Most Powerful Force Users

[sell-dog]

As per the Exiles, the only one with any credibility to his name is Murr and that is really only cause of the Talisman he made that turns people into Rakghouls. Ya he mastered Force Lighting, but aside from that there really isn't much, seems most of his stuff was alchemy and what not.

 

Syn created that Tailsman. Her and Murr had some sort of ego-fight over contribution to the creation of Leviathans. Syn was no joke. Murr was also the man in terms of healing and most importantly he considered Krayt to be a scrub and Krayt is considered by a quite a few of posters on a previous thread to be a top 10 Sith and was mentioned on this forum a couple times as well. Not as much is given about Dreypa but from all I just listed about how great I think Murr is and he couldn't get rid of Dreypa makes me think Dreypa was quite the stud as well. XoXann yeah I definitely agree with you on her being nothing too special which is why I rank her a distinctive last of the group.

 

Referring again to that previous huge thread on Top 10 Sith, lots of people had Marka Ragnos and Tulak Hord on there list based solely on perceived speculated reputation as not as much info is available on them and I will do the same in my treatment of Pall. Given all the detail I gave on the other Exiles and particularly Murr and Syn, those guys all answered to Pall. Let's say for the sake of argument that Pall was a great strategist but not as powerful as the others. Is that really the nature of the Dark Side to answer to someone or to call that person "High General" if you knew you were better than them? Absolutely not. Pall's got to be quite powerful to be in charge. I guess the reason for my post is that I disagree on just Murr being powerful among the bunch. Thanks for the thoughts though! I find the Exiles to be interesting and was fun reviewing them while I posted this. Ps, huge bummer for me that the SWOTR Galactic Timeline Records ended right before they did the Exiles!!!!!

Edited June 3, 2013 by sell-dog

[Aurbere]

Agreed with you from before the start about Yoda being #2 Jedi, just was paraphrasing others.

 

Question to when you listed off Yoda's skills, I thought it was stated that Mace was the greatest swordsman of the Jedi Order during that time? Nothing really related to the argument but just a mild inquiry.

 

Mace Windu himself has stated that Yoda is the superior swordsman. They are roughly equal, in my opinion.

 

In my opinion, the Exiles during that war didn't lose because their creatures and they themselves sucked. The dominant reasons for them losing was that they were massively outnumbered and had typical infighting. Many great Sith could not defeat the Jedi Order because they all had the same two problems. Lasting 100 years in the war is to me an impressive feat in and of itself given the circumstances.

 

Really, their monsters were their only saving grace here. But they never really gained any sort of advantage. In fact, they were on the defensive most of the time. At least until the Leviathans. But that didn't last long.

 

All of Yoda's skills that you mentioned are skills that other members of the order have demonstrated in the past but Yoda is just better. Ie: Revan does everything that you listed (NOT saying Revan > Yoda) and Revan was the greatest swordsman of his era and I believe Yoda was #2 (see question above).

 

Again, Yoda was not the number 2 swordsman. Plus Revan was not the best swordsman of his time, that right goes to Exar Kun with Ulic Qel Droma coming close behind him. Most of Revan's hype regarding his swordplay is mainly from characters. Considering that the post Great Sith War Jedi Order was a low point for the Order, those quotes mean nothing to me.

 

Also regarding Yoda's feats being replicated by Revan. Sorry, but no. Revan is not a master of all seven lightsaber forms. He is not a master of Battle Meditation. He has not shown the same level of telekinetic abilities that Yoda has. The only comparable feat he has is the redirection of Force lightning. But this is also limited because Darth Nyriss is not in the same league as Darth Sidious.

 

Your argument revolves around the stalemate/loss of Yoda's duel with Sidious and mine revolves around my belief that it takes more power to innovate than perfectly replicate others. I'm not swayed in my view but will give it some thought during downtime.

 

My argument revolves around G-canon. The novel clearly points out that Yoda is the most powerful Jedi the Sith had ever faced.

 

Truly appreciate sharing your views and the thinking points you gave!

 

Also consider a few more points regarding Sith Alchemy.

 

Darth Sidious was a master of Sith Alchemy, and yet this simply doesn't compare to Luke Skywalker's abilities with the Force.

 

King Adas was a master of Sith Alchemy, and yet he is inferior to later Sith Lords.

 

The ability to create monsters, while good and all that, simply is not indicative of power. In other areas, the Dark Jedi Exiles are, for lack of a better word, pathetic compared to later Sith Lords and Jedi. Alchemy is great, but it simply isn't a great boon to them when it comes to comparisons. That's basically all they really have going for them, but it simply doesn't matter when they are laughably weak in other areas compared to Yoda.

[sell-dog]

Again, Yoda was not the number 2 swordsman. Plus Revan was not the best swordsman of his time, that right goes to Exar Kun with Ulic Qel Droma coming close behind him. Most of Revan's hype regarding his swordplay is mainly from characters. Considering that the post Great Sith War Jedi Order was a low point for the Order, those quotes mean nothing to me.

 

Also regarding Yoda's feats being replicated by Revan. Sorry, but no. Revan is not a master of all seven lightsaber forms. He is not a master of Battle Meditation. He has not shown the same level of telekinetic abilities that Yoda has. The only comparable feat he has is the redirection of Force lightning. But this is also limited because Darth Nyriss is not in the same league as Darth Sidious.

 

My argument revolves around G-canon. The novel clearly points out that Yoda is the most powerful Jedi the Sith had ever faced.

 

King Adas was a master of Sith Alchemy, and yet he is inferior to later Sith Lords.

 

The ability to create monsters, while good and all that, simply is not indicative of power. In other areas, the Dark Jedi Exiles are, for lack of a better word, pathetic compared to later Sith Lords and Jedi. Alchemy is great, but it simply isn't a great boon to them when it comes to comparisons. That's basically all they really have going for them, but it simply doesn't matter when they are laughably weak in other areas compared to Yoda.[/color]

 

First thanks for the clarification in regards to my Mace inquiry.

 

I can see your point about Revan being Swords Champ of a watered down Jedi Order. However, when I say Revan was the best swordsman of his time, I literally mean the time that Revan was a trained force user. Given that this time was decades after Qel-Droma and Kun had (phycially) died, I say this of Revan (note applying this "feat" to Revan's 3900s BBY lifetime not necessarily the Revan in that Flashpoint Mission). If you/we are clumping broader time frames than rank during lifespan then yes I'd definitely agree with you on he being after those 2. I was only citing Revan as example of how a select few other Jedi have demonstrated all of Yoda's skills you mentioned to various (lesser) degrees and I have never differed from my view/cannon/statement of Yoda being #1 Jedi pre-Luke.

 

One reason why I give the old Sith a lot of props is from a Kreia quote about ancient Sith being the ****. One thing I'm not sure on is was she talking about just Hord or all the ancient Sith? Again, I remember this quote being referenced on an old Top 10 Sith thread and some posters thought this quote was nonsense. Given some of your statements, are you one that doesn't put much stock in this ancient Sith notion? Thought saw couple other places that ancient Sith are serious powers.

 

Please note that none of my questions in this post are rhetorical. Been fun discussing

Edited June 3, 2013 by sell-dog

[tunewalker]

First thanks for the clarification in regards to my Mace inquiry.

 

I can see your point about Revan being Swords Champ of a watered down Jedi Order. However, when I say Revan was the best swordsman of his time, I literally mean the time that Revan was a trained force user. Given that this time was decades after Qel-Droma and Kun had (phycially) died, I say this of Revan (note applying this "feat" to Revan's 3900s BBY lifetime not necessarily the Revan in that Flashpoint Mission). If you/we are clumping broader time frames than rank during lifespan then yes I'd definitely agree with you on he being after those 2. I was only citing Revan as example of how a select few other Jedi have demonstrated all of Yoda's skills you mentioned to various (lesser) degrees and I have never differed from my view of Yoda being #1 Jedi pre-Luke.

 

One reason why I give the old Sith a lot of props is from a Kreia quote about ancient Sith being the ****. One thing I'm not sure on is was she talking about just Hord or all the ancient Sith? Again, I remember this quote being referenced on an old Top 10 Sith thread and some posters thought this quote was nonsense. Given some of your statements, are you one that doesn't put much stock in this? Thought saw couple other places that ancient Sith being the all that.

 

Please note that none of my questions in this post are rhetorical. Been fun discussing

 

She was talking about sword skills only firstly secondly its meaningless as while they made her and metra and revan and such look like children she has know knowledge of what future jedi would be. The prequel era's order was the most powerful order (before Luke's...... maybe) meaning the top 5 of them were more then likely greater then most any one that came before.

[pan_sObak]

1. Empire (he is one with the force he can't die so doing is master of the force.

2.

3.Revan *only sith that studied both force sides and was foolish to oppose the empire*

4.

5

6.Darth vader. *he got lucky*

7.Skywalker *best in crying*

8.trash jedi's etc

 

first two (three?) i agree with you

 

Palpatine and Yoda somwhere near the Revan

and dart vader and his son are just under them

 

all ohters are not even close to those leaders!

[RTCBrad]

1. Luke Skywalker - most powerful force user ever

2. Mace Windu - beat Sidious

3. Yoda - overpowered sidious lightning

4. Palpatine - most powerful sith ever

5. Revan - we all know this one

6. Vader - most ****** sith to ever grace the sw universe, oh and he was pretty tough as well

7. Vitiate -we all know this one

8. Obi-Wan - beat anakin

9. pre must Anakin Skywalker - lost to obi-wan

10. Meetra Surik - could absorb the power of the people around her

Edited June 3, 2013 by RTCBrad

[Wolfninjajedi]

Edit: Eh nvrm...i'll just leave it be. Though if were going by General Force Users, there are more then just the Sith/Jedi as like on my list that are far more powerful then any mortal. Edited June 3, 2013 by Wolfninjajedi

[Aurbere]

One reason why I give the old Sith a lot of props is from a Kreia quote about ancient Sith being the ****. One thing I'm not sure on is was she talking about just Hord or all the ancient Sith? Again, I remember this quote being referenced on an old Top 10 Sith thread and some posters thought this quote was nonsense. Given some of your statements, are you one that doesn't put much stock in this ancient Sith notion? Thought saw couple other places that ancient Sith are serious powers.

 

Please note that none of my questions in this post are rhetorical. Been fun discussing

 

The thing about Kreia's quote regarding ancient Sith is that she wasn't there. She doesn't personally know those Sith Lords, and most records of them were wiped out.

 

There is, however, the case of Khem Val, who has provided plenty of information regarding Tulak Hord. However, I find that his statements are contradictory to the Tulak Hord codex.

 

Regardless, I don't see much evidence pointing to them being uberpowerful. I very much wish that the era of Tulak Hord was fleshed out in more forms than just character statements and in-game codexes.

[sell-dog]

The thing about Kreia's quote regarding ancient Sith is that she wasn't there. She doesn't personally know those Sith Lords, and most records of them were wiped out.

 

There is, however, the case of Khem Val, who has provided plenty of information regarding Tulak Hord. However, I find that his statements are contradictory to the Tulak Hord codex.

 

Regardless, I don't see much evidence pointing to them being uberpowerful. I very much wish that the era of Tulak Hord was fleshed out in more forms than just character statements and in-game codexes.

 

I see, thanks for the info.

 

Getting back to one of my earlier posts, I wish they wouldn't have cancelled the SW Galatic Timeline Records right before they would've did the Exiles. Regardless of however powerful they are I find them interesting b/c of their historical importance in the SW universe. I agree in that I also wish there could've been more stuff on Hord's time. Combining the two together what would've been ideal for me is a one of those on the early empire, ie Hord, and one on the Exiles. Hopefully someone picks it, Hord's era, up soon as a novel/comic book or something.

[AlexDougherty]

9. Nomi Sunrider (grossly underrated. Qel-Droma has appeared on this thread, Sunrider permanently wiped his Force Connection)

 

Nomi Sunrider's cutting off Ulic Qel-Droma's connection to the force was a matter of technique rather than strength in the force.

Edited June 3, 2013 by AlexDougherty

[EnsignSorrow]

1. Luke Skywalker - most powerful force user ever

2. Mace Windu - beat Sidious

3. Yoda - overpowered sidious lightning

4. Palpatine - most powerful sith ever

5. Revan - we all know this one

6. Vader - most ****** sith to ever grace the sw universe, oh and he was pretty tough as well

7. Vitiate -we all know this one

8. Obi-Wan - beat anakin

9. pre must Anakin Skywalker - lost to obi-wan

10. Meetra Surik - could absorb the power of the people around her

 

This is the most correct, I believe. I agree. Luke, and then Mace. And of course the exile is in there too. I totally agree.

Edited June 3, 2013 by EnsignSorrow

[Aurbere]

1. Luke Skywalker - most powerful force user ever

2. Mace Windu - beat Sidious

3. Yoda - overpowered sidious lightning

4. Palpatine - most powerful sith ever

5. Revan - we all know this one

6. Vader - most ****** sith to ever grace the sw universe, oh and he was pretty tough as well

7. Vitiate -we all know this one

8. Obi-Wan - beat anakin

9. pre must Anakin Skywalker - lost to obi-wan

10. Meetra Surik - could absorb the power of the people around her

 

No, just no.

[EnsignSorrow]

No, just no.

 

What? This is correct.

[Aurbere]

What? This is correct.

 

No it's not. It really is not correct. Some are, but most of it is wrong.

[tunewalker]

If were going by Force Users as a whole, then the list would be something like so...

 

1. The Celestial beings

 

2. Abeloth

 

3. Bedlam Spirits

 

4. GM Luke Skywalker

 

5. Darth Sidious

 

6. Anakin/Vader

 

7. Yoda

 

8. Exar Kun(Spirit)

 

9. Darth Caedus

 

Hm...guess I can't think of a 10th. Though I will say, I am unsure of 2/3...I know Abeloth is a being that is strong with the darkside though I am not sure that she could control time and space.

 

still almost but... caedus is jacen and he lost to his sister didn't he so..... on the list at all I don't think he belongs.

[EnsignSorrow]

No it's not. It really is not correct. Some are, but most of it is wrong.

 

What is wrong about it? Luke is number 1, and Mace is number 2. That is correct.

[tunewalker]

What is wrong about it? Luke is number 1, and Mace is number 2. That is correct.

 

no its not mace is no where near number 2 if were just talking about jedi and sith it would be 1. Luke 2. Sidious 3.Vader 4.Yoda mace likely doesn't even hit the top 5 (3 and 4 can switch spots its arguable.)

[EnsignSorrow]

Mace was the most powerful Jedi in the order at the time.

 

The Emperor stood no chance against him, and would have been defeated if not because Mace got stabbed in the back.

Edited June 3, 2013 by EnsignSorrow

[tunewalker]

Mace was the most powerful Jedi in the order at the time.

 

no he wasn't yoda was Mace was number 2. of that particular order check your sources.

 

Had Windu not used Vaapad he would have been destroyed just as quick as the other 3. His saber style (vaapad) channels the darkness of the opponent to use against the opponent so essentially the only reason windu lived is he turned the fight into sidious vs sidious.

Edited June 3, 2013 by tunewalker

[EnsignSorrow]

My sources are SWWIKI. Mace was superior in lightsaber technique, and shatterpoint. Yoda was not as powerful, although perhaps more wise.

 

He like Yoda mastered all forms.

Edited June 3, 2013 by EnsignSorrow

[AlexDougherty]

Mace was the most powerful Jedi in the order at the time.

 

The Emperor stood no chance against him, and would have been defeated if not because Mace got stabbed in the back.

 

Not even close, Mace was the second best Fighter(Yoda is a better swordsman), but both Yoda and Anakin were more powerful in the force. Mace Windu's nearly defeating Palpatine has been debated endlessly, but most people think it was a set up to force Anakin to choose sides, and Palpatine had conditioned Anakin's mind to choose him.

[tunewalker]

My sources are SWWIKI. Mace was superior in lightsaber technique, and shatterpoint. Yoda was not as powerful, although perhaps more wise.

 

I re-edited it 1 and 2 check your source again then because if you did you would know windu was not as good as yoda. Yoda was known for being a better saber master and more powerful in the force then windu.... sounds to me like you are saying the unique shatterpoint ability some how makes him as powerful as yoda..... it doesn't, even in episode 1 they admit yoda to be the most powerful at the time so no windu is not the most powerful he was number 2 that's G-cannon.

[EnsignSorrow]

Fair enough.

[Aurbere]

What is wrong about it? Luke is number 1, and Mace is number 2. That is correct.

 

Luke is number 1, good. Mace should be number 4 or 5. Darth Sidious is number 2 and Yoda is number 3. I personally put Darth Caedus into the same slot as Yoda. I find it too difficult to decide who is more powerful.

[sell-dog]

Nomi Sunrider's cutting off Ulic Qel-Droma's connection to the force was a matter of technique rather than strength in the force.

 

?? Not sure I understand the difference between technique and strength as it relates to power. Are you saying technique is training and strength is potential? Regardless, as the thread was Force POWER I think the two are coupled.

 

Before I proceed take note that I am not as knowledgeable as others but know some stuff. Throughout SW franchise, we see someone cutting themselves off from the Force before death (ie: Jedi Exile) but, to my knowledge, we don't see someone completely cutting someone else's connection to the Force yet along that person being someone that many posters consider to be a Top 10 Sith and someone that has been mentioned as a Top 10 Force User on this thread.

 

If we say it's a technique and not strength in the Force (which I'm not so sure I agree with, can you site source?) then this "technique" is something that only one person has demonstrated and has demonstrated in an impressive feat throughout SW history. That feat to me implies that Sunrider must have quite the Force POWER to do such a thing. Plus it's also stated that the 3 best Jedi pre-Luke are Yoda, Sunrider, and Thon. As I consider Sunrider slightly above Thon she made my list.