Snoke is a Sith(Confirmed)

[Slowpokeking]

http://www.starwars.com/databank/kylo-ren

 

A dark side warrior with a mysterious past, Kylo Ren was neither Jedi nor Sith, but a product of both sides’ teachings. Once an apprentice of Luke Skywalker’s, he killed his fellow students and drove Skywalker into exile, becoming a First Order warlord and servant of Supreme Leader Snoke. Kylo was determined to destroy the last remnants of the Jedi, fulfilling the legacy of Darth Vader.

 

So it was confirmed. If Snoke is just dark sider from other organization, then Kylo Ren could not have been trained by the way of the Sith.

[Wolfninjajedi]

Doesn't really confirm anything and then that it really destroys literally the whole of Anakin's character throughout Episodes 1-6. Which seems unlikely that it would be allowed to happen, it says Kylo is neither a Jedi nor Sith but had teachings from both sides. Ok but that doesn't make Snoke a Sith Lord, it just means he has teachings from the dark side which is what the Sith used. Edited February 10, 2016 by Wolfninjajedi

[that_Spartan_IV]

Doesn't really confirm anything and then that it really destroys literally the whole of Anakin's character throughout Episodes 1-6. Which seems unlikely that it would be allowed to happen, it says Kylo is neither a Jedi nor Sith but had teachings from both sides. Ok but that doesn't make Snoke a Sith Lord, it just means he has teachings from the dark side which is what the Sith used.

 

Pretty much this. The Dark Side isn't restricted to the Sith only, they're pretty much the biggest/has the individuals with the most power in it/that use it.

[Fyurii]

Doesn't really confirm anything and then that it really destroys literally the whole of Anakin's character throughout Episodes 1-6..

 

Destroys Anakin's character how???

[PadsterPwns]

Destroys Anakin's character how???

I wouldn't say it destroys Anakin's character, rather it destroys a key plot point in Star Wars. Anakin's entire purpose was to destroy the Sith and bring balance to the Force, if Snoke is a Sith then it means the Force's will literally failed. It would be particularly bad if Snoke is Plageuis or a RoT Sith as it would mean Anakin's sacrifice and redemption meant nothing at all.

[Rhyltran]

Pretty much this. The Dark Side isn't restricted to the Sith only, they're pretty much the biggest/has the individuals with the most power in it/that use it.

 

I think I'm with the original poster on this one due to the wording. While it's true that the dark side isn't exclusively Sith you must realize that other Dark Side philosophies use it differently. If it had said "Product of the light or dark" you would have a point. However, what it states, is that he's "Jedi nor Sith" it gave the name of two "philosophies" and then said he's the product of both sides teachings. The way it's worded tells us that he's learned both Jedi and Sith teachings. This goes beyond the respective "Sides."

 

I could be mistaken but this is my interpretation of the wording as well. It doesn't mean Snoke is Sith. It just means he uses Sith teachings and philosophies.

 

I wouldn't say it destroys Anakin's character, rather it destroys a key plot point in Star Wars. Anakin's entire purpose was to destroy the Sith and bring balance to the Force, if Snoke is a Sith then it means the Force's will literally failed. It would be particularly bad if Snoke is Plageuis or a RoT Sith as it would mean Anakin's sacrifice and redemption meant nothing at all.

 

I disagree here. Why? Snoke might be as much Sith as Ventress was. Remember, she was never considered Sith. She did use, however, Sith teachings and philosophies but that in of itself didn't make her Sith. Even if Snoke trained Kylo in the ways of the Sith it doesn't mean Snoke himself is a Sith.

Edited February 10, 2016 by Rhyltran

[PadsterPwns]

I disagree here. Why? Snoke might be as much Sith as Ventress was. Remember, she was never considered Sith. She did use, however, Sith teachings and philosophies but that in of itself didn't make her Sith. Even if Snoke trained Kylo in the ways of the Sith it doesn't mean Snoke himself is a Sith.

That would still mean Snoke would be Sith by all but name and Ventress doesn't really play into this as even though she would be in the same category as Snoke, she died way before 4, 5 and 6 meaning that her fate still coincided with the prophecy. Snoke would be an outlier to this though, having known Sith teachings and being able to pass them on. Therefore the Sith effectively survived making the prophecy, and by extension Anakin's story, void.

[Slowpokeking]

Doesn't really confirm anything and then that it really destroys literally the whole of Anakin's character throughout Episodes 1-6. Which seems unlikely that it would be allowed to happen, it says Kylo is neither a Jedi nor Sith but had teachings from both sides. Ok but that doesn't make Snoke a Sith Lord, it just means he has teachings from the dark side which is what the Sith used.

 

He had teachings from both sides, this means he had the teaching of the SITH. It could only come from Snoke.

[Slowpokeking]

Pretty much this. The Dark Side isn't restricted to the Sith only, they're pretty much the biggest/has the individuals with the most power in it/that use it.

 

But he had the teaching of the Sith.

[MadDutchman]

Just because he has teachings from them doesn't mean Snoke is a Sith. At best he is a wannabe.

[Fyurii]

I wouldn't say it destroys Anakin's character, rather it destroys a key plot point in Star Wars. Anakin's entire purpose was to destroy the Sith and bring balance to the Force, if Snoke is a Sith then it means the Force's will literally failed. It would be particularly bad if Snoke is Plageuis or a RoT Sith as it would mean Anakin's sacrifice and redemption meant nothing at all.

 

At worst, that's simply down to interpretation, since he fulfilled his role as The Chosen One and destroyed the Sith (Palpatine "and Vader"), and restored balance to the Force.

It was the imbalance in the Force created by the Sith (Plagueis) that prompted the Force to create Jes... Anakin, for the purpose of restoring balance. Which he did.

 

That aspect of Anakin hasn't been changed at all so far, and I still question WolfninjaJedi's assertion that one single film has destroyed Anakin's entire character over 6 movies.

[Wolfninjajedi]

At worst, that's simply down to interpretation, since he fulfilled his role as The Chosen One and destroyed the Sith (Palpatine "and Vader"), and restored balance to the Force.

It was the imbalance in the Force created by the Sith (Plagueis) that prompted the Force to create Jes... Anakin, for the purpose of restoring balance. Which he did.

 

That aspect of Anakin hasn't been changed at all so far, and I still question WolfninjaJedi's assertion that one single film has destroyed Anakin's entire character over 6 movies.

 

Ok so I exaggerated the wording a little, you didn't have to take it as literally destroying his entire character. But it ruins a big part.

 

Even still, I don't think Snoke is a Sith Lord. I mean Dark Jedi have learned from Sith teachings, yet they aren't Sith Lords themselves soo...yeah.

Edited February 10, 2016 by Wolfninjajedi

[Rhyltran]

Ok so I exaggerated the wording a little, you didn't have to take it as literally destroying his entire character. But it ruins a big part.

 

Even still, I don't think Snoke is a Sith Lord. I mean Dark Jedi have learned from Sith teachings, yet they aren't Sith Lords themselves soo...yeah.

 

This is pretty much what I said before. The wording makes it clear he taught some sith teachings to Kylo Ren but it doesn't make Snoke a Sith nor does it mean he taught him everything a Sith is about. Just that Kylo ren has received some Sith training from Snoke. We don't know how little or how much that is.

[Fyurii]

Ok so I exaggerated the wording a little, you didn't have to take it as literally destroying his entire character. But it ruins a big part.

 

You still haven't said what you think it ruins about Anakin's character across six films.

If it is to do with the silly trope of The Chosen One, then it doesn't ruin it at all. If it's not that, then please explain what you mean instead of using pointless hyperbole to ridicule the film just because you didn't like it.

[Slowpokeking]

This is pretty much what I said before. The wording makes it clear he taught some sith teachings to Kylo Ren but it doesn't make Snoke a Sith nor does it mean he taught him everything a Sith is about. Just that Kylo ren has received some Sith training from Snoke. We don't know how little or how much that is.

 

So your point is that "Snoke trained Kylo Ren with Sith teaching but he was not a Sith himself"? Does that make any sense?

 

If he was never a Sith, how would he know the Sith teaching, and why would he teach Kylo Ren with the Sith way?

Edited February 10, 2016 by Slowpokeking

[Rhyltran]

So your point is that "Snoke trained Kylo Ren with Sith teaching but he was not a Sith himself"? Does that make any sense?

 

If he was never a Sith, how would he know the Sith teaching, and why would he teach Kylo Ren with the Sith way?

 

If my father was a cop and trained me some police techniques and then I taught those same techniques to you are you now a cop? If Snoke found a holocron or two and learned bits and pieces of sith philosophy/teachings and then taught said teachings to Kylo does it make him a Sith? No.

 

Again, one just needs to look at Ventress. Ventress studied the dark side, craved power, and was willing to channel her hatred to destroy her enemies. She also learned the ways of the dark side and proclaimed herself as Sith. Dooku corrected her and pointed out that she is no Sith. Being Sith is much more than following some basic tenets, using certain techniques, and following the dark side.

Edited February 11, 2016 by Rhyltran

[Wolfninjajedi]

You still haven't said what you think it ruins about Anakin's character across six films.

If it is to do with the silly trope of The Chosen One, then it doesn't ruin it at all. If it's not that, then please explain what you mean instead of using pointless hyperbole to ridicule the film just because you didn't like it.

 

? Nowhere did I say I didn't like the film.

 

Also it does, that was Anakin's whole thing, he was destined to destroy the Sith. It's been hammered in I don't know how many times, Snoke doesn't need to be a Sith Lord to use the dark side or be a good villain.

[Slowpokeking]

If my father was a cop and trained me some police techniques and then I taught those same techniques to you are you now a cop? If Snoke found a holocron or two and learned bits and pieces of sith philosophy/teachings and then taught said teachings to Kylo does it make him a Sith? No.

 

Again, one just needs to look at Ventress. Ventress studied the dark side, craved power, and was willing to channel her hatred to destroy her enemies. She also learned the ways of the dark side and proclaimed herself as Sith. Dooku corrected her and pointed out that she is no Sith. Being Sith is much more than following some basic tenets, using certain techniques, and following the dark side.

If he taught Kylo by that way, that means he accept the philosophy of the Sith, thereby he is a Sith. Sith is not cop, they are a special organization, you must accept their philosophy to be one. It's not some common technique, it' that Kylo Ren was trained by the Sith way.

 

But she was trained by Dooku and Dooku is a Sith. Your example could only show that Ventress is not a Sith, her master surely is one.

Edited February 11, 2016 by Slowpokeking

[xSeyx]

If he taught Kylo by that way, that means he accept the philosophy of the Sith, thereby he is a Sith. Sith is not cop, they are a special organization, you must accept their philosophy to be one. It's not some common technique, it' that Kylo Ren was trained by the Sith way.

 

But she was trained by Dooku and Dooku is a Sith. Your example could only show that Ventress is not a Sith, her master surely is one.

 

No it does not mean that. If you teach something at a school, you do not need to be apart of that something to pass on knowledge. You only need to be aware of the subject matter in order to convey it to another individual. As said previous, Snoke may have found a Sith holocron and said "Golly this shiz is the bomb, however Im to old to be doing flips and **** to channel my passion. I shall pass this knowledge on to Kylo." This would mean he is not a Sith, that he used the teachings of an organisation to train a follower. He is only Sith if he is also a practitioner of those teachings.

[Slowpokeking]

No it does not mean that. If you teach something at a school, you do not need to be apart of that something to pass on knowledge. You only need to be aware of the subject matter in order to convey it to another individual. As said previous, Snoke may have found a Sith holocron and said "Golly this shiz is the bomb, however Im to old to be doing flips and **** to channel my passion. I shall pass this knowledge on to Kylo." This would mean he is not a Sith, that he used the teachings of an organisation to train a follower. He is only Sith if he is also a practitioner of those teachings.

But we are talking about

 

but a product of both sides’ teachings.

 

Sith' teaching, not teaching you some knowledge of a Sith.

 

It doesn't work this way, Palpatine is old but he could still do the Sith way. Why would Snoke learn Sith' teaching and pass it to Kylo if he isn't a Sith himself? Each of these examples are horrible because it doesn't make sense if Snoke himself isn't a Sith but can and chose to use the Sith' way to teach Kylo Ren.

[Rhyltran]

If he taught Kylo by that way, that means he accept the philosophy of the Sith, thereby he is a Sith. Sith is not cop, they are a special organization, you must accept their philosophy to be one. It's not some common technique, it' that Kylo Ren was trained by the Sith way.

 

But she was trained by Dooku and Dooku is a Sith. Your example could only show that Ventress is not a Sith, her master surely is one.

 

Her master is one but Ventress thought herself as one but wasn't. Ventress was never considered a true sith even after being taught by one. You can learn Kenjutsu (Like I have) but it doesn't make you a Samurai. Some Sith teachings doesn't mean fully understanding and comprehending the entire philosophy or idea. Likewise, Luke had jedi teaching in a new hope and empire strikes back but wasn't a Jedi until return of the Jedi.

 

The examples aren't horrible. Snoke can pass off Sith teachings without being Sith himself by simply knowing some of the Sith's teachings and passing it down. I can teach you some of the Samurai's arts without being or ever have been a Samurai because I learned said teachings from people who had it passed down since that time but they are not Samurai either.

Edited February 11, 2016 by Rhyltran

[Slowpokeking]

Her master is one but Ventress thought herself as one but wasn't. Ventress was never considered a true sith even after being taught by one. You can learn Kenjutsu (Like I have) but it doesn't make you a Samurai. Some Sith teachings doesn't mean fully understanding and comprehending the entire philosophy or idea. Likewise, Luke had jedi teaching in a new hope and empire strikes back but wasn't a Jedi until return of the Jedi.

 

The examples aren't horrible. Snoke can pass off Sith teachings without being Sith himself by simply knowing some of the Sith's teachings and passing it down. I can teach you some of the Samurai's arts without being or ever have been a Samurai because I learned said teachings from people who had it passed down since that time but they are not Samurai either.

 

Yes just like Kylo Ren wasn't one, but like Dooku, Snoke surely is one otherwise why would he teach him by the Sith way?

 

And Luke was trained by a Jedi. All the other Dark Siders have their own way of training, there is no way that they would train other with the way of the Sith if they are not.

[Rhyltran]

Yes just like Kylo Ren wasn't one, but like Dooku, Snoke surely is one otherwise why would he teach him by the Sith way?

 

And Luke was trained by a Jedi. All the other Dark Siders have their own way of training, there is no way that they would train other with the way of the Sith if they are not.

 

If Ventress taught some they would have "Some" sith training. As she was self teaching herself based on what she knew and discovered about the Sith. Still not enough to be considered Sith.

 

As someone mentioned earlier. Snoke could be a wannabe Sith.

Edited February 11, 2016 by Rhyltran

[Eternalnight]

Snoke is Jar Jar Binks

[Slowpokeking]

If Ventress taught some they would have "Some" sith training. As she was self teaching herself based on what she knew and discovered about the Sith. Still not enough to be considered Sith.

 

As someone mentioned earlier. Snoke could be a wannabe Sith.

 

Ventress is not a Sith herself, she didn't know enough, nor is she totally evil, how could she and why would she choose to train others with the way of the Sith?