warrior female vs male

[peter_plankskull]

Except for Revy from Black Lagoon (which I will totally give you, along with Balalaika and Roberta), most of those don't even come close to what I was describing.

 

And this is why I dread even posting in these types of discussions, because no matter how I phrase a simple fact or observation, I am going to get a horde of zombies pouring out of the woodwork, all going, "Well actually...!" at me on a subject I have more practice arguing than my warrior gets with her lightsabers.

 

You put up a statement... and of course people are going to either agree or refute it... this is a public forum... its one thing to state if they derail the thread ... ... but another to complain about how people respond to you about the subject on hand.

 

I will admit powerful females are uncommon, but by no means rare, look at the Metal Gear Solid series... theirs arguably just as much strong women as they are men in that game, albeit the men still slightly stand out on top... but its WAY more than simply because of gender.

[peter_plankskull]

Then explain what fits the critera, ebcause the way you decribe it, it's simply a ****** who kills a lot of people. Also, 'horde of zombies'? I know my ego is big, but it doesn't count as multiple different people.

 

Have you seen you're personality disorders Code? You yourself have like 4 people in you alone.

 

 

Is the sleeper code agent: 4kids?

 

[Codedrago]

Have you seen you're personality disorders Code? You yourself have like 4 people in you alone.

 

 

Is the sleeper code agent: 4kids?

4....Kids....

[peter_plankskull]

4....Kids....

 

It's okay... Michael Bay ruined my childhood with Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles CGI movies, and now my favorite video game franchise is now being discontinued and instead being used to fuel gambling addictions.

[ZanyaCross]

Then explain what fits the critera, ebcause the way you decribe it, it's simply a ****** who kills a lot of people. Also, 'horde of zombies'? I know my ego is big, but it doesn't count as multiple different people.

 

I already explained the criteria. An anti-hero/villain who can physically dominate or steamroll through all or most of the opposition. Think Darth Vader, think The Terminator, think The Punisher.

 

You put up a statement... and of course people are going to either agree or refute it... this is a public forum... its one thing to state if they derail the thread ... ... but another to complain about how people respond to you about the subject on hand.

 

I have every right to complain about guys who incessantly want to argue every single time someone points out the discrepancies between how men and women are depicted in the media, despite studies, evidence, and history being on my side.

 

I will admit powerful females are uncommon, but by no means rare, look at the Metal Gear Solid series... theirs arguably just as much strong women as they are men in that game, albeit the men still slightly stand out on top... but its WAY more than simply because of gender.

 

Oh yeah, let's take a moment to look some of the strong depictions of female empowerment in the Metal Gear franchise.

 

Meryl, who comes at Liquid ocelot with a friggin' army and gets stomped and humiliated and has to be rescued by the guy who's famous for repeatedly soiling his pants.

 

Naomi Hunter (fridged).

 

Quiet, a sniper who the writers came up with a hilariously convoluted reason to put into a bikini and never speak. If her rifle could fire sandwiches then she would be the MRA dream.

 

The Beauty and the Beast unit. These four might actually perfectly fit the criteria I gave above, being able to massacre redshirt armies single-handedly and not bat an eyelash doing it, but then, if you take them down non-lethally, you get to watch them have an emotional breakdown, and make them pose for pictures in their skin-tight, painted on suits.

[Codedrago]

I already explained the criteria. An anti-hero/villain who can physically dominate or steamroll through all or most of the opposition. Think Darth Vader, think The Terminator, think The Punisher.

 

Oh, so most of th characters I mentioned then? Hell, Juliet is the appitamy of that.

 

I have every right to complain about guys who incessantly want to argue every single time someone points out the discrepancies between how men and women are depicted in the media, despite studies, evidence, and history being on my side.

Yes, people saying they disagree with somthing said in a discussion fourm. Tragic.

[Nefla]

If I had to choose I'd go with female. Male SW is really well-acted and written, but in the end he comes off like almost every grimdark dude-bro villain-protagonist anti-hero that I have seen in so many different things. Female warrior's VA is just as good (and she seems to do sarcasm just a bit better, for those who like snarking at Baras), and having the woman be the unstoppable power-fantasy murder-machine is something you simply don't see as often (if ever) in media, so it might make for a fresher experience (imo).

 

Downside is your only romance option until SoR is Quinn (although a fling with Pierce is also possible).

 

You can play your character however you want. My male SW is 100% LS, a good person but who cracks jokes at every turn. Definitely not a grimdark villain whatever My female SW is a proud imperial loyalist who acts for the good of the empire and doesn't kill people for fun. She landed at a neutral alignment because of this. SWtOR treats men and women the same and you can be any gender with any class and any alignment.

 

PS: you shut up about my husbando!

Edited June 21, 2016 by Nefla

[ZanyaCross]

Oh, so most of th characters I mentioned then? Hell, Juliet is the appitamy of that..

 

She murders zombies, that's not exactly being an anti-hero. Although I do like how the camera keeps panning up her skirt after the shower-scene as she jumps around, just like it does with guys in video game.

 

SWtOR treats men and women the same and you can be any gender with any class and any alignment.

 

Old Republic, and Bioware in general, do better, but if they treated men and women the same we wouldn't have the Slave Leia or dancers outfits. The female body type 3 and 4 would also be a lot heavier, in muscle and fat, respectively.

Edited June 21, 2016 by ZanyaCross

[Codedrago]

She murders zombies, that's not exactly being an anti-hero. :

 

How?

 

Although I do like how the camera keeps panning up her skirt after the shower-scene as she jumps around, just like it does with guys in video game. :rolleyes

Yeah, with the male characters it usually focuses on the muscles, strenght and... oh so honey-to-your-ears voices for sexyness points.

[Codedrago]

 

 

Old Republic, and Bioware in general, do better, but if they treated men and women the same we wouldn't have the Slave Leia .

 

Oh yeah, Slave Leia. The whole thing that only happened because Leia's actress wanted to be in sexyer clothing for once. Though even if it wasn't her influence, I still on't see the problem with it.

[ZanyaCross]

Yeah, with the male characters it usually focuses on the muscles, strenght and... oh so honey-to-your-ears voices for sexyness points.

 

Muscles and strength aren't inherently sexy to women, and often the camera doesn't sexualize these guys to pander to women. This is a fallacy I see repeated and regurgitated everywhere and it's related to what I just said above about the type 3 and 4 bodies, which on the male side are made to look massive and powerful, catering to male power fantasy, while the type 3 and 4 female bodies are still made to look conventionally attractive to male players. A type 3 female body should look like Zarya from Overwatch, but someone who's a tiny bit taller and broad-shouldered than average.

[Codedrago]

Muscles and strength aren't inherently sexy to women, and often the camera doesn't sexualize these guys to pander to women.

 

Becuase when looking into the usual demigraphic of both genders in terms of what is found attractive, in general woman and men have noticably differences in what usualy is seen as attractive. Think about most chick-flicks or romance novels (Stuff like Fifty-Shades of Grey) where the major demographic is woman, the attributes that make the girls drool there are usually a nicly muscled hunk who shows power and domination. Aspects like that. Males (Again, generally as we can't examine everyone different kink) see different aspects for what is attractive.

 

In regards to power fantasies, they're not really dependent on how attractive the person is, but their effect.

[peter_plankskull]

I have every right to complain about guys who incessantly want to argue every single time someone points out the discrepancies between how men and women are depicted in the media, despite studies, evidence, and history being on my side.

 

 

 

Oh yeah, let's take a moment to look some of the strong depictions of female empowerment in the Metal Gear franchise.

 

Meryl, who comes at Liquid ocelot with a friggin' army and gets stomped and humiliated and has to be rescued by the guy who's famous for repeatedly soiling his pants.

 

Naomi Hunter (fridged).

 

Quiet, a sniper who the writers came up with a hilariously convoluted reason to put into a bikini and never speak. If her rifle could fire sandwiches then she would be the MRA dream.

 

The Beauty and the Beast unit. These four might actually perfectly fit the criteria I gave above, being able to massacre redshirt armies single-handedly and not bat an eyelash doing it, but then, if you take them down non-lethally, you get to watch them have an emotional breakdown, and make them pose for pictures in their skin-tight, painted on suits.

 

Nice try cherry picking.

 

You realize Meryl was created for an entire different purpose, which was to substitute how the user would react upon entering a war, right? At first we would all think were this awesome incredible person spouting one liners, but then we realize how awful war is and realize the horrors of it. Besides, she gets a huge upgrade in MGS4 and while isn't physically unstoppable and slightly mentally unstable, remains true to her goals and doesn't let anything stop her. Not to mention if you haven't noticed... Liquid Ocelot is kind of... I don't know... a master manipulator and genius always 5 steps ahead of everyone.

 

You left out sniper wolf... I uh... don't know to much about her honestly, but she also has apparently one of the STRONGEST mental focusing connections in the world as well. "Miller" mentions that a average sniper can only fully concentrate on a target for about 15 minutes... meanwhile she can go on FOR DAYS. Her marksmanship is kind of unknown since she can only go up against Snake, and Meryl was more clueless than a 2 year old so she doesn't count...

 

Rose... rose is... uh... kind of... meh... not every female into the series can be awesome. Least she never cheated on Raiden... just uh... stalked him... manipulated him... err... yeah... moving on.

 

Although brief, Olga still gets a pretty nice spotlight showing that she will do ANYTHING to protect her child from the patriots, even her own life. MGS2 is... err... a bit convoluted and I haven't played it in awhile and she kind of got short handed with the codec to know about her... and I don't refer to the wiki when gaining my knowledge about characters. Bit short on information on her, and once again, she comes across the path of "The Legendary Hero" so it's hard to get a real data on her combat abilities. She was able to easily block bullets while in the Fox suit and seemed to plan things pretty well while maintaining her cover.

 

Fortune... err... well... again... not everyone can be awesome. Still... the way she deflects dem rockets though, rockets meant to take out other Metal Gears and practically wrecks Rex.

 

Way to leave out the boss, which is arguably the strongest female in the entire series, and one of the most fan favorites. She matches your criteria perfectly, almost physically impossible to beat and one of the strongest mental and most focused minds ever. She had to betray everything she loved, her son, Snake, her country, her friends, EVERYTHING she loved, all for the sake of stopping WW3, even her life which would then give her student nightmares forever. She practically smashed Naked Snake every time until he finally had the mental ability to beat her, the fear, the pain, the end, the fury, and the sorrow all had to be suppressed and focus on his mission.

 

Beauty and the Beast Corp... welp... I didn't exactly like the tight skinned suits either. Still that isn't the point, its to show how traumatized they are for the hideous acts of war between countries that turned them into what they are-unstable emotional killing machines.

 

Depends on a subjective point of view when looking at why Quiet is the way she is in terms of physical appearance. Ill admit... she uh... she is... extremely... gazed upon...for her body... but still... the commitment she has to Venom Snake is unparalleled. Yet again another VERY strong willed individual and her physical capabilities are... jeez. Notice how she was one of the ONLY characters in MGSV NOT to be eaten up completely be revenge. Look at what happened to Miller... Skull face... Zero... Naked Snake... they all let revenge, anger, hatred, to sway their actions and make terrible decisions and changed their personality forever. Miller became a incredibly cynical man and would at ever chance try to throw Quiet under the bus, Skull Face wanted revenge on the world and to cause chaos, Naked Snake and Zero due to being unable to reason with one another destroyed the Bosses will letting the world revolve around war. Everything she fought for, believed, everything Zero and Snake believed was thrown away because of anger. Quiet on the other hand did evidently at first go out to fight Venom Snake, however she didn't give in to revenge, she instead even fell in love with the very man she hated by looking past what her own actions did. She could of at ANY time destroyed the entire base, even when they tortured her she didn't break, she even helps you take down her former employer. The only thing that made her break was saving the life of Venom Snake. Should I honestly even go into her physical abilities? Choking out two well built individuals with one hand at the same time when they fought under Big boss? That whole incident with the Russians...

 

Still got Eva, Naomi Hunter, etc. etc.

 

I could go on and on about the female characters in the game and if you look past how their physically presented theirs a lot to their character. Besides... the men in the series have also been WAY over sexualized as well. Any reason for Liquid to be shirtless when piloting Metal Gear Rex when its freezing in Alaska? Two grown shirtless men duking it out near the coldest place in Alaska as well? Raiden and his naked butt flap cartwheels anyone? How about when theirs a really well placed cup... and... uh... straw... in the interrogation room? The existence of Johnny constantly crapping his pants in 1, 3, 4 and a cameo in 2 and 5? Naked snake... going... Naked when ever you want him to in Metal Gear Solid 3? The constant crotch grabs that happens to Raiden/Snake/Raikov/Volgin?

 

EDIT-Damn it... how could I forget Armstrong that dudes literally looks like he came out of one piece.

Edited June 21, 2016 by peter_plankskull

[jstankaroslo]

Muscles and strength aren't inherently sexy to women, and often the camera doesn't sexualize these guys to pander to women. This is a fallacy I see repeated and regurgitated everywhere and it's related to what I just said above about the type 3 and 4 bodies, which on the male side are made to look massive and powerful, catering to male power fantasy, while the type 3 and 4 female bodies are still made to look conventionally attractive to male players. A type 3 female body should look like Zarya from Overwatch, but someone who's a tiny bit taller and broad-shouldered than average.

 

Not that I don't have my own muscle girls fantasy, but lets be real -male BT3 looks like your everyday american football player. Fem BT3 is more like tough but still lean female soldiers ie -both have a look of their respective genders at their physical peak.

Massive bodybuilders are slow and have no condition -our characters run constantly

 

OT: Female SW for DS (who doesn't love evil babes?) and Male for LS -btw playing a LS male warrior was one of my best story experiences in this game. The voice seemed noble and honourable, fitting my idea of LS SW. Truly worth it (this is probably true for fem SW too)

[ZanyaCross]

Becuase when looking into the usual demigraphic of both genders in terms of what is found attractive, in general woman and men have noticably differences in what usualy is seen as attractive. Think about most chick-flicks or romance novels (Stuff like Fifty-Shades of Grey) where the major demographic is woman, the attributes that make the girls drool there are usually a nicly muscled hunk who shows power and domination. Aspects like that. Males (Again, generally as we can't examine everyone different kink) see different aspects for what is attractive.

 

In regards to power fantasies, they're not really dependent on how attractive the person is, but their effect.

 

Thanks for that paragraph of pseudoscience gobbledygook, but you pretty much defeated the entire point of your original argument.

 

You can't argue that men and women are treated the same in media, and then turn around and say, "Yeah, they are, but it's totally because of reasons!" That argument, even if it was true (and it really isn't) ignores how often media shapes society's outlook and not the other way around.

 

Look, the simple fact is that I am telling you that there is a lack of a certain type of character in media to identify with, you decided to mansplain to me how that is wrong, like millions of guys do every single day, and provided a few examples that only proved how little you even understood my original post.

[Codedrago]

Thanks for that paragraph of pseudoscience gobbledygook, but you pretty much defeated the entire point of your original argument.

 

You can't argue that men and women are treated the same in media, and then turn around and say, "Yeah, they are, but it's totally because of reasons!"

 

So, my argument falls apart because I gave reasons for my argument? Or do you not realise hw that sentence immediatly contradicts itself? My argument was that what you think is simply 'male-power fantisies' is sexification of men as well, and that the differences you noted are because of the general difference in what each gender-demographic finds attractive.

 

That argument, even if it was true (and it really isn't) ignores how often media shapes society's outlook and not the other way around.

 

Media has a little influence, yes. But the leading influence is the enviorment we grow up in and our basic biological functions.

 

Look, the simple fact is that I am telling you that there is a lack of a certain type of character in media to identify with,

It's not a fact, there are plenty of characters to identfy with in media. Even if there was a lack of women, my statement would still hold true. People don't need to be the same gender, race or sexuality to identify with a character.

 

you decided to mansplain to me how that is wrong, like millions of guys do every single day, and provided a few examples that only proved how little you even understood my original post.

 

Mansplain? Common, even you're better then that eye rolling idiocy. It goes in the same category of bull as manspreading.

[ZanyaCross]

My argument was that what you think is simply 'male-power fantisies' is sexification of men as well...

 

Mansplain? Common, even you're better then that eye rolling idiocy. It goes in the same category of bull as manspreading.

 

I'm just gonna let those two statements sit together side by side and bask in each-others stupidity.

 

Nice try cherry picking.

 

I'm not even gonna argue with you about Metal Gear Solid. If that's the hill you want to die on go right ahead.

 

Not that I don't have my own muscle girls fantasy, but lets be real -male BT3 looks like your everyday american football player.

 

I went to art school and the only guy I have ever seen even come close to those proportions is Hafþór Júlíus Björnsson, the guy who plays The Mountain on Game of Thrones.

 

http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/ln7fva3fo25kc1rkropx.png

 

The guy he's next to is 5'11", which is above-average human height. If Pascal had maybe 15lbs more muscle he'd be a perfect example of type 2 male body next to a type 3.

 

And because guys arguing against me are so predictable, I'll head off the argument they're already getting ready to post, that the type-3 female body is Brienne of Tarh, so it works.

 

And if you think that's a valid defense, then kindly go jump in a river, because your argument is that laser swords, magic levitation, faster than light space travel, and aliens are all more realistic in a game than a woman who's over 6' tall and has thick arms.

Edited June 21, 2016 by ZanyaCross

[peter_plankskull]

I'm not even gonna argue with you about Metal Gear Solid. If that's the hill you want to die on go right ahead.

 

10/10 counter argument, way to solidify your point and prove me blatantly wrong at every chance. Quiet, The boss, Meryl, Sniper wolf, heck all of the females in the Metal Gear universe have no backstory, personality, or character, and exist solely for the purpose to entertain men. GG.

[Codedrago]

I'm just gonna let those two statements sit together side by side and bask in each-others stupidity.

Yeah, pointing outthe ridiculousness of a word that is used only to dissmiss people's views based o them being a man is very stupid. It's because I shouldn't even need to point out such obvious bul, right?

 

I'm not even gonna argue with you about Metal Gear Solid. If that's the hill you want to die on go right ahead.

This is a really strange pattern of ''I have no actual ground to stand on, so I'll just dissmiss everything you say"

 

And because guys arguing against me are so predictable,

 

Assuming a persons gender based on them daring to disagree with you again? Or is it 'guys' as in people? Either way it's still makign me wish I had not eaten all my popcorn.

[ZanyaCross]

10/10 counter argument, way to solidify your point and prove me blatantly wrong at every chance. Quiet, The boss, Meryl, Sniper wolf, heck all of the females in the Metal Gear universe have no backstory, personality, or character, and exist solely for the purpose to entertain men. GG.

 

I can totally see Sniper Wolf's strength on full display.

 

http://static1.gamespot.com/uploads/original/1179/11799911/2967602-1.jpg

 

Let me guess, she breathes through her cleavage?

[Codedrago]

I can totally see Sniper Wolf's strength on full display.

 

http://static1.gamespot.com/uploads/original/1179/11799911/2967602-1.jpg

 

Let me guess, she breathes through her cleavage?

 

Being sexy takes away her strength?

[ikinai]

Yeah, pointing outthe ridiculousness of a word that is used only to dissmiss people's views based o them being a man is very stupid. It's because I shouldn't even need to point out such obvious bul, right?

 

 

This is a really strange pattern of ''I have no actual ground to stand on, so I'll just dissmiss everything you say"

 

 

 

Assuming a persons gender based on them daring to disagree with you again? Or is it 'guys' as in people? Either way it's still makign me wish I had not eaten all my popcorn.

 

well, technically you are being rather dismissive of the female view point, which is mansplaining, so yeah.

[ZanyaCross]

Yeah, pointing out how women's concerns about how they are depicted by male designers totally aren't valid even though I have no first-hand personal experience in the matter and they do is very stupid.

 

Fixed that for you.

[Codedrago]

well, technically you are being rather dismissive of the female view point, which is mansplaining, so yeah.

 

Where have I dissmissed the femle point of view? I've tried to always present an argument instead of simply going ''Meh, I'm right you're wrong''. If I am doing so, I'd like to see it so that I may improve.

[peter_plankskull]

I can totally see Sniper Wolf's strength on full display.

 

http://static1.gamespot.com/uploads/original/1179/11799911/2967602-1.jpg

 

Let me guess, she breathes through her cleavage?

 

Waht the hell even is that anyway. Still, that's not the argument at hand, and im sure theirs plenty of over things the internet could bring over these characters. The point is, that men, and women, are both sexualized in media, and that theirs more to females in the Metal Gear universe than physical appearance.