Why doesn't the Consular just shield himself from the Emperor?

[JennyFlynn]

Jenny, you know who will be the villain of Season 2...

 

We might but others don't.

 

I'm also not bothered by Valky as a recurring villain, I've gotten quite used to him. I don't even see him as the big bad for this KotFE story. It kicks off with him but ends rather quickly with Arcann taking over the reigns. On top of that not every Outlander has dealt with Vitiate/Valky in their original story, just the JK and SW. The Smuggler didn't "go up against" him until Ziost and start of KotFE. Leading up to Ziost was Revan as a baddie so looking at it that way, V/V isn't that much of a milked out concept. It's only my JK who goes "ugh, you again?" and my SW who goes "oh hi boss man, thought I was rid of you.."

 

That said, I'd love for Jadus to suddenly show up and do something batshtomgwtf worthy, no doubt he could.

[Max_Killjoy]

We might but others don't.

 

I'm also not bothered by Valky as a recurring villain, I've gotten quite used to him. I don't even see him as the big bad for this KotFE story. It kicks off with him but ends rather quickly with Arcann taking over the reigns. On top of that not every Outlander has dealt with Vitiate/Valky in their original story, just the JK and SW. The Smuggler didn't "go up against" him until Ziost and start of KotFE. Leading up to Ziost was Revan as a baddie so looking at it that way, V/V isn't that much of a milked out concept. It's only my JK who goes "ugh, you again?" and my SW who goes "oh hi boss man, thought I was rid of you.."

 

That said, I'd love for Jadus to suddenly show up and do something batshtomgwtf worthy, no doubt he could.

 

However, as the player, I'm quite aware of what's gone on with Vitiate Sue and how multiple instances should have been the end of him and his arc of the overall story before we ever got to the Planet Eating Cartoon Villain moment on Ziost.

[Codedrago]

Actually, I've run into quite a few places where it's not assumed that THE player character on hand did something, only that it happened. For example, (minor spoilers at this point) when you first directly speak with the Dread Masters on Oricon, in the watchtower, they don't say that YOU killed Styrak, they say that the EMPIRE killed Styrak. I don't know if that changes for characters who've actually done S&V, and refers to them directly having a hand in Styrak's death -- but depending, it either acknowledges the character's actual history, or words things in such a way as to leave either possibility open.

 

I said story-vital. The dread masters have no overall bearing on what occurs during kofte.

[JennyFlynn]

However, as the player, I'm quite aware of what's gone on with Vitiate Sue and how multiple instances should have been the end of him and his arc of the overall story before we ever got to the Planet Eating Cartoon Villain moment on Ziost.

Yeah we the player might be getting kinda sick of the guy, you're not wrong there, but to some of our PCs he's a brand new villain and that's the one way of looking at it that keeps me sane throughout KotFE

 

The one thing that 'offends' me most in all this is his supposed death/defeat/whateverjamshimintoyourhead.

 

- JK/Vitiate meet pt 1; Vitiate overpowers JK & co. and submits them to his mind control, JK breaks free with help.

- JK/Vitiate meet pt 2; Flashy show inside Temple, JK defeats Voice of and Vitiate retreats somewhere far away.

- Vitiate eats Ziost and regains super duper powers and stuff then heads for Wild Space, presumably still weak but who knows?

- JK/Outlander/Vitiate/Valkorion meet pt 3; One simple lightsaber/weapon strike to the back and this world devouring uber epic Emperor 'dies' and now he's a mere pest in your brain?

 

Still don't know how dead he actually is and how much his power has actually diminished but it seems like a weak ending for a guy who just ate up a whole planet and who had a pretty decent showdown with the JK in the past (one that goes beyond angry face > back stab > poof defeated).

[Codedrago]

Yeah we the player might be getting kinda sick of the guy, you're not wrong there, but to some of our PCs he's a brand new villain and that's the one way of looking at it that keeps me sane throughout KotFE

 

The one thing that 'offends' me most in all this is his supposed death/defeat/whateverjamshimintoyourhead.

 

- JK/Vitiate meet pt 1; Vitiate overpowers JK & co. and submits them to his mind control, JK breaks free with help.

- JK/Vitiate meet pt 2; Flashy show inside Temple, JK defeats Voice of and Vitiate retreats somewhere far away.

- Vitiate eats Ziost and regains super duper powers and stuff then heads for Wild Space, presumably still weak but who knows?

- JK/Outlander/Vitiate/Valkorion meet pt 3; One simple lightsaber/weapon strike to the back and this world devouring uber epic Emperor 'dies' and now he's a mere pest in your brain?

 

Still don't know how dead he actually is and how much his power has actually diminished but it seems like a weak ending for a guy who just ate up a whole planet and who had a pretty decent showdown with the JK in the past (one that goes beyond angry face > back stab > poof defeated).

 

Well, when he's struck he smiles the same smile he had back when Arcaan tried to strike him down in the trailers. Coupled with his dying line it makes it seem he wanted to be stabbed in the back. Either that or he's trying to save his bruised ego from his decision to turn his back on you.

 

Though he could be just like the Inquisitor and Vaylin, they're powerful, but squishy.

[Nothing_Shines]

Sith Magics of somone who was no where near the power of anyone we fought after act 2.

 

 

With the help of his dead master and while Vitiate is trapped on Voss.

 

 

We're never told how powerful the ghosts are. At best they're probably just above average.

 

Which is you ASSUMING that precludes their use in this case. No character has made any such claim.

 

Lana: Could your shielding technique work in this case? It has proven effective against ancient Sith magics before.

JC: I don't know. Maybe. Let's try.

*cut-scene of intense concentration before technique fails and Valkorian laughs and mocks the JC*

JC: Gah! He's too entrenched. Too powerful. We'll have to find some other way to get him out of my head!

Lana: It's OK. Don't worry. We'll find it.

 

Wow, that was tough. Probably take too much money and time and effort for that 60 second cutscene, though. Why bother? Just assume it wouldn't work and move on.

 

I'll say it again: He's so powerful and unstoppable that a single blaster bolt through heavy armor one shot's the Immortal Emperor God-thing, while at the same time all the esoteric end of story abilities certain PCs have displayed are just assumed to fail outright? Yeah, OK. Makes sense.

 

Let me ask you, if my smuggler didn't one-shot Valkorian at the start of KOTFE, and it was Arcann that killed him and just blamed me, would you be proclaiming Valkorian was as unto a god and only a Force user like Arcann could have killed him? Based on your argument, I'd say you would and you'd be wrong, because he clearly can be one-shot by a mook with a blaster pistol ... because he was.

 

We know this, because someone actually tried it, and didn't just assume it would fail.

[JennyFlynn]

Well, when he's struck he smiles the same smile he had back when Arcaan tried to strike him down in the trailers. Coupled with his dying line it makes it seem he wanted to be stabbed in the back. Either that or he's trying to save his bruised ego from his decision to turn his back on you.

 

Though he could be just like the Inquisitor and Vaylin, they're powerful, but squishy.

 

Yeah I've always wondered if getting inside of you was his plan all along in a way. There's something about his laugh and look on his face that screams 'This is exactly what I wanted'.

 

Dirty old man.

[Codedrago]

Which is you ASSUMING that precludes their use in this case. No character has made any such claim.

 

Lana: Could your shielding technique work in this case? It has proven effective against ancient Sith magics before.

JC: I don't know. Maybe. Let's try.

*cut-scene of intense concentration before technique fails and Valkorian laughs and mocks the JC*

JC: Gah! He's too entrenched. Too powerful. We'll have to find some other way to get him out of my head!

Lana: It's OK. Don't worry. We'll find it.

 

Wow, that was tough. Probably take too much money and time and effort for that 60 second cutscene, though. Why bother? Just assume it wouldn't work and move on.

 

I'll say it again: He's so powerful and unstoppable that a single blaster bolt through heavy armor one shot's the Immortal Emperor God-thing, while at the same time all the esoteric end of story abilities certain PCs have displayed are just assumed to fail outright? Yeah, OK. Makes sense.

.

 

The characters know more about their own limits, they witnessed Ziost. THey know how powerful Vitiate is.

 

Let me ask you, if my smuggler didn't one-shot Valkorian at the start of KOTFE, and it was Arcann that killed him and just blamed me, would you be proclaiming Valkorian was as unto a god and only a Force user like Arcann could have killed him? l

No, I don't think we can stop him on our on either way. Plus, depends on how he dies and why.

 

because he clearly can be one-shot by a mook with a blaster pistol ... because he was.

 

 

Be had no armour on and was busy fighting Arcann, a lot of characters can be easily one shotted no matter their power if they don't have anything defending their vital organs.

 

We know this, because someone actually tried it, and didn't just assume it would fai

They assumed they could shoot him while he was distracted and vulnerable.

[Nothing_Shines]

Yeah I've always wondered if getting inside of you was his plan all along in a way. There's something about his laugh and look on his face that screams 'This is exactly what I wanted'.

 

Dirty old man.

 

Except the look on his face is one of complete surprise. He does a ZOMG face, looks down at the hole in his chest and says, "So be it." Then he does his purple magic explosion while he laughs.

 

He was not planning on dying there in that way or to the PC. He recovers and does his villain laugh as he prepares to possess the PC, but no way was this "all a part of my sinister plans, mwwwawaahhaha!"

[Codedrago]

Yeah I've always wondered if getting inside of you was his plan all along in a way. There's something about his laugh and look on his face that screams 'This is exactly what I wanted'.

 

Dirty old man.

 

As Arcann points out, Vitiate's been getting weaker al the time. So, I'm thinking either he got killed to latch onto us because after all the damage we've done to him before hand and some unexpected side affects of what he did on Ziost, he's slowly dying and needs to stay with us to stay alive. Or when he was killed by Arcann, he saw us as the only way of surviving.

[Nothing_Shines]

Be had no armour on and was busy fighting Arcann, a lot of characters can be easily one shotted no matter their power if they don't have anything defending their vital organs.

 

Now I know you're just talking out of your ***. Go look at every single piece of marketing imagery for Valkorian and then go watch the cutcene again. He's wearing heavy armor, heavier than the generic Jedi armor or Arcann. And he'd just KO'd Arcann. He says, "That is why you fail." Then the PC says there "for freedom!" or "for you being a meanie" speech and shoots him through and through.

Edited April 4, 2016 by Nothing_Shines

[Codedrago]

Now I know you're just talking out of your ***. Go look at every single piece of marketing imagery for Valkorian and then go watch the cutcene again. He's wearing heavy armor, heavier than the generic Jedi armor or Arcann.

 

Not really, that looks no where near heavy armour.

[Master-Nala]

So who would make a good villain to replace Arcann, Vaylin and Valkorion as KotFE progresses into S2 and S3? Like, who or what at this point would be 'acceptable' as opposition to our heroes? I'm seeing plenty reason why our current villains 'suck', or that seems to be the gist of it, but I see little suggestions on who'd make for a better bad guy.

 

Oh that's easy, the other PCs.

 

I would much rather my Consular be trying to stop the machinations of Darth Nox. Or my Smuggler in an underworld war with the Bounty Hunter.

 

Or even not having a "big bad" villain. You know, kinda like Vanilla where we're at war with the Sith/Republic. There were enemies, some of whom were a significant threat, some not. But the real conflict was a clash of civilizations. Zakuul is silly.

[Nothing_Shines]

Not really, that looks no where near heavy armour.

 

Sure, OK. It's a bathrobe. Whatever let's you defend BW's poor story choices.

[Codedrago]

Oh that's easy, the other PCs.

 

I would much rather my Consular be trying to stop the machinations of Darth Nox. Or my Smuggler in an underworld war with the Bounty Hunter.

That would piss off too many people for even Bioware's liking.

 

Or even not having a "big bad" villain. You know, kinda like Vanilla where we're at war with the Sith/Republic. There were enemies, some of whom were a significant threat, some not. But the real conflict was a clash of civilizations. Zakuul is silly.

You always had a big bad, for class stories and planetary stories. The conflict of Sith Vs Republic was only the setting.

[Master-Nala]

You always had a big bad, for class stories and planetary stories. The conflict of Sith Vs Republic was only the setting.

 

Not at all. Many of the opponents for the class stories were not significant threats. Heck, some spent most of their time running from you until you caught up to then, see e.g. Tavus, Skaavak, Tarro Blood. Tarro Blood is a particularly interesting example. He was worried, basically from the beginning about the Bounty Hunter. He was an antagonist, but at no point did the story need to show him as superior martially to your character.

[Max_Killjoy]

I said story-vital. The dread masters have no overall bearing on what occurs during kofte.

 

They were vital to the story from Imperial Belsavis to multiple operations to Section X to Oricon and two more capstone Ops. Their story fed a metric ton of the post-50 content.

 

 

 

You always had a big bad, for class stories and planetary stories. The conflict of Sith Vs Republic was only the setting.

 

I don't recall that the Bounty Hunter ever really had a "Big Bad" in terms of someone far more powerful they had to struggle to overcome.

Edited April 4, 2016 by Max_Killjoy

[Khevar]

For example, (minor spoilers at this point) when you first directly speak with the Dread Masters on Oricon, in the watchtower, they don't say that YOU killed Styrak, they say that the EMPIRE killed Styrak. I don't know if that changes for characters who've actually done S&V, and refers to them directly having a hand in Styrak's death --

It's been a while since I've experienced the dialog, but I'm 99.9% sure that if your toon ran SnV and then does the Oricon storyline, that fact (i.e. YOU killed Styrak) is referred to specifically by the original quest giver on the fleet (Saresh / Marr) as well as the Dread Masters themselves in the Watchtower.

[IanArgent]

It needed to end at the end of the JK story...

 

So say we all

[IanArgent]

Side note: what if he's not possessing you (at least not until you let him in by making certain choices)? Instead, maybe just hanging around as a free-floating Force entity. The only time he has any control is a)when you're basically on the threshold of death (Ch.II), or b) when you've opened yourself up to his influence by taking his power.

 

I think the story of KotFE is rather lazy in its assumptions, and that Vitiate's story should have ended at the finale of the REDACTED class quest. But (so far) they haven't forced a possession on the Outlander, merely a haunting (unless the Outlander asks for it, knowingly or unknowingly). Possession implies control, and Valk doesn't have that (unless you invite him in, three times even); at least on the run-throughs I've done. Those run-throughs have all been light-sided rejections of power; so it's possible that I missed something, but I haven't heard anything that glaringly contradicts that, either

[Max_Killjoy]

It's been a while since I've experienced the dialog, but I'm 99.9% sure that if your toon ran SnV and then does the Oricon storyline, that fact (i.e. YOU killed Styrak) is referred to specifically by the original quest giver on the fleet (Saresh / Marr) as well as the Dread Masters themselves in the Watchtower.

 

OK.

 

Not sure what others think, but to me it would be quite jarring if I was on a character who had never done S&V, and yet everyone acted as if that character had killed Styrak.

[Codedrago]

They were vital to the story from Imperial Belsavis to multiple operations to Section X to Oricon and two more capstone Ops. Their story fed a metric ton of the post-50 content.

.

 

You participating in that content had nothing to do with SOR, Ziost or KOFTE. Your character is assumed to have finished their class stories, the planetary quests and SOR because those are very important to KOFTE.

[Codedrago]

OK.

 

Not sure what others think, but to me it would be quite jarring if I was on a character who had never done S&V, and yet everyone acted as if that character had killed Styrak.

 

I wouldn't find it jarring, but I would find it slightly confusing before shrugging it off.

[Max_Killjoy]

You participating in that content had nothing to do with SOR, Ziost or KOFTE. Your character is assumed to have finished their class stories, the planetary quests and SOR because those are very important to KOFTE.

 

I was asked for an example of an instance in which a character's NON-participation in previous content had been differentiated from actual participation in current content, and I provided one.

 

As for important to KofTE, that's great and all, but it's still possible that whatever comes after KotFE could be designed such that a particular character's participation isn't vital to that new story arc.

Edited April 5, 2016 by Max_Killjoy

[Codedrago]

I was asked for an example of an instance in which a character's NON-participation in previous content had been differentiated from actual participation in current content, and I provided one.

 

 

You said this in response to me telling you they've always assumed the player went through content that their participation in was vital to the story.

 

As for important to KofTE, that's great and all, but it's still possible that whatever comes after KotFE could be designed such that a character's participation isn't vital to that new story arc.

With how they're going and the way Bioware works story-wise, it seems VERY VERY unlikly that becoming the Outlander will not be a key component after KOFTE.