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The Great PvP War

RayGonJinn

By RayGonJinn
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NvrShoutNvr

NvrShoutNvr

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Lol, I remember the good old days of PvP where DPS wasn't split into two different types.

 

And where all you had to do as a tank was throw a guard on a healer and taunt.

 

And where a tank and a healer could hold a node from three DPS by themselves.

 

Because back in the day, killing something didn't take skill. Surviving wasn't hard, and the game was so slow.

 

Sorry Raygon, game's changed. Not that you were really a challenge then, but even less now that it takes skill to do damage and survive in WZs.

 

all we need is neo and myrm and the dream team is back.

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Kayla_Shadowsong

Kayla_Shadowsong

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I generally avoid these drama threads and I'm sure someone will manage to twist my few thoughts, but here's my two cents.

 

I have noticed recently a very large number of very very new PvP players in every tier. It's honestly not fun to fight them even running solo as I usually do. Sure there's a moment of ego and adrenaline when you solo 3 defenders, but that fades quickly and then you feel bad for picking on those just learning to play.

 

Sure it's fun to get 90+ kills in lowbie, or go a dozen matches before you die, but that rush quickly becomes hollow if the reason you're getting those kills is because your opponents are still struggling with the basic game mechanics.

 

We aren't helping nurture a new crop of PvP'rs with our verbal trash talking and the running of guild teams in lowbies and mids. I'm quite skittish and asocial, but I will often swap factions if we win too strongly in my small attempt to keep things more balanced. Even so, perhaps one match in three is close enough to make me turn off my audio book and make me pay attention, which is a shame.

 

There's nothing more fun for me than to go up against challenging players that know all the cc's and defensive moves, not just the dps rotations. Sadly most of those who are left in that category have grown to be toxic in our small little pool.

 

I don't know if conquest is to blame for all the new pvp'rs, or if it's just the batch of new players that started at Christmas, but I'm at a loss as to how to get them up to speed before they get frustrated and stop queuing.

 

Perhaps my memories of matches gone by is just my rose tinted glasses, but I'm definitely feeling like the old cat lady in the warzones right now.

 

It's bad enough I'm considering going through the story again for one of the classes just for a change of pace and cut my warzone time back.

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RayGonJinn

RayGonJinn

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Sorry Raygon, game's changed. Not that you were really a challenge then, but even less now that it takes skill to do damage and survive in WZs.

 

I don't understand you PvPers. You were able to take the OP, a post that was basically an observation and compare type post of generality and literaly twist and turn it into me boasting and bragging about myself. This ability you guys have at doing this is just inconceivable. Step back a moment, get out of your ego and will to prove your knowledge online, and read the post with the intentions it was meant to be in. I know what the best looked like, I know what their tactics looked like, I know what their honor and will to win looked like. Scyn, Wolfbane, DeeDee, Consular, Neo, Tyrosine, Beleg, Darknight (the Jugg) Melyn, Ushanev, Ogclutchbossman, Aubrey, Tughazi, and plenty more I can name of. Look, No lie, I love you guys with all my heart and spirit. No hard feelings towards you and the things you've said to me at all, I love you. But you can't take away the fact that I've seen the best, fought the best, and have victories over the best even with me playing this game straight from a MAcbok pro with its track pad mouse. Say what you want to say, express yourself (that's what the world wants you to believe and do) I love you guys. "I am the wisest man alive for I know one thing, and that is that I know nothing." Socrates

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Kayla_Shadowsong

Kayla_Shadowsong

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I did finally get one from each faction to 60's (Kayla and Wisp) and I'm forcing myself to do the 4-5 matches each time I play to get the daily done. So far I've been disappointed with the quality of play. It's not really much better than the previous brackets. The numbers are bigger, but that's about it. Guild teams are fun to fight, and I encounter them perhaps a bit more frequently in 60 than mids.

 

Trash talking is almost unbearable in the 60 bracket, I really don't understand that.

 

With my horrible alt-itus it takes me longer than many to get geared up and I may be getting burned out by the process since this is about the 4th time I've gone through it. The last 3 times I've been one to two pieces away from a complete max set, the level has gone up and I've had to start all over. That means I can't really play more than 2-3 characters in that bracket with a reasonable expectation of getting geared before they raise the cap again. Even then it will take me months.

 

I have a very hard time focusing on the 60 bracket long term primarily because it's so bloody expensive and difficult to change outfits (primarily due to having to re-augment)... stupid I know, but I really wish they'd remove augments from the pvp stat calculations. That would narrow the stat differential between top tier gear and entry as well as facilitate swapping out outfits a lot easier.

 

It also makes it easier to swap to a different class when the mood strikes you.

 

Removing augments from the PvP calculation would be such a quality of life improvement, but I'm sure the crafters would scream bloody murder. :p

Edited by Kayla_Shadowsong
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Kallpa

Kallpa

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I don't understand you PvPers. You were able to take the OP, a post that was basically an observation and compare type post of generality and literaly twist and turn it into me boasting and bragging about myself. This ability you guys have at doing this is just inconceivable. Step back a moment, get out of your ego and will to prove your knowledge online, and read the post with the intentions it was meant to be in. I know what the best looked like, I know what their tactics looked like, I know what their honor and will to win looked like. Scyn, Wolfbane, DeeDee, Consular, Neo, Tyrosine, Beleg, Darknight (the Jugg) Melyn, Ushanev, Ogclutchbossman, Aubrey, Tughazi, and plenty more I can name of. Look, No lie, I love you guys with all my heart and spirit. No hard feelings towards you and the things you've said to me at all, I love you. But you can't take away the fact that I've seen the best, fought the best, and have victories over the best even with me playing this game straight from a MAcbok pro with its track pad mouse. Say what you want to say, express yourself (that's what the world wants you to believe and do) I love you guys. "I am the wisest man alive for I know one thing, and that is that I know nothing." Socrates

 

name dropping a bunch of people who used to play when the game was very different doesnt really prove your point imo. it seems that all your on about is the lack of objective game play. not everyone bothers to plays objectives. i used to play objectives when i first started, but then i realized that the majority of BC is terrible and cant play, so f it. i play the way i want to play.

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SnowmanSD

SnowmanSD

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Well since zuhara is gonna be late to his own 10 page flash back... lets review... its true Ray Jay that you didn't talk about your ego from the start but as soon as someone questioned you that **** flipped in a matter of minutes. So don't act like you aren't coming in here trying to stroke your "I was gewd back in da day" ****. THE PEOPLE OF BC HAVE SPOKEN... and we have found you... Lacking :(
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Raazmir

Raazmir

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Well since zuhara is gonna be late to his own 10 page flash back... lets review... its true Ray Jay that you didn't talk about your ego from the start but as soon as someone questioned you that **** flipped in a matter of minutes. So don't act like you aren't coming in here trying to stroke your "I was gewd back in da day" ****. THE PEOPLE OF BC HAVE SPOKEN... and we have found you... Lacking :(

 

I was never Gewd back in da day. But i have enough self awareness to remember how hard most everyone acting tuff in the pvp forums got stomped by people who left when 8v8 ranked went away. I also have enough self awareness to laugh at people playing FOTM classes spoon fed the mechanics to win at TDM talking about how "the game just requires more skill now" when the PvP forum is nothing but fury and rage at how overpowered those classes are.

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SnowmanSD

SnowmanSD

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I was never Gewd back in da day. But i have enough self awareness to remember how hard most everyone acting tuff in the pvp forums got stomped by people who left when 8v8 ranked went away. I also have enough self awareness to laugh at people playing FOTM classes spoon fed the mechanics to win at TDM talking about how "the game just requires more skill now" when the PvP forum is nothing but fury and rage at how overpowered those classes are.

 

Jesus dude... 8v8 is over... ITK is done and thats all you still talk about. now plz let me go back to trolling RayJay

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RayGonJinn

RayGonJinn

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Let him. This is priceless cause tbh mallo is dominating this at the moment. RIP Bioware's "perma forum bans", welcome back Zuzu and Feken.

Canin, you're as fake a "Friend" as McDonalds meat... Word of Advice, don't make an enemy out of a "Friend" you once confided to. How is that girlfriend that left you anyway? You ever get her back? Anyway, I hope it went well and you got her back and ran off into the sunset to live happily ever after. I love you man and I'm always here for you ;)

 

Well since zuhara is gonna be late to his own 10 page flash back... lets review... its true Ray Jay that you didn't talk about your ego from the start but as soon as someone questioned you that **** flipped in a matter of minutes. So don't act like you aren't coming in here trying to stroke your "I was gewd back in da day" ****. THE PEOPLE OF BC HAVE SPOKEN... and we have found you... Lacking :(

 

You and Ammut keep refering back to my youtube channel like it means some thing. I have my reasons why I have the videos on my channel and don't have to explain my reasons to you but I don't promote my channel or a single video I've ever uploaded. I don't because they aren't there for the reason you think they're there. They're not private because I don't care that they're there, other than the reason why I have them there. I have hella tough skin and the least of my worries is a threat outside of my soul. I still love you and Ammut though, you're still my brothers ;)

 

On to the other point of me not talking with ego until someone questioned me, I wasn't questioned; more like antagonized. C'mon Mallo the man said it himself...

First of all, I mainly come to these forums looking for either drama or entertainment, so I made some assumptions and misconceptions to keep myself entertained.

Step back, step out of your PvP ego and read his first reply and the intent behind it, as if he were responding to you. Don't sit here and tell me that he wasn't being an antagonist. Any neutral party reading his reply, unbiased, can see it. Why do i have to be stroking my own ego? Because I do feel like I'm at the top of my game? Comparing who I am to who I was yesterday? Why can't a man have confidence in himself? Everytime I step into a WZ, what happened in the past is behind and it's about the now and how I can help my team, not be a "Regstar" To be a Regstar is not in my DNA, I stay true to who I am man... http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=536397 I started this thread, it was from 2 1/2 years ago. It's not about being a "Regstar" It's about a new level of competition so we all can grow and experience competitive play. I love you man.

Edited by RayGonJinn
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Mevarek

Mevarek

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Canin, you're as fake a "Friend" as McDonalds meat... Word of Advice, don't make an enemy out of a "Friend" you once confided to. How is that girlfriend that left you anyway? You ever get her back? Anyway, I hope it went well and you got her back and ran off into the sunset to live happily ever after. I love you man and I'm always here for you ;)

 

 

 

You and Ammut keep refering back to my youtube channel like it means some thing. I have my reasons why I have the videos on my channel and don't have to explain my reasons to you but I don't promote my channel or a single video I've ever uploaded. I don't because they aren't there for the reason you think they're there. They're not private because I don't care that they're there, other than the reason why I have them there. I have hella tough skin and the least of my worries is a threat outside of my soul. I still love you and Ammut though, you're still my brothers ;)

 

On to the other point of me not talking with ego until someone questioned me, I wasn't questioned; more like antagonized. C'mon Mallo the man said it himself...

 

Step back, step out of your PvP ego and read his first reply and the intent behind it, as if he were responding to you. Don't sit here and tell me that he wasn't being an antagonist. Any neutral party reading his reply, unbiased, can see it. Why do i have to be stroking my own ego? Because I do feel like I'm at the top of my game? Comparing who I am to who I was yesterday? Why can't a man have confidence in himself? Everytime I step into a WZ, what happened in the past is behind and it's about the now and how I can help my team, not be a "Regstar" To be a Regstar is not in my DNA, I stay true to who I am man... http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=536397 I started this thread, it was from 2 1/2 years ago. It's not about being a "Regstar" It's about a new level of competition so we all can grow and experience competitive play. I love you man.

 

Yes, I clearly antagonized you and you clearly fell for it.

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ZooMzy

ZooMzy

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I don't understand you PvPers. You were able to take the OP, a post that was basically an observation and compare type post of generality and literaly twist and turn it into me boasting and bragging about myself. This ability you guys have at doing this is just inconceivable. Step back a moment, get out of your ego and will to prove your knowledge online, and read the post with the intentions it was meant to be in. I know what the best looked like, I know what their tactics looked like, I know what their honor and will to win looked like. Scyn, Wolfbane, DeeDee, Consular, Neo, Tyrosine, Beleg, Darknight (the Jugg) Melyn, Ushanev, Ogclutchbossman, Aubrey, Tughazi, and plenty more I can name of. Look, No lie, I love you guys with all my heart and spirit. No hard feelings towards you and the things you've said to me at all, I love you. But you can't take away the fact that I've seen the best, fought the best, and have victories over the best even with me playing this game straight from a MAcbok pro with its track pad mouse. Say what you want to say, express yourself (that's what the world wants you to believe and do) I love you guys. "I am the wisest man alive for I know one thing, and that is that I know nothing." Socrates

 

Hmm, I'm a little rustier at this than I thought because Mk'dermott was the one who made the ignorant 4v4 comment, not you.

 

I'll agree on the overall population of the server being bad, but I'd like to forum war over the concept of 4v4s not teaching people skill. When it, in fact, does it better than 8v8s ever did. For example:

 

They complain about class balance instead of trying to understand what their class can really do and knowing what their enemy can do.

 

In a queue where every single advantage such as what spec and class you are, you learn this better than the old 8v8s where all you had to worry about were the roles you had and how smart your players were. You don't truly learn class balance in a queue that has no advantage in class balance, where ranked 4s actually give you that. Thus, the game is way better off in teaching the fundamentals than it was back in the 8v8 days.

 

They have no sense of urgency or ability to predict their enemy, for if they successfully defend a cap point they all still remain to get the last kill, compromising their team at the other cap point that's surely under attack by all the respawns.

 

Yet in 8v8s, there is urgency? IIRC, Flux himself complained and whined about how guard swapping shouldn't be a thing because he didn't like how burst damage could actually burst. That he would have to do more than just stand there with a guard on a healer and taunt.

 

The new ranked forces players into a new sense of urgency way better than 8v8s ever did with turtle fests and the one golden game mode, Huttball. I don't even think DPS coordination was existent in ranked as two good burst damage dealers are nowadays

 

They also complain about Players entering Warzones in PvE gear and then the one wearing PvE gear out performs them in the end. The PvPers before understood that if something goes wrong it's not the fault of 1 person for it takes a team to achieve Victory.

 

Lol, no. Back in the day, people whined about your Recruit gear much harder than they do about your PvE gear now. The only difference is that back then, you didn't have bolster and War Hero actually did give you a stupid high advantage in comparison. Nowadays, bolster kind of craps on any argument you can make that you can't actually do something in PvE gear in regs.

 

Overall point, that is directed at any of the try hards here from the good old days that think 8v8s developed players better than 4v4s do, wrong. 8v8s taught nearly nothing in regards to class balance, overall utility you specifically bring to the fight, and how to prepare yourself best for a fight.

 

Sure, that's not what wins you a game. But at the end of the day, a game mode tailored to teaching that concept trumps 8v8s any day of the week when it comes to training the community in how to succeed.

 

The problem, as it's always been, is that the community itself is too casual. No one cares except for the few forum warriors, all enjoying themselves in a text PvP battle for the lulz.

 

Man, it's good to be back.

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RayGonJinn

RayGonJinn

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NAWWW MAN IM DA BEST AT DIS GAME. YALL SUM FAKE *** MUH****HS. COME TO MY CRIB IF YALL WANT A

Thanx for the views tho Mallo, I love you :D but only Family is welcome to the crib for a cut... sorry...

In a queue where every single advantage such as what spec and class you are, you learn this better than the old 8v8s where all you had to worry about were the roles you had and how smart your players were. You don't truly learn class balance in a queue that has no advantage in class balance, where ranked 4s actually give you that. Thus, the game is way better off in teaching the fundamentals than it was back in the 8v8 days.

First off, Welcome back. Here's my detailed take on ranked 8v8s and 4v4s... For 1, premading is not a game mode, so I ultimately believe they should be solo Q only. Back in the day and today, when you know who is Queing before the Queue (which happens because no one Q's without knowing there are players Q'n) You know how to tailor your Ranked team for better efficiency to counter what the opposing team is bringing. So, fundamentals are not learned in a controlled environment. Magneto told Professor to shot him so he could stop the bullet (the controlled environment) but he already knew he could stop the bullet. So he wouldn't learn anything because stopping the bullet wouldn't be challenging. But if the ranked were only solo Q, with the randomness, competency of the players is tested and that's were fundamentals can be learned.

 

Let me also clarify why I brought up old names when it comes to PvP. Sycn wasn't just some regular Guardian, Tyrosine wasn't some regular Assassin, Kronn wasn't just some regular sniper, and so on... The mechanics of the match changes when the top of a class is on your opposing team. You know that your regular plan will not work against master players. That why I named them, not to show how 8V8s can develope a player into a better player.

 

Lol, no. Back in the day, people whined about your Recruit gear much harder than they do about your PvE gear now. The only difference is that back then, you didn't have bolster and War Hero actually did give you a stupid high advantage in comparison. Nowadays, bolster kind of craps on any argument you can make that you can't actually do something in PvE gear in regs.

 

Overall point, that is directed at any of the try hards here from the good old days that think 8v8s developed players better than 4v4s do, wrong. 8v8s taught nearly nothing in regards to class balance, overall utility you specifically bring to the fight, and how to prepare yourself best for a fight.

 

Sure, that's not what wins you a game. But at the end of the day, a game mode tailored to teaching that concept trumps 8v8s any day of the week when it comes to training the community in how to succeed.

 

The problem, as it's always been, is that the community itself is too casual. No one cares except for the few forum warriors, all enjoying themselves in a text PvP battle for the lulz.

 

Man, it's good to be back.

I admit that my OP was a bit of a comlaint but not in the way it was interpreted but that's my fault because I wasn't specific enough. My complaint is that players complain instead of getting better. It's the simple tweeaks the players can make to help get the win. Hell, Rescue/Extraction or Force Pull or Harpoon/Grapple can be used to help a teamate from dining. I see all these Sage/Sorcs around and they aren't Rescuing like they used to. I see all the Vanguard/Powertechs and they aren't pulling like they used to. Objectively those moves can help, especially in huttball. "Okay, I need to intercept Andreus and push him off the ramps before he can pull the ball carrier." "Okay, Wolfbane just used his grapple so I have to hurry and get this ball into the endzone before I'm grappled into Fire or Acid and get this ball stripped from me." That's a form of sense of ungency! I leveled characters back in those days, I had recruit geared toons against the top geared fully augmented. I know the hurt and pain, but I didn't cry about it. I didn't cry about it because I knew I'd get better and geared. All i want is for them to apply themselve instead of wanting things to be given to them. They don't know how better off they'd be if they just endured it and grew through it. All I want is some more effort and style to this PvP **** man, I love you guys.

Edited by RayGonJinn
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