Solo Everything

[DreadtechSavant]

No, no, no.

 

I don't like coordinating with other people. I like my guild. I don't like doing ops. With my guild or not, regardless.

 

I hate the wait for the group to be formed, I hate ppl that waste my time by messing up, I hate socializing.

 

Why would I be FORCED to group up? Why?

 

I don't care about rewards. I want to play the game-play. Alone. I pay the sub alone, I want to be able to enjoy the entire game alone.

 

 

 

^this. For all those "This is a MMA" arguing guys.

 

Not sure what you mean by MMA? As for arguing, well if you bothered to quote the whole post instead of just part of it. you'll see I was not. As I clearly went on to say...

 

" As for me personally I see it like this, if they made them soloable I would do them if only once. If they are never made soloable I am no worse off than I am now. So really don't care all that much as nothing would have changed. So not opposed to them being made soloable but not asking for it either."

 

As said though maybe I have the wrong end of the stick here as "MMA" means nothing to me.

Edited March 10, 2017 by DreadtechSavant

[DarthDymond]

Just want to throw out there that a solo version (i.e. [Heroic 2+] version) of the Aurora Cannon in SecX would also be welcome.

[IanArgent]

Just want to throw out there that a solo version (i.e. [Heroic 2+] version) of the Aurora Cannon in SecX would also be welcome.

 

It's been soloable since 4.0. You can throw the EMP grenade directly into the core now. The Champ guarding is still an extreme PITA - I generally run past him and throw the grenade, and then eithr die quick or jump into the pool o death

[DarthDymond]

It's been soloable since 4.0. You can throw the EMP grenade directly into the core now. The Champ guarding is still an extreme PITA - I generally run past him and throw the grenade, and then eithr die quick or jump into the pool o death

Ah, I did not know that - they took out the doors that you have to have two people deactivate as well?

[aerockyul]

It's been soloable since 4.0. You can throw the EMP grenade directly into the core now. The Champ guarding is still an extreme PITA - I generally run past him and throw the grenade, and then eithr die quick or jump into the pool o death

 

Ha, you don't even need to deal with that chump anymore. Just run around to the right side of the room and stand in the corner of the "finger" and throw the grenade into the thing. Mission done, the Champ just stands over there doing nothing.

[aerockyul]

Ah, I did not know that - they took out the doors that you have to have two people deactivate as well?

 

No doors, no trip lasers, and you can completely skip the "boss", and just click on the core (ignore the shielding, it means nothing now).

 

See, this is what they would do if you left it to them to make solo operations. All puzzles would be trivialized or outright removed, and I wouldn't put it past them that you could just run around the bosses. They might as well allow mounts inside and have you go from the start to finish with no enemy encounters.

Or just give us an unlock so we can see the cutscenes/stories/cinematics around the operations. Much less time wasting.

[IanArgent]

No doors, no trip lasers, and you can completely skip the "boss", and just click on the core (ignore the shielding, it means nothing now).

 

See, this is what they would do if you left it to them to make solo operations. All puzzles would be trivialized or outright removed, and I wouldn't put it past them that you could just run around the bosses. They might as well allow mounts inside and have you go from the start to finish with no enemy encounters.

Or just give us an unlock so we can see the cutscenes/stories/cinematics around the operations. Much less time wasting.

 

Puzzles are only interesting once; after that, it's just another timewaster; as I was just reminded running through the Macrobinocs and Seeker Droid quest chains the past couple of days; despite deliberately not looking up the walkthroughs and only having done them once before, and that prior to 4.0, I found them to be instantly recalled and dealt with impatiently.

 

The designers have a nasty habit of confusing tedium with difficulty, admittedly. I complain at the drop of a hat about the Oricon chain winding up in a pair of Ops that I haven't been able to pug up for (won't waste my time on fleet waiting for a group to form, and GF is useless for Ops); but I wouldn't suggest they rebuild those ops for soloing. I think what they did with Revan was a necessary weasel - yeah, the fight's boring and trivial, but it only matters for folks who won't do ops.

 

As a primarily solo player, I would rather do FPs in VBeteran Mode with my wife and a pair of comps than the story (solo) modes. But again, as a solo player, I'm glad the option exists for the "Story-critical" FPs to be soloed.

[JLazarillo]

This, probably more than anything else, is the biggest barrier to people getting into Ops. You can't play the game while you're trying to get into an Op. Every other group activity has a functional group finder, in that you can set and forget, and go out into the world and do something. Ops, you have to watch the jawa jokes on fleet and spam chat with LFG.

One thing I really miss from City of Heroes was easy-access, cross-server LFG channels, and similar. This game has them to some degree, but they're just not utilized by the players. I do sort of loosely affiliate with some guilds that use similar channels, but still find that getting a good team with them is a bit rare.

 

It also doesn't help that Operations are generally multi-hour affairs unless you get a team that just knows how to run 'em perfectly (and that's not likely with a PuG). So you spend a couple hours waiting and then a couple more hours actually in an Op that may or may not fail if a tank gets bored. This is why I'd like to see, if not "solo" alternatives to Operations missions that I can use to clear their story equivalents, then at the very least, SMs getting dumbed way down so that any PuG can do them, since as it is, the greatest "challenge" of Ops is just finding people to do them with, not the content itself.

 

It seems like the biggest opposition comes from the players who aren't satisfied to achieve something unless other players can't. Me, I'd rather carry 7 random schmos then not be able to finish stuff at all.

[IanArgent]

Enh - I'm not any kind of leet gamer, and the handful of ops I've done I've been in mediocre gear for SM, but they haven't been that hard. Length, I can't speak to - I've done DP (1 hr) and SnV (something like 3-4 hrs). I've been given to understand SnV is an outlier though. In both cases, I'll admit to having a guide up on the other screen and skimmed it prior.

[JLazarillo]

Enh - I'm not any kind of leet gamer, and the handful of ops I've done I've been in mediocre gear for SM, but they haven't been that hard. Length, I can't speak to - I've done DP (1 hr) and SnV (something like 3-4 hrs). I've been given to understand SnV is an outlier though. In both cases, I'll admit to having a guide up on the other screen and skimmed it prior.

True, it does vary from Op to Op. My biggest beef is probably Explosive Conflict, since it's still just astoundingly punishing even on SM, and it's quite possibly the most plot-critical Operation in the story arc, since it directly sets up TfB, SnV, Oricon (and its Ops) and even solo stuff like the Seeker Droid (which can be soloed but is harder than necessary...not as bad as Macrobinoculars at least, though) and Section X and the Oricon dailies too. It's a great big middle finger to anyone who doesn't want to sequence break.

[Icykill_]

I play at RedEclipse, most populated EU server...

 

I have a quest for H4 shroud and its impossible to collect enough players!

I have a quest for Kaon Under Siege (thanks for making it 70lvl - not) and group finder is dead!

I have a quest for Corporate Labs and group finder is dead!

 

Make EVERY quest in game soloable... solo mode for operations, solo mode for flashpoints, FOR EVERYTHING. I cant enjoy the game because there is noone to play with. I dont care about loot... I want to complete EVERY quest in my quest log and its impossible. You changed things and created Veteran and Master... where is CASUAL mode just for quests and learning tactics. Operations should have CASUAL mode as well... I want to try it solo without watching 1hour long video.

 

I'm not trying be being antagonistic when I say the game isn't a solo game. It's an MMO, which means multiplayer. I think if you want a solo game you are playing the wrong game.

There is possibly a solution to your troubles. Transfer to a more active server.

Edited March 11, 2017 by Icykill_

[Kheld]

I was thinking about it, and IMO it can be done. Let's take everyone's favorite noob op, EV:

 

Droid - Strict timer, about 1/3 HPs, all mechanics left in. "I have been armed" you'd better stack under him. Red circles? Avoid. Knockback? Oh yeah. Burn phase desperation race? Yeppers.

 

Unless you know how to sneak by the adds to Gharj, you get to fight them. Except, make them all gold, and triple the number of them. Not fair for a soloable op to give a ton of CXP because you're farming champion level mobs.

 

Gharj - All mechanics left in. Adds left in. Platform and lava left in. Knockbacks left in. Again, dps race.

 

Puzzle - HM mechanics. You still have to solve it, and each time you click you get a lockout debuff, where you have to fight spawned mobs. After 3rd set, you get the Acklay. Not know how to solve, and clicking randomly? Much like in regular op, you get more Acklays.

 

Council - you have to fight 1 of each type: one assassin, one lord, one marauder. They spawn individually, but on timers. Your companion is locked out of helping - it is a one-on-one fight. You only get 2 kolto stations for the duration. Also, this is the only place in the entirety of the op to have Kolto stations.

 

Soa - ALL THE HARDMODE MECHANICS!!! Platform falling, you HAVE to kill pylons in order on way down, your companion gets thrown into Mind Traps regularly, or goes flying. On floor, JesusDroid gets frozen/Mind Trapped 10 seconds before pylon drops, so YOU have to kite him to it.

 

As a raider, this would be a fun test of my skills. This is also a great way to introduce real mechanics, the actual op mechanics, to the new/solo/too whatever to group players.

 

Would it be difficult? HECK YES it should be; It's an Operation, not a fetch and gather planetary mission. The difficulty level should be far higher, to reflect the level of the intended content. Operations are the highest level of PvE content. In a story sense, they are missions that gather the best of the galaxy's best, to do the impossible. It shouldn't be a walk on the beach. Look at it like this: an Operation is the equivalent of throwing a party for the Queen. Normally, you delegate things like decorations, food, guest list. But you want to do it all yourself, so you're going to bust your buns to make it fantastic. Same here - you're going to not rely on JesusDroid to do everything, you're not going to AFK while the boss fight goes on (like you do in Revan), you're not going to be in level 10 greens and breeze through.

 

If "solo all the things" players don't want to work at this, then please elaborate why not.

 

If they made a solo version of Operation bosses sort of equal to the later Eternal Championship bosses it could be quite fun & interesting.

 

It would also have the benefit of people being able to SEE the story cutscenes without someone screaming "SPACEBAR SPACEBAR" at you.

 

It would also allow people to get used to the layout of the Operation, AND maybe even tempt them into TRYING a SM group operation. If more people do Ops then the Ops budget gets more cash, YES?

[VegasTheLost]

Sorry but I don't get it. Playing and MMO and expecting that everything can be done by solo play. I just don't get it really. Also all I'm seeing is excuses for not to do anything. Half of them could've been solved by joining a guild, the other half could've been solved by just sticking around. It really just comes to if you really want something, do the necessary to get it.

[Kirameki]

Perhaps a better solution would be to add both the H4 Heroics for the Seeker Droid and Macrobinocular to the Group Finder. This way people can queue up for it. Because many people have done those quests ages ago so not many people are currently recruiting for it. Got the same problem. You can solo some parts of the quests however. Just not all. Will keep them till I manage to find people or end up not doing them at all.

[DarthDymond]

Sorry but I don't get it. Playing and MMO and expecting that everything can be done by solo play. I just don't get it really.

It's pretty simple: the game, and genre as a whole, would be better than it is now if it included the option to play anything / everything either solo or in a group.* That way those who like grouping with other people can continue to do so to their hearts' content, and those who like playing solo will be able to experience all the content the game has available through their preferred play-style. The result would be an overall better experience for playerbase as a whole.

 

*By this same token, BW's decision to make the Fallen Empire / Eternal Throne storylines (and to a lesser extent the Shadow of Revan storyline) so unfriendly to grouping was an equally wrongheaded move, and a number of players have said that doing so turned them off on the game - or at least that specific content.

Edited March 11, 2017 by DarthDymond

[Foreignobjects]

I play at RedEclipse, most populated EU server...

 

I have a quest for H4 shroud and its impossible to collect enough players!

I have a quest for Kaon Under Siege (thanks for making it 70lvl - not) and group finder is dead!

I have a quest for Corporate Labs and group finder is dead!

 

Make EVERY quest in game solo able... solo mode for operations, solo mode for flashpoints, FOR EVERYTHING. I cant enjoy the game because there is no one to play with. I don't care about loot... I want to complete EVERY quest in my quest log and its impossible. You changed things and created Veteran and Master... where is CASUAL mode just for quests and learning tactics. Operations should have CASUAL mode as well... I want to try it solo without watching 1hour long video.

 

i hoped they would do this a long time ago. also it would give it more of a kotor feel. , i know it would be hard to add an offline mode. but they did sort of do this so far with making all of the original flash points solo able. and i think that's very successful and fun, cause you can go through the games side stories solo, i'm having trouble gaining commander points cause i play alone a lot, with the uprising quests,,,

i cant solo and stuff, unless i am not doing something i'm suppose to or missing something, but i finished the story line on one of my mains, and am level 70, i was legacy capped two years ago. so it wont let me do some things cause it requires you to level to max legacy, but it wont give it to you if you already were... that's another issue i have. but great post and idea!!!

[VegasTheLost]

It's pretty simple: the game, and genre as a whole, would be better than it is now if it included the option to play anything / everything either solo or in a group.* That way those who like grouping with other people can continue to do so to their hearts' content, and those who like playing solo will be able to experience all the content the game has available through their preferred play-style. The result would be an overall better experience for playerbase as a whole.

 

*By this same token, BW's decision to make the Fallen Empire / Eternal Throne storylines (and to a lesser extent the Shadow of Revan storyline) so unfriendly to grouping was an equally wrongheaded move, and a number of players have said that doing so turned them off on the game - or at least that specific content.

 

I don't know where I saw it, maybe in this thread, but it is quite similar that: you go to a steakhouse as a vegan and complain that top dishes are made from meat.

[IanArgent]

I don't know where I saw it, maybe in this thread, but it is quite similar that: you go to a steakhouse as a vegan and complain that top dishes are made from meat.

 

False comparison, since the vast majority by runtime of content in the game is soloable (everything but Ops, the non-storymode FPs, and the Macrbinocs/Seeker Droids H4s). More like asking why there aren't soy burgers on the menu of a American Bistro joint like TGIFridays; when they have other vegetarian options.

 

The comment about TEC is an intertesting one - it shows the (current) devs can generate challenging and interesting single-player content (HSF does as well to a certain extent). But it takes a lot of work, so I don't at all expect them to go back and redo all the existing ops and I really doubt they'll give solo options for the upcoming one.

[ludoviccb]

True, it does vary from Op to Op. My biggest beef is probably Explosive Conflict, since it's still just astoundingly punishing even on SM, and it's quite possibly the most plot-critical Operation in the story arc, since it directly sets up TfB, SnV, Oricon (and its Ops) and even solo stuff like the Seeker Droid (which can be soloed but is harder than necessary...not as bad as Macrobinoculars at least, though) and Section X and the Oricon dailies too. It's a great big middle finger to anyone who doesn't want to sequence break.

 

You're missing the first in that questline. It start with KP.

 

 

The 1 time mission show their involvement in it.

 

[JLazarillo]

You're missing the first in that questline. It start with KP.

True, but it's more tangential at that point. There's not really any active involvement 'til the end of EC.

Also KP is, thankfully, pretty simple to PuG (it's the model for how all SM Operations should be, IMO), so it doesn't make me quite so wroth.

[MACharlieV]

Operations and World Bosses soloable? No. You need to maintain more purpose then just for the sake of gearing to maintain a proper multiplayer player base. This is an MMO with a single player component not SP (like other recent Bioware games) with optional multiplayer component.

 

Some operations need to be tweaked tho so that the opening cutscene doesn't require an operations group. It's kinda annoying that you finally get a group, get transported and miss the opening cutscene because everyone else wants to get going.

 

Turn the final Shroud/Dread Seed soloable? Yes. It's a pain to get to that point anyway and even harder to group up for. It's been years. Time to retire that one to the soloable content.

Edited March 11, 2017 by MACharlieV

[DarthDymond]

I don't know where I saw it, maybe in this thread, but it is quite similar that: you go to a steakhouse as a vegan and complain that top dishes are made from meat.

A steakhouse that leaves all of its top dishes exactly the way they are, and also has decent vegan options of those dishes available, would be an all-around better restaurant than if it had those exact same top dishes without the vegan options. The only reason to think otherwise would be out of an "eeewww, vegans, I don't like those people, they eat different than I do, why should they get to enjoy the same restaurant I do?" attitude.

 

If one wants to argue over the opportunity costs, that's a reasonable discussion to be had, but in a straight comparison of [A]: "the game, as it is now" vs : "the game with the same content it has now, with solo and group modes for everything in it", option is better.

Edited March 11, 2017 by DarthDymond

[Severith]

A steakhouse that leaves all of its top dishes exactly the way they are, and also has decent vegan options of those dishes available, would be an all-around better restaurant than if it had those exact same top dishes without the vegan options. The only reason to think otherwise would be out of an "eeewww, vegans, I don't like those people, they eat different than I do, why should they get to enjoy the same restaurant I do?" attitude.

 

If one wants to argue over the opportunity costs, that's a reasonable discussion to be had, but in a straight comparison of [A]: "the game, as it is now" vs : "the game with the same content it has now, with solo and group modes for everything in it", option is better.

 

Dinner with a group of friends is ten times better than going to a steakhouse alone. It doesn't matter how good the food is, when the overall experience isn't anything close to what it could have been.

 

SWTOR gives you a super droid for those solo flashpoints. He's tougher than you are, he can heal constantly and he can dps better than you. In a solo game, your character isn't the hero. That combat droid is. You're just window dressing. Just a loot thief that's along for the ride.

 

That's the game the OP wants. The experience gets ruined, but anti social people get to see more content. But they'll still be just as miserable, cause they missed the entire point of a multiplayer game.

 

Just some "food for thought" there buddy.

[DarthDymond]

Dinner with a group of friends is ten times better than going to a steakhouse alone. It doesn't matter how good the food is, when the overall experience isn't anything close to what it could have been.

I don't think you're quite following the analogy. Saying "being with other people is better than being alone" in the context of VegasTheLost's analogy is just saying "steak is better than vegan food" - which is a perfectly valid personal preference, but clearly not one shared by the vegans (i.e. the solo players).

 

SWTOR gives you a super droid for those solo flashpoints. He's tougher than you are, he can heal constantly and he can dps better than you. In a solo game, your character isn't the hero. That combat droid is. You're just window dressing. Just a loot thief that's along for the ride.

 

That's the game the OP wants.

If it's an option, then what do you care? No one is talking about taking out the existing group options for content that is currently group-only, just like the introduction of Solo Mode FPs didn't remove the group versions. OP gets to play the way s/he wants, and your oh-so-much-better group experience is still available for you. That's a net gain in the 'players getting what they want out of the game' tally.

 

I think a lot of people would like to see the Jesus!Droid replaced with an option to use multiple companions or some other approach to making the content solo-able, but even if there is room for improvement the current setup is still better than not having the solo option at all.

 

Solo Mode w/ Multiple Companions > Solo Mode w/ Super!Droid > No Solo Mode At All

The experience gets ruined, but anti social people get to see more content. But they'll still be just as miserable, cause they missed the entire point of a multiplayer game.

Riiiiight. Because we all known that people who have different preferences in their entertainment than you do are clearly just doing it wrong. I don't think many solo-centric players wound up "just as miserable" after the solo-mode FPs came out, I think their experience was improved by having that option - which is probably why they're asking for it to be expanded.

Edited March 11, 2017 by DarthDymond

[Khevar]

I don't think you're quite following the analogy. Saying "being with other people is better than being alone" in the context of VegasTheLost's analogy is just saying "steak is better than vegan food" - which is a perfectly valid personal preference, but clearly not one shared by the vegans (i.e. the solo players).

Let's take the analogy further.

 

Would you expect the restaurant, whenever it adds a meat dish to a menu, to always add an "equivalent vegan version" of that SAME DISH?

 

Why can't it have some vegan dishes over here, and some other completely different meat dishes over there? Can the vegan customer not be happy with the EXTENSIVE variety of existing dishes that match their personal dietary restrictions?

 

What we have here is:

 

"There's no vegan version of the tri-tip! I don't want to eat meat, but I want the ability to experience every meal this restaurant has to offer"