Cordarn Posted November 5, 2014 Author Share Posted November 5, 2014 Sure there was, stop shooting. Look the GCD is more than a second, there is no advantage to pressing buttons that fast, slow down. The fact that my ability was already activated for the kill shot seems to allude you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cordarn Posted November 5, 2014 Author Share Posted November 5, 2014 I would say a 0.5s window is fairly small, when you consider that the griefer has to kill the target between your press and 0.5s when the press is registered, and again, only applies if you're using instant activation abilities, as anything with an activation timer can be canceled or will fizzle if the target dies before it's finished. While I'm not saying it's not possible, the timing is quite precise and the entire thing can be avoided by toggling the auto target anyways. What you just described happened to be my scenario, and if anyone is wondering I did use an instant skill (laceration to be exact.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ikinai Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 What you just described happened to be my scenario, and if anyone is wondering I did use an instant skill (laceration to be exact.) And how often does this happen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivanhedgehog Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 I am a raider on a PVE server. Every now and then if I see someone flagged for PVP, I choose to take a chance to take them down. If I win, I am happy. If I lose, I get on with my life. I recommend the people throwing the term "griefer" around incorrectly do the same. if they are flagged, thats fine. I am talking about a way for pvpers to show that they are a community(and a large one) and possibly get projects aimed at them greater priority. if one of the pvp servers has a thriving, active membership, the devs will be much more inclined to push content their way. This is not a snarky comment. its a suggestion of how to leverage influence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cordarn Posted November 5, 2014 Author Share Posted November 5, 2014 And how often does this happen? First time for me in awhile, but its happened to friends. Ive watched. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ikinai Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 First time for me in awhile, but its happened to friends. Ive watched. Strange, it's never happened to me, guess I'm just lucky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danw Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 (edited) While all the PvPers on PvE servers talk loudly about not changing the PvP flag mechanics, they need to be ignored, if you want open world PvP go play on PvP server (if they can), that's why they exist. Flagging (in open world) should ONLY be possible (on PvE server) if the player MANUALLY flags, there should be NO OTHER WAY. (by manual I mean click portrait and click flag for pvp) Only people who want to grief would object to this. These are the same people who can't cut it on a PvP server in the first place. Edited November 5, 2014 by Danw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ikinai Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 While all the PvPers on PvE servers talk loudly about not changing the PvP flag mechanics, they need to be ignored, if you want open world PvP go play on PvP server (if they can), that's why they exist. Flagging (in open world) should ONLY be possible (on PvE server) if the player MANUALLY flags, there should be NO OTHER WAY. Only people who want to grief would object to this. These are the same people who can't cut it on a PvP server in the first place. As a non-PvPer I disagree. I play on RP servers almost exclusively and I see no reason to change it. I have never been griefed by PvPers, so maybe I just don't understand the issue. but then again, I am fairly cautious about what I do in game and am aware of my surroundings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 While all the PvPers on PvE servers talk loudly about not changing the PvP flag mechanics, they need to be ignored, if you want open world PvP go play on PvP server (if they can), that's why they exist. Flagging (in open world) should ONLY be possible (on PvE server) if the player MANUALLY flags, there should be NO OTHER WAY. Only people who want to grief would object to this. These are the same people who can't cut it on a PvP server in the first place. By attacking a flagged player, you have consented to PvP. Stop being a lazy player and pay attention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivanhedgehog Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 It prevents you from quickly flagging. So maybe you don't typically PvP, but you come across someone on your faction being attacked and choose to help them. Instead of simply being able to heal them or attack/CC the enemy, you have to turn your flag on and then begin. Which could mean your ally dies before you hop in. Honestly, you should have your auto target turned off or the chances of accidentally aggroing nearby mobs while questing or in ops/FPs is too high. The fact that it helps prevent you from accidentally flagging in PvP is an added bonus. honestly, you should have your pvp flag turned on to you can heroicly rescue some othe poor pvper. that simple change would not change your gameplay at all and eliminate any inconvenience of having to flag yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azudelphi Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 honestly, you should have your pvp flag turned on to you can heroicly rescue some othe poor pvper. that simple change would not change your gameplay at all and eliminate any inconvenience of having to flag yourself. This doesn't make sense. You should turn your flag on so you don't have to be inconvenienced by turning your flag on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azudelphi Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 (edited) While all the PvPers on PvE servers talk loudly about not changing the PvP flag mechanics, they need to be ignored, if you want open world PvP go play on PvP server (if they can), that's why they exist. Flagging (in open world) should ONLY be possible (on PvE server) if the player MANUALLY flags, there should be NO OTHER WAY. Only people who want to grief would object to this. These are the same people who can't cut it on a PvP server in the first place. False. Being able to pre-cast on flagged targets intentionally is tactically advantageous. As a PVE'er myself who dabbles with PVP, I refuse to be cast as someone who needs to go to a PVP server so that you can feel invulnerable to your own errors. The only change that seems reasonable is disabling auto-target from switching to yellow targets. Because yes, I see the last second kill similar to the old "run into aoes" that have been fixed. Edited November 5, 2014 by azudelphi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jadescythe Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 honestly, you should have your pvp flag turned on to you can heroicly rescue some othe poor pvper. that simple change would not change your gameplay at all and eliminate any inconvenience of having to flag yourself. Just because you choose to help someone being attacked by flagging, doesn't mean you want to be flagged at all times. I don't feel like you even read/understood what I posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivanhedgehog Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 This doesn't make sense. You should turn your flag on so you don't have to be inconvenienced by turning your flag on? if they were to make you only flag if you manually flagged. you claimed that the delay might stop you from saving a same faction player in a tough pvp fight because it would slow you down. if you stay flagged all the time, there will be no delay. they could make the change and not inconvenience anyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HammerOneOne Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 To be fair, based on the OP's scenario, it sounds as though the GCD had basically just cleared and the instant of pressing the ability was fractions of a second after the mob had died and the flagged player became target-able. I'm going to say that in this instance, predicting that in <.5 seconds the mob you are attacking is no longer going to be there and a flagged player will be there is a bit of an unrealistic expectation. High APM is fairly common for PVE, so I see nothing wrong with preparing for the GCD to complete. The issue here has been a lack of knowledge that the auto-target was able to be turned off; highly recommended in high traffic cross-faction areas. OP's "mistake" was having it on, not preparing for the GCD to clear. He's not interested in being fair. Fair would be saying that the fault is 90/10. Fair would saying the OP was griefed and wrong but the OP could have (in his own best interest) avoided the entire by disabling auto target. But what he clearly is saying is that the OP was wrong and was blatantly button mashing and the griefer has no fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivanhedgehog Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 False. Being able to pre-cast on flagged targets intentionally is tactically advantageous. As a PVE'er myself who dabbles with PVP, I refuse to be cast as someone who needs to go to a PVP server so that you can feel invulnerable to your own errors. The only change that seems reasonable is disabling auto-target from switching to yellow targets. Because yes, I see the last second kill similar to the old "run into aoes" that have been fixed. precasting is cheating. shame on you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivanhedgehog Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Just because you choose to help someone being attacked by flagging, doesn't mean you want to be flagged at all times. I don't feel like you even read/understood what I posted. so you want me to change my targeting options all the time but wont change yours at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azudelphi Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 if they were to make you only flag if you manually flagged. you claimed that the delay might stop you from saving a same faction player in a tough pvp fight because it would slow you down. if you stay flagged all the time, there will be no delay. they could make the change and not inconvenience anyone. Or... you can leave the system as it is, and let someone target their ally or their enemy and throw attacks from an unflagged state, becoming flagged at first heal / damage dealt... which seems to make more sense than, "Well, if you think you might see PVP at some point during your travels, always be flagged." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azudelphi Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 (edited) precasting is cheating. shame on you That's absurd. First strike opportunities are tactical, not cheating... Edited November 5, 2014 by azudelphi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivanhedgehog Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Or... you can leave the system as it is, and let someone target their ally or their enemy and throw attacks from an unflagged state, becoming flagged at first heal / damage dealt... which seems to make more sense than, "Well, if you think you might see PVP at some point during your travels, always be flagged." are you saying you only pvp when you have an unfair advantage? attacking when you clearly arent flagged? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jadescythe Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 so you want me to change my targeting options all the time but wont change yours at all? I don't understand what you're trying to say here. By targeting options are you referring to auto target or what players you can attack? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azudelphi Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 are you saying you only pvp when you have an unfair advantage? attacking when you clearly arent flagged? Do you have any better argument than, "How do you play?" I rarely open world PVP, but I will humor you: If I am flagged, I know I am vulnerable to a surprise attack. In fact, I become paranoid about stealthers who can get first strike on me (attacking when you clearly aren't visible?!?). So if I see someone and think I can get an advantage by hitting them first, yes... I'll take it because I expect the same of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HammerOneOne Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 While all the PvPers on PvE servers talk loudly about not changing the PvP flag mechanics, they need to be ignored, if you want open world PvP go play on PvP server (if they can), that's why they exist. Flagging (in open world) should ONLY be possible (on PvE server) if the player MANUALLY flags, there should be NO OTHER WAY. (by manual I mean click portrait and click flag for pvp) Only people who want to grief would object to this. These are the same people who can't cut it on a PvP server in the first place. In fairness the system is in place to keep a non flagged person from assisting a flagged player and remaining untouchable. Apparently griefing a PvP is not acceptable but it's just part of the game if it's done to someone that's solely PvE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanNV Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 And how often does this happen? Fairly often is the number of times I see a ranged DPS shoot a mod they didn't intend to is any indication. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ikinai Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Do you have any better argument than, "How do you play?" I rarely open world PVP, but I will humor you: If I am flagged, I know I am vulnerable to a surprise attack. In fact, I become paranoid about stealthers who can get first strike on me (attacking when you clearly aren't visible?!?). So if I see someone and think I can get an advantage by hitting them first, yes... I'll take it because I expect the same of them. Didn't you know it's only fair play to line up against each other and count to three and then shoot at each other? Tactical advantage is for weaklings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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