Swap Character sex 5.0

[Eshvara]

Don't know what Dragon Effect 2 is but I still find that messed up that they didn't make story companions flirtable for both male and female to begin with because that was highly unfair to the LGBT community. I for one didn't like that I play male characters and the only people I was allowed to flirt with were females. I felt very offended by that. I was thrilled when I played RotHC and was able to flirt with the male pure blood Sith only to be disappointed that it didn't get very far cause you either sacrifice him and he dies or if you save him he is severely injured and ends up leaving you either way. Then Theron came along and then you mostly got the same idea and when I saw he had returned for KOTFE and you could enter a romantic relationship with him I was thrilled but that still doesn't compensate for the disappointment I still feel that I was not able to do so with my class companions. I'd have enjoyed a bit of drama if one of my male love interest had come back and met my new love interest Theron but I'm denied that because it wasn't available unlike those who got to do that with their female companions they romanced if they are male or their male companions if they are female. That's like a swift kick in the balls to me for being gay.

 

Add-on: Not to mention but say if my Sith Warrior had romanced Malavai Quinn his betrayal to me and the difference that may have made to his betrayal to the Sith Warrior would have been so much of an interesting situation.

 

Do you feel like all Companions should be bi, including vanilla or some straight, bi, gay?

[DarthEnrique]

Do you feel like all Companions should be bi, including vanilla or some straight, bi, gay?

 

I can't answer that as I have no idea what vanilla means...

[Eshvara]

I can't answer that as I have no idea what vanilla means...

 

Base game, before any additional content. You know characters including your seemingly favourite Quinn? Do you prefer the approach of all bi, or Aa mix between bi, gay, straight?

 

I know having everyone a bi can't make anyone u happy as its ffa but yah.

[DarthEnrique]

Base game, before any additional content. You know characters including your seemingly favourite Quinn? Do you prefer the approach of all bi, or Aa mix between bi, gay, straight?

 

I know having everyone a bi can't make anyone u happy as its ffa but yah.

 

Personally here is the way I would truly look at it. If you are a female character and you are a Sith Inquisitor and you romance Andronikus then he's straight. If you are a male character and you romance him then he's gay. Leave it at that. I personally feel it's up to that and nothing else. I see Lana and Theron in the same way. Their orientation is based on your characters gender and nothing else.

 

Also, I don't favor Quinn I favor Theron Shan cause he is actually to me for a CGI character the most attractive one. I'm sure there are others who disagree with that but I personally favor him. Quinn I mentioned as a more possibility of a romantic drama to the storyline due to him betraying the Sith Warrior in the story line despite gender, I'm assuming, I don't play female characters nor will I ever so I have no idea the differences in storylines between genders.

Edited November 2, 2016 by DarthEnrique

[Limariko]

The way it came across in Dragon Age 2 didn't feel like the companions were so much bi as playersexual. Even taking into account Thedas having different perspectives of sexuality than what we have in the real world, it felt more like you could swap around any flavor of Hawke in the same playthrough and it'd make no difference. It felt more like a cop out method of approaching the topic than putting any thought into it.

 

I rather liked how they handled it with Dragon Age: Inquisition with your Inquisitor just isn't going to be to everyone's tastes.

[Keta]

Who cares if it makes you gay or not. It should still be an option. I've been asking for the gay option for a long time anyway. I really don't see the issue, the responses to the story don't need to change, they just need to be unisex.

But I've argued that point over and over for many years. I'm not going to fall into that trap again.

 

Maybe as a work around to this "falsely" perceived issue, they could limit the sex swap to characters that have already finished the vanilla story. I can't see how that can cause any issues with them being gay or flagging story problems.

 

The same sex romances issue was brought up in closed beta as soon as companion romances were introduced. Many, if not most, players wanted that option. Sadly it was not implemented.

 

If they were to offer a sex change option (similar to the rest of appearance changes you can do now) I don't see why they'd have to change a thing in romances. Just leave them as they are.

[DarthEnrique]

The same sex romances issue was brought up in closed beta as soon as companion romances were introduced. Many, if not most, players wanted that option. Sadly it was not implemented.

 

If they were to offer a sex change option (similar to the rest of appearance changes you can do now) I don't see why they'd have to change a thing in romances. Just leave them as they are.

 

I'm honestly surprised a female couldn't start flirting with Vette or Kalyio or a male couldn't flirt with Gault or Jorgan when they returned in KOTFE. Not like it would matter anymore with the level 60 tokens as you skip all the class story content.

Edited November 2, 2016 by DarthEnrique

[Nothing_Shines]

So you are in favor of player-sexual, the absolute worst option when designing NPCs. Or Schrodiner's Sexuality. A character's sexuality informs who they are, how they act, suggests a certain history and what they might do going forward, just as a real person's does. To make every NPC nebulous until they encounter the PC undermines who they are, breaks immersion and places them in the category of sex toy. Suddenly, they don't have their own backstory. They only exist as the PC wishes them to.

 

It's also lazy, from a writer's perspective. If their reactions are exactly the same to advances from anyone, it saves time writing dialogue or blocking out scenes.

 

Whatever the NPC's sexuality -straight, gay, bi- should be a deliberate trait chosen based on what best suits that character and the story being told, not what flavor of ice cream the PC has a craving for. When you meet people in real life that you are attracted to, do you get to choose their sexuality for them?

Edited November 2, 2016 by Nothing_Shines

[DarthEnrique]

So you are in favor of player-sexual, the absolute worst option when designing NPCs. Or Schrodiner's Sexuality. A character's sexuality informs who they are, how they act, suggests a certain history and what they might do going forward, just as a real person's does. To make every NPC nebulous until they encounter the PC undermines who they are, breaks immersion and places them in the category of sex toy. Suddenly, they don't have their own backstory. They only exist as the PC wishes them to.

 

It's also lazy, from a writer's perspective. If their reactions are exactly the same to advances from anyone, it saves time writing dialogue or blocking out scenes.

 

Whatever the NPC's sexuality -straight, gay, bi- should be a deliberate trait chosen based on what best suits that character and story being told, not what flavor of ice cream the PC has a craving for. When you meet people in real life that you are attracted to, do you get to choose their sexuality for them?

 

Are you serious? Who really gives a crap if some female goes wants to go after Vette or some male wants to go after Jorgan or whatever floats their boat. You say all this but what about all the inter-species relationships that go on in this game? That's okay but for people to have the option to flirt with their male class story companions if they are men and vise versa is wrong? They may has well have made it where only people of each species should have not been able to flirt with each other but yet a human female can flirt with a male cathar and a male human can flirt with a female Twi'lek and that's fine and dandy ask for same respect for same-sex and it's oh the shame.

Edited November 2, 2016 by DarthEnrique

[Eshvara]

Are you serious? Who really gives a crap if some female goes wants to go after Vette or some male wants to go after Jorgan or whatever floats their boat. You say all this but what about all the inter-species relationships that go on in this game? That's okay but for people to have the option to flirt with their male class story companions if they are men and vise versa is wrong? They may has well have made it where only people of each species should have not been able to flirt with each other but yet a human female can flirt with a male cathar and a male human can flirt with a female Twi'lek and that's fine and dandy ask for same respect for same-sex and it's oh the shame.

 

But that's not what he's saying, you're making a strawman counter arguement that isn't really valid.

He doesn't care if a female goes after Vette or a male after Jorgan, He's basically saying characters don't have much depth or story behind them if they are what he said "player sexuality" Take DA inquisition for example, some characters are gay, some are straight, some are bi, one is pansexual? It gives the characters are much more interesting background and there is something for everyone. That's something that would have made swtor a lot more interesting too. also if it was included with the vanilla characters.

[DarthEnrique]

But that's not what he's saying, you're making a strawman counter arguement that isn't really valid.

He doesn't care if a female goes after Vette or a male after Jorgan, He's basically saying characters don't have much depth or story behind them if they are what he said "player sexuality" Take DA inquisition for example, some characters are gay, some are straight, some are bi, one is pansexual? It gives the characters are much more interesting background and there is something for everyone. That's something that would have made swtor a lot more interesting too. also if it was included with the vanilla characters.

 

Okay but I'm not sure I agree look at Theron he has a well established interesting background that's not just been established in the game but in The Old Republic book series as well, and it doesn't effect his character.

Edited November 2, 2016 by DarthEnrique

[Eshvara]

Okay but I'm not sure I agree look at Theron he has a well established interesting background that's not just been established in the game but in The Old Republic book series as well, and it doesn't effect his character.

 

It doesn't affect Theron, but it would affect people like Doc, he's a real ladies men, so is Corso, he's very chivalrous towards women. They have personalities that go with their sexualities. Where it wouldn't matter are people like Kaliyo, or Jaesa, and a few others I can't think of right now.

[dr_mike]

but it would affect people like Doc, he's a real ladies men

 

*snort*

 

Oh the other Doc....

Edited November 2, 2016 by dr_mike

[AlienEyeTX]

I'm sure it's already been stated, but it breaks romance decisions and whatnot, so... no.

 

I mean, I suppose gender reassignment should be a legitimate concern for our characters and I'm certainly not stating that some may have been created male, but identify as female (or vice-versa) and I certainly am not looking to trample on their rights as digital properties. I just... maybe I'm being too biased here... but, I'm just thinking of the developers and all the other "important" things they have on their plates at the moment.

 

I'm sorry if I have offended any of the digital entities which may or may not ever be made aware of this post.

 

[Rolodome]

Thinking about the technical issues... perhaps they could have an option to do this, but it locks the character out of story? Or maybe just resets all of their story stuff back to the beginning? Would need a major warning on use to protect people from mistakes, but that might, in theory, be a way to get around bugs.

 

Either a hard wipe of everything story-related (if that's even feasible) or a permanent lockout.

 

It's not the ideal, but it'd be something.

[AlienEyeTX]

Thinking about the technical issues... perhaps they could have an option to do this, but it locks the character out of story? Or maybe just resets all of their story stuff back to the beginning? Would need a major warning on use to protect people from mistakes, but that might, in theory, be a way to get around bugs.

 

Either a hard wipe of everything story-related (if that's even feasible) or a permanent lockout.

 

It's not the ideal, but it'd be something.

 

The thing is, it would only be able to be made available at a certain level. You couldn't do it in the middle of class story, for instance. There would have to be certain points in character development that it would be available. Or, just do it right before KotFE or KotET. And if you did one of those, it should treat your character like an insta-60 and reset all choices to default light/dark. At that point, why not just make a new character?

 

Not to mention, what happens with character design? Are all of the same number choices transferred over? Do you get to redesign completely? Rename? I mean, really, just start a new character. For the few (likely) who would use this, why put the effort into it on the development side? People can just make a new character and play through or use one of those insta-tokens. I'm sure the cost for a "feature" like this would be similar to a character token on the CM anyway.

[DarthEnrique]

It doesn't affect Theron, but it would affect people like Doc, he's a real ladies men, so is Corso, he's very chivalrous towards women. They have personalities that go with their sexualities. Where it wouldn't matter are people like Kaliyo, or Jaesa, and a few others I can't think of right now.

 

Oh God don't remind me of Doc, I despised him and almost every conversation when the choices you make for the conversation always, always covered his crotch and so I had to look at that while reading the options and then want burn my eyes cause I despised this companion so much for his behavior towards women. I may be gay but I still respect women.

Edited November 2, 2016 by DarthEnrique

[Eshvara]

Oh God don't remind me of Doc, I despised him and almost every conversation when the choices you make for the conversation always, always covered his crotch and so I had to look at that while reading the options and then want burn my eyes cause I despised this companion so much for his behavior towards women. I may be gay but I still respect women.

 

But do you see where i'm coming from? some characters are (stereotypical, if you can call it that) straight, and making them bi or gay would not always suit them. While it's easier with others. Which is why I mentioned Doc and Corso.

Edited November 2, 2016 by Eshvara

[DarthEnrique]

But do you see where i'm coming from? some characters are (stereotypical, if you can call it that) straight, and making them bi or gay would not always suit them. While it's easier with others. Which is why I mentioned Doc and Corso.

I get what you are saying now. But still doesn't mean they could not have made some, but I got Theron and if that had been an option they'd have been dumped for Theron anyway cause after 5 years of being believed to be dead I'm sure they moved on anyway.

 

Add-on: I need bleach for my brain now, I'm having PTSD flashbacks of those conversations with Doc. lol! Jk.

Edited November 2, 2016 by DarthEnrique

[Ralei]

Are any of the original companions or npc's personalities *really* that tied up in their sexuality? Doc and Corso are the two obvious ones - and many of us find them extremely annoying because of it. Stop frontin', dudes.

 

I think the way it was handled with Lana and Theron was great. They are player-sexual, but it doesn't effect their personalities or the overall story in any way. Because, why should it? We're not playing a game about the struggles of breaking out of the patriarchy. The SWTOR society has sentient droids, omnipotent force gods, light speed travel, and aliens of all colors and configurations; no one gives a rats *** about sexuality.

[DarthEnrique]

Are any of the original companions or npc's personalities *really* that tied up in their sexuality? Doc and Corso are the two obvious ones - and many of us find them extremely annoying because of it. Stop frontin', dudes.

 

I think the way it was handled with Lana and Theron was great. They are player-sexual, but it doesn't effect their personalities or the overall story in any way. Because, why should it? We're not playing a game about the struggles of breaking out of the patriarchy. The SWTOR society has sentient droids, omnipotent force gods, light speed travel, and aliens of all colors and configurations; no one gives a rats *** about sexuality.

 

Note he does not make any complaints about having to look at Doc's crotch during the conversations. Lol!

[ivanhedgehog]

It actually had me wondering what he would have said if it was a male. No option to shock him as he doesn't say anything bad?

 

there are some unusual cutscenes that we only see in edge cases. I ran a SW totally 100% lightside and the cut scene at the oasis on tat was way different then I had ever seen.

[Rolodome]

The thing is, it would only be able to be made available at a certain level. You couldn't do it in the middle of class story, for instance. There would have to be certain points in character development that it would be available. Or, just do it right before KotFE or KotET. And if you did one of those, it should treat your character like an insta-60 and reset all choices to default light/dark. At that point, why not just make a new character?

 

Not to mention, what happens with character design? Are all of the same number choices transferred over? Do you get to redesign completely? Rename? I mean, really, just start a new character. For the few (likely) who would use this, why put the effort into it on the development side? People can just make a new character and play through or use one of those insta-tokens. I'm sure the cost for a "feature" like this would be similar to a character token on the CM anyway.

Well, if you consider how KOTFE works with unfinished class story, it just acts as if you haven't done the parts you did and locks you out of them. If you're already deep in, I think it'd have to be either a hard reset or you keep what you have, but it works exactly like KOTFE in that you can't progress any further.

 

As for character design, some kind of tie-in to the appearance changer would be all that's needed. Same idea as changing your character's species, in that customizations would be free until you've committed changes the first time.

 

Why? I don't know. Because some people might want it. If there is enough of a demand for it and it's technically feasible, there's no reason not for them to get the extra business from people who want to use one. Starting a new character is not always a desirable option for a number of reasons, one of them being character name. Another being things like character titles earned, valor and social levels, character bound items acquired, and so on.

[EnzoForMe]

So you are in favor of player-sexual, the absolute worst option when designing NPCs. Or Schrodiner's Sexuality. A character's sexuality informs who they are, how they act, suggests a certain history and what they might do going forward, just as a real person's does. To make every NPC nebulous until they encounter the PC undermines who they are, breaks immersion and places them in the category of sex toy. Suddenly, they don't have their own backstory. They only exist as the PC wishes them to.

 

It's also lazy, from a writer's perspective. If their reactions are exactly the same to advances from anyone, it saves time writing dialogue or blocking out scenes.

 

Whatever the NPC's sexuality -straight, gay, bi- should be a deliberate trait chosen based on what best suits that character and the story being told, not what flavor of ice cream the PC has a craving for. When you meet people in real life that you are attracted to, do you get to choose their sexuality for them?

 

Great post.

[Rolodome]

So you are in favor of player-sexual, the absolute worst option when designing NPCs. Or Schrodiner's Sexuality. A character's sexuality informs who they are, how they act, suggests a certain history and what they might do going forward, just as a real person's does. To make every NPC nebulous until they encounter the PC undermines who they are, breaks immersion and places them in the category of sex toy. Suddenly, they don't have their own backstory. They only exist as the PC wishes them to.

 

It's also lazy, from a writer's perspective. If their reactions are exactly the same to advances from anyone, it saves time writing dialogue or blocking out scenes.

 

Whatever the NPC's sexuality -straight, gay, bi- should be a deliberate trait chosen based on what best suits that character and the story being told, not what flavor of ice cream the PC has a craving for. When you meet people in real life that you are attracted to, do you get to choose their sexuality for them?

See, the thing I don't get about posts like this, is I just don't see people complaining about Theron/Lana/Koth being able to go either way. So who are the people who actually care? It seems they largely exist in the land of hypotheticals. Or, I suppose more likely, they exist in the land of "I'm afraid of pre-existing characters changing in some way."