UltimateKrucible Posted October 19, 2015 Share Posted October 19, 2015 Two classes dominate - sorcs and PTs. Pointless to play anything else, so everyone rolls one - flip a coin and the match is won. No point learning other classes, or tactics, or trying to enjoy the game. Just roll a broken class and hey ho - game over. SWTOR PvP was once quite good, but has been left behind by PVE advances to become a broken, laughable mess. The only solution is to take an axe to the whole thing, divorce it from PVE and actually make it competitive. But that won't happen, so it's going to go the way of GSF - a minor part of the game ignored by just about everyone save those who want to roll OP classes and flip coins to see who wins. Dead in the water. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icykill_ Posted October 19, 2015 Share Posted October 19, 2015 Two classes dominate - sorcs and PTs. Pointless to play anything else, so everyone rolls one - flip a coin and the match is won. No point learning other classes, or tactics, or trying to enjoy the game. Just roll a broken class and hey ho - game over. SWTOR PvP was once quite good, but has been left behind by PVE advances to become a broken, laughable mess. The only solution is to take an axe to the whole thing, divorce it from PVE and actually make it competitive. But that won't happen, so it's going to go the way of GSF - a minor part of the game ignored by just about everyone save those who want to roll OP classes and flip coins to see who wins. Dead in the water. That's mainly in ranked arena... Just about any class is viable in objective pvp... Obviously some classes require a lot more skill to play, but they are more forgiving in regs and in the hands of good players are actually extremely good "if" they play their role correctly... Mara's, Juggs, Ops can dominate Hutt Ball all by themselves... Put 2 snipers together to guard any node maps and they can dominate... Sins and Ops can usually guard or ninja well, even against those Sorcs and especially against PTs... Of course Sorc heals are OP at the moment and are a big asset if on your team... But DPS PTs can be glass canons the same as Mercs if left by themselves with no healer... I do agree with the suggestion to split pve from pvp... Now would have been the perfect time as they could have left out these silly new teleporting abilities and just tried to balance pvp on the current meta which has most of the work already done... I'm sure most pvpers would rather that than new abilities that will make pvp an even more unbalanced mess I also agree with your assessment about pvp being ignored from now on and basically dying out... With the game focus now story mode and basically single player... Even pve Ops and FPs will die off, they will be treated like pvp is now and we will be treated like GSF or even the old "on rails" space missions... With 4.0 the game isn't an MMO anymore, it's a adventure single player story, with some small side games... PVP has been dying a slow death for the last 2 years and as we can see end game pve will now be treated that way too... If so many people hadn't been asking for silly features like Strong Holds, guild ships, dress up and other "bling" features, the money and resources spent on those things could have been spent on new content instead or even adding a little story too and then we could stilly have an MMO for everyone... Don't get me wrong, I like some of those things... But I think the resources could have been better allocated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lhancelot Posted October 19, 2015 Share Posted October 19, 2015 If so many people hadn't been asking for silly features like Strong Holds, guild ships, dress up and other "bling" features, the money and resources spent on those things could have been spent on new content instead or even adding a little story too and then we could stilly have an MMO for everyone... Don't get me wrong, I like some of those things... But I think the resources could have been better allocated This is partially wrong. They added strongholds, guildships, dress-up barbie options and other "bling" features because all of these bring in tons of real money from people buying cartel packs to get SH furniture, armor skins etc. Yeah, I think they could have allocated the money on other things too, perhaps a stronger engine for the game so cross-server queues could happen along with other future changes. Due to limitations of the technology they have available they are limited in what they can do which is stupid IMO. You'd think they would look at the big picture and consider upgrades technologically. I really am clueless with what direction they are going for this game. Until I see it, experience it, I won't make judgments yet. Trying to predict what is what at this point is nothing but theorycrafting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ascensionthree Posted October 19, 2015 Share Posted October 19, 2015 Worst game ever. Worst PvP ever. So horrible why would anyone play the worst mmo of all time. Overpowered! This is an outrage! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UltimateKrucible Posted October 19, 2015 Author Share Posted October 19, 2015 That's mainly in ranked arena... It's bled into regs now too. Add up the ever-present curse of premades and PvP is now pointless. Teams running op classes in conjunction means there is simply no point trying to compete if you play DPS. With the amount of heals and defensives you can be lucky to actually scratch some players. I was in a WZ tonight where the entire team got two kills. TWO. That's just broken. I played Warhammer and that game died because of its terrible PvP. SWTOR Isn't going to die, of course - but PvP has and is just a rotting corpse propped up by players who just want FOTM coin tosses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJMazz Posted October 20, 2015 Share Posted October 20, 2015 You're wrong, op. People play operatives too. So that's 3 classes. Ha! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icykill_ Posted October 20, 2015 Share Posted October 20, 2015 This is partially wrong. They added strongholds, guildships, dress-up barbie options and other "bling" features because all of these bring in tons of real money from people buying cartel packs to get SH furniture, armor skins etc. Yeah, I think they could have allocated the money on other things too, perhaps a stronger engine for the game so cross-server queues could happen along with other future changes. Due to limitations of the technology they have available they are limited in what they can do which is stupid IMO. You'd think they would look at the big picture and consider upgrades technologically. I really am clueless with what direction they are going for this game. Until I see it, experience it, I won't make judgments yet. Trying to predict what is what at this point is nothing but theorycrafting. Yeah, I realise that those non content features are good for cartel... But too much focus on them and basically a whole 18 months worth of resources have been spent on them... Plus, if you go way back and look in the forum suggestions area you can see that people asked for these things... Would the Devs have thought of all of them by themselves? Maybe... Would they have still found other cartel cash grab things to do... Probably... But maybe not as much... We'll never know I'm not blaming the Devs as much as I blame EA management... EA are being to heavy handed with the game developers and too focused the quick bucks instead of player enjoyment... There needs to be balance... At the moments it is on cashing in... Which is why "I believe" the switch to the whole story mode thing is purely about a cash grab to take advantage of the movie release... They know not everyone likes MMOs, but most Star Wars fans will be tempted to try out a SW story game... I know all of this is "theorycrafting" as you put it... But you only need to see the treatment of pvp in this game, to make some guesses as to what is going to happen... I would really like to be wrong... I really would... We'll just have to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UltimateKrucible Posted October 20, 2015 Author Share Posted October 20, 2015 You're wrong, op. People play operatives too. So that's 3 classes. Ha! Nothing they can do against a guarded healer - fight the tank, he gets healed. Fight the healer, he heals. Bring a teammate, he heals, bring 2, he bubbles, runs and heals. Tank laughs off damage and kills you. Seriously, I can;t believe how similar this is to the dying days of Warhammer. It's that broken, which takes some doing, believe me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lhancelot Posted October 20, 2015 Share Posted October 20, 2015 Worst game ever. Worst PvP ever. So horrible why would anyone play the worst mmo of all time. Overpowered! This is an outrage! lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyperionjr Posted October 20, 2015 Share Posted October 20, 2015 I left a few months ago with high hopes for 4.0 and improvements to PVP....at last there is none. Zero PVP additions for a major update? I'm really curious as to what the statistics are for PVP players vs PVE players. People have been asking for the return of 8v8 for years now. I just don't understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lhancelot Posted October 20, 2015 Share Posted October 20, 2015 It's bled into regs now too. Add up the ever-present curse of premades and PvP is now pointless. Teams running op classes in conjunction means there is simply no point trying to compete if you play DPS. With the amount of heals and defensives you can be lucky to actually scratch some players. I was in a WZ tonight where the entire team got two kills. TWO. That's just broken. I played Warhammer and that game died because of its terrible PvP. SWTOR Isn't going to die, of course - but PvP has and is just a rotting corpse propped up by players who just want FOTM coin tosses. Healing is too easy now, it really is. I enjoy healers more than anything, so this really bothers me. I love to play heals! It's not fun healing anymore. On this game healing is like playing whack-a-mole. I just run around watching health lvls, fill them up when they low, and that's it. If I get pressured by 2-3 dps, I just use my extreme mobility speed boosts or escapes and get away. Merc healing is boring as crap I refuse to even play that heal spec. What has happened now is, being impossible to kill as a healer has created an overabundance of healers which only makes pvp more frustrating. I am hoping 4.0 fixes all of these problems we are aware of. I have faith in BW! They made WARHAMMER and, hey, that game DID get better. It just got good too late and died because no one went back to it a couple years after all the kinks got worked out. I actually enjoyed WAR especially the last year I played it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icykill_ Posted October 20, 2015 Share Posted October 20, 2015 It's bled into regs now too. Add up the ever-present curse of premades and PvP is now pointless. Teams running op classes in conjunction means there is simply no point trying to compete if you play DPS. With the amount of heals and defensives you can be lucky to actually scratch some players. I was in a WZ tonight where the entire team got two kills. TWO. That's just broken. I played Warhammer and that game died because of its terrible PvP. SWTOR Isn't going to die, of course - but PvP has and is just a rotting corpse propped up by players who just want FOTM coin tosses. Premades dominate in most matches they are in, no matter the class... What you'll find is happening at the moment is those premades are running 1-2 healers or a whole stealth squad... That's got nothing to do with balance or classes... I mainly play DPS and dabble with healing and tanking... I have zero issues with any class... Even Mercs, although they are hard to survive on and can be frustrating to play with the way they are... Most of those matches you play where you get few kills is because there are too many healers or a Sorc healer... Plus people are noobs and don't focus healers and CC tanks... Then you have the people who have no idea "how" to play objective pvp or even what "tactics" are... They try to death match or brute force everything... Good objective players know killing everything isn't the only way to win... Too many noobs and badly geared people is what the issue is at the moment in 8 man pvp... Arena is a different story altogether... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlrikFassbauer Posted October 20, 2015 Share Posted October 20, 2015 That's mainly in ranked arena... Just about any class is viable in objective pvp... Might be. But in objective PvP, people prefer these 2 classes instead ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedcjedcjedc Posted October 20, 2015 Share Posted October 20, 2015 this thread seems to be the same 5 or so people complaining in all the other threads. we get it, you don't know how to kill things. If you can't kill a healer with 3 dps, the problem is not the healer or the tank Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UltimateKrucible Posted October 20, 2015 Author Share Posted October 20, 2015 this thread seems to be the same 5 or so people complaining in all the other threads. we get it, you don't know how to kill things. If you can't kill a healer with 3 dps, the problem is not the healer or the tank Actually I started this thread, having not posted in a long, long time. I've been a subscriber since launch, played the hell out of PvP, but for the past while I've been lvling alts, pveing with guildies - basically not pvping since getting DR on my main many, many moons ago. It's not that I don't know how to kill things. Quite the opposite - I know fine well. It's just that you can't now because PvP is so broken. Nothing works, as a DPS unless it's against another dps who's isloated away from the healers and not guarded. Maybe you can't see - possibly you play a healer, or a tank - or you've been PvPing this whole time and become habituated. Bu having taken a break I'm surprised at the awful state PvP is in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aristrokratie Posted October 20, 2015 Share Posted October 20, 2015 (edited) Sorcheals are the problem, neither ops nor mercs are. Sorcheals are the most mobile healer with pretty much the strongest uncounterable healing (there is no point in interrupting a sorc it will hardly hurt him if you do) best defensive/ escapes and the ultimate anti stunlock ability. The way sorcs should be balanced: -Consumtion costs health without force surge -innervate no longer works with force mobility -wandering mend now has a 1.5 second cast time -force mobility now allows you to cast wandering mend on the move -no phasewalk The way mercs should be improved: mercs need better survivability if tunneled -you can use jump while stunned -jump breaks all movement impearing effects -anti tunnel smokebomb -healing and energy adjustements -i could carry on forever... Scoundrel: scoundrels are too vulnerable to interrupts and the only healer who can effectively be killed within a single stun -new skill: xxx: makes your next two cast heals non interruptable, 45 seonds cooldown -pugnacity no longer grants an instant UM -the defensive cd utility for pugnacity is removed and given to scoundrels by default on a 2 minute cooldown -scamper can be used while rooted and ignores incoming stuns and cc until you are done with your roll (anti rubberbanding -shield probes cooldown is reset by 10 seconds every time you get stunned, mezzed etc and is now usable while stunned OR holotraverse is usable while stunned (healers only) Edited October 20, 2015 by aristrokratie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capizm Posted October 20, 2015 Share Posted October 20, 2015 get premades out of regs, period. go to 4 and 8 man ranked. make it so you cant have 2 healers of same class, so 3 sorcs cant happen, but sorc op and merc would be ok. 4 dps per team, 2 tanks per team. the problem is the system, not classes or players. bad players verse bad players can be a amazing game, but premade verse bads isent. so stop it...simple. no team speak in regs, and no premade. at all. regs are for average , bad or solo players. how could biofail ever think a team of 4 to 8 on team speak, within same guild or that play all the time, wouldnt kill regs? so basicly i have to play regs and verse premades, but if you dont want to play premades you cant? some chioce there....my chioce is to lose and lose badly all the time. thats why pvp is bad. bracket system sux, and im sorry , but good teams shouldnt be pounceing regs for easy wins...players use the excuse of there wouldnt be any ranked left, wait....there was no ranked pvp when game started right? first year or 2 pvp was very fun...sorry to say, but the premades have all the advantages in regs...all. you would think someone would get it by now...that what they have isent working . yet still a premade fest. in regs... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PBoba Posted October 20, 2015 Share Posted October 20, 2015 (edited) Sorcheals are the problem, neither ops nor mercs are. Sorcheals are the most mobile healer with pretty much the strongest uncounterable healing (there is no point in interrupting a sorc it will hardly hurt him if you do) Uh, I think you interrupt a moving cast, it gives them stacks. Edited October 20, 2015 by PBoba Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pherdnut Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 It's when I'm losing to pre-mades that I can tell actually suck but just happen to have the right class composition that I'm really seriously ready to move on. I have loved PVP in this game but it is and has been slowly but surely going away for some time. And don't get me wrong, I love me some barbie times. But it's not enough without PVP. Looking forward to playing the not-quite Kotor 3 content but beyond that, pvp improves or I'm an intermittent subscriber at best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KumbayaGOD Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 bioware will keep adding content of pvp or ops in future but it is just business first for them adding stronghold , and outfit designer is too make people spend real money big money that bioware see this as good business let see this way , you own this company and you see your customers base 90% doing pve or even solo playing (in mmo setting even) , some doing stronghold to make their place pretty maybe 5% doing raid and maybe 1% doing nim raid other 5% doing pvp and 1% doing rank pvp ok obviously you want to focus first at your 90% customers base , rite? now break it again in term of revenue maybe this 90% people spend cartel coins to buy bling bling either deco or packs ----> this is your revenue generator, people are sometime crazy in buying megapacks etc and maybe spend upto usd 100 or more raider and pvper--- to be honest rarely maybe spend money on cartel coins , what they need it for if they are purely raiding and pvp ? some still spend but i can say majority dont care with stronghold even so bioware in business sense already correct but i may annoy other player like no pvp content or raiding they will leep adding it but the resources they put wont be as much as cartel and other pve content so you either accept or not it is our choices, i still enjoy this game and the story even now i purely do pvp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazedo Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 Yeah, Sorc's are the only viable healer for ranked, I'm greatly saddened by this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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