cs_zoltan Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Not really... Their rotation have huge amount of crit.. THey aren't in optimized 198 so I guess they have maybe 400 crit probably less and they have a crit rate I could see in optimized 198 with 650 crit... THey used a high DPS parse and not an average one. The damage from both rotation should end up fairly the same on a dummy. Their rotation falls in heavy movement fight because of the second PS, in AoE fight because of the lack of fillers to spread DoTs efficiently... Otherwise both rotation are equal. Not really, they don't use TD on cd in favor for more PS, which, afaik, is a dps loss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryuku-sama Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Not really, they don't use TD on cd in favor for more PS, which, afaik, is a dps loss. And not a small one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BreakingNews Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Using TD on cd would result in overheating. In the general rotation, the power shot that uses stb and the power shot right after ss, are used to proc ipa. Generally, the power shot or rapid shot used after the hard casted power shot to proc ipa, is dependent on your resources. If you can get supercharged and still have heat to fit in td after unload, you can generally do ps>ps>ms>ul>td. However, if the 2nd power shot would put you over 40 heat when you used td, you would replace it with rapid shot instead. The rotation attempts to fit in td when heat permits it, and td will also be off cd by the time you would use it again, once again if heat permits it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryuku-sama Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Using TD on cd would result in overheating. In the general rotation, the power shot that uses stb and the power shot right after ss, are used to proc ipa. Generally, the power shot or rapid shot used after the hard casted power shot to proc ipa, is dependent on your resources. If you can get supercharged and still have heat to fit in td after unload, you can generally do ps>ps>ms>ul>td. However, if the 2nd power shot would put you over 40 heat when you used td, you would replace it with rapid shot instead. The rotation attempts to fit in td when heat permits it, and td will also be off cd by the time you would use it again, once again if heat permits it. It doesn't if you use Unload to proc the second IPA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RookB Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Here's what I came up with optimized 198 gear using the simulator. It's fairly close to what others have stated. http://imgur.com/a/uCLbk I was able to identify another "peak" in gear with about 532 Alacrity. It's about the same DPS, but once I adjusted the sequence of attacks, the other gear above came out slightly ahead. http://imgur.com/a/A1rY6 I'm still working the details out on this, but I doubt it will be the one above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BreakingNews Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 It doesn't if you use Unload to proc the second IPA. it isn't though..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BreakingNews Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Here's what I came up with optimized 198 gear using the simulator. It's fairly close to what others have stated. http://imgur.com/a/uCLbk I was able to identify another "peak" in gear with about 532 Alacrity. It's about the same DPS, but once I adjusted the sequence of attacks, the other gear above came out slightly ahead. http://imgur.com/a/A1rY6 I'm still working the details out on this, but I doubt it will be the one above. and holy **** that math simulator 2014 is pretty cool Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TACeMossie Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 I was gonna ask if the maths was using the real method to calculate execute DPS, but then I checked and its a simulator so its all good. WHAT I MEAN BY REAL METHOD 0.7x Normal DPS + 0.3 x Execute DPS is not only lazy, but also wrong. e.g. 90 second parse, 2k normal DPS, 3k execute DPS Damage Dealt: 207k using above method Expected HP remaining for Execute: 62.1k HP remaining with above method's execute: 81k Now for the method that is accurate! DPS = 10 / ( ( 7 / Normal DPS ) + ( 3 / Execute DPS ) ) Same 90 second parse, only this time its 200k damage done - 90 x 10 / (7/2k + 3/3k) becomes 90 x 10/(9/2k), or 200k. The execute starts properly at 30% hp remaining, and you get the Real expected DPS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryuku-sama Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 (edited) I was gonna ask if the maths was using the real method to calculate execute DPS, but then I checked and its a simulator so its all good. WHAT I MEAN BY REAL METHOD 0.7x Normal DPS + 0.3 x Execute DPS is not only lazy, but also wrong. e.g. 90 second parse, 2k normal DPS, 3k execute DPS Damage Dealt: 207k using above method Expected HP remaining for Execute: 62.1k HP remaining with above method's execute: 81k Now for the method that is accurate! DPS = 10 / ( ( 7 / Normal DPS ) + ( 3 / Execute DPS ) ) Same 90 second parse, only this time its 200k damage done - 90 x 10 / (7/2k + 3/3k) becomes 90 x 10/(9/2k), or 200k. The execute starts properly at 30% hp remaining, and you get the Real expected DPS Thank for the correction.. Was too lazy to think after having recalculated all the coefficients... Well we end up with an average of 4932 DPS with all the approximations I did in my model... So probably 5050-5150 for a real average parse. Edited December 23, 2014 by Ryuku-sama Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peachbrah Posted December 27, 2014 Share Posted December 27, 2014 (edited) have hit 5k a few times with 31-32% crit using a slightly modified version of this rotation in bis sm warrior gear minus left side except for implants. think this rotation is as viable as mari and fascs. it flows smoother for me anyway but idk Edited December 27, 2014 by Peachbrah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiaowZedong Posted December 27, 2014 Share Posted December 27, 2014 For Advanced Targeting... You have crit% chance to trigger it. Assuming 25% crit chance, it means you will proc it before it ends in 1-0.75^4 = 68% Not really enough to be a 100% uptime... if you consider 12s and 8 GCD's, you get to 89% chance to proc it... So I would probably say it looks more like a 70-80% uptime depending on your luck... With DoTs, Rapid Shots used occasionally and off-hand hits on many skils, you have many chances to proc it per GCD. This accounts for the near 100% uptimes noticed in game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MegaLifeMan Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 What's needed crit rating for IO?Dulfy says it is 400+ but i have 500.Is it more than needed or what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryuku-sama Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 (edited) What's needed crit rating for IO?Dulfy says it is 400+ but i have 500.Is it more than needed or what? 650 is BiS with main Stat augs. EDIT : And 120 alacrity. Edited January 7, 2015 by Ryuku-sama Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ardarell_Solo Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 650 is BiS with main Stat augs. EDIT : And 120 alacrity. 650? Are you sure? I'm seeing a decrease in DPS once I go over 450 - but I'm still in a mix of 192-186-180, so that might change things. Which different Crit ratings have you tested and how did you come to the conclusion 650 is BIS? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spudik Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 650 is meant in min maxed 198s. If u go couple pages back u can see Ryukus post which suggest spending about 25% of your crit/power budget on crit rest in power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryuku-sama Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 (edited) 650 is meant in min maxed 198s. If u go couple pages back u can see Ryukus post which suggest spending about 25% of your crit/power budget on crit rest in power. Min max 198, with correct Surge/Alac balance. It's a lot but as a IO Merc you have almost 100% uptime on your surge bonus... And the higher the crit, the higher the uptime will be. You have about 1.1 crit multiplier on your main abilities. Way above the other classes. 650? Are you sure? I'm seeing a decrease in DPS once I go over 450 - but I'm still in a mix of 192-186-180, so that might change things. Which different Crit ratings have you tested and how did you come to the conclusion 650 is BIS? I tested everything via a model I built (took me ages figure out everything and make sure I didn't forget anything) and since I have no skill whatsover in coding, I tested al crit between 0 and 1000 rating for every possible enhancements possiblities (so 0-120-240-360-480 alac vs 480-360-240-120-0 surge) with main stat augs. I then tested it with power/crit augs and from 0 to 1000.... The higher was 650 crit main stat augs 120 alac with a perfectly average DPS (Zorz parse is way too high for their gear.. Insane crit rate and over average damage ) of 5113.203 Edited January 7, 2015 by Ryuku-sama Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MegaLifeMan Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 What if i am have 650 crit with power augments and 120 alacrity?How many dps i am lost? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryuku-sama Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 (edited) What if i am have 650 crit with power augments and 120 alacrity?How many dps i am lost? About 12 DPS. Edited January 8, 2015 by Ryuku-sama Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ardarell_Solo Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 I tested everything via a model I built (took me ages figure out everything and make sure I didn't forget anything) and since I have no skill whatsover in coding, I tested al crit between 0 and 1000 rating for every possible enhancements possiblities (so 0-120-240-360-480 alac vs 480-360-240-120-0 surge) with main stat augs. I then tested it with power/crit augs and from 0 to 1000.... The higher was 650 crit main stat augs 120 alac with a perfectly average DPS (Zorz parse is way too high for their gear.. Insane crit rate and over average damage ) of 5113.203 Thanks for the info. I tried going to 600 Crit, but found that it does only work better if I have 300ish Surge and no Alacrity. But I'd have to get better gear to really know. Generally it seems logical you'd want your Surge near soft cap (which I believe is sth like 300) if you use that much Crit. I suspect it only makes sense to work in Alacrity, once you get near Surge soft cap with only 2 slots, so you have one slot open for Alacrity. And that's probably only the case in full 198, which I'm miles away from. Good food for thought either way, so thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryuku-sama Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 Thanks for the info. I tried going to 600 Crit, but found that it does only work better if I have 300ish Surge and no Alacrity. But I'd have to get better gear to really know. Generally it seems logical you'd want your Surge near soft cap (which I believe is sth like 300) if you use that much Crit. I suspect it only makes sense to work in Alacrity, once you get near Surge soft cap with only 2 slots, so you have one slot open for Alacrity. And that's probably only the case in full 198, which I'm miles away from. Good food for thought either way, so thanks! Eh?? You have four slots for Surge/Alac in 198. You use 6 Accuracy and 4 Surge/Alac + 1 Accuracy augment. The later isn't really needed. I prefer prefer having it and being over the cap, but using 14 main stat augments instead of 13 is a 7 DPS increase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ardarell_Solo Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 Eh?? You have four slots for Surge/Alac in 198. You use 6 Accuracy and 4 Surge/Alac + 1 Accuracy augment. The later isn't really needed. I prefer prefer having it and being over the cap, but using 14 main stat augments instead of 13 is a 7 DPS increase. Right, totally forgot about that: I just dropped the eighth piece of accuracy, since I hadn't focussed on my Commando for Dread Ops, so he had many 180 enhancements, which meant I had to use 8 slots of accuracy first. So now I'm at 7, and yeah, in 198s you'd obviously go for 6 only. I'm with you on the additional augment then, for I always want my DPS toons at full accuracy. Right now I'm sitting at 4450 DPS in a wild mix of 192s, 186s and still a few 180s with 13 new mainstat augments (still can't bring myself to augment that last 180s implant ;-) But it's very nice to know which stats to aim for while gearing up, as I will focus on my Commando a bit more than before... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MegaLifeMan Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 Is sorc in lighting have more burst, than merc in IO?so best 3 slots surge 1 alacrity, another in accuracy.And where u get information about Zorz stats?Marisi's log done with 650 crit rating? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryuku-sama Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 Is sorc in lighting have more burst, than merc in IO?so best 3 slots surge 1 alacrity, another in accuracy.And where u get information about Zorz stats?Marisi's log done with 650 crit rating? Marisi's parse was done in 192 yet the parse shows way higher damage.. What would be expected in a good 198 parse. They used a record parse for their guide and not an average one. And I know nothing more about Zorz stats but I doubt they would have gone to 650 crit since in their guild they advice to go over 400 nothing more. My 650 comes from maths and models. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pagy Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 Min max 198, with correct Surge/Alac balance. It's a lot but as a IO Merc you have almost 100% uptime on your surge bonus... And the higher the crit, the higher the uptime will be. You have about 1.1 crit multiplier on your main abilities. Way above the other classes. I tested everything via a model I built (took me ages figure out everything and make sure I didn't forget anything) and since I have no skill whatsover in coding, I tested al crit between 0 and 1000 rating for every possible enhancements possiblities (so 0-120-240-360-480 alac vs 480-360-240-120-0 surge) with main stat augs. I then tested it with power/crit augs and from 0 to 1000.... The higher was 650 crit main stat augs 120 alac with a perfectly average DPS (Zorz parse is way too high for their gear.. Insane crit rate and over average damage ) of 5113.203to confirm then you have 360 surge, 120 alacrity then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryuku-sama Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 to confirm then you have 360 surge, 120 alacrity then? Yup. Remember this is only in 198. In 192, forget the alacrity and go for surge/accuracy only. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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