Why Was Oricon Never Made Solo-Friendly?

[VegasTheLost]

I'm from TRE as well and I'm always baffled by this fear of operations and raiders. Maybe it is a server thing, as you say. I never had a problem when I was new.

 

Well, I had some back in the days, but I was trying to join a HM SnV as a fresh 60.

[Ylliarus]

You don't deserve a solo mode the story line wasn't designed to have this so why should bioware get down on there hands and knees to please some guy/girl who can't get 7 other friends together to complete what they designed so give up on this quest it's not going to happen.

 

The storyline can be started from the mission terminal from the player's personal ship. Have you seen anything but story content in there? No. The Oricon arc appears there as a mission to continue the story, per definition it makes it a narrative to further the overall story. So everyone in the game has a right to see and experience the tale from start to end, how are you so blind you don't see this. Oricon was presented as a storyline on its own, yes you'd get the full story experience if having previously done the operations but is it a requirement to start Oricon? No.

 

So we do have a right to see the story of Oricon from start to end, how the heck would it ever occur to you we wouldn't have the same right to story content as raiders? If we didn't have a right to it the entire Oricon arc would have been locked behind a requirement to have done the operations that prelude it. It was just an oversight of the dev team to allow a solo alternative to it which was corrected in Shadow of Revan but not yet in Oricon, so hence why I am asking for them to repair this oversight.

[DieAlteHexe]

I'm from TRE as well and I'm always baffled by this fear of operations and raiders. Maybe it is a server thing, as you say. I never had a problem when I was new.

 

As for me, it's a "once burnt, twice shy" thing. Actually more than "once burnt".

 

I have a different...hmm..."speed" at which I game which is not appreciated by a lot of folks. To put it bluntly, I dither, wander, explore, check out etc. This is annoying to folk who are more goal oriented and I totally get that. I'm also fairly lazy when it comes to gear with the mindset of "if I can tackle the content, I'm good" and that also irks raiders/OPs etc. (again, understandably).

 

So, it's not "fear" with me, it's defense both my part and the part of those whose heads would explode if they included me. Also, I have to /afk sometimes without notice which is problematic.

 

Thus, I love content where I can mosey along at my own rate, enjoy a decent story, and don't inconvenience others.

 

No fear!

[Ahbal]

Then your tone in your writing comes over as very hostile, because I am more than capable of continuing a discussion in a sensible and rational way, but if I start losing my temper there is a reason for that. So I suggest you rethink your tone instead of stating I am losing my mind, because I am rather very calm (again an assumption about me from your side).

 

It will not be like adding entirely new content, I am not asking for a solo mode in the operation. I am asking for a way to bypass the operations instead so that those can remain untouched, how many times do I have to repeat myself? It will be adding a few tweaks as only 1 little dialogue option would be added as a bypass to the operations, that is the suggestion I am making nothing else. If the devs added entire new cutscenes to the start of this game, then surely this must be a walk in the park.

Adding to this, the devs started seeing that when people are properly rewarded for content they will go back and redo it. You can expect the devs will be looking at the dailies now as to how to improve on them because of the CXP bug. The devs saw there is an interest in older content that way, so it would be the perfect opportunity to add in a solo alternative for Oricon.

 

Ah missed this while typing another response, again. No idea how I came off as hostile in terms of tone either but Ill try to write differently this time.

 

Ok, so its not that simple. The OP consists of you fighting the whole council at once. Thats how the story goes. This fight has its own mechanics, each master fights differently. You fight them in completely unique fights seperately, then you fight them in a council chamber of sorts all at once. Yes, an alternative would be great but due to how the masters themselves fight it is very difficult to keep the essence and story of the fight (each master has their own style) in a solo alternative due to the ops mechanics. The most viable alternative is to do it the god mode way (unfortunately) in terms of Dev team time. As, most likely, they are working on another expansion. Also, the cutscenes werent completely new from what ive seen, cutscenes are very different to redoing mechanics from an op and retrofitting them into a solo alternative.

[fushnchips]

The storyline can be started from the mission terminal from the player's personal ship. Have you seen anything but story content in there? No. The Oricon arc appears there as a mission to continue the story, per definition it makes it a narrative to further the overall story. So everyone in the game has a right to see and experience the tale from start to end, how are you so blind you don't see this. Oricon was presented as a storyline on its own, yes you'd get the full story experience if having previously done the operations but is it a requirement to start Oricon? No.

 

So we do have a right to see the story of Oricon from start to end, how the heck would it ever occur to you we wouldn't have the same right to story content as raiders? If we didn't have a right to it the entire Oricon arc would have been locked behind a requirement to have done the operations that prelude it. It was just an oversight of the dev team to allow a solo alternative to it which was corrected in Shadow of Revan but not yet in Oricon, so hence why I am asking for them to repair this oversight.

 

get it out of your head it's nothing about raiders it's about how bioware made the content cycle it was started from a terminal or the ship then you went through the story and then you have to fight the dread masters and so on just kill it in SM if you can't find 7 others go play space invaders or something because Bioware will never break how they done that content and you need to relise this and get over it.

[Ahbal]

As for me, it's a "once burnt, twice shy" thing. Actually more than "once burnt".

 

I have a different...hmm..."speed" at which I game which is not appreciated by a lot of folks. To put it bluntly, I dither, wander, explore, check out etc. This is annoying to folk who are more goal oriented and I totally get that. I'm also fairly lazy when it comes to gear with the mindset of "if I can tackle the content, I'm good" and that also irks raiders/OPs etc. (again, understandably).

 

So, it's not "fear" with me, it's defense both my part and the part of those whose heads would explode if they included me. Also, I have to /afk sometimes without notice which is problematic.

 

Thus, I love content where I can mosey along at my own rate, enjoy a decent story, and don't inconvenience others.

 

No fear!

 

Yes in your case, Group finder/pickup groups arent the best option. Or progression guilds. Try to find people who are like you in playstyle. Also, not to be "rude" or "hostile" but AFK'ing without warning is definitely a problem. Some finding it very rude, some see it like you dont care about the group (being selfish) etc. Which are all fair points considering theyve got no idea what happened. Also, its not an inconvenience if they know. If you are part of a group, just tell them! I used to be on a horrid connection where I would lose connection (often mid fight too!) but I told my team that. Even though Id sometimes lose connection 2-3 times a fight, they stuck with me. Unfortunately...once I got a new connection...the solo focus came around and they all left (as i described in another post here).

 

Try to find a guild or friends like that, it is worth it.

[Ylliarus]

Ah missed this while typing another response, again. No idea how I came off as hostile in terms of tone either but Ill try to write differently this time.

 

Ok, so its not that simple. The OP consists of you fighting the whole council at once. Thats how the story goes. This fight has its own mechanics, each master fights differently. You fight them in completely unique fights seperately, then you fight them in a council chamber of sorts all at once. Yes, an alternative would be great but due to how the masters themselves fight it is very difficult to keep the essence and story of the fight (each master has their own style) in a solo alternative due to the ops mechanics. The most viable alternative is to do it the god mode way (unfortunately) in terms of Dev team time. As, most likely, they are working on another expansion. Also, the cutscenes werent completely new from what ive seen, cutscenes are very different to redoing mechanics from an op and retrofitting them into a solo alternative.

 

Then we finally have managed to come to understand one another.

 

Yes, redoing the fight with the Dread Masters would indeed be problematic and making it Revan-style would indeed require more development time to be put into it. Hence why it is not something that I have been suggesting as I know the size of the dev team is too small for that as well as the fact there are bigger fish to fry. It's why I ask for doing the dailies X amount of times as an alternative and have in the story, should you choose the solo alternative, that a strike team went in and defeated the Dread Masters while you were holding the territory for the team to return. I am convinced soloplayers wouldn't mind not having to fight the Dread Masters, I am sure they'd be more than happy to do the dialies X amount of times. Should the alternative be done that way you'll please the people who want to further the story but not do the operations, you won't have to stick crazy amounts of development time into it and you'll leave the operations untouched so that group content focused players won't feel a thing of the entire alternative and stick to happily raiding as they did before. It would be a win-win situation.

[Ylliarus]

get it out of your head it's nothing about raiders it's about how bioware made the content cycle it was started from a terminal or the ship then you went through the story and then you have to fight the dread masters and so on just kill it in SM if you can't find 7 others go play space invaders or something because Bioware will never break how they done that content and you need to relise this and get over it.

 

Nope, I don't. Because in Shadow of Revan they managed to present a solo alternative next to the operation, so if the dev team could do it there they can also do it with Oricon. It was an oversight to not implement a solo alternative to Oricon from the start, thus I consider it my duty to stick here in these forums and try to point it out to the devs. So no, I won't be realising or getting over anything, but I have the same amount of right to suggest or ask for a revision of something as you have in asking for new operations or more group content.

 

Also, why would I leave this game for space invaders? I've invested 5 years worth of time and money into this game and it's my favourite one to play. What an idiotic and pathetic thing to reply with, but I guess if you can't reply sensibly to an argument saying "go away" or "play another game" is the sole option left.

Edited September 5, 2017 by Ylliarus

[Ahbal]

Then we finally have managed to come to understand one another.

 

Yes, redoing the fight with the Dread Masters would indeed be problematic and making it Revan-style would indeed require more development time to be put into it. Hence why it is not something that I have been suggesting as I know the size of the dev team is too small for that as well as the fact there are bigger fish to fry. It's why I ask for doing the dailies X amount of times as an alternative and have in the story, should you choose the solo alternative, that a strike team went in and defeated the Dread Masters while you were holding the territory for the team to return. I am convinced soloplayers wouldn't mind not having to fight the Dread Masters, I am sure they'd be more than happy to do the dialies X amount of times. Should the alternative be done that way you'll please the people who want to further the story but not do the operations, you won't have to stick crazy amounts of development time into it and you'll leave the operations untouched so that group content focused players won't feel a thing of the entire alternative and stick to happily raiding as they did before. It would be a win-win situation.

 

Yes, thats fine but one problem. You start Oricon when you finish your main story. Your character is the "emperors wrath" or "member of the dark council" the "barsenthor" etc. You are the only one with the power to do this, also, at the start of oricon (I did this years ago, bear with my memory) they tell you Rep/Imp soldiers can't go outside of a certain area or they lose their minds to the dreadmasters power. There is no way a strike team could go into the fortress. No forces can land either. Its up to you and the other "heroes" (players on oricon) to do this. I understand what you want, but in the sense of oricons story it wont work. The more I think about it, the more I realise the "god mode" option is the most efficient idea (again, unfortunately).

 

Or, maybe....they could have NPCs that take the place of other classes. E.g, you are the imp agent.....but they pair you with NPCs who are respectively emperors wrath (warrior) dark council (inquisitor) and mandalores champion (BH) this is no different than having millions of players with these titles. Or just have them as generic imperial heroes (we never hear about other heroes, only our player character). Then have them with the player and the player, if tank class, must protect them. If healer, must heal them. If DPS must manage agro (all like in a normal op). Give them the same AI as companions but none of the invincible fully healing dumb stuff from Solo FP's. So the ops will still be hard, they wont need to be seperately redesigned but still soloable. Just have mechanics of move here do that cut out, and it should be ok. This is the best middle ground we can get imo.

[DieAlteHexe]

Yes in your case, Group finder/pickup groups arent the best option. Or progression guilds. Try to find people who are like you in playstyle. Also, not to be "rude" or "hostile" but AFK'ing without warning is definitely a problem. Some finding it very rude, some see it like you dont care about the group (being selfish) etc. Which are all fair points considering theyve got no idea what happened. Also, its not an inconvenience if they know. If you are part of a group, just tell them! I used to be on a horrid connection where I would lose connection (often mid fight too!) but I told my team that. Even though Id sometimes lose connection 2-3 times a fight, they stuck with me. Unfortunately...once I got a new connection...the solo focus came around and they all left (as i described in another post here).

 

Try to find a guild or friends like that, it is worth it.

 

I'm not alone, Ahbal. There are a lot of folk like me. We're just usually not found on forums because we're pretty much content to do our own thing and rarely have axes to grind.

 

I am aware that /afk-ing without notice is rude, which is why I won't do it to a group, as I thought I said?

 

I have a guild, thanks. Filled with like minded souls. Occasionally we get together to do stuff but we are mainly scattered due to RL considerations and obligations. It's comfortable for all of us.

 

I don't need to find groups or guilds etc. I'm content with my playstyle and hang out with those who feel as I do. I know this has been a hugely long thread so I'll clarify my stance once again. I have no issue with OPs being in a quest line so long as I know before taking and investing in that quest line. I just get crabby when I've been dithering along and BAM! Oh lookee here, you need to do an OP to finish this. Bah.

[fushnchips]

Nope, I don't. Because in Shadow of Revan they managed to present a solo alternative next to the operation, so if the dev team could do it there they can also do it with Oricon. It was an oversight to not implement a solo alternative to Oricon from the start, thus I consider it my duty to stick here in these forums and try to point it out to the devs. So no, I won't be realising or getting over anything, but I have the same amount of right to suggest or ask for a revision of something as you have in asking for new operations or more group content.

 

Also, why would I leave this game for space invaders? I've invested 5 years worth of time and money into this game and it's my favourite one to play. What an idiotic and pathetic thing to reply with, but I guess if you can't reply sensibly to an argument saying "go away" or "play another game" is the sole option left.

 

Well at least I can do SM lol and SOR was after oricon so back then they saw a different path as it should be actually you should go play Star Wars the original arcade game at least you have solo content in it.

[Ylliarus]

Yes, thats fine but one problem. You start Oricon when you finish your main story. Your character is the "emperors wrath" or "member of the dark council" the "barsenthor" etc. You are the only one with the power to do this, also, at the start of oricon (I did this years ago, bear with my memory) they tell you Rep/Imp soldiers can't go outside of a certain area or they lose their minds to the dreadmasters power. There is no way a strike team could go into the fortress. No forces can land either. Its up to you and the other "heroes" (players on oricon) to do this. I understand what you want, but in the sense of oricons story it wont work. The more I think about it, the more I realise the "god mode" option is the most efficient idea (again, unfortunately).

 

Or, maybe....they could have NPCs that take the place of other classes. E.g, you are the imp agent.....but they pair you with NPCs who are respectively emperors wrath (warrior) dark council (inquisitor) and mandalores champion (BH) this is no different than having millions of players with these titles. Or just have them as generic imperial heroes (we never hear about other heroes, only our player character). Then have them with the player and the player, if tank class, must protect them. If healer, must heal them. If DPS must manage agro (all like in a normal op). Give them the same AI as companions but none of the invincible fully healing dumb stuff from Solo FP's. So the ops will still be hard, they wont need to be seperately redesigned but still soloable. Just have mechanics of move here do that cut out, and it should be ok. This is the best middle ground we can get imo.

 

And thus consensus is possible! I agree, my solution isn't ideal because lore wise it would break the Oricon narrative. So if the Dev team would be more willing to invest more developing time into this then indeed your proposal is a better alternative. I could see a solo fight like that working, barring getting the same exp and rewards as doing the operations themselves. I wouldn't even mind if the penalty for doing the solo route would give you no rewards at all, not even exp or cxp, only giving you story progression.

 

So again, I'd think that if the devs had the time and will to redo all the cutscenes for all the starts of the eight classes, they aren't adverse to going back and revising old content. Especially now that the devs have realised that people will gladly do old content if properly rewarded as was the case with the CXP bug. So I'd say it would be well worth it to invest some time and money in making a solo alternative along the lines of what you suggested, or simply making a revan-style fight but solely the Dread Masters boss fight and not all the other stuff from the operation, because if you'd want to see/experience that you'd naturally have to simply do the ops.

[DieAlteHexe]

Well at least I can do SM lol and SOR was after oricon so back then they saw a different path as it should be actually you should go play Star Wars the original arcade game at least you have solo content in it.

 

Ahhh the smell of snark early in the morning.

 

Guys, you're unlikely to achieve a meeting of the minds here. This debate has been ongoing for decades now. It's a shame as it almost always devolves into bickering and meanders off the course of the discussion.

 

I'm pretty happy with the amount of solo content and not fussed about not doing OPs (is my choice) but I do get cranky when an OP intrudes on my lovely solo quest line. Happily it's not a common occurrence.

[Ahbal]

I'm not alone, Ahbal. There are a lot of folk like me. We're just usually not found on forums because we're pretty much content to do our own thing and rarely have axes to grind.

 

I am aware that /afk-ing without notice is rude, which is why I won't do it to a group, as I thought I said?

 

I have a guild, thanks. Filled with like minded souls. Occasionally we get together to do stuff but we are mainly scattered due to RL considerations and obligations. It's comfortable for all of us.

 

I don't need to find groups or guilds etc. I'm content with my playstyle and hang out with those who feel as I do. I know this has been a hugely long thread so I'll clarify my stance once again. I have no issue with OPs being in a quest line so long as I know before taking and investing in that quest line. I just get crabby when I've been dithering along and BAM! Oh lookee here, you need to do an OP to finish this. Bah.

 

What I meant was, no need to avoid the content. Because I know there are players out there with your playstyle (i didnt know you were in a likeminded guild already). I was only saying to team up with them to do this content the way you like, at your own pace. I was just trying to help as I dont like seeing people miss out on things like OPs because the experience is awesome with a like minded group of people, which it seems you have which is good.

[Ylliarus]

Well at least I can do SM lol and SOR was after oricon so back then they saw a different path as it should be actually you should go play Star Wars the original arcade game at least you have solo content in it.

 

Rather immature reply. No thank you, I'll stick to the game where I have been a subscriber of for five years and invested enormous amount of time into doing story, PvP, Flashpoints and all the other aspects of except operations.

 

And did I ever say I can't do story mode? Nope, never said that. I said I don't want to do operations because of people like you being in them. Two seperate and different things, but I don't expect you to understand. I play for pleasure, don't need to have my freetime be ruined by the likes of you.

Edited September 5, 2017 by Ylliarus

[fushnchips]

Rather immature reply. No thank you, I'll stick to the game where I have been a subscriber of for five years and invested enormous amount of time into.

 

And did I ever say I can't do story mode? Nope, never said that. I said I don't want to do operations because of people like you being in them. Two seperate and different things, but I don't expect you to understand.

 

I actually help people all the time it's just you with the solo attitude I don't agree with so end of the day I have the right to disagree with what you want in a game I also have been subbed to since day 1 and yes 5 years of been a solid sub I stuck through the mud of terror KOTFE/KOTET.

[DieAlteHexe]

What I meant was, no need to avoid the content. Because I know there are players out there with your playstyle (i didnt know you were in a likeminded guild already). I was only saying to team up with them to do this content the way you like, at your own pace. I was just trying to help as I dont like seeing people miss out on things like OPs because the experience is awesome with a like minded group of people, which it seems you have which is good.

 

Awww, I'm sorry if it sounded like I was snarling at you, wasn't my intent at all. My apologies for that.

 

Not being snarky here but OPs aren't something I'm overly interested in as a rule. Maybe because when I game I want to be Über and do it all by my own self? Or maybe because I'm still traumatised from EQ raiding days? Probably the former, if pushed into it. I like figuring things out myself and the challenge (I got my arse handed to me yesterday in a VM flashpoint. I ended up laughing too much at myself to try and bailed, it was hilarious. But...challenge accepted!).

 

My guild was specifically created so that like-minded souls (wanderers, short attention span, RL issues, etc.) had a place where we could chat with each other, share crafting and other things. Amusingly, most of us did play EQ and swore never, ever to deal with that stuff again, even for an hour. We're scarred.

[Ahbal]

And thus consensus is possible! I agree, my solution isn't ideal because lore wise it would break the Oricon narrative. So if the Dev team would be more willing to invest more developing time into this then indeed your proposal is a better alternative. I could see a solo fight like that working, barring getting the same exp and rewards as doing the operations themselves. I wouldn't even mind if the penalty for doing the solo route would give you no rewards at all, not even exp or cxp, only giving you story progression.

 

So again, I'd think that if the devs had the time and will to redo all the cutscenes for all the starts of the eight classes, they aren't adverse to going back and revising old content. Especially now that the devs have realised that people will gladly do old content if properly rewarded as was the case with the CXP bug. So I'd say it would be well worth it to invest some time and money in making a solo alternative along the lines of what you suggested, or simply making a revan-style fight but solely the Dread Masters boss fight and not all the other stuff from the operation, because if you'd want to see/experience that you'd naturally have to simply do the ops.

 

Yes it is very doable in terms of dev time, as essentialy they just need some new companions and to cut some abilities/mechanics and it should be fine. As, if many wanted to go back and replay it...quite frankly there arent enough players around to do it (players who know it are mostly all gone too) which i think I said on this thread somewhere, might have been another one.

 

In terms of Revan fight, respectfully, it was horrible (solo version). It broke the story for me. IMO, it should have been you, marr and satele (or your choice of heroes). Thats it. There were way too many characters in the fight. There was no sense of urgency or mortality (lana and satele could heal even when trapped). For a solo fight to work, it needs to have the players role (tank, dps, healer) be important in the fight like in the example I put forward.Or else its not impactful at all, which is why, even now, I still feel a bit opposed to a soloable dread palace. It used to be a struggle to do even with overgeared and experienced players at the time, and when you beat them you truly felt like you beat them. The solo version must be similar, or else the story will feel shallow or not impactful as SoR.

[Ylliarus]

I actually help people all the time it's just you with the solo attitude I don't agree with so end of the day I have the right to disagree with what you want in a game I also have been subbed to since day 1 and yes 5 years of been a solid sub I stuck through the mud of terror KOTFE/KOTET.

 

You mistake my request for a solo alternative being one of a solo attitude. I play PvP daily, I do Uprising and Flashpoints daily, I have been and am active in guilds. I most certainly don't have a solo attitude and saying I do is generalising and stereotyping what a player with a more solo-focus is.

 

We have a right to disagree, but did you see me telling you to go to another game? Did you see me replying immaturely "at least I can do sm lol"? I remained rational and sensible, you turned snarky and childish. That is not the proper way to disagree with people.

[Ylliarus]

Yes it is very doable in terms of dev time, as essentialy they just need some new companions and to cut some abilities/mechanics and it should be fine. As, if many wanted to go back and replay it...quite frankly there arent enough players around to do it (players who know it are mostly all gone too) which i think I said on this thread somewhere, might have been another one.

 

In terms of Revan fight, respectfully, it was horrible (solo version). It broke the story for me. IMO, it should have been you, marr and satele (or your choice of heroes). Thats it. There were way too many characters in the fight. There was no sense of urgency or mortality (lana and satele could heal even when trapped). For a solo fight to work, it needs to have the players role (tank, dps, healer) be important in the fight like in the example I put forward.Or else its not impactful at all, which is why, even now, I still feel a bit opposed to a soloable dread palace. It used to be a struggle to do even with overgeared and experienced players at the time, and when you beat them you truly felt like you beat them. The solo version must be similar, or else the story will feel shallow or not impactful as SoR.

 

I completely agree, I wouldn't mind it being a challenge at all as that's the most fun content. If they could make a solo fight that indeed forces the player to know their class and struggle in defeating the Dread Masters that would be epic. Let me have to respawn several times, make me think and challenge me to really try in defeating them. I'd love it in a solo version of the Dread Palace!

 

The Revan fight is indeed a very easy thing and even a slight joke. As dying there is nigh impossible especially if you are already level 70 as leveling goes fast these days. So if they made a solo alternative along these lines then I would be more than happy if it would have difficult mechanics just like in the operation. As I said in my OP or a reply afterwards it would be the perfect preparation for the raid.

Edited September 5, 2017 by Ylliarus

[Ahbal]

Awww, I'm sorry if it sounded like I was snarling at you, wasn't my intent at all. My apologies for that.

 

Not being snarky here but OPs aren't something I'm overly interested in as a rule. Maybe because when I game I want to be Über and do it all by my own self? Or maybe because I'm still traumatised from EQ raiding days? Probably the former, if pushed into it. I like figuring things out myself and the challenge (I got my arse handed to me yesterday in a VM flashpoint. I ended up laughing too much at myself to try and bailed, it was hilarious. But...challenge accepted!).

 

My guild was specifically created so that like-minded souls (wanderers, short attention span, RL issues, etc.) had a place where we could chat with each other, share crafting and other things. Amusingly, most of us did play EQ and swore never, ever to deal with that stuff again, even for an hour. We're scarred.

 

Its all good, no problem.

 

What you say here makes sense, as I know people who like to take on the whole thing themselves (younger brother is like that in swtor....doesnt work well for him in warzones though). I also understand if its from trauma from previous experience as there used to be some genuinely toxic people. E.g we had a random tag along in a guild run, when a guildie lost connection, they were like "kick them kick them" over and over...There are other worse things said by other experiences but not sure they belong on the forums. On the point of VM and such, unfortunately I never tried them. I took a hiatus after 4.0 (due to losing my guilds to the solo focus ) and again after 5.0 due to more of the same. I had found a guild but again they soon left. I also hated the RNG at 5.0 launch (which is much better now hence why im back). I may quit again after these CXP bugs are patched if I cant find a guild on my server, which is slowly becoming a wasteland.

 

So yes, most certainly understand your stance, as I was in the same boat before I met my guild on BC (they were awesome). I was also avoiding OP's due to bad experience (thanks to my connection) but once I found this guild I finally got to experience OPs, I then realised how many players may miss out on Ops due to such experiences, which is why I am so passionate about convincing others to do them and find people (to others who will read this, dont give up, keep trying). I didn't know you weren't really interested in them, I thought it was just due to the people youve encountered while doing them before.

[FtWorthJim]

Everyone their own playstyle

 

And there is story for each. I am not a hard core raider mind you. I have ZERO NiM and few HM cheevs. You are saying that there's no room in your world for Op based story. This is the flaw in your argument. The writers felt otherwise. They won't go back and add to an old expac. You simply need to accept this and move on. If you want the story, take 2 hours out of your life and do an op. I promise it really won't kill you.

[Ahbal]

I completely agree, I wouldn't mind it being a challenge at all as that's the most fun content. If they could make a solo fight that indeed forces the player to know their class and struggle in defeating the Dread Masters that would be epic. Let me have to respawn several times, make me think and challenge me to really try in defeating them. I'd love it in a solo version of the Dread Palace!

 

The Revan fight is indeed a very easy thing and even a slight joke. As dying there is nigh impossible especially if you are already level 70 as leveling goes fast these days. So if they made a solo alternative along these lines then I would be more than happy if it would have difficult mechanics just like in the operation. As I said in my OP or a reply afterwards it would be the perfect preparation for the raid.

 

Yes thats pretty much it. Another thing that your post reminded me of is proving grounds. We need some sort of step up from solo (no FPs or uprisings) that teach solo players or smaller group content players new mechanics only found in Ops. Why? Because in OPs these are the players who are on the receiving end of toxicity. Now, toxicitity occurs due to frustration most of the time from my experience (players who have gear ten levels below the OP.....wasting everyones time...) but you also have genuine toxicity as I hinted at above somewhere in response to another member here. I believe this will be reduced if players transitioning to OPs from solo or FP/Uprisings have a proving ground mission they must complete once (on their legacy) to be allowed into ops. Same thing goes with gear. This will definitely encourage me to finally hit that group finder button once again, as even with FPs I find players who respectively ruin the experience, even on very easy tactical FPs. This occurence increased greatly after shadow of revan due to how easy it was. There must be a barrier, a proving ground, to ensure players can handle this content to avoid problems. Might have gone off topic a bit but its related to the solo content. As players complete the solo content then go to group stuff which is wayy harder, and wont adapt to or listen to veteran players advice.

 

e.g As a tank...many, many times. I explain to the DPS they need to agro dump/let me attack first to pull....but they dont listen. They then blame me....Toxicity comes from both sides is what Im getting at. Again, not trying to be "hostile" but thats my group content experience after SoR.

[DieAlteHexe]

Its all good, no problem.

 

What you say here makes sense, as I know people who like to take on the whole thing themselves (younger brother is like that in swtor....doesnt work well for him in warzones though). I also understand if its from trauma from previous experience as there used to be some genuinely toxic people. E.g we had a random tag along in a guild run, when a guildie lost connection, they were like "kick them kick them" over and over...There are other worse things said by other experiences but not sure they belong on the forums. On the point of VM and such, unfortunately I never tried them. I took a hiatus after 4.0 (due to losing my guilds to the solo focus ) and again after 5.0 due to more of the same. I had found a guild but again they soon left. I also hated the RNG at 5.0 launch (which is much better now hence why im back). I may quit again after these CXP bugs are patched if I cant find a guild on my server, which is slowly becoming a wasteland. .

 

Finding just the right guild can be really, really hard and frustrating. I lucked out big time finding mine and don't think I'm not totally aware of that. Some VM are not that awful, some are rough (for me anyway) so it's been a matter of "what the hell, might as well try". Have to be in the right frame of mind though because sometimes the beatdown is truly spectacular.

 

So yes, most certainly understand your stance, as I was in the same boat before I met my guild on BC (they were awesome). I was also avoiding OP's due to bad experience (thanks to my connection) but once I found this guild I finally got to experience OPs, I then realised how many players may miss out on Ops due to such experiences, which is why I am so passionate about convincing others to do them and find people (to others who will read this, dont give up, keep trying). I didn't know you weren't really interested in them, I thought it was just due to the people youve encountered while doing them before.

 

When I was playing DAoC I had the WORST connection (bite me Sprint) and that's where I learned it was just easier and kinder to stay to myself. This, of course, didn't work after a certain point in DAoC due to the game's goals. As for not being interested...it's more due to the complications than not wanting to run them. If my guild were to all of a sudden decide to hare off and do a few OPs, I'd tag along because they know me and know my quirks.

 

Given this thread I might ask around and see how many of us are lacking the OP that started this all and see if we might give it some thought. If I'm not pelted with virtual-veggies, who knows. Still want warning on quest lines about this sort of thing though.

[Ahbal]

And there is story for each. I am not a hard core raider mind you. I have ZERO NiM and few HM cheevs. You are saying that there's no room in your world for Op based story. This is the flaw in your argument. The writers felt otherwise. They won't go back and add to an old expac. You simply need to accept this and move on. If you want the story, take 2 hours out of your life and do an op. I promise it really won't kill you.

 

Ok. I do sort of agree, however. On many servers its simply not possible to find people to begin with. Often, I log onto the fleet and there are barely 12 people on there, let alone 8 people able to do the OP. Mind you, I have done these ops, however if i want to go back and do them, I cant. I literally cannot find enough people who know what they are doing (DP is hard, especially for new players in terms of OPs).

 

My point is, due to population and timezone issues, in many cases it is flat out impossible to run an OP. I dont want all ops to be soloable, what im saying is even if the solo player wanted to, they cannot find a group (depending on server and timezone) these days.