Nerf supporters are so happy because...

[DarthSylar]

2) After the nerf almost nobody but pro players in high end gear can now get the “one for all” achievement. Ridiculous and unbelievable, but I don’t see any other reason explaining the happiness of the nerf supporters with 4.02.

 

Definitely not true. I have never done a NiM op and only a handful of HM ops, but decided to try and get the achievement yesterday and did. My gear is mainly 216 with a handful of 220, but I do not think I qualify as a pro player and I do not have high end gear

[cambul]

i have been trying to reason why the 'we want challenge' players, seem unwilling to consider taking any personal steps to increase the challenge level of their play, such as down scaling gear and/or companion abilities, and seem instead to NEED the game to do it for them? is it that the allure of all that accumulated power is just too great for them to resist, or is it simply a lack of empathy towards those of any different mind set?

 

while the game cant equally cater for both camps, there is far more the mighty can do to create extra challenge, than there is for the meek and the fun hunters to lessen it.

[Uruare]

What rot

 

Not wanting a trivial game has nothing to do with anything else but not wanting a trivial game. The very strange stuff people read into says a lot more about the people doing it than anything else.

 

Trivial game.

 

Trivial. Game.

 

As opposed to deep, meaningful games that change lives?

 

As opposed to games in which the cures for RL cancer, AIDS and stupidity are found?

 

Please tell us all what game is not trivial? I've tried and tried and all I can think of is that some professional sports players earn a lot of money playing their trivial games for the entertainment of others, but the games themselves are still trivial.

 

Because 'trivial game' is an oxymoron. If it isn't trivial, it isn't a game. If it isn't trivial, it might be important, and might deserve more attention and conversation than merely playing at or with it connotes.

 

But perhaps I simply fail utterly to understand the gravitas and deep importance inherent to this game.

 

Please, tell me how and why it isn't fundamentaly trivial?

[DisIzMe]

The completion of the star fortress destruction quest chain.

Elitism.

The difference is that you still may play 100m sprinting. What you ask for is to allow casual sprinters only 50m runs. As they dont deserve to run the whole 100m.

.....You do know that there is solo mode for star fortress quest chain? Just so that you can complete your 100m.

[Shwarzchild]

I think we're talking about two different things here. What I mean by "sense of progression" refers to the folks who think everything needs to be challenging, to give the feeling of accomplishment at beating a difficult quest objective; that sort of thing.

 

What you just referred to above is the basic MMO structure which isn't an issue with me. Making that structure unnecessarily tedious or frustrating, IS.

 

Just playing devils advocate here:

 

One sentence states what you referenced is the basic MMO structure which you don't have an issue with. The next sentence somewhat contradicts that first sentence a bit, correct? Progression by it's nature requires tedious or frustrating moments? Also, "unnecessarily" ends up being subjective to the point where nobody is able to make that value quantifiable. What's unnecessary for you, may not be for others, and so on and so forth. As you've said previously (at least I think it was you), was that the game should taylor to the diverse crowd it serves. Can't it be argued that the your definition can't be taken as a 100 percent blanket philosophy since we do have a diverse crowd that must be taken into account? And, most broadly, that people who do like a minimum amount of challenge need to be more open minded about what they're complaining about as well?

[Pagy]

Did this really need the 10 billionth thread to be made?

especially with some fictional, strawman debate with...himself?

[geschmonz]

I have no idea - both are, because both spend their money to get what they want.

 

It isn't a right vs wrong, and it certainly isn't something to get bent out of shape over.

 

So tell me, what is wrong about adding an option which allows both parties fun in the game?

 

What except the envy someone else could complete it without the effort you put in?

 

It also isn't worth demonizing people who have a different opinion than you do. "Envy" and "hate"? Over how much challenge or lack thereof there is in a video game?

 

Hatred for "the filthy casual", and envy someone who plays 2 hours a week could see the same content as like a hardcore player.

[TX_Angel]

This whole ''real life'' argument is a fallacy. Have you considered that actually playing the way pro nerf people are saying is relaxing and fun and this is what actual escapism is. And dumbing it down is not relaxing, but boring and making you fall asleep on the chair.

Not being faceroll easy doesn't mean it becomes a second job, but it helps it fulfill it's purpose as entertainment.

 

Another thing. You are taking too seriously the words striving and achievment. They are used only in a gaming slang sense, not some real life-like ambition horse ****. There has to be a sense of progression which requires actual gameplay + time investment. That's how rpgs and mmorpgs work. In such games you develop a character, that's the way it goes.

 

No, you are mistaken... You are projecting your opinion and viewpoint on everyone else.

 

There is nothing wrong with YOU wanting to play like that, but there is something wrong with you thinking EVERYONE should want to play like that.

[geschmonz]

.....You do know that there is solo mode for star fortress quest chain? Just so that you can complete your 100m.

 

You can only complete 50m in the solo mode. The end boss is only available in the 100m h2+ version.

[Bobs_YourUncle]

Me: Aside from a few issues, the companions with the nerf are ok, and it's in fact more fun with the increased challenge.

 

Nerf Opposer: Why didn't you just turn off your companion abilities, dismiss them, remove your armor, etc, if you wanted it more challenging?

 

Me: Oh, I was having fun while the comps were super OP, I just think its more fun now.

 

Nerf Opposer: God, you freaking whiners got them to nerf the companions. Loud minority elitest aholes.

 

Me: Nah I never posted demanding they nerf companions. I might have agreed with someone saying they were OP and the game was a bit over the top face walkey.

 

Nerf Opposer: The game is broken. I can no longer solo HM FPs due to companion nerfs.

 

Me: I don't think you were meant to solo HM FPs on level.

 

Nerf Opposer: THAT DOESNT CHANGE THE FACT THAT I COULD BEFORE THE NERF AND NOW I CANT.

 

Me: Sounds right to me.

 

Nerf Opposer: You kick puppies.

 

Me: No, I like puppies generally.

[TX_Angel]

Definitely not true. I have never done a NiM op and only a handful of HM ops, but decided to try and get the achievement yesterday and did. My gear is mainly 216 with a handful of 220, but I do not think I qualify as a pro player and I do not have high end gear

 

If you can beat HM ops, then you're an elite player. Very few people can beat those.

[Diterakor]

Star Wars Galaxies: New Game Enhancement

We just got one step closer with 4.0

Did Bioware go out and hire all the out of work developers from SOE??

[Pagy]

Me: Aside from a few issues, the companions with the nerf are ok, and it's in fact more fun with the increased challenge.

 

Nerf Opposer: Why didn't you just turn off your companion abilities, dismiss them, remove your armor, etc, if you wanted it more challenging?

 

Me: Oh, I was having fun while the comps were super OP, I just think its more fun now.

 

Nerf Opposer: God, you freaking whiners got them to nerf the companions. Loud minority elitest aholes.

 

Me: Nah I never posted demanding they nerf companions. I might have agreed with someone saying they were OP and the game was a bit over the top face walkey.

 

Nerf Opposer: The game is broken. I can no longer solo HM FPs due to companion nerfs.

 

Me: I don't think you were meant to solo HM FPs on level.

 

Nerf Opposer: THAT DOESNT CHANGE THE FACT THAT I COULD BEFORE THE NERF AND NOW I CANT.

 

Me: Sounds right to me.

 

Nerf Opposer: You kick puppies.

 

Me: No, I like puppies generally.

pretty much sums it up

[geschmonz]

If you can beat HM ops, then you're an elite player. Very few people can beat those.

 

Some can, so everyone can. And if they cant, it's their failure. Elitist logic.

[lanawinst]

It's not really 'challenging' now (apologies if that's how I actually worded it), it just pushes you to actually DO SOMETHING, as in, you actually have to press some buttons and not just let your companion do everything for you etc. While it does last a BIT longer, I can't see how that's more boring then actually doing nothing (Unless you're playing a sorc or something and just keep hitting the same ability over and over again because you're already op as f***).

 

If other people say it can be done then it probably can. Even with a dps. Come on, it's a video game? What's wrong with overcoming a little challenge?

 

I find pressing x times your rotation buttons as boring as pressing x times 1 button, honestly. It's still pressing repeatedly some buttons without that much thought given... The only difference is that it takes longer without being more rewarding. It just became a longer mindless grind, so yes, to me, it just became more boring and that's about it.

Edited November 23, 2015 by lanawinst

[geschmonz]

Me: Aside from a few issues, the companions with the nerf are ok, and it's in fact more fun with the increased challenge.

 

.. for you. Tunnel vision? You see all those reactions on subs and in the forum?

 

Nerf Opposer: Why didn't you just turn off your companion abilities, dismiss them, remove your armor, etc, if you wanted it more challenging?

Me: Oh, I was having fun while the comps were super OP, I just think its more fun now.

 

You still could have the fun if it was optional. It wont be taken away.

[lanawinst]

If you can beat HM ops, then you're an elite player. Very few people can beat those.

 

Not true. I beat HM ops more than once yet I don't consider myself an elite player. Not even close. After all, I couldn't solo the Star Forteress... Just means that I'm well equipped, in good company and that I know how to work in a team. But my character's flaws (DPS with no healing,...) makes it not as viable when it comes to solo heroics.

Edited November 23, 2015 by lanawinst

[Shwarzchild]

You can only complete 50m in the solo mode. The end boss is only available in the 100m h2+ version.

 

Much like the Revan fight from SoR is different from the operation one. If we take the game and slice it into sections, there will inevitably be portions that require different effort levels from the player. To make sure that those effort levels are adequately compensated the reward structure is different. Just like gear drops from a tactical flashpoint differ from those of a hard mode flashpoint, and further more the gear drops from Korriban are different than that of Voss, or story mode operations drops are lesser than hard mode or nightmare.

 

The population of this game is diverse. The game must scale and attempt to find that happy medium between all the fanatics that are logged in. You can't expect every piece of the pie to be cherry. If you want to run that 100m sprint instead know that you are entering a potentially different slice of the game's pie that many other players enjoy as is and it very well may ask something different of you than the piece you usually find yourself in.

[geschmonz]

Not true. I beat HM ops more than once yet I don't consider myself an elit player. Not even close. After all, I couldn't solo the Star Forteress...

 

"Because i can everyone can".

[OniGanon]

The level of the challenge had been raised extraordinary after the companions were nerfed.

 

The level of challenge OF WHAT?!

 

Specifically what SOLO content are you referring to?

[DarthSylar]

If you can beat HM ops, then you're an elite player. Very few people can beat those.

 

Bull, I have been in groups that have dragged players through HM EV and KP before

[DisIzMe]

You can only complete 50m in the solo mode. The end boss is only available in the 100m h2+ version.

Thats part of heroic mechanics. It is supposed to be HARD. Thats why it is not solo. So that people who cannot manage the hard mechanics will not need to and will be able to finish their 100m - star fortress quest chain in solo chain.

I will tell you a bigger secret - hard mode and NIM operations all have additional mechanics and some have additional bonus bosses too. They are hard to beat. I never did some and probably never will ,it is above my abilities.And i still have access to the content. I just cant deal with it. Lots of people can.

Which is ok with me.

But you demand to lower even the hardest bits of the game to your own level,while grasping at "elitism vs poor me" straws.

People do not have common denominator so some are better at stuff then others. This is the way of things.

[Pagy]

If you can beat HM ops, then you're an elite player. Very few people can beat those.

well...not really. bad players can be carried through for sure, but i digress, wasnt the point you were trying to make.

[JessieLoverRxE]

For what should i be envious? That some people have no life but the best epics? You know, i got my epics in real life and not something virtual as like a computer game.

 

Right. If you love video games, if you like to actually DO SOMETHING but sit back in video games, you have no life. Because people aren't allowed to have a life along with enjoyable hobbies.

 

"It is only your fault if you dont manage it". So much for elitism. "Give the people cake if they have no bread"..

 

If you want to accomplish something someone else has, you put effort into it. And if you need help, well, I'm sorry but you didn't even list what you're having problems with?

 

Always the same pattern. And i doubt you really are any kind of skilled gamer.

 

This community is full of hypocrisy.

 

Where did I claim I was a 'skilled gamer'?

 

The only difference between me and you is that I actually learn how to do something when I can't finish it, instead of complaining and wanting everything handed to me. I actually find that fun. That's all there is to it.

[Bobs_YourUncle]

.. for you. Tunnel vision? You see all those reactions on subs and in the forum?

 

Yes I forgot the doomsday nerf opposers. Me: Well if enough don't like it they'll change it back. Maybe they won't and the game will die after losing all those subs, resulting in me finding another game to play.

 

You still could have the fun if it was optional. It wont be taken away.

 

Even if it were optional, I'd have left it default probably, since I was having fun anyways. Maybe after a while I'd have messed around with it, especially for achievements or something. I learned long ago not to expect challenge outside of group content, including dailies and endgame grind. Doesn't change the fact I think the endgame daily grind is now more fun than before. The Heroic SFs with the nerf are very challenging. Personally, I was quite proud to solo them post nerf. I died many times.