Why premade is a problem?

[OmegaDagger]

On my last "streak" of pvp, meaning doing more then the every now and then when I feel like it pvp, but on a set mission. This one for M1-4X companion, which I was lucky enough to complete in less then 20/20 rounds.

 

I noticed this.

 

the only times my team won, was when we all took a little time before the match to set some very basic tactics, to survey our team on who is weakest and who is strongest, then quikly apply roles, have a PREMADE tactic against premades as much as we could.

 

So we encountered a premade, and becuse we then diregarded our own win ration for the moment, we all focused on thaking out first their healer then their stealther, in this case the premade had both.

 

Doing that we ended up with 1 dead vs their 2 dead, so we won the deathmatch.

 

My point is that premades is nothing more then people gathering in advance, sharing tactics, and to some extend planning their pvp.

 

I can not see that premades are wrong in any way at all to be fair. Can I see that being beaten by the "same" group again and again is a problem, yes and no....yes becuse loosing isn't fun.

No, becuse Nothing prevents both sides from doing what MMOS somewaht are intended for.....teaming up and doing things.

 

If you are to turn it around to pve, then premades is often the only way to make sure we beat a HM OPS, we are sure that our group knows at least the basics of the matches in the ops etc and we can easily use preagreed tatics.

 

IF premades is such a probem, then team up your self.

 

Now, I don't want to guild up, it has "duties", I don't want to pull togheter a team of friends to plan some pvp for the day....

So I QUE alone, then I get PUGed with alot of other that really don't have level of competition and pre planning as the premades so becuse I REFUSE to team up in advance I complain.

 

LOL!

 

It is the same with really my issues about the belitteling and result orientented complaining I am so fed up with and complain about.

 

Here we have people wanting to do "sport" in a place where every other team mate they encounter have a very other idea then "sport", yet in stead of then seeking out thir sport where it is most likely to be found, they compalain.

 

And this thing about premades is the exact same, the ONLY reason premades is problem, is becuse people let be......if those that really felt that premades were such a major issue, bothered to do what most MMO players .....group up, and when called for, group up in advance and plan.........then really the problem about premades becomes utterly silly

 

is there a like button on these forums?

[Yorioko]

is there a like button on these forums?

 

Should have been one next to "quote"

[jenlen]

It is way past time for Solo Unranked. If nothing else, queues would pop a lot faster!

 

BUT... we would need better matchmaking to go with it or it is wasted effort. I could see it ending up with 4 healers on one team and none on the other without better matchmaking.

[Yorioko]

The problem about players in a MMO teaming up to go and do something, in this case pvp honestly escapes me.

Logic? Nope...............lets chuck that one ot the window

[Talosred]

Not really a problem for me, its fun to troll premade groups, they are sensitive folks.

[foxmob]

The only reason it exists is to group up people who dont have friends. It isnt a special protected category.

 

lol right. c'mmon, man. you don't have to agree with the solo-queueing, but don't make up **** as stupid as the dude who calls premades an exploit.

[Lhancelot]

lol right. c'mmon, man. you don't have to agree with the solo-queueing, but don't make up **** as stupid as the dude who calls premades an exploit.

 

I think what that guy is saying is, solo queue should be renamed the "lonely people with no friends queue", and group queues should be called, "awesomely social people with friends queue".

[-Bob-]

okay so, Lets say Devs make Regs Solo Que only, no more premades. Those players that would want to play with each other will individually Q synch and when they don't get on the same teams they will leave and try again. Probably going to lead to several half filled matches that end early because contrary to popular belief, not every premade flies the same guild tag. You might think your team is all solo players but you have no idea which of those players may have grouped and Que'd as a 2-3 or 4 man.

[Bobbafatter]

okay so, Lets say Devs make Regs Solo Que only, no more premades. Those players that would want to play with each other will individually Q synch and when they don't get on the same teams they will leave and try again. Probably going to lead to several half filled matches that end early because contrary to popular belief, not every premade flies the same guild tag. You might think your team is all solo players but you have no idea which of those players may have grouped and Que'd as a 2-3 or 4 man.

 

That's why regs needs to go away. Just run ranked - solo and group. The losers that run in premades in regs today will not quit if it affects their rating.

[Savej]

okay so, Lets say Devs make Regs Solo Que only, no more premades. Those players that would want to play with each other will individually Q synch and when they don't get on the same teams they will leave and try again. Probably going to lead to several half filled matches that end early because contrary to popular belief, not every premade flies the same guild tag. You might think your team is all solo players but you have no idea which of those players may have grouped and Que'd as a 2-3 or 4 man.

 

You're talking about a very small percentage of pvpers that would do that for any length of time in regs. Most of the people that want to pvp are not afraid to pvp without having all their friends backing them up - but many aren't going to do it at all if they -do- have to organize a guild event every time just to have a fair chance of not getting stomped by a gang. Remove the ~10% of people that are ruining it for everyone else by always grouping with friends in mumble and I bet the qs double in size fairly quickly. Same deal in solo ranked.

Edited March 13, 2016 by Savej

[Razortron]

Guild!

[peepa]

100% truth here.

 

I actually like regs because of the 8v8 format. I also solo queue a lot. I have group queued before and occasionally do now if someone invites me to a group for PVP.

 

That being said, I am just surprised some people defend the "solo queue" system in effect right now, and refuse to admit that it's definitely not exactly a fair match up having organized groups fighting random solo queued pugs.

 

I don't cry about how it works, because I usually can find people to group with if the matches become too much to suffer through and if not, well I can log on my healing sorc and make solo queing not as bad.

 

Point is, it's not really a fair matchup. No one can honestly say it is, and stomping pugs while in a premade gets boring fast for me as it does for others too.

 

I have been with really good pvpers who decide to go to pub side because the stompings are so easy, just to try to balance the sides out a bit for more compelling fights.

 

usually the best fights occur when premades end up against other premades or pugs face pugs. The problem is when premades face pugs they usually steamroll them easily. I know pugs can beat premades but let's be honest usually they do not.

 

If solo queue truly split up everyone in the queue and matched them according to classes, and not the group premade they were in when joining the queue, how would this not make for more compelling fights?

 

I just think from the perspective of what would make better fights and that's more important to me tbh.

 

If people want to group with their friends, guildies, whatever, it would be best if they were matched against others who group queued too.

 

I realize it won't happen but in theory it would be better for PVP, if the population could handle such queues.

 

All good stuff right there.

 

If they did add in a truly solo unranked queue that seems like it would be the most fair. There would still be areas for unranked premades to pvp in and also solo players to pvp in. Why would anyone be against adding that as an option?

[-Bob-]

You're talking about a very small percentage of pvpers that would do that for any length of time in regs. Most of the people that want to pvp are not afraid to pvp without having all their friends backing them up - but many aren't going to do it at all if they -do- have to organize a guild event every time just to have a fair chance of not getting stomped by a gang. Remove the ~10% of people that are ruining it for everyone else by always grouping with friends in mumble and I bet the qs double in size fairly quickly. Same deal in solo ranked.

 

I think it's a difference in perspective. As a solo runner (rarely ever group up) I personally don't have a problem with premades and i do not think they are a problem at all, so from my perspective, it would be a small percentage of pvpers as you mentioned above. To me a small percentage doesn't sound like an issue at all.

On the other hand, those who constantly QQ about premades make it sound as if these groups are abundant and out in force constantly dominating the WZs. They make it sound like a much larger portion of the community is grouping up which would result in more Q synching with a solo only option.

Honestly though, none of it even matters to me, ive become so casual in this game i would rather log out and do something else after getting stuck with 1 bad group. I was just tossing something out there for people to think about. More often than not people tunnel vision on what they want and dont think about the negative effects, like many of the WZs.

It's beer :30

Cheerz

Edited March 13, 2016 by -Bob-

[Razortron]

THIS MMO HAS GUILDS WITH PEOPLE THAT KNOW EACH OTHER AND PLAY WITH EACH OTHER IS THAT A BAD THING?

[omaan]

What could make it work better is cross-faction queuing meaning letting pubs and imps play on the same side.

I really don't like the idea of cross-faction. It It spoils and ruins the game story and content, republic must fight empire and they can't be friends. We must remember about the plot of this game and it's story. They should look for another decision to balance factions.

[Yorioko]

How utterly STUPID isn't it to critizise that people in an MMO are grouping up.

LOL

[peepa]

How utterly STUPID isn't it to critizise that people in an MMO are grouping up.

LOL

 

So you can play in ranked/unranked matches vs other premades and while doing that criticize the rest of the people that are going into solo matches. Both get what they want. Glad you agree.

[Yorioko]

So you can play in ranked/unranked matches vs other premades and while doing that criticize the rest of the people that are going into solo matches. Both get what they want. Glad you agree.

 

I am not at all critizing anyone other them tht cries foul fo no reson.

 

YOU decide to queue solo, KNOWING full well you will be in a PUG group, with the "risks" that intails, YOU STILL INSIST on doing this.....

The other side, have decided to team up in advance, after all TEAMING UP is sort of the bigger aspect of MMOs, so they do this.

Becuse they group up in advance, they will perform better.........much better then any group that has less planning ahead.

 

I really can't see the issue.

 

To me it sounds like this.

 

I want to play this MMO, I even PVP on it ALONE, but so happens that Groups beat me.................let's make groups aka TEAMWORK ( or the concept of an MMO) illegal so that groups in a MMO can't be done becuse I don't WANT to Group up.

 

PREMADES HAS NEVER NOR WILL IT EVER BE A PROBLEM, AFTER ALL PREMADES ARE PEOPLE GROUPING UP IN AN MMO, AND ONLY THAT.

[kweassa]

I am not at all critizing anyone other them tht cries foul fo no reson.

 

YOU decide to queue solo, KNOWING full well you will be in a PUG group, with the "risks" that intails, YOU STILL INSIST on doing this.....

The other side, have decided to team up in advance, after all TEAMING UP is sort of the bigger aspect of MMOs, so they do this.

Becuse they group up in advance, they will perform better.........much better then any group that has less planning ahead.

 

 

I really can't see the issue.

 

Then here's the issue in a nutshell.

 

WITH PREMADES, THE OUTCOME OF THE GAME IS PRE-DETERMINED BEFORE THE ACTUAL PROCESS OF FIGHTING ITSELF, DUE TO UNEQUAL STARTING CONDITIONS

 

That clear enough for you?

 

 

To me it sounds like this.

 

I want to play this MMO, I even PVP on it ALONE, but so happens that Groups beat me.................let's make groups aka TEAMWORK ( or the concept of an MMO) illegal so that groups in a MMO can't be done becuse I don't WANT to Group up.

 

The problem is that teamwork is itself a commodity. It does not come by free, nor can everyone may have the time and resources to find teams(= which usually imply guilds and everything that follows). The WHY does not matter. "WHY DO YOU NOT MAKE TEAMS" is not a question that needs to be answered, nor even brought up in the first place. It is totally IRRELEVANT.

 

The only simple truth regarding this whole ordeal is this:

 

1. There is a game

2. When you play a game, you start out equal.

 

Nobody gives a shi* why people make, or do not make premades. The only apparent factor that comes into play is that premade team is essentially a predetermined win. You yourself mentioned that teamwork is a means to win. By definition an organized team is itself an advantage WHICH SOME PEOPLE MAY NOT BE ABLE TO ACQUIRE due to variety of reasons, and therefore the formation of a team in unranked reg matches is a means to solidify the chances of a win outside the boundaries of the game itself.

 

It TAMPERS with the starting conditions which normally, a process of random selection tends to guarantee fairness on a larger time scale. Through random, individual queues, the system disperses people with better skill and better gear into different teams each time, and therefore, guarantees individual players inside each team has about the same chance as being landed with a "winning team" and a "losing team" on average.

 

 

PREMADES HAS NEVER NOR WILL IT EVER BE A PROBLEM, AFTER ALL PREMADES ARE PEOPLE GROUPING UP IN AN MMO, AND ONLY THAT.

 

People grouping up to steamroll others, to be more exact.

 

One can easily ask the exact opposite question: The game also supports a ranked arena where teams are more encouraged than unranked, casual level of PvP. Why waste your time PvPing lesser people which you know you are greatly advantaged over, instead of face the same odds in ranked WZs exclusively?

 

Normally, I don't call people who get off by participating in predetermined slaughter as "PvP"ers -- knowing that they've (most likely) already secured a (most likely) win before the actual fighting happens.

 

I usually call them "wannabes."

 

......

 

And no. Premades have always been a problem in every game that supports similar circumstances. I've seen hordes of other, small~middle grade MMOGs literally fall apart with entire PvP population just disappearing, because premades shat on everyone else. Many PvP guilds in other games actually go so far as to come up with internal regulations to prohibit their guildsmen from entering 'casual' matches as teams -- allowing them to team up in premades of pairs or more only in ranked, "official" ones. People like these, are PvPers -- the ones that can tell the difference which environment warrants teaming, and which not.

 

 

So ask yourself this.

 

Are people so frickin' serious, or desperate to get wins, that they need to raindown shi*storm with such "pro" teaming, in an arena of casual PvP gameplay where like 70~80% of the population can't even tell which direction you have to run or how to throw the ball in Huttball?

 

 

Better yet. Ask yourself this: "Why do we make premades" -- which, everyone knows the answer.

You make premades to win. It is a FACTOR THAT IS OUTSIDE THE PROCESS OF ACTUAL COMBAT THAT INFLUENCES THE OUTCOME.

 

The better the PvP, the less it allows outside influences to affect the outcome of the game. It's "Player versus Player" -- you decide the outcome of the fight by actually doing the fight to determine who loses and wins -- not by grabbing a number of people you already know has a high chance of winning.

Edited March 13, 2016 by kweassa

[Yorioko]

Then here's the issue in a nutshell.

 

WITH PREMADES, THE OUTCOME OF THE GAME IS PRE-DETERMINED BEFORE THE ACTUAL PROCESS OF FIGHTING ITSELF, DUE TO UNEQUAL STARTING CONDITIONS

 

That clear enough for you?

 

 

 

 

The problem is that teamwork is itself a commodity. It does not come by free, nor can everyone may have the time and resources to find teams(= which usually imply guilds and everything that follows). The WHY does not matter. "WHY DO YOU NOT MAKE TEAMS" is not a question that needs to be answered, nor even brought up in the first place. It is totally IRRELEVANT.

 

The only simple truth regarding this whole ordeal is this:

 

1. There is a game

2. When you play a game, you start out equal.

 

Nobody gives a shi* why people make, or do not make premades. The only apparent factor that comes into play is that premade team is essentially a predetermined win. You yourself mentioned that teamwork is a means to win. By definition an organized team is itself an advantage WHICH SOME PEOPLE MAY NOT BE ABLE TO ACQUIRE due to variety of reasons, and therefore the formation of a team in unranked reg matches is a means to solidify the chances of a win outside the boundaries of the game itself.

 

It TAMPERS with the starting conditions which normally, a process of random selection tends to guarantee fairness on a larger time scale. Through random, individual queues, the system disperses people with better skill and better gear into different teams each time, and therefore, guarantees individual players inside each team has about the same chance as being landed with a "winning team" and a "losing team" on average.

 

 

 

 

People grouping up to steamroll others, to be more exact.

 

One can easily ask the exact opposite question: The game also supports a ranked arena where teams are more encouraged than unranked, casual level of PvP. Why waste your time PvPing lesser people which you know you are greatly advantaged over, instead of face the same odds in ranked WZs exclusively?

 

Normally, I don't call people who get off by participating in predetermined slaughter as "PvP"ers -- knowing that they've (most likely) already secured a (most likely) win before the actual fighting happens.

 

I usually call them "wannabes."

 

......

 

And no. Premades have always been a problem in every game that supports similar circumstances. I've seen hordes of other, small~middle grade MMOGs literally fall apart with entire PvP population just disappearing, because premades shat on everyone else. Many PvP guilds in other games actually go so far as to come up with internal regulations to prohibit their guildsmen from entering 'casual' matches as teams -- allowing them to team up in premades of pairs or more only in ranked, "official" ones. People like these, are PvPers -- the ones that can tell the difference which environment warrants teaming, and which not.

 

 

So ask yourself this.

 

Are people so frickin' serious, or desperate to get wins, that they need to raindown shi*storm with such "pro" teaming, in an arena of casual PvP gameplay where like 70~80% of the population can't even tell which direction you have to run or how to throw the ball in Huttball?

 

 

Better yet. Ask yourself this: "Why do we make premades" -- which, everyone knows the answer.

You make premades to win. It is a FACTOR THAT IS OUTSIDE THE PROCESS OF ACTUAL COMBAT THAT INFLUENCES THE OUTCOME.

 

The better the PvP, the less it allows outside influences to affect the outcome of the game. It's "Player versus Player" -- you decide the outcome of the fight by actually doing the fight to determine who loses and wins -- not by grabbing a number of people you already know has a high chance of winning.

 

To be blunt I still dont understand the problem.

 

Here is the case.

 

I want to PVP, I want to WIN, after all that is WHY solo queue in the reg ZONES, i never GO TO THE RANKED ZONES EVER, becuse there I have to actually "work" for a win.

 

So I refuse to do the work I at the same demand other do when joining in the reg zones, I refuse to besic advance work to better my chances for a win.........sinec I am a pvper that win is what life is all about.

 

However I encounter others that grasped the concept of MMOS, that DO THEIR ADVANCE WORK, to Make their CHANCES of a WIN better.

 

in 99 of 100 cases a premade will win VS a non premade........but is that the PREMADES fault?

No it the other ones thar for what ever reason REFUSE to group up in advance.

 

If a miltary commander were to send a squad of soldiers out into the field against another professional unit, that have made ALL the preperations they needed, simply send 8 random guys out there, I would say that mission was doomed to fail.

 

That is why the commander PLANS his mission in ADVANCE, he PREMADE his team, becuse he KNOW from experience that most lilely he will encounter a PREMADE enemy.

 

Therefore the ONLY reason premades is a problem is becuse the non premades REFUSE to propperly team up

 

I play on the Progenitor, A RP/PVE server, premades is a phenomeon here as well, and to some an imagined problem, BUT the pvp channel is FULL of people calling for PVP groups, and from there to make a premade of your own is only a simple and fast chat..and viola.

 

Premades are made to WIN, or to have better chances at it, so in stead of then complaining that a better ORGANIZED team beat you, team up and counter them.

After all the ONLY differance between PUGS and PREMADE is that premades have done the job right, in wht raising their chances to win is concerned.

 

SO Again, when ANYONE can gropu up, even in advance and plan a pvp session, AKA MAKE A PREMADE, becuse ANYONE can, then where is the issue when ONE CHOOSES NOT TO

[omaan]

As i told premade is not a problem...not a problem in MMO with high online. Today i had a fight against one premade 3 times in a row (because no one else were quing) after these 3 stupid fights against full 208 geared,with healers,juggs i decided that no sense to play more and went playing wow...in my first fight in wow i got against premade AGAIN and lost but when i qued second time i got on bg wihout premade and won,so i didn't paid attention to my first fight. That's the difference between premades in swtor and other MMO. while you play other MMO you don't meet premades much but when you play SWTOR you will fight against premade often because there are no other who ques.

Actually i agree with those players who says that pvp is dead in this game.It's really dead.

[kweassa]

To be blunt I still dont understand the problem.

 

Here is the case.

 

I want to PVP, I want to WIN, after all that is WHY solo queue in the reg ZONES, i never GO TO THE RANKED ZONES EVER, becuse there I have to actually "work" for a win.

 

So I refuse to do the work I at the same demand other do when joining in the reg zones, I refuse to besic advance work to better my chances for a win.........sinec I am a pvper that win is what life is all about.

 

However I encounter others that grasped the concept of MMOS, that DO THEIR ADVANCE WORK, to Make their CHANCES of a WIN better.

 

in 99 of 100 cases a premade will win VS a non premade........but is that the PREMADES fault?

No it the other ones thar for what ever reason REFUSE to group up in advance.

 

If a miltary commander were to send a squad of soldiers out into the field against another professional unit, that have made ALL the preperations they needed, simply send 8 random guys out there, I would say that mission was doomed to fail.

 

That is why the commander PLANS his mission in ADVANCE, he PREMADE his team, becuse he KNOW from experience that most lilely he will encounter a PREMADE enemy.

 

Therefore the ONLY reason premades is a problem is becuse the non premades REFUSE to propperly team up

 

I play on the Progenitor, A RP/PVE server, premades is a phenomeon here as well, and to some an imagined problem, BUT the pvp channel is FULL of people calling for PVP groups, and from there to make a premade of your own is only a simple and fast chat..and viola.

 

Premades are made to WIN, or to have better chances at it, so in stead of then complaining that a better ORGANIZED team beat you, team up and counter them.

After all the ONLY differance between PUGS and PREMADE is that premades have done the job right, in wht raising their chances to win is concerned.

 

SO Again, when ANYONE can gropu up, even in advance and plan a pvp session, AKA MAKE A PREMADE, becuse ANYONE can, then where is the issue when ONE CHOOSES NOT TO

 

Thanks for actually proving, and reinforcing my point.

 

Basically, your entire comment in above quote can be summarized as:

 

1. I want easy wins

2. So I want a steamroller team

 

Like said, you want to secure a win before the game even begins. That's not PvP. There is no 'competition' there. It's the same thing as rigged up match -- people get killed for doing that stuff in the underworld, you know.

 

Without intention of personal insult, I must point out that usually, when people are so obsessed with winning, they tend to stop thinking straight about how their actions may ripple and influence the environment. Its pretty much the same thing as pollution -- people usually don't see what it does, until the environment itself goes dead.

 

Same in PvP. It may be a fun and easy way for you to "enjoy" a one-sided slaughter which you pretend to be "PvP" -- except it tends to just stop people from playing PvP altogether.

 

In any game, the PvP community is only a small fraction of the more stable, PvE community. On average around 5~10% of the population are exclusively PvPers. All the rest are people who play it casually, and would not hesitate to just give up shi* rather than have to trouble their PvE guild players and ask them to form teams for a content they don't enjoy as main. Many of them do it for just the daily quests.

 

PvPers have a habit of ignoring these people as non-consequential -- except in reality, PvP heavily relies on those people. They make up the backbone of the players who fill out all the slots, the average, low-skill bunch of people who just do everything casually, and these people make PvP possible.

 

What stuff like premades do, is make them the prey of easy kills and easy wins. It makes you feel superior, no? It makes you feel smart -- you know how to make teams and operate it in, all the others are like cattle or sheep, easily exploited and butchered upon demand.

 

Unfortunately, these "cattle" or "sheep" have a brain, and they tend to remember just how much they suffer when they play PvP. When that continues, they have no hesitation in just giving up PvP altogether.

 

 

When that happens, who are your team gonna play against?

 

Each other?

 

(ps) Just look at the comment directly above this post. That's what usually happens. People don't like to be victimized and suffer like that. Everything starts out with low-population times, and then spreads to other timezones. It happens when the overall impression of PvP becomes "something bad" , "something dominated by high-tier players", that starts driving the casual players away, which leads to decreasing population with no more flow of fresh new players to try PvP out, which goes into a vicious cycle of people wanting to PvP meeting more premades all the time.. and then more people quitting.

 

Premades have a place where they belong. Outside that place, the premades are nothing but wolves in a meadow of sheep, and no matter how numerous it may look, the sheep have limits in numbers.

 

Premades, HURT the game. Do the math. Seen dozens of games suffer the same thing, which always end up "PvP-dead". I don't want same thing happening in SWTOR.

Edited March 13, 2016 by kweassa

[jedcjedcjedc]

I love how people keep saying it's just predetermined. Especially Kweassa saying it while having that sig, lol. To put it bluntly, it's predetermined if you're bad. If you're even half decent, go ninja a node, use some focus targeting, you know that sniper or merc that can put out massive damage if they have the chance? how about matching their target and see what happens. Odds are it dies real quick-like. "but they'll have a healer and a tank and another 4 man group running with them!!!!" or you know, they won't... with the amount of healers running around these days if you don't have a healer on your side as well, that's not a premade problem that's a matchmaking problem. Why is it half the people on here have no problems but then you get these other people screaming bloody murder?

[Yorioko]

It is NOT the same as a rigged match.

 

IF Premades is a problem then it is a problem ONLY if one side are allowed to group up in advance and plan while the other side is FORBIDDEN this.

 

But when One side CHOOSE to NOT plan, then how it unfair that the OTHER side do plan?

 

ther NO machanics in the game that makes it 100% impossible my gmae mechanics or TOS to group up in advance, to NOT ONLY increase your win chnaces, but also be a LTTLE more chance to get teamamtes that ACTALLY know pvp and the maps.....

 

But again, the ONLY way a TEAM is a probmem is if the other side is BANNED from making a team.

 

so since BOTH sides are equally free to make teams, then the fact that one side does and the other does not is NOT about fairness it is about CHOISE.

 

A premade group, is actually in principal as simple as ANY PUG group that during the start countdown even agrees on 1 thing, be it tactics or otherwise and then "does as agreed" IS a premade group.

 

Again the logic behind "becuse I refuse for what ever reason to team up with others on pvp, yet I want to win and hate to loose" I for some "semi insane" reason tun this around and go.....

THSI is an MMO, you group up, I am 100% free to do so my self but I CHOOSE not to, so then ANYONE tht makes this oposite choise is a cheat, and prevents a fair fight

 

The onlyone that prevents a fair fight vs a premade is a pug......period.

[Vashadan]

It is NOT the same as a rigged match.

 

IF Premades is a problem then it is a problem ONLY if one side are allowed to group up in advance and plan while the other side is FORBIDDEN this.

 

But when One side CHOOSE to NOT plan, then how it unfair that the OTHER side do plan?

 

ther NO machanics in the game that makes it 100% impossible my gmae mechanics or TOS to group up in advance, to NOT ONLY increase your win chnaces, but also be a LTTLE more chance to get teamamtes that ACTALLY know pvp and the maps.....

 

But again, the ONLY way a TEAM is a probmem is if the other side is BANNED from making a team.

 

so since BOTH sides are equally free to make teams, then the fact that one side does and the other does not is NOT about fairness it is about CHOISE.

 

A premade group, is actually in principal as simple as ANY PUG group that during the start countdown even agrees on 1 thing, be it tactics or otherwise and then "does as agreed" IS a premade group.

 

Again the logic behind "becuse I refuse for what ever reason to team up with others on pvp, yet I want to win and hate to loose" I for some "semi insane" reason tun this around and go.....

THSI is an MMO, you group up, I am 100% free to do so my self but I CHOOSE not to, so then ANYONE tht makes this oposite choise is a cheat, and prevents a fair fight

 

The onlyone that prevents a fair fight vs a premade is a pug......period.

 

The only "thing" that prevents a fair fight (if we can all agree to call it that) is a lack of matchmaking.

It is as simple as that. This issue has been going on so often, I even expect a new thread on premades coming up at least once a week.

There is little to no initiative to even respond to this anymore so just remind yourselves that this is all we got, or rather do not as a simple matchmaking system would at least allow for ppl to have an equal number of tank/healer/dd roles on each side.

I have nothing against premades, I did and do them from time with 1 of my guild to get conquest points in faster.

I know who of these guild members is good and what they can bring so we try to have at least 1 healer and a dedicated "troublemaker" if the warzone turns out to be in favor of stealth classes.

So yes, we stack the deck in our favor, I am sure plenty of other premades do this and there are at least the same amount of bad ones who try to do the same, more often losing the match in spite of running a premade.

 

Give it a rest, keep asking for matchmaking but do try and take the time before the match starts to clear a few things, see who can and wishes to do what, mark players on the other team and so on...and if you get a troll response for at least trying/showing the effort to communicate you will not incure a penalty for leaving and not wasting your time.

This too goes for when you see half of your team being pve heroes with little expertise rating.