What is the best scout ship and the best loadout for taking out Gunships?

[MDVZ]

I suggest using Laser Cannon for the extra range.

 

As per above discussion, I think this is a playstyle thing. Being able to open up at range, vs being able to get higher dps from getting in close.

 

I do think that the firing arc and tracking penalty benefits of LLCs give a benefit in turn fights, holding/attacking nodes etc that can't be ignored. You're not hunting gunships ALL the time. (If anyone is, I think there's a support group for that )

 

But you're not wrong and I'm not arguing. More range is more attack opportunity; it's a serious benefit. I mean, just look at gunships . If anyone wants to play that way, great.

Edited December 17, 2015 by MDVZ

[aakrea]

I'm not an ace but I have been working with some different GS killing builds. Here are a few that I use.

 

T2- BLC, pod, tt, disto, retro, range capacitor. I like this build because it is good for GS killing as well as dogfighting, the range Capacitor and retro are more for dogfighting to take shots from a little farther off but as far as going after a GS it has great burst damage with any capacitor as long as you get as close as you can. This build is also good for taking out bombers, both BLC and pods have armor piercing

 

- quad, pod, tt, disto, BR, freq. Cap. I don't like dogfighting with this one, the quads take too much juice, it has longer range and does more dps unless you get close, I use barrel roll with this one to get back to friendly territory faster.

 

There aren't as many options for the T1 but unless you get the cartel T2 I would recommend the T2 for dogfighting and the T1 for GS killing.

 

The only choices are:

LLC or LC... the trade off as I see it is range, LLC is the same range as BLC, so you do have to get closer but it does more damage and the tracking should be mostly irrelevant because you should have the shot lined up on a target that isn't moving. LC is better if you want to be able to dogfight. LLC I go frequency for more burst.

 

TT or BR- I actually like BR for this one, TT does more damage but with BR you should never run out of gas

 

Barrel roll or power dive- this one is just personal preference, if you use booster recharge barrel roll would probably be better for mobility.

 

As far as tactics it's basically hide hit run repeat, I also like to take a few shots at other ships on the way back to see if I can get them to chase and be an easy kill for a friendly gs.

[Drakkolich]

Honestly the big reason to use Laser Cannon over Light Laser Cannon in the build you guys are refering too is that they synergize better with Rocket pods. Rocket pods are very hard to use at 2500m so being able to open at 4500m and not lose much accuracy or dps is important with them.

 

When you play Burst lasers and Rocket Pods the Rocket pod are really only for immobile targets like Bombers or Gunships when fighting Scouts and Strikes you end up killing them with just your Burst lasers. Trying to kill someone with just Light lasers just isn't advisable because of how hard it is to track targets with them.

 

 

If your whole game plan is to never engage players that move when you shoot them then by all means play Light lasers and Rocket pods but once you start fighting decent pilots that don't let you 100-0 them before they move your life is going to get really hard.

[SWCNT]

Drako's right about LC pairing better with pods than LLC. I wouldn't say it's a just a matter of play style whether you pick LLC or LC. Several of you commented on DPS of LLC vs. LC. Which one is better depends upon your target, there's some merit to Krixarc's comment about how if you think LLC is better you're not fighting against good people. If you're flying against foodships, then LLC all day, but against people that can fly, LC is the best. This is true because when you're playing against good people, damage per second (DPS) doesn't matter that much, because you won't have second long intervals to deal the damage. Instead, damage per shot (DPSh) is what counts. LC has a ~13% higher DPSh than LLC (364 vs 318), so it's better against higher skilled opponents. It's the same reason good scouts love BLC, which don't actually have high DPS, but their DPSh is very high at 493.98. Point is, DPS is misleading in high level match ups, of course against that food ship that never moves no matter how many times you hit them, then DPS matters. Edited December 17, 2015 by SWCNT

[Greezt]

Drako's right about LC pairing better with pods than LLC. I wouldn't say it's a just a matter of play style whether you pick LLC or LC. Several of you commented on DPS of LLC vs. LC. Which one is better depends upon your target, there's some merit to Krixarc's comment about how if you think LLC is better you're not fighting against good people. If you're flying against foodships, then LLC all day, but against people that can fly, LC is the best. This is true because when you're playing against good people, damage per second (DPS) doesn't matter that much, because you won't have second long intervals to deal the damage. Instead, damage per shot (DPSh) is what counts. LC has a ~13% higher DPSh than LLC (364 vs 318), so it's better against higher skilled opponents. It's the same reason good scouts love BLC, which don't actually have high DPS, but their DPSh is very high at 493.98. Point is, DPS is misleading in high level match ups, of course against that food ship that never moves no matter how many times you hit them, then DPS matters.

 

You obviously know what you're talking about. Still, both my kills and my dps went up when I swapped to LLC from lasers (and that was actually when your guys came over to TRE to practice).

 

Edit- LLC does more dps than LC from ~2800m, but it's DPSh is higher from ~1000m. That's close range, but still not worthless in my opinion.

Edited December 18, 2015 by Greezt

[SWCNT]

Edit- LLC does more dps than LC from ~2800m, but it's DPSh is higher from ~1000m. That's close range, but still not worthless in my opinion.

 

I'm not sure what you're talking about here. LLC has higher DPS than LC at all ranges, in terms of DPSh, LLC is higher at less than 1000 meters, however, it's only 3% higher and that's at 500 meters, which is the max difference. For example, at 700 meters it's only ~1% higher. That's not enough to justify, especially when you consider the hit you're taking in accuracy at longer ranges with LLC, which goes back to Drako's comment about LC pairing better wtih pods. If you want to use LLC, go for it, but the numbers don't back it up. As a fun build some people will run LLC with sabotage probe, there it makes more sense, but that build in general is considered a T1 troll build.

Edited December 18, 2015 by SWCNT

[aakrea]

When attacking a GS it isn't just damage per shot either though. It's damage before it moves, with LLC you get off more shots. I haven't done the math but I think it just depends on how long it takes the target to move.

 

I haven't used LLC long enough to have an opinion, I just thought it depended on how close you want to start shooting. I usually use BLC/pod

[Linuxizer]

The Stasie's Guide (the stickied thread) is a good resource. Most of my builds are similar if not the same.

 

LLC really isn't as bad as some people say. In my experience, LC, QLC and LLC are fairly even, with LC slightly ahead. If you're using Retro Thrusters, then the extra range of the QLC could be very useful (LC is not available with RT).

 

LC, QLC and LLC are all poor against evading BLC Scouts and Charged-Plating Bombers. LLC is slightly better against a stationary Gunship (or slow-moving Bomber) at close range, but you're not going to be in that kind of situation most of the time. LLC has less range, but higher DPS, and better tracking (especially with the level 4 tracking upgrade). So you have to get closer, where it is harder to keep the target centered, but it is more forgiving when the target is a few degrees off center.

 

RFL is much weaker than the LLC. Accuracy and DPS are both lower. Power efficiency is not a useful advantage unless your aim is really poor. The lower tracking penalty is only a significant advantage at very high angles, where both weapons are poor anyway.

 

I use LLC sometimes. LC has a lower rate of fire but the sound effect doesn't compensate enough, so it feels like one gun is jammed. I also prefer the short-barrelled, less threatening appearance of the LLC. Sometimes I just want to blend in with the rookies and look harmless

 

... damage per second (DPS) doesn't matter that much, because you won't have second long intervals to deal the damage. Instead, damage per shot (DPSh) is what counts. LC has a ~13% higher DPSh than LLC (364 vs 318), so it's better against higher skilled opponents. It's the same reason good scouts love BLC...

 

I'm going to disagree slightly with Yallia on the rate of fire advantage. The BLC does so much damage per shot (800+ is common) that we are willing to deal with the long downtime between shots. The LLC, QLC and LC on the other hand, just don't do enough in one shot and are really for spraying, so the higher rate of fire of the LLC is a small advantage in this respect.

 

OP, once you get the Flashfire/Sting, you should plan to use it with BLC. QLC is better when you first sneak up on a Gunship, but again, you are not going to be doing that the whole time. BLC is more practical than QLC in a lot of situations. If you have a Flashfire/Sting and an IL-5, then it might make sense to use QLC on one and BLC on the other.

[Greezt]

I'm not sure what you're talking about here. LLC has higher DPS than LC at all ranges, in terms of DPSh, LLC is higher at less than 1000 meters, however, it's only 3% higher and that's at 500 meters, which is the max difference. For example, at 700 meters it's only ~1% higher. That's not enough to justify, especially when you consider the hit you're taking in accuracy at longer ranges with LLC, which goes back to Drako's comment about LC pairing better wtih pods. If you want to use LLC, go for it, but the numbers don't back it up. As a fun build some people will run LLC with sabotage probe, there it makes more sense, but that build in general is considered a T1 troll build.

 

I meant after base accuracy reduction. I'm going to try damage capacitor next week, and see if I can get better results.

 

As for drako's comment, I can't argue with that. I wouldn't, seeing how much more experienced than me he has... But I was thinking about killing gunships (and bombers), and they tend to be slower targets.

[ALaggyGrunt]

The long downtime between shots is actually a strength. You fire the gun -> fly the ship -> fire the gun again. The rapid-fire guns don't let you do that.

 

Add to that the way hit detection works: if you click and sweep your mouse across the lead indicator very quickly, a lot of times it will register a hit. On a real gun, that's a really good way to put a shot where you really don't want to, but with the way this game is written (hitscan + server sanity checks}, that will work sometimes, which makes long-interval guns that much nastier. As long as your mouse sweep is approximately in line with the direction of the target's motion on your screen, there's a very good chance the game will scan a hit.

 

Because this game is intended to simulate shooting at things, I don't think it's an intended mechanic.

[Krixarcs]

this thread got a little derailed but let me set it straight. anyone that thinks light lasers are good should uninstall the game

[Kinsha]

I think verain did an analysis of how BLC is superior to LLC over the duration of 1 second. Long story short, it basically amounted to BLC coming leaps and bounds ahead of LLC during the small time frame where there was just enough time for BLC to get 2 shots in. LLC may have come out ahead barely before BLC got a new shot, before it dropped back drastically as BLC fired again. Edited December 24, 2015 by Kinsha