How people learned the numbers???

[ross_deutsch]

So I have always wonder, and been reluctant to ask but here goes...

 

How do people figure out the percentages/numbers needed for each stat?

Even long before star parse came along, even in World of Warcraft.

 

How did people know how to calculate how much accuracy, crit, crit mult., alactrity, power, etc.

 

And what stats are really needed for each class? Is alacrity needed on melee dps? some of the warrior/guardian pieces do have it as a stat.

 

I have played since launch, but I don't get into progressive OPs so I never really bothered with caring. But have always wondered how people figured it all out.

[alricka]

Is alacrity needed on melee dps? some of the warrior/guardian pieces do have it as a stat.

Alacrity is for the speed of channeling, so I can't imagine it being terribly useful for melee dps classes as most of their abilities are instantly cast. In my understanding it's something that would be more valuable for healers.

 

That aside, I'll be honest, I have sometimes wondered the same thing. Well, not so much how they do it, but what does it involve, is it a lot of trial-and-error, or math, or whatever, and thus - who has the patience and the dedication to do that?! Off with my hat to those people because I know for a fact that I could never have the patience to do something like that..

[TjhScorch]

So I have always wonder, and been reluctant to ask but here goes...

 

How do people figure out the percentages/numbers needed for each stat?

Even long before star parse came along, even in World of Warcraft.

 

How did people know how to calculate how much accuracy, crit, crit mult., alactrity, power, etc.

 

And what stats are really needed for each class? Is alacrity needed on melee dps? some of the warrior/guardian pieces do have it as a stat.

 

I have played since launch, but I don't get into progressive OPs so I never really bothered with caring. But have always wondered how people figured it all out.

 

Can't answer how the formulae are calculated, but I can say; alacrity is 100% needed for optimal dps results, melee, ranger, or healer. It lowers the GCD, individual CD's, the time between DoT ticks, the ICD's on procing effects, etc, meaning every % of alacrity is a direct boost in your overall damage.

Edited February 19, 2016 by TjhScorch

[masterceil]

The only number crunching I've done so far was on Crit, and all I did there was see how the points in crit stat converted to a crit percentage chance to find the point of diminishing returns (which was somewhere around a 38% crit chance iirc). I love crunching some numbers, I just haven't gotten around to doing it much for this game.

 

Reading some of the guides out there, it appears that much of the time these people are simply doing a lot of trial and error. Hundreds of parses and armour/augment configurations to find the best results. These guys sort of 'brute force' it, swapping out augments and enhancements dozens or more times to see how high they can go in DPS/HPS/DTPS.

 

There are others, 'theorycrafters', who look solely at the numbers and come up with the optimal configuration, assuming zero latency and 100% efficiency in triggering abilities/running rotations. They know, for instance, the GCD is 1.5 seconds, and what effect 10% Alacrity will have on how quickly you can trigger abilities, when DoTs should be reapplied in a rotation, etc.

 

I don't know who I admire more - those who put in the work doing endless parses for countless hours, or those that run the numbers for idealised optimal results.

 

As the guy above me said, Alacrity helps any class with a GCD, really. It's just that, for instance, Tanks get more utility from Absorb and Shield stats than they do Alacrity, because mitigation is more important to them than getting Taunt to cool down two seconds quicker. Combat Sentinels need to go high on Critical and Alacrity (after reaching 110% Accuracy) to maximise damage in their burst windows. Other classes may get more use out of Power or Mastery. Experts from each class put in a lot of work to see what stats need to be focused on for them, and how to balance those stats.

 

Mmmm, data...

[MadDutchman]

I've never done it for this game, but usually when I need to find an optimal, I write a program to brute force it. I imagine there is a little of this going on.

 

Being a programmer can be terribly convenient sometimes...

[Halinalle]

Alacrity is for the speed of channeling, so I can't imagine it being terribly useful for melee dps classes as most of their abilities are instantly cast. In my understanding it's something that would be more valuable for healers.

 

It's not 2014 and 2.x anymore. Time to wake up.

 

Alacrity:

- makes channeling/casting faster

- makes GCD faster (you have to press buttons faster)

- makes cooldowns faster (so you don't see difference in your rotation to non-alacrity gear)

- makes your resources regen faster (to compensate your higher resource needs)

 

Change was made in 3.0 but since you still had to balance amount of alacrity with Crit rating and Surge rating you had to know when to use alacrity.

In 4.0 Surge rating was removed and Crit rating gives both Crit chance and Crit multiplier so Alacrity is now much more useful. Currently Alacrity is second best stat in the game for healers and dps.

Edited February 19, 2016 by Halinalle

[SteveTheCynic]

In 4.0 Surge rating was removed and Crit rating gives both Crit chance and Crit multiplier so Alacrity is now much more useful. Currently Alacrity is second best stat in the game for healers and dps.

Hey, cool, I can up my Alacrity and make sure my guild complains even more about how much damage I do on my main! (Seriously, I'm getting half-joking-half-serious complaints about me doing too much damage!)

[trashy_spartan]

Simple answer : Maths.

 

Complete answer : Bant's post.

[FlyingUsPoo]

Never been a fan of the "how to" sites and posts. I've always just run my gear and altered it based on what works and what doesn't.

I run healers, toss it all in power the round out alacrity. In my experience, they don't need near as much tweaking as dps. I guess that's the balance.

[Hebruixe]

Alacrity is for the speed of channeling, so I can't imagine it being terribly useful for melee dps classes as most of their abilities are instantly cast.

 

I think alacrity speeds up the global cooldown, doesn't it? So you can spam your insta-cast abilities faster. But your point is correct, of course. Alacrity is intended to be a healer stat.

[efffel]

My synthweaver will be busy I didn't think of cooldown when assessing alacrity, but it seems it means more force chokes and more twirling sabers and more interrupts,...

[DawnAskham]

So I have always wonder, and been reluctant to ask but here goes...

 

How do people figure out the percentages/numbers needed for each stat?

Even long before star parse came along, even in World of Warcraft.

 

How did people know how to calculate how much accuracy, crit, crit mult., alactrity, power, etc.

 

And what stats are really needed for each class? Is alacrity needed on melee dps? some of the warrior/guardian pieces do have it as a stat.

 

I have played since launch, but I don't get into progressive OPs so I never really bothered with caring. But have always wondered how people figured it all out.

 

By applying basic mathematics and statistical tools to in-game data, recorded / observed game data (combat logs), data mining of game files, and simulations to analyze abilities and mechanics and work out the formulas such as damage coefficients and individual stat values.

[Aldael]

Alacrity is for the speed of channeling, so I can't imagine it being terribly useful for melee dps classes as most of their abilities are instantly cast. In my understanding it's something that would be more valuable for healers.

 

That aside, I'll be honest, I have sometimes wondered the same thing. Well, not so much how they do it, but what does it involve, is it a lot of trial-and-error, or math, or whatever, and thus - who has the patience and the dedication to do that?! Off with my hat to those people because I know for a fact that I could never have the patience to do something like that..

 

Alacrity hastes almost everything now, global cd, skills cd, resource generation (for knight/warrior lowering the cd of the skills that generates it), casting speed, time the dot hits.

 

Only thing that are off the alacrity are long cds ( class buffs, inspiration,...).

 

 

There are a lot of theorycrafters out there, in the classes forum there are a few topics about the optimal stat distribution for each class/spec.

[lightSaberAddiCt]

Alacrity is for the speed of channeling, so I can't imagine it being terribly useful for melee dps classes as most of their abilities are instantly cast. In my understanding it's something that would be more valuable for healers.

 

That aside, I'll be honest, I have sometimes wondered the same thing. Well, not so much how they do it, but what does it involve, is it a lot of trial-and-error, or math, or whatever, and thus - who has the patience and the dedication to do that?! Off with my hat to those people because I know for a fact that I could never have the patience to do something like that..

 

All dps needs alacrity, it not only speeds up channel times, it shortens recharge times. If you are looking to do OPs, then you will need 110% accuracy, I think the target for crit is 1300, and alacrity if I remember of top of head should be around 800. If heals, dont worry about accuracy, you want alacrity and crit.

[AlrikFassbauer]

By applying basic mathematics and statistical tools to in-game data, recorded / observed game data (combat logs), data mining of game files, and simulations to analyze abilities and mechanics and work out the formulas such as damage coefficients and individual stat values.

 

In short : This is a game designed for mathematicians.

 

That a game is considered so much through the eyes of mathematics shows me that emotion don't really have a place in this game.

 

This is true for *any* Action-RPG after Blizzard's model : Everything can be described through mathematical formulae.

Immersion ? Emotional storytelling ? Who needs this sh** ?

You can see it by Blizzard reducing *any* social interaction withoin their Action-RPG line to the absolute minimum.

THere is the only absolute minimum of quest givers, they say only the absolute minimum of words, are only to do only 2 or 3 tasks (buy / sell / repair), and that's it. Math is the basis of the whole games following this model.

 

Bioware hasztried emotional storytelling - but it feels a bit odd on the base of an math game.

Because emotions and logic are mostly incompatible with one another.

[GrandLordMenace]

In short : This is a game designed for mathematicians.

 

That a game is considered so much through the eyes of mathematics shows me that emotion don't really have a place in this game.

 

This is true for *any* Action-RPG after Blizzard's model : Everything can be described through mathematical formulae.

Immersion ? Emotional storytelling ? Who needs this sh** ?

You can see it by Blizzard reducing *any* social interaction withoin their Action-RPG line to the absolute minimum.

THere is the only absolute minimum of quest givers, they say only the absolute minimum of words, are only to do only 2 or 3 tasks (buy / sell / repair), and that's it. Math is the basis of the whole games following this model.

 

Bioware hasztried emotional storytelling - but it feels a bit odd on the base of an math game.

Because emotions and logic are mostly incompatible with one another.

 

Not... entirely true.

 

A lot of that theorycrafting that myself included create is just that, theory. The execution of the player is just as important, and that's where things get interesting. I've met some very... logical and formulaic and procedural players, and I've met highly aggressive hotheads who make up for the lack of formality by just... willing themselves more damage.

 

It's hard to explain, but once seen, it can't really be missed.

[DawnAskham]

In short : This is a game designed for mathematicians.

 

That a game is considered so much through the eyes of mathematics shows me that emotion don't really have a place in this game.

 

This is true for *any* Action-RPG after Blizzard's model : Everything can be described through mathematical formulae.

Immersion ? Emotional storytelling ? Who needs this sh** ?

You can see it by Blizzard reducing *any* social interaction withoin their Action-RPG line to the absolute minimum.

THere is the only absolute minimum of quest givers, they say only the absolute minimum of words, are only to do only 2 or 3 tasks (buy / sell / repair), and that's it. Math is the basis of the whole games following this model.

 

Bioware hasztried emotional storytelling - but it feels a bit odd on the base of an math game.

Because emotions and logic are mostly incompatible with one another.

 

I find the two to go hand in hand in these games.

 

The math allows players to better understand how choices in their gearing, stat allocations, rotations, abilities, talent choices etc effect their performance, but it doesn't make the game itself interesting to play.

 

What makes it interesting is the emotional components and social connections.

 

I enjoy theory-crafting and understanding enough about the math behind the game to allow me to optimize my characters to perform well, but without the emotional connections to my characters and the story, as well as the social connections I make with other like minded players, I'd find it very boring and more like work than fun.

[Khevar]

In short : This is a game designed for mathematicians.

 

That a game is considered so much through the eyes of mathematics shows me that emotion don't really have a place in this game.

The game isn't designed FOR mathematicians, but it is designed USING mathematics.

 

In a pen-and-paper roll playing game, the GM can supplement dice rolls with anything he/she feels like. Emotion can play a big part of it.

 

But this is a video game, running on a computer, which is not capable of emotion, only math.

 

Edit: I should add that it's totally a thing for a player to contribute their own emotion in a video game, based on storytelling, or in-game experiences, or accomplishing an objective, or winning a battle, or (dare I say it?) figuring out how the game works with theorycrafting.

 

Edited February 19, 2016 by Khevar

[Kernel_Cinders]

I mostly solo in this game, but I am also a dedicated crafter. I make all of the gear myself up to 212 rating.

 

Accuracy: 110.01% => 208 Advanced Proficient Enhancement x 5 = 9.01%. The other 1% I get from Legacy.

 

Alacrity: 7.02% => 208 Advanced Savant Enhancement x 2 and 208 Alacrity Augment x 5 = 7.02%.

 

Critical: 212 Defiant Adept Ear, 212 Defiant Adept Implant x 2, 208 Advanced Critical Augment x 9, +41 Crystal x 2, +1% Legacy Bonus, plus the bonus from Mastery = 31.40% / 67.02%

 

Modification: 208 Advanced Lethal Mod 40A x 9.

 

Relics: 212 Defiant Relic of Focused Onslaught (+903 Mastery / self-triggered) and 212 Defiant Relic of Serendipitous Assault (+903 Power / self-triggered).

 

Armorings, Hilts, and Barrels: 208 Advanced Versatile.

 

MY LEVEL 65 CHARACTERS WITHOUT BUFFS

 

MASTERY: 4412 // ENDURANCE: 5779 // POWER: 1598 // CRITICAL: 1171 // ALACRITY: 639 // ACCURACY: 685.

 

Overall, very good statistics with items that are all crafted.

Edited February 19, 2016 by Kernel_Cinders

[efffel]

I don't apply much mathematics in the game, I play the character and try to correct its flaws for how I play the character. Thanks to this thread, I may be able to make my warrior/knight jump and kill a little faster