[Accuracy 3.0] It's time to say something!!

[IInox]

so BW..I'm not the only one to read this:

 

"Accuracy Rating grants more Accuracy per point."

 

as a BUFF to the formula accuracy without taking into account the change lvl (55 to 60) on it..because it is not a buff.

 

So..do you want to fix this accuracy rating (I say Fix because if u said that accuracy will grant more accuracy bonus..the actual accuracy is bugged) or not? Can you tell something pls?

 

Thanks in advice

[azudelphi]

so BW..I'm not the only one to read this:

 

"Accuracy Rating grants more Accuracy per point."

 

as a BUFF to the formula accuracy without taking into account the change lvl (55 to 60) on it..because it is not a buff.

 

So..do you want to fix this accuracy rating (I say Fix because if u said that accuracy will grant more accuracy bonus..the actual accuracy is bugged) or not? Can you tell something pls?

 

Thanks in advice

 

Check out the Bug Reports forums. They are looking into it.

 

Edit: Added link because I am swell.

Accuracy Raiting post 3.0

Edited December 11, 2014 by azudelphi

[Brewski]

You mean like this?

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=7868876#post7868876

 

They are looking into it, meaning we'll get an answer one way or the other eventually.

[Andryah]

Where exactly did they quantify what "more" actually means?

 

You should focus your request for comment from Bioware on getting them to quantify what they meant by the statement + is it working as intended.

 

Why? Because them saying "more" is an invitation to players do self-define what they want "more" to mean. In other words, using vague statements like "more" is inviting players to decide what they think it means or they want it to mean.. and then raging in the forum about it not meeting their expectations management.

 

Vague statements by the devs encourages bad expectation management on the part of players. Sad, IMO, but true.

Edited December 11, 2014 by Andryah

[azudelphi]

Where exactly did they quantify what "more" actually means?

 

You should focus your request for comment from Bioware on getting them to quantify what they meant by the statement + is it working as intended.

 

Why? Because them saying "more" is an invitation to players do self-define what they want "more" to mean. In other words, using vague statements like "more" is inviting players to decide what they think it means or they want it to mean.. and then raging in the forum about it not meeting their expectations management.

 

Vague statements by the devs encourages bad expectation management on the part of players.

 

In the Combat Mechanics live stream they did make mention that in light of removing +% accuracy from the skill trees during the transition to Disciplines that they were intending to increase the %/point of accuracy; though if I recall correctly they did also imply you would still need more Accuracy Rating to reach 100%.

 

Granted, anything said prior to the official launch of the patch is subject to change.

 

Either way, they're checking into that % / point ratio and we will find out if the current ratios are as intended or not.

Edited December 11, 2014 by azudelphi

[IInox]

oh sorry guys..didin't see :\

 

Btw just to return it as pre 3.0 4/5 pieces accuracy + x augments (or better..not because it's..awful to see) = 100% and bye bye

Edited December 11, 2014 by IInox

[Andrellma]

Check the Dev tracker.

 

Working as intended.

[Brewski]

Check the Dev tracker.

 

Working as intended.

 

Right. To quote my post in the other thread...

 

The results are in. After internal reviews they decided to leave accuracy as it was prior to 3.0, and have no plans to change it in the immediate future.

 

I know this is going to cause a lot of QQ, but personally I'm okay with the numbers as they are for now. It will make DPSing a bit more challenging, which is, after all, part of what they were going for.

 

I'm just glad to have it answered for sure so I can get to serious gearing.

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=7869767#edit7869767

 

Hey everyone,

 

I heard back from the Combat team, and Accuracy is right where it should be. The Accuracy change (more Accuracy Rating granting more Accuracy per point) that was mentioned on the Global Combat livestream and in the Patch Notes never ended up going out. Following internal testing, the team decided to not implement the change as they were happy with where it was when using high end level 60 gear.

 

With that being said, we are happy with DPS numbers as they are right now and therefore have no plans currently to adjust Accuracy. As always we will continue to monitor DPS and will make changes as needed.

[Andryah]

Right. To quote my post in the other thread...

 

The results are in. After internal reviews they decided to leave accuracy as it was prior to 3.0, and have no plans to change it in the immediate future.

 

I know this is going to cause a lot of QQ, but personally I'm okay with the numbers as they are for now. It will make DPSing a bit more challenging, which is, after all, part of what they were going for.

 

I'm just glad to have it answered for sure so I can get to serious gearing.

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=7869767#edit7869767

 

Well, that settles that then.

 

Certainly not the end of the world by any means.

 

In fairness though.. they should have volunteered this inside the patch notes.. not wait for complaints to then come out and say that they never actually included a per-point accuracy boost in 3.0-live.

Edited December 11, 2014 by Andryah

[btmart]

So the question is where are we supposed to cram in alacrity, as they intend? Looking at probably 5 accuracy augments just to make up for accuracy. Ideally I'd have all main stat after gearing properly. So sacrifice main stat? That doesn't seem like a good idea.

[Andryah]

So the question is where are we supposed to cram in alacrity, as they intend? Looking at probably 5 accuracy augments just to make up for accuracy. Ideally I'd have all main stat after gearing properly. So sacrifice main stat? That doesn't seem like a good idea.

 

The point is... main stat, crit, surge, accuracy and alacrity all contribute to DPS (over time.. not instantaneous DPS). So, you have to decide what ratio you personally wish to apply with the available mod slots.

 

Clearly they have a DPS budget they work to when setting itemization... and NO.. you cannot have it all. That's the point.

Edited December 11, 2014 by Andryah

[Nitblade]

Well, that settles that then.

 

Certainly not the end of the world by any means.

 

In fairness though.. they should have volunteered this inside the patch notes.. not wait for complaints to then come out and say that they never actually included a per-point accuracy boost in 3.0-live.

 

/sarcasm

Boss: Guys, what's up with the accuracy buff in 3.0

Minion: We never actually implemented it. Should we?

Boss: Nah! It'll be fine as is. We'll just say it's working as intended.

/sarcasm off

 

But seriously we shouldn't have to badger them endlessly to know what's going on with Released Content and what they decide to pull out without notice.

[xBenouze]

http://dulfy.net/2014/12/11/swtorno-accuracy-rating-change-with-3-0/

 

Seriously ! We'll need 7/10 accuracy enhancements + 1 or 2 augments *** !!

Plus you want us to stack accuracy but not a lot of pieces have accuracy on it, i don't really understand, is BW going dumb or what ?

We'll end up with 60/62 % surge, 0 alacrity (which you claim you improved to be more useful but you make it so we can't use it ?!)

You say it will be ok with high end game gear (NiM Ops), so you mean you do it to satisfy 5% of the playerbase (closer to 1% even i think) ...

Edited December 11, 2014 by xBenouze

[DVLots]

I'd be really interested in getting some of those numbers. Were they tested using full 100% accuracy with severely less on main stat/power/surge

 

DVLOTS

[Pagy]

ok so another great aspect of this launch, lets go down the list

 

-tiny content patch and calling it an expansion with a bad story

-advertising class missions that turn out to last five minutes

-unplayable ability lag

-unbeatable last boss

-ripping off countless preorder customers by removing training costs hours after telling them it was intended to be that way

-lying about accuracy changes and not confirming it for over a week

-invalidating alacrity for the umpteenth time by not adjust accuracy

 

way to nail that coffin closed bioware

Edited December 11, 2014 by Pagy

[Jawsers]

The point is... main stat, crit, surge, accuracy and alacrity all contribute to DPS (over time.. not instantaneous DPS). So, you have to decide what ratio you personally wish to apply with the available mod slots.

 

So, what you are saying is just fill your mod slots with whatever stats you feel like because they all contributed the same to damage over time.

[Pagy]

The point is... main stat, crit, surge, accuracy and alacrity all contribute to DPS (over time.. not instantaneous DPS). So, you have to decide what ratio you personally wish to apply with the available mod slots.

 

Clearly they have a DPS budget they work to when setting itemization... and NO.. you cannot have it all. That's the point.

andryah usually i enjoy your bw apologizing in the face of countless entitled whiners, but this isnt a matter of choice its a math equation.

 

i exaggerated by saying alacrity is worthless, but it comes at a great cost either to surge or accuracy.

 

its not like you can use equal ststs for all and yield the same result...accuracy must be 100% for best results.

[Andryah]

So, what you are saying is just fill your mod slots with whatever stats you feel like because they all contributed the same to damage over time.

 

NO... that is not what I said. Not even close. I'm sure every secondary stat has a diminishing returns curve to it.

 

If you want to draw conclusions from my comments... conclude that they do NOT want you to have every stat maxed out. They want you to have to make choices.

 

Different players are going to put higher priority on different secondary stats. Some see accuracy as king. Some will want higher alacrity and will drop accuracy to get it. Etc. etc. etc.

[Andryah]

andryah usually i enjoy your bw apologizing in the face of countless entitled whiners, but this isnt a matter of choice its a math equation.

 

i exaggerated by saying alacrity is worthless, but it comes at a great cost either to surge or accuracy.

 

its not like you can use equal ststs for all and yield the same result...accuracy must be 100% for best results.

 

Prove it. show us combat logs that compare the trade-offs. By the way.. that is a heck of a lot of work to come to a conclusion that max anything in the form of secondary stats is less then optimal.. so NO.. I'm not demanding you do the log work... it would require hundreds of runs to remove /random effects.

 

Are you trying to say that if you have 98% accuracy instead of 100% and use the extra slots for surge, crit, or alacrity that you will fail on your DPS during a full fight sequence? If I get 3% more total damage from other stats during a 1 minute fight, with 98% accuracy... I'll take the 3% more total.

 

Accuracy has importance.. but it is not the DPS silver bullet. Never has been. Never will be.

 

I get that some people would prefer that their attacks never miss. But that does not mean it is the optimal DPS pathway. And.. if you are going to be exclusively doing high end OPs.. you slot differently then for other types of play. If you have to boost accuracy for boss encounters.. then that is what you do. But there is a lot of play styles in this game that are not boss fights.

 

That said... we are in the min/maxers space now... arguing over a few percentage points here and there. Such discussions are never resolved.

Edited December 12, 2014 by Andryah

[Aletheos]

http://dulfy.net/2014/12/11/swtorno-accuracy-rating-change-with-3-0/

 

Seriously ! We'll need 7/10 accuracy enhancements + 1 or 2 augments *** !!

Plus you want us to stack accuracy but not a lot of pieces have accuracy on it, i don't really understand, is BW going dumb or what ?

 

No need to be rude. They are not suffering from a grey cell depletion. The are just giving you the middle finger. Be a man, get over it.:-)

[Khevar]

If you're not going into an operation, going 100/110 accuracy is probably a waste of time.

 

But if you ARE, then it's a really tough call to trade away accuracy for more surge/alacrity.

 

- Missing on a hard-hitting ability is going to hurt you a lot more than missing on a low-hitting one.

- Missing on an ability needed for a proc can throw off your rotation/priority list.

- Missing on an interrupt could wipe the group.

 

It's all fine and dandy to say things like "go through combat logs and prove that 100% accuracy is needed for best results". But really, that's missing the forest for the trees.

 

The reason for 100/110 accuracy on an ops boss is to lessen the chance of RNG throwing a wrench into the fight.

Edited December 12, 2014 by Khevar

[Ryuku-sama]

Prove it. show us combat logs that compare the trade-offs. By the way.. that is a heck of a lot of work to come to a conclusion that max anything in the form of secondary stats is less then optimal.. so NO.. I'm not demanding you do the log work... it would require hundreds of runs to remove /random effects.

 

Are you trying to say that if you have 98% accuracy instead of 100% and use the extra slots for surge, crit, or alacrity that you will fail on your DPS during a full fight sequence? If I get 3% more total damage from other stats during a 1 minute fight, with 98% accuracy... I'll take the 3% more total.

 

Accuracy has importance.. but it is not the DPS silver bullet. Never has been. Never will be.

 

I get that some people would prefer that their attacks never miss. But that does not mean it is the optimal DPS pathway. And.. if you are going to be exclusively doing high end OPs.. you slot differently then for other types of play. If you have to boost accuracy for boss encounters.. then that is what you do. But there is a lot of play styles in this game that are not boss fights.

 

That said... we are in the min/maxers space now... arguing over a few percentage points here and there. Such discussions are never resolved.

 

Problem isn't in the total DPS. On a dummy, yes being at 95, 98,99 isn't THAT bad. In front of the boss, it's another story. Tight burn phases where a single miss on a key ability can put you under he DPS target and wipe you. Interrupts you mustn't miss less wiping hard. They do exist.

 

In front of a dummy you may be right. In front of a boss, without 100/110 accuracy you are opening room to RNG wipes... And no one wants to wipe because of some bad luck. You need your accuracy to avoid them, not to have a high DPS.. Just not to wipe stupidly.

[Andryah]

If you're not going into an operation, going 100/110 accuracy is probably a waste of time.

 

But if you ARE, then it's a really tough call to trade away accuracy for more surge/alacrity.

 

- Missing on a hard-hitting ability is going to hurt you a lot more than missing on a low-hitting one.

- Missing on an ability needed for a proc can throw off your rotation/priority list.

- Missing on an interrupt could wipe the group.

 

It's all fine and dandy to say things like "go through combat logs and prove that 100% accuracy is needed for best results". But really, that's missing the forest for the trees.

 

The reason for 100/110 accuracy on an ops boss is to lessen the chance of RNG throwing a wrench into the fight.

 

100% agree. You need predictability more then damage surges for Ops.

Edited December 12, 2014 by Andryah

[Andryah]

Problem isn't in the total DPS. On a dummy, yes being at 95, 98,99 isn't THAT bad. In front of the boss, it's another story. Tight burn phases where a single miss on a key ability can put you under he DPS target and wipe you. Interrupts you mustn't miss less wiping hard. They do exist.

 

In front of a dummy you may be right. In front of a boss, without 100/110 accuracy you are opening room to RNG wipes... And no one wants to wipe because of some bad luck. You need your accuracy to avoid them, not to have a high DPS.. Just not to wipe stupidly.

 

I stated this in my post you responded to. Perhaps I was not clear enough in my comments. So there is no disagreement about Ops bosses (from me, anyway). But Ops and the Ops bosses are NOT what the majority of players are facing because only a small fraction of the playerbase does OPs as a preferred play style.

 

See. the problem with stating that accuracy must be 100/110 is that it is a limited context (ie: Ops bosses, or perhaps other bosses if someone is into grouping to farm bosses).

 

As it stands.... (and likely will always be the case)... we as players must make conscious choices as to what secondary stats we load on our characters, because they don't give us enough utility budget on a character to max out multiple secondary stats. There is no right answer for every circumstance.

 

Now, it would be nice if Bioware would publish curves (or tables) for each secondarys stat so that we can sit down and calculate a stat outcome target for our characters. Of course they don't make it that easy for us though. Happily, there are always some good theory crafters available that like to do the leg work to figure out what the basis per-point is and what the slope to diminishing returns is.

 

This over-fixation on accuracy, IMO, is a strawman position, based on Ops requirements = the only play style that matters.

Edited December 12, 2014 by Andryah

[Jawsers]

Are you trying to say that if you have 98% accuracy instead of 100% and use the extra slots for surge, crit, or alacrity that you will fail on your DPS during a full fight sequence? If I get 3% more total damage from other stats during a 1 minute fight, with 98% accuracy... I'll take the 3% more total.

 

Do you know for sure that you will get 3%, or is that just a number you pulled out of the air? How do you know you will do more as well? It's possible you could do less.

 

Accuracy has importance.. but it is not the DPS silver bullet. Never has been. Never will be.

Tsk tsk, absolutes.

 

I get that some people would prefer that their attacks never miss. But that does not mean it is the optimal DPS pathway. And.. if you are going to be exclusively doing high end OPs.. you slot differently then for other types of play. If you have to boost accuracy for boss encounters.. then that is what you do. But there is a lot of play styles in this game that are not boss fights.

 

In a raid setting you want accuracy. It is most optimal in a raid setting because it removes the RNG in a DPS check. Sure it is possible you may do more damage, but it is possible to miss some attacks. That is a type of variability you don't want in a raid.

 

And I'm fairly certain that those who posted wondering about if the rating was intended or not, are raiders.

 

That said... we are in the min/maxers space now... arguing over a few percentage points here and there. Such discussions are never resolved.

 

Oh boy, a potshot and another absolute.