Keith! You continue to amaze!

[Darkside]

Thanks

I am glad at least one person understands this.

 

You two are the reason phrases like "No good deed goes unpunished" exist. And you all are literally making the case for statements like "This is why we can't have nice things". All of your self serving, bitter, jealous, and entitled attitudes do is ensure that no goodwill actions will be given to players in the future. There is absolutely nothing wrong with what Keith did, and it was indeed a nice gesture. To read anything into it more than that, is not living in, or being able to function in reality.

Edited June 4, 2017 by Darkside

[BradTheImpaler]

I understand constructive criticism. I understand there's always room for improvement.

 

Yes, as a rule in marketing, companies have to be careful about managing expectations, and one-off instances of generosity can sadly backfire thanks to cynicism and consumer entitlement. However, we can and should ask ourselves if that's the kind of attitude we want this game's community to have.

 

I haven't won anything and it doesn't bother me. Some people might feel differently, and we should hear out anyone with honest concerns...but some people just aren't prepared for constructive engagement.

[QuinlanSaathis]

You two are the reason phrases like "No good deed goes unpunished" exist. And you all are literally making the case for statements like "This is why we can't have nice things". All of your self serving, bitter, jealous, and entitled attitudes do is ensure that no good will actions will be given to players in the future. There is absolutely nothing wrong with what Keith did, and it was indeed a nice gesture. To read anything into it more than that, is not living in, or being able to function in reality.

 

I disagree

It needs to be explained why this person was singled out and that explanation needs to be more than she knows the "right " people.

He has a responsibility to all players to act in a fair and consistent manner, what is done for one is done for all.

[Guilty_Spark]

I disagree

It needs to be explained why this person was singled out and that explanation needs to be more than she knows the "right " people.

He has a responsibility to all players to act in a fair and consistent manner, what is done for one is done for all.

 

I know life is hard man I don't feel very lucky often either. however If some one's good fortune upsets you this much maybe it's time to look for some help before you really get hurt.

Edited June 4, 2017 by Guilty_Spark

[QuinlanSaathis]

I know life is hard man I don't feel very lucky often either. however If some one's good fortune upsets you this much maybe it's time to look for some help before you really get hurt.

 

Luck has nothing to do with it

[DiamondDove]

I think the concern being expressed here by some, is that the live-streamer knows a BWA employee who asked Keith on her behalf. Keith then pops into her stream and delivers a gift - I perceive it as being in good faith and out of generosity, as a genuinely nice thing to do. They perceive it as nepotism.

 

This is a bit different to give-aways on a BW livestream, or a competition, as there is a suggestion that she only received the armour because of who she knows. I don't believe this personally - I think she was given it because Keith was being nice, and knew how to contact her. It just so happens that Keith found out how to contact her through a mutual BWA friend.

 

I say give Keith the benefit of the doubt, and watch him drop into more live-streams as he finds out how to contact them. If this remains as a once-off, then the suspicion of nepotism may be warranted, but let's assume Keith is just nice

 

Who knows - he might even start to do some random in-game or forum gifts?

[stoopicus]

This thread reads like herpes and cancer had an aids baby. I thought I would never be surprised again by entitled whining on the internet, but damn, you guys delivered. Edited June 4, 2017 by stoopicus

[Jdast]

Quinlan,

 

While it is true we neither know you nor have the right to censor your views on this private forum as it's not our place, it is reasonable that we can glean information about your personality based on your posts. After all, that is all we have to go on given the inherent anonymity of the Internet.

 

Having said that -- from my perspective -- the fact that you compared this situation to insider trading and contract bidding fraud in the real world doesn't cast you in a very favorable light. Those two instances are completely non-analogous.

 

Regards,

 

Dasty

[QuinlanSaathis]

I think the concern being expressed here by some, is that the live-streamer knows a BWA employee who asked Keith on her behalf. Keith then pops into her stream and delivers a gift - I perceive it as being in good faith and out of generosity, as a genuinely nice thing to do. They perceive it as nepotism.

 

This is a bit different to give-aways on a BW livestream, or a competition, as there is a suggestion that she only received the armour because of who she knows. I don't believe this personally - I think she was given it because Keith was being nice, and knew how to contact her. It just so happens that Keith found out how to contact her through a mutual BWA friend.

 

I say give Keith the benefit of the doubt, and watch him drop into more live-streams as he finds out how to contact them. If this remains as a once-off, then the suspicion of nepotism may be warranted, but let's assume Keith is just nice

 

Who knows - he might even start to do some random in-game or forum gifts?

 

Where there is smoke, there is fire.

To use a legal terminology, there is enough evidence here to go to trial to discover the truth.

[QuinlanSaathis]

Quinlan,

 

While it is true we neither know you nor have the right to censor your views on this private forum as it's not our place, it is reasonable that we can glean information about your personality based on your posts. After all, that is all we have to go on given the inherent anonymity of the Internet.

 

Having said that -- from my perspective -- the fact that you compared this situation to insider trading and contract bidding fraud in the real world doesn't cast you in a very favorable light. Those two instances are completely non-analogous.

 

Regards,

 

Dasty

 

I disagree, the facts are clear.

It is not of course a crime what was done here and I never said it was but apply those same facts, the same circumstances and it is a crime, a serious one.

 

My point here is this looks bad and smells even worse, as you said perception is all we have to go on and I perceive an injustice in this action that needs to be called out for an explanation if nothing else.

 

Assuming the worst is true which at this point it could very well be.

A player spoke with a friend who works for Bioware, this friend (in some capacity) speaks to Keith and Keith agrees to provide this gift to this player just because he was asked to do so.

If you knew this to be true, would any of you feel differently?

 

I see this as a real possibility you can't discount it because you don't like it.

[Jdast]

I disagree, the facts are clear.

It is not of course a crime what was done here and I never said it was but apply those same facts, the same circumstances and it is a crime, a serious one.

 

My point here is this looks bad and smells even worse, as you said perception is all we have to go on and I perceive an injustice in this action that needs to be called out for an explanation if nothing else.

 

Assuming the worst is true which at this point it could very well be.

A player spoke with a friend who works for Bioware, this friend (in some capacity) speaks to Keith and Keith agrees to provide this gift to this player just because he was asked to do so.

If you knew this to be true, would any of you feel differently?

 

I see this as a real possibility you can't discount it because you don't like it.

 

A much better real world example, albeit imperfect would be the following...

 

Someone, say Bob, is an employee for a famous artist, singer, politician, etc. For sake of argument, let's say Jennifer Lawrence. Bob's good friend Jane asks Bob if she can join him on set one day so she can get a quick selfie with JLaw. Bob pulls strings and Jane gets her selfie.

 

Is that fair to the thousands of other JLaw fans? No. Is any real harm done? No. Can JLaw realistically do this for everyone? No.

 

The CATEGORICAL difference, though, is that Jane's gain should in no way cause suffering to others. It's not zero-sum. That is why your insider trading and contract corruption cases are patently absurd.

 

The streamer got some nice pixelated armor because her friend had some inroads. Welcome to: a) real life; and b) no harm. Arguably c) it is beneficial because it promotes goodwill and the brand of JLaw. In the case at hand, it promotes the lead producer doing something nice for a fan, which promotes the brand of SWTOR.

 

Regards,

 

Dasty

Edited June 4, 2017 by Jdast

[QuinlanSaathis]

A much better real world example, albeit imperfect would be the following...

 

Someone, say Bob, is an employee for a famous artist, singer, politician, etc. For sake of argument, let's say Jennifer Lawrence. Bob's good friend Jane asks Bob if she can join him on set one day so she can get a quick selfie with JLaw. Bob pulls strings and Jane gets her selfie.

 

Is that fair to the thousands of other JLaw fans? No. Is any real harm done? No. Can JLaw realistically do this for everyone? No.

 

The CATEGORICAL difference, though, is that Jane's gain should in no way cause suffering to others. It's not zero-sum. That is why your insider trading and contract corruption cases are patently absurd.

 

The streamer got some nice pixelated armor because her friend had some inroads. Welcome to: a) real life; and b) no harm.

 

Regards,

 

Dasty

 

 

We are not fans, we are paying for a service and have the right to equality within that service

 

I don;t care that she got the armor, I care that it was given in such a way that it was impossible for anyone else to partake.

 

If Keith had of gone to Hoth on a dead server with two players on it and offered the armor to the first one to find him then both have the chance and this would be more fair than what happened here.

[Jdast]

We are not fans, we are paying for a service and have the right to equality within that service

 

I don;t care that she got the armor, I care that it was given in such a way that it was impossible for anyone else to partake.

 

If Keith had of gone to Hoth on a dead server with two players on it and offered the armor to the first one to find him then both have the chance and this would be more fair than what happened here.

 

I don't think you know what the word "right" means. This is a company. Companies often discriminate for promotional purposes -- as is its right to do. It's often good business except for obstinate curmudgeons who cloak themselves in victimhood. That this wasn't a promotion per se is irrelevant. It does not harm you in any way. You suffered nothing.

 

While the JLaw example, was admittedly imperfect, it was much closer to the mark than insider trading and contract bidding fraud. Those examples belong in a galaxy far, far away.

 

I think I'm done here. Let's just agree to disagree.

Edited June 4, 2017 by Jdast

[QuinlanSaathis]

I don't think you know what the word "right" means. This is a company. Companies often discriminate for promotional purposes -- as is its right to do. It's often good business except for obstinate curmudgeons who cloak themselves in victimhood. While this is somewhat of a dig, you strike me as the type of person who complains about Ladies Night at bars. It discriminates against me because a) I don't get free drinks; and b) I'm gay so I ain't getting a date!

 

Kidding aside, while the JLaw example, was admittedly imperfect, it was much closer to the mark than insider trading and contract bidding fraud. Those examples belong in a galaxy far, far away.

 

I think I'm done here. Let's just agree to disagree.

 

I pay my sub and expect the same advantages as the streamer paying her sub (assuming it is paid for)

I agree to disagree, your arguments have not swayed me and obviously mine have not swayed you.

The opportunity to try is appreciated.

[TyonYlle]

From the little part I watched, he was delivering it to her on behalf of her friend. How said friend obtained it I don't know but it wasn't Keith going "Here's a gift from us at Bioware".

 

Quin, there's a perfectly REASONABLE reason. Wherein her friend that happens to work at BWA BROUGHT her the armor set through legitimate means, and Keith decided to surprise a fan.

 

Who knows - he might even start to do some random in-game or forum gifts?

 

^^ This is <3

We are not fans, we are paying for a service and have the right to equality within that service.

I mean, don't speak for me or anything? I for one consider myself to be a fan, NOT a "paying consumer".

[QuinlanSaathis]

Quin, there's a perfectly REASONABLE reason. Wherein her friend that happens to work at BWA BROUGHT her the armor set through legitimate means, and Keith decided to surprise a fan.

 

Most of what you have posted isn't worth my time but this takes the cake.

 

Tell me in what legitimate way you can buy the Tulak Hord armor set and have it delivered on a Bioware branded ingame mail?

[TyonYlle]

Most of what you have posted isn't worth my time but this takes the cake.

 

Tell me in what legitimate way you can buy the Tulak Hord armor set and have it delivered on a Bioware branded ingame mail?

 

The friend brought the armor set of the GTN? and Keith told said friend to send it to him to surprise a fan. IDK, you know realize there is a public auction knowns as the GTN, right? You seem to just about be the only person that has an issue with this, therefore the problem is you.

[QuinlanSaathis]

The friend brought the armor set of the GTN? and Keith told said friend to send it to him to surprise a fan. IDK, you know realize there is a public auction knowns as the GTN, right? You seem to just about be the only person that has an issue with this, therefore the problem is you.

 

Rubbish, I don't believe that for a second.

Go through the vid again, that is not what happened.

[TyonYlle]

Rubbish, I don't believe that for a second.

Go through the vid again, that is not what happened.

 

You asked what "legitimate means" there could be, so then the problem is you, goodday sir. I hope you find a little happiness.

Edited June 4, 2017 by TyonYlle

[QuinlanSaathis]

You asked what "legitimate means" there could be, so then the problem is you, goodday sir. I hope you find a little happiness.

 

Right so this unnamed Bioware employee just happened to have 100m+ of legit credits to spend on an armor set to give away, then just happened to set up a very elaborate method for giving that armor to this streamer using the Producer of the game as an errand boy.

 

I am not buying it.

[TyonYlle]

Right so this unnamed Bioware employee just happened to have 100m+ of legit credits to spend on an armor set to give away, then just happened to set up a very elaborate method for giving that armor to this streamer using the Producer of the game as an errand boy.

 

I am not buying it.

 

What's so hard to believe that someone aquired 100 mil+ credits through legit means?

[QuinlanSaathis]

What's so hard to believe that someone aquired 100 mil+ credits through legit means?

 

That is not the part that I do not believe.

 

The in game mail system is used by us dragging and dropping items into it to send, I cannot see the GM's or Devs using it the same way unless they are logged in with a character like we are. The droids you see are avatars and as I was a volunteer GM myself on a different game of course I know that this is handled via command codes not drag and drop.

 

I have see these Bioware branded emails before. They are used for twitch giveaways, and replacement items, those items and generated from a list of items and added via code to the mail. Unless you think there are a bunch of CS agents in a hidden room in game with a series of in game mailboxes to use?

[uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu]

You two are the reason phrases like "No good deed goes unpunished" exist. And you all are literally making the case for statements like "This is why we can't have nice things". All of your self serving, bitter, jealous, and entitled attitudes do is ensure that no goodwill actions will be given to players in the future. There is absolutely nothing wrong with what Keith did, and it was indeed a nice gesture. To read anything into it more than that, is not living in, or being able to function in reality.

 

So now I'm self serving, bitter, jealous and entitled? Show me where I asked for anything? Show me where I was bitter or jealous at the streamer? If you can't I'll expect your apology Go back and read my post the guy was quoting me on. I simply called someone out for constantly feeling the need to insult the guy then accuse HIM of being the only negative thing in the thread. I then stated that I was happy for the streamer but disagreed with the precedent regardless of who got the damn item. Don't lump me in just to build up your argument please.

Edited June 4, 2017 by uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu

[Rabin_Lorac]

You all know she only has 300 subscribers right?

 

She is no "influencer".

 

She is not dedicated to SWTOR. She has dozens of other games streamed and recorded.

 

She doesn't even get more than 50 views on 90% of her vids.

 

She has produced 132 vids in the last 12 months. Most of them are a year or more older.

 

53 of the 132 vids produced in the last year are SWTOR.

 

Most of them are just about the new chapters. Nothing about the rest of the game.

 

Going back 1-2 years of her vids she only has about 10 SWTOR vids.

 

She does not have any vids more than 2+ years.

 

You know all you have to do is click her channel name and then click vids and look for yourself.

 

Make your own conclusions from this info but she isn't special. But you all need to learn to do your research before commenting.

 

In her collections she only has 21% of all armor sets. Now we cannot see what other stuff she has in collections but 21% is pretty pathetic for someone that would/should be collecting and spending money/cartel coins and credits in this game if she was an "influencer".

 

But she gets recognized.

Edited June 4, 2017 by Rabin_Lorac

[TyonYlle]

You all know she only has 300 subscribers right?

 

She is no "influencer".

 

She is not dedicated to SWTOR. She has dozens of other games streamed and recorded.

 

She doesn't even get more than 50 views on 90% of her vids.

 

She has produced 132 vids in the last 12 months. Most of them are a year or more older.

 

53 of the 132 vids produced in the last year are SWTOR.

 

Most of them are just about the new chapters. Nothing about the rest of the game.

 

Going back 1-2 years of her vids she only has about 10 SWTOR vids.

 

She does not have any vids more than 2+ years.

 

You know all you have to do is click her channel name and then click vids and look for yourself.

 

Make your own conclusions from this info but she isn't special. But you all need to learn to do your research before commenting.

 

In her collections she only has 21% of all armor sets. Now we cannot see what other stuff she has in collections but 21% is pretty pathetic for someone that would/should be collecting and spending money/cartel coins and credits in this game if she was an "influencer".

 

But she gets recognized.

 

That isn't the point, but I'm done with this thread. I'm not going to be losing any sleep over her getting a stupid pixilated item, and I certainly don't care enough to ask for compensation, or to "get my freebie." It's one single FAKE item. Can she use use the item irl? Maybe you shouldn't play the game if you hold these items in such high regard. They aren't really that important, guys, and to call it freud is a little much, don't you think?

 

I posted in this thread because it put a smile on my face, the thought that it was unfair had NEVER occurred to me.

 

This is EXACTLY what's wrong with society. People just can't be happy for another person, if they don't like something, they just can't ignore it.

 

http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/58/58b60830d26ef5b1f63fd4edb732fe5c220cba41465f207836d5bf861c5ece40.jpg

 

Shame on the OP for even starting this thread, damn him!

Edited June 4, 2017 by TyonYlle