that poster is serious. Now that constant forum spamming has paid off for the sub rewards, the next step is to go after the pvp rewards people didn't earn. You'll see.

For sure people will do it. Not a good thing, though.

The arguments will be that in game items shouldn't be walled off by playing style

I'd love to hear their justification for that "should". If someone says, "I don't like it that in-game items are walled off by playing style," I'd say, "OK, that's nice," but I can think of no way to justify a "should" in there.

and people didn't really "earn" them anyway since win trading is a thing

That's a different question, and is more down to how they can deal with incidents of win-trading. (PvP without premades and with mechanisms to prevent enter-syncing might help here, but anything like that will tend to lengthen wait times.)

The other recycled "appeal to pity" arguments will also flood the discussions.

Yeah, well, despite their effectiveness, "appeal to pity" arguments are worth less than zero.

[BRKMSN]

Yeah, well, despite their effectiveness, "appeal to pity" arguments are worth less than zero.

 

The effectiveness is their worth. Appeal to pity doesn't strengthen an argument, but it does effectively persuade the listener (reader).

[SteveTheCynic]

The effectiveness is their worth. Appeal to pity doesn't strengthen an argument, but it does effectively persuade the listener (reader).

Pfft. Not this listener. If anything, an appeal to pity will make me *less* likely to agree, especially if the pity-inspiring circumstance is one that touched me, but didn't prevent me from doing the thing being appealed for.

 

(Case in point: the guy who complained about being unable to subscribe in time to get Nico, citing "job, death in the family". I have a job, and I'd had a death in the family, and yet I found five minutes to get my subscription set up. No sympathy for him from me.)

[drug_cartel]

I do prefer the Veteran Rewards system over the "Only New Subscriber Rewards", but I guess that's because I most frequently find myself on the 'Veteran' side of things as a subscriber. I'm the type of guy who will let a subscription continue to pull out of my debit card even if I'm not playing a game (I was subbed to DCUO for over a year without even having it installed on the new computer).

 

It would have been awesome if this was "You get Shae!" If you've already got Shae, "You get Nico!". If you've already got Nico, "You get Jakarro!" [Or any other random NPC they might feel like adding].

 

Instead, it's "Thank you, subscribers. Except you there, who paid the most money. We won't be thanking you because we know you're going nowhere."

[BRKMSN]

I do prefer the Veteran Rewards system over the "Only New Subscriber Rewards", but I guess that's because I most frequently find myself on the 'Veteran' side of things as a subscriber. I'm the type of guy who will let a subscription continue to pull out of my debit card even if I'm not playing a game (I was subbed to DCUO for over a year without even having it installed on the new computer).

 

It would have been awesome if this was "You get Shae!" If you've already got Shae, "You get Nico!". If you've already got Nico, "You get Jakarro!" [Or any other random NPC they might feel like adding].

 

Instead, it's "Thank you, subscribers. Except you there, who paid the most money. We won't be thanking you because we know you're going nowhere."

To be honest, I wouldn't be surprised if Bioware has something additional in there for those subs by the time it comes out.

[xordevoreaux]

I've stated in another thread that I'm done caring what I get for subscriber rewards, and this holds true, but to help the creatively bankrupt on SWTOR's dev team, I've listed below the actual veteran rewards from Everquest II from my oldest Eq2 account that I qualify for (12 years' worth). There may be more, but I only have the 12 years.

 

Hopefully, by providing this, any sort of veteran reward system created for SWTOR includes more than recycled mounts, pets, and emotes. Some of the items listed below are irrelevant for SWTOR because they address completely different in-game mechanics. Some are low value, but notice the frequency that rewards come as well as what they have.

 

Definitions:

field repair kit (armor repair)

forgiveness (experience debt mechanic, not meaningful in SWTOR)

Makeover/Reforming (complete character appearance change token)

Paying rent on strongholds is a thing in EQ2, so there are some RRs (Rent Reductions). % listed is % off rent.

GTN Deco (not called the GTN but player auction house has a similar SWTOR tax). Listed is % off. Unlimited.

Shapechange token (unlimited usually, but timed) for a unique, specific illusion. Usually grants no buffs/abilities.

Toy - could be something that follows, floats around you, gives the equivalent of a tuning item

Vitality Refresh - has no swtor equivalent, but you could think of it as resetting to rested xp for crafting/adventuring

Stronghold - there are many buyable strongholds (houses) for everyone, but some are exclusive to veteran rewards

Inventory Bag (bank and personal inventory has slots, and slots can have bags, and bags can have items).

Unattuner -- makes an object currently bound to your character unbound again

 

 

Anything with a number next to it is a consumable x number of times.

I'm not listing what the house decos are other than they're decos, not the point here.

 

1 Day - 12-slot inventory bag

1 Week - 6 potions of 30-min xp gain, 55%

1 Month - 1 house deco, 3 field repair kits, 3 wands of forgiveness

3 Months - 1 house deco, Reforming Stone (1 charge), Firework (unlimited)

6 Months - 6 potions of 1-hour xp gain, 77%

1 Year - 6 potions of 1-hour xp gain, 110%. Title: The Loyal

18 months - Fancy Firework (unlimited), 1 house deco

2 Years - 6 potions of 1-hour xp gain, 110%, Makeover Mirror (1 charge), Title: The Dedicated

3 Years - 6 potions of 1-hour xp gain, 110%, Title: The Distinguished, Title: Server name, GTN Deco 40%

4 Years - 6 potions of 1-hour xp gain, 110%, Shapechange token (unlimited), Title: The Zealous, RR Deco 25%

5 Years - 6 potions of 1-hour xp gain, 110%, Toy (floats around you), Firework (unlimited), Vitality Refresh (xp)

6 Years - Unlimited Buff for faster harvesting, Group summon token (unlimited), outfit, 3 wands of forgiveness

7 Years - Stronghold (huge 17th Century Renaissance-style Castle)

 

8 Years - Self-resurrection token (unlimited), toy (illusion), Title: The Veteran, Flying Mount, 6 potions of 1-hour xp gain, 110%

 

9 Years - 3 scrolls of self-resurrection (1x), 7 unattuners (1x), 3 Field Repairs (1x), 3 health potions, 3 xp potions, House Deco (GTN 50% reduction)

 

10 Years - Token to claim 1 companion, being from one particular city alignment (think lightside/darkside)

 

11 Years - Stronghold (A zone representing the entire starting area of the game), 17 Decos

 

12 Years - 365 Loyaly tokens (unique vendor currency)

Edited April 2, 2018 by xordevoreaux

[drug_cartel]

To be honest, I wouldn't be surprised if Bioware has something additional in there for those subs by the time it comes out.

 

I wish that that were true, but given that the whole goal of this seems to be to encourage people to sub by 04/03/18, I really can't imagine them keeping a bonus secret that might have brought in extra subs, nor do I think they're going to announce something extra tomorrow, the day before the deadline.

 

I'm pretty sure they just assume those subscribers are already subbed anyway, and going to stay subbed no matter what, so we do not deserve to be included in the thank you.

[PorsaLindahl]

Something about all this is somehow familiar.

[zombiehk]

i agree, i saw the post about the companions being given out to premium players and immediately lost a little love for this game, the developer at least. For one, i already have those companions. And two, what real benefit does my subscription get me? i can buy unlocks for everything a sub gets, i can buy cartel coins. what do i really get for my money that non subs cant have? A veteran rewards program would be nice, sub only items, something. We as subs keep the game alive and i do love playing but as of now it seems only benefit to being a sub is early access to expansions. Show us some love, no more everything for everyone

[JEDIKATT]

we had to wait, subscribed, every month, to get bits and pieces of nico.

The gun.

The hat.

The npc.

 

Our reward for being loyal subscribers.

Now, the value of that loyalty has been erased by nico's reintroduction.

 

Therefore, now that the swtor gaming community knows, demonstrably, that there are, in fact, no subscriber time-driven rewards, but rather things that just pop up every once in a while and you can sub when you want, loyalty be damned...

 

...then it's time to introduce loyalty rewards, because, obviously, the sub rewards now repeat.

 

Everquest 2 has veteran rewards. You get those rewards over time for the time you put in. One the first week, one the first month, one after 6 months, and then a reward (excuse me, a collection of 3 to 6 rewards) on every anniversary thereafter.

 

Time for swtor to do the same, so that truely loyal subscribers who never break their subscription are rewarded.

Everything else, now, we know, are not subscriber rewards. They are cyclical rewards for the fickle who quit and quit and quit over and over again. Oh look! I'll subscribe this month, get that, then unsubscribe until something else i want from days gone by makes an appearance.

 

Fine. Bioware has made its choice in this matter, the decision is done.

 

So now, bioware, turn your attention to your truly loyal subscribers, and reward them, and there's only one way you can do that -- by tracking their uninterrupted subscriptions, and rewarding accordingly. Over time.

 

 

this can be good but at the same time i like old stuff geting re gifted as i missed out on the hk gift level and posters and comp,s

 

also that bit by bit re sub ober most of a year to get that stuff was a pain in the back

==================

 

to the op the ncp give away is just for the ncp,s not the other rewards that came with them

[xordevoreaux]

i agree, i saw the post about the companions being given out to premium players and immediately lost a little love for this game, the developer at least. For one, i already have those companions. And two, what real benefit does my subscription get me? i can buy unlocks for everything a sub gets, i can buy cartel coins. what do i really get for my money that non subs cant have? A veteran rewards program would be nice, sub only items, something. We as subs keep the game alive and i do love playing but as of now it seems only benefit to being a sub is early access to expansions. Show us some love, no more everything for everyone

 

Non-subs with guild bank unlock cannot get credits out of the bank, just stuff. Taking credits from a guild bank is subscriber only.

 

Even when buying an extra crew skill, a non-sub cannot load up a companion with 5 items to craft at one time, just one.

 

A non-sub is limited to the amount of credits one can have on hand without paying cc for unlocks to those credits. Subs have no such cap.

 

The list goes on but it's late.

You get the idea.

[BRKMSN]

Non-subs with guild bank unlock cannot get credits out of the bank, just stuff. Taking credits from a guild bank is subscriber only.

 

Even when buying an extra crew skill, a non-sub cannot load up a companion with 5 items to craft at one time, just one.

 

A non-sub is limited to the amount of credits one can have on hand without paying cc for unlocks to those credits. Subs have no such cap.

 

The list goes on but it's late.

You get the idea.

I wouldn't argue that we aren't way better off without the F2P restrictions, but I look at it a little bit different.

 

A sub pays about $75-80 every six months. A stand alone new release premium video game for practically any console or PC is $50-60 . Being an MMO, we need to make sure the servers are funded too. So in essence, we should be getting the equivalent of 2 expansions / year from a content standpoint. Currently we aren't seeing anything close to that rate and the time spent changing critical aspects of the game has yielded disappointing results.

 

Because of the scale down in development resources, we should have actually seen a reduction in the monthly subscription rate. A sub fee reduction could very well yield the same revenue if the reduced costs encourage more subs. But at least then (after a sub fee reduction) you could make a stronger argument that the "value" of the sub benefits is fair even in the absence of new content. But as long as they keep the rates at $13-15 / month, there should be something to offset the lack of new content.

[GRIM_REAPER_Xdc]

I agree there needs to be something for the long term subscribers. I knew a great many players (at the time) including myself who were only remaining subscribed through the content drought to receive the Nico rewards (and later the HK chapter reward).

 

However if all these rewards are just going to be brought back what's the incentive to stay subscribed? If a subscriber bonus pops up most of the time now it's a re-skinned pet, nothing of any significance. I agree 100% with the OP, there needs to be a Veteran style reward system (even though I've never played EQ this sounds great) to incentivise long term subscriptions.

 

 

This would probably be a fairly straightforward system to implement and I believe it would have an immediate effect on subscription numbers (providing the rewards and known in advance and are significant). Players who are on the fence about re-subbing or not may do so simply because they are feeling WANTED. After all, isn't that the reason most players unsub, because they don't feel the game is providing anything to keep them interested?

[PorsaLindahl]

I'm going to highlight some of the suggestions from my old thread here because it's full of arguing over the current rewards system.

 

 

Birthday rewards for each character (regardless of sub or time played - and yes, I realize this will cause some of you to lash out at the idea). Each anniversary that character gets a birthday present (like a CM crate).

 

In these presents are:

 

 

• 1 Credit boom giving 100k-500k Credits
  
• A mini pet / holo of Satele/Malgus/Shae/Malcom, etc.
  
• A tiered companion token (T1 for 1st anniversary, T2 for 2nd and so on) for the numerous companions that have been released either through the CM or through subscriber rewards. Only one can be chosen per token, but the holocommunicator/license can be traded.
  

 

Event rewarded companions (Master Ranos / Darth Hexid) should remain gated as event rewards as the events may repeated in the future. Each tiered companion holocommunicator will only unlock the specific companion for that character, but may be unlocked in collections for a nominal CC cost.

 

 

• Tier 1: Akk Dog, Probe Droid, other Creature / Droid companion.
  
• Tier 2: Nico Okarr, Nexxu, other Creature / Droid companion.
  
• Tier 3: HK-55, Z0-OM, Creature / other Droid companion.
  
• Tier 4: Wampa, K1-Z3N, other Droid / Creature companion.
  
• Tier 5: Shae Vizla, Droid / Creature companion.
  

 

 

I realize that some will say "Why put Shae at 5 years?" Well why not? She wasn't introduced as a companion until after the 4th anniversary of the game. Everyone got along fine without her for that long before and even now. What's changed now? And remember these holocommunicators will be trade-able if implemented. That adds more value to the higher tiered companions. So those that already have these companions can sell them or hoard them for future alts.

 

 

 

Even SWG more or less did this. It has been so long ago I forgot when they implemented it to be honest. But I do remember you could unsub/resub and it'd pick up where you left off... but you'd always be a bit behind on getting any new reward added to the system. Which is fair enough. You'll still get it... but you would've gotten it when it was brand new had you been subscribed the whole time.

 

I still think they need to make it more tangible... but limited to your account.

• Pick One Item (Bound to Legacy) at so many months from Cartel Market
  
• Earn 1 Free Character Kiosk Token (no limit to CC changes done to character)
  
• Free Cartel Packs
  
• Free Month if you stay subbed for a year
  

 

Those are just a few things I'd run with over the current system. On the Cartel Packs... those would also be Bound to Legacy things. That'd be key to me. It is a reward to You; but you also can't RNG make millions of credits off it out of stupid luck vs. someone else getting jack. Example: Wind up with a Defiant Ventilated Lightsaber (hell, even 2 of them)... guess what? No selling them. But they'd be BoL or BoP on whichever toon claimed it from stash.

 

 

 

 

 

If they did it like SWG there were various items in the vet rewards.

 

Example:

 

3 Month Rewards

Self powered harvester kit*

Holonet Terminal

Translator Terminal

Control Array

Holonet Tracking Console

Protocol Droid Miniature Replica

R2 Droid Miniature Replica

 

 

6 Month Rewards

A Crate of Free Resources*

YT1300 Passenger Lounge

YT1300 Modular Seating

TIE Fighter Miniature Replica

X-wing Miniature Replica

 

You have a variety of items to choose from.

Note: These items could be geared more towards the Old Republic era, but the theory is sound.

 

 

And...

 

I would like to add my suggestion to this list.

 

I suggest a subscriber rewards program that rewarded players for total sub time, non-contiguous. Here is the general gist.

 

SWG had a great program for subscriber rewards IMO, and I think a similar system would do well here.

 

The idea is to reward subs for total amount of time they played, but I would change it up a bit....I would set it for total amount of time SUBSCRIBED.

 

First, you would need to be subscribed to receive the rewards, and you could only collect the reward on one server, one character.

 

Second, it would be set up in tiers....every 90 days of subscription, the days/months would have no need to be contiguous. All items would be bound to legacy (with noted exceptions), so they can not be sold or traded.

 

90 - 100cc

180 - low demand armor set (bronze)

270 - low demand speeder (bronze)

360 - transfer token

 

450 - 250cc

540 - medium demand armor set (silver)

630 - medium demand speeder (silver)

720 - 5 character slots

 

810 - 500cc

900 - high demand armor set (gold)

990 - high demand speeder (gold)

1080 - rename token

 

1170 - 1000cc

1260 - rare armor set (platinum)

1350 - rare demand speeder (platinum)

1440 - level up token

 

1530 - 2000cc

1620 - Legacy XP bonus armor set

1710 - rare animal and droid companion

1800 - white/white and black/black dye

 

1890 - 3000cc

1980 - 5 ultra rare weapons

2070 - code for 30 days sub time (can be given to friend)

2160 - 100 percent XP boost legacy implant

 

2250 - code for 90 days sub and 2400 coins (can be given to friend), exclusive mount and title

 

This is just a general example of what you could offer, you could go more conservative, but IMO those that have been subbed this entire time deserve special rewards.

 

Note: While Artemis breaks it down in 90 day increments, it may be a little confusing. In order to be less confusing, think of it in 3 month increments.

 

 

These are just general ideas of what can be given. I won't put words into other people's mouths. I won't claim to know their thoughts, other than what they express.