t-darko Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 GSF is currently the place to be if you wanna get severely ganked and hardcore Spawncamped, not always but far to often for it to be oK ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asbetos Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 Yet another one... You have 3 spawn points which are selected randomly whenever you respawn. In my 2000+ games I haven't seen all 3 get camped even once, sooo... It's your own damn fault if you get camped. P.S. Next time read the forums before you post, there have been several threads like this recently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bolo_Yeung Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 This happens if one team is severely weaker.... few solutions are: - In TDM - use a different spawnpoint. Try to coordinate your actions with teammates (for instance "I am using south spawn, lets all go there and sneak behind". If any enemies are present, boost AS SOON AS YOU CAN, dont fly in straight line. If theres 1 enemy ship watching - concentrate fire. and kill, If 3-4 ships cant kill enemy ship - well... its like going in PvE gear into warzone and expecting winning. Also, group up. Much people say premades are overpowered. That is true, so... make your own premade. Even without voice comms, you can ahve few 2-3 letter codes (for instance in TDM "ga3" meaning particularly nasty gunship in a3 square that needs to be taken care of). Or "ra" meaning rushing objective A. Find your tactics, like - Nova with EMP charging in, zapping turrets and stays upsideto finish turrets while strike goes below to finish hiding bomber (the bomber won't drop drone of interdiction mine while EMPed, the strike can take one -two seismic in the face and still fly... ) Everyone was starting someday. Everyone was frustrated after 10th getting one shotted by GS from far away. Some gave up, some didnt. You are getting hunted by those who didnt. So... "dont get mad, get even" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SammyGStatus Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 GSF is currently the place to be if you wanna get severely ganked and hardcore Spawncamped, not always but far to often for it to be oK ... This is the reason why my group doesn't play often anymore - when it's the 6 or 7 of us on a team, it really doesn't matter who we're up against, (minus Bastion guys who're uber coordinated and playing the game the way it should be), the other team is going to get smoked. Royally. Like charred cinder doesn't describe it. Anddddd that's okay, because when we started, we were trash too. There were many games where we had issues (I'm talking about ion tap love making days). But we persevered, and triumph. Now, the meta has changed a bit but if you're a group of Average Joes going against a group that knows how each other plays and each are on a tier above the entire opposition combined, having them group is not going to present a lot of enjoyment. That said, while I do enjoy a 3 cap and will never not go for it if the opportunity presents itself, in TDM if you're getting spawn camped you're doing something wrong AS A TEAM. Not one individual - as a team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eedwana Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Can one not be camped on Oricon as well? maybe we should yell at BW for making a contested planet too contested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RatPoison Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Yet another one... You have 3 spawn points which are selected randomly whenever you respawn. In my 2000+ games I haven't seen all 3 get camped even once, sooo... It's your own damn fault if you get camped. P.S. Next time read the forums before you post, there have been several threads like this recently. And these threads are going to continue because whether or not you've seen it or not, there is at least evidence that camping all three spawns has happened. Albeit a rare occurrence, it can and apparently has happened. So just because you haven't seen it, that's no more a valid argument than mine of never seeing a winning team hiding behind their cap ships (when turrets functioned). It most certainly could, and apparently did. Additionally, and not necessarily directed to you Asbestos, but to the others below who want to talk about chatting it up and getting coordinated. How often does that happen? I dare say damn few playing are reading the chat, and damn few flying are actually trying to stop and type crap out on a consistent basis to fight against a team that is more than likely a premade group. That said, while I do enjoy a 3 cap and will never not go for it if the opportunity presents itself, in TDM if you're getting spawn camped you're doing something wrong AS A TEAM. Not one individual - as a team. Yeah, and that "something wrong" likely is that the team getting camped is grossly under skilled to begin with. After all, it is these wildly unbalanced matches where camping to some degree will occur. Hence the issue will continue due to poor matchmaking as a result of low participation in the mini-game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asbetos Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 And these threads are going to continue because whether or not you've seen it or not, there is at least evidence that camping all three spawns has happened. Albeit a rare occurrence, it can and apparently has happened. So just because you haven't seen it, that's no more a valid argument than mine of never seeing a winning team hiding behind their cap ships (when turrets functioned). It most certainly could, and apparently did. If it happens, it's an ENORMOUS difference in team quality and absolutely nothing short of cap ships moving in and shooting the opposition can help the losing team. Additionally, and not necessarily directed to you Asbestos, but to the others below who want to talk about chatting it up and getting coordinated. How often does that happen? I dare say damn few playing are reading the chat, and damn few flying are actually trying to stop and type crap out on a consistent basis to fight against a team that is more than likely a premade group. Just last night had a perfect example of it: we were in a 3-man premade and the other team didn't have a premade at all (I think). They stood in a perfect line at their spawn with 4GS, 3 bombers and a Clarion while we stood in a perfect line some 16K away with our 4GS and a few scouts. That was the lamest match I've been in, but both teams were coordinated, whole teams. I have quite a few more stories like that. Sure, it's not always possible and not every random pug has the brain capacity of listening and actually doing what people say, but it does happened often, I'd even go as far as saying MUCH more often than spawn camping. P.S. Imagine what that match would be like if the turrets were on, this way they at least needed some player piloting to protect the GSs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RatPoison Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 (edited) If it happens, it's an ENORMOUS difference in team quality and absolutely nothing short of cap ships moving in and shooting the opposition can help the losing team. And that's precisely what is the leading issue behind how and why spawn camping happens in TDM. Regardless, this does not usurp the point that having the ability to safely spawn into a match is important. Just last night had a perfect example of it: we were in a 3-man premade and the other team didn't have a premade at all (I think). They stood in a perfect line at their spawn with 4GS, 3 bombers and a Clarion while we stood in a perfect line some 16K away with our 4GS and a few scouts. That was the lamest match I've been in, but both teams were coordinated, whole teams. I have quite a few more stories like that. This has nothing to do with the scenario I was referencing and I think you're well aware of that. Hiding behind ones cap ships was a reference to when turrets function and the primary reason folks wanted the turrets gone (or so they claimed). My point then, and still now... is despite never seeing such a game, it could and apparently did happen just as while spawn camping may not often happen, but it can and does. Your issue with the ship selection of the opposing team and their organization is not relevant to these points. I understand the frustration with the above situation, hell I lived through it just two nights ago in a match where I was teamed with 6 two ship newbies and one unknown pilot with 4 ships against all hardened and damn good pilots. One minute into the match, the opposing team is using 7 gunships and 1 T2 scout against this team and basically parking themselves in a line at the edge of the mesas map just outside our spawn to pew pew all incoming flights. It wasn't quite spawn camping, and it was of course their choice of play style, but the disheartening chatter and frustration from the newbies made me question just what the sense was behind the other teams choice to abuse them so relentlessly. The potential for one team to form up a bomber ball with gunships, etc is another issue entirely that is tough to wrestle with without restricting everybody's free choice to play a ship of their choosing. Sure, it's not always possible and not every random pug has the brain capacity of listening and actually doing what people say, but it does happened often, I'd even go as far as saying MUCH more often than spawn camping. Short of the little chatter before a match starts, which typically is happening between overachieving newbies or veterans... I more often than not see zero communication in a match, minus whatever I'm begging for folks to do or consider. We can debate it out, but I've not kept a physical count of people who acknowledge and/or followed any strategy or action, as I'm sure you haven't... but as a guy who primarily flies solo and does try to issue some notices during a match, it's a rare day that there is a positive reaction to it. I think beside that point is that communication or not... spawn camping... or really being able to safely spawn into the map should be a given. People shouldn't have to die ontop of their spawn to be alerted to the fact its being camped. P.S. Imagine what that match would be like if the turrets were on, this way they at least needed some player piloting to protect the GSs. And to that point I absolutely agree behind the premise of no turrets to protect a team's spawn that has the lead. I however disagree that no turrets period is a good thing unless a newb friendly manner of spawning is implemented. Hence... and I'm fairly certain you're aware of it, the suggestion I've made regarding turrets was made. I'm not a big fan of drawing a hard line and saying they're either on or off, the spawns are either safe or not... there is a better way to do things and until such time that is found, you will continue to see complaints from players (primarily new) about spawn camping. Don't be surprised. Edited August 21, 2014 by RatPoison Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SammyGStatus Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Ranked queues would solve this. At least we know BW fully supports GSF. Oh wait.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fractalsponge Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Cross server or bust! It really does have to be said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SammyGStatus Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Cross server or bust! It really does have to be said. We have our own version of cross server that, while meeting more of the community, doesn't seem to be bettering the playing field :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asbetos Posted August 22, 2014 Share Posted August 22, 2014 This has nothing to do with the scenario I was referencing and I think you're well aware of that. Hiding behind ones cap ships was a reference to when turrets function and the primary reason folks wanted the turrets gone (or so they claimed). My point then, and still now... is despite never seeing such a game, it could and apparently did happen just as while spawn camping may not often happen, but it can and does. Your issue with the ship selection of the opposing team and their organization is not relevant to these points. I understand the frustration with the above situation, hell I lived through it just two nights ago in a match where I was teamed with 6 two ship newbies and one unknown pilot with 4 ships against all hardened and damn good pilots. One minute into the match, the opposing team is using 7 gunships and 1 T2 scout against this team and basically parking themselves in a line at the edge of the mesas map just outside our spawn to pew pew all incoming flights. Short of the little chatter before a match starts, which typically is happening between overachieving newbies or veterans... I more often than not see zero communication in a match, minus whatever I'm begging for folks to do or consider. We can debate it out, but I've not kept a physical count of people who acknowledge and/or followed any strategy or action, as I'm sure you haven't... but as a guy who primarily flies solo and does try to issue some notices during a match, it's a rare day that there is a positive reaction to it. I think beside that point is that communication or not... spawn camping... or really being able to safely spawn into the map should be a given. People shouldn't have to die ontop of their spawn to be alerted to the fact its being camped. Yes, the match was frustrating and I do have a problem with that kind of ship selection, but that wasn't the point I was trying to make. The point I was trying to make is merely that pugs (I presume) on both sides actually listened to what someone was saying and did as they were told. And to that point I absolutely agree behind the premise of no turrets to protect a team's spawn that has the lead. I however disagree that no turrets period is a good thing unless a newb friendly manner of spawning is implemented. Hence... and I'm fairly certain you're aware of it, the suggestion I've made regarding turrets was made. I'm not a big fan of drawing a hard line and saying they're either on or off, the spawns are either safe or not... there is a better way to do things and until such time that is found, you will continue to see complaints from players (primarily new) about spawn camping. I'm afraid I don't remember which suggestion exactly was yours, but I know there were some pretty good ones in all those topics. Personally, I think the best solution would be exhaustion zones around the capships with a buff that protects players for X seconds. Turning the turrets back on is definitely not even a good temporary solution because it opens space for a perfectly viable (and almost uncounterable) tactic, while what we have now only hurts people that don't know and have a lot to learn anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RatPoison Posted August 22, 2014 Share Posted August 22, 2014 Yes, the match was frustrating and I do have a problem with that kind of ship selection, but that wasn't the point I was trying to make. The point I was trying to make is merely that pugs (I presume) on both sides actually listened to what someone was saying and did as they were told. But that is just a presumption. After all, I'd like to think that there are other people out there that are smart enough to observe what their team is flying, and concentrated and make the decision to either participate or not. After all, that's one route to becoming better at this game, assuming you have teammates to lean on. And none the less, some amount of communication does happen, especially at the beginning of a match... so it's not an outright denial of the premise, just that it isn't effective or common. I'm afraid I don't remember which suggestion exactly was yours, but I know there were some pretty good ones in all those topics. Personally, I think the best solution would be exhaustion zones around the capships with a buff that protects players for X seconds. Turning the turrets back on is definitely not even a good temporary solution because it opens space for a perfectly viable (and almost uncounterable) tactic, while what we have now only hurts people that don't know and have a lot to learn anyway. My suggestion was regarding turrets coming on for the losing team when the score was (severely) lop-sided. I disagreed with immunity of any sort, having to boost or travel out of the exhaustion zone as theres no guarantee newbs would be paying attention, while it additionally increases the time required to get back to the action on the map, etc. Regardless, I'm willing to try anything that would provide folks the ability to get safely spawned into the map as until something changes, these sorts of threads will continue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fractalsponge Posted August 22, 2014 Share Posted August 22, 2014 My suggestion was regarding turrets coming on for the losing team when the score was (severely) lop-sided. I disagreed with immunity of any sort, having to boost or travel out of the exhaustion zone as theres no guarantee newbs would be paying attention, while it additionally increases the time required to get back to the action on the map, etc. Regardless, I'm willing to try anything that would provide folks the ability to get safely spawned into the map as until something changes, these sorts of threads will continue. Let's say that a team is so badly outmatched that it was actually getting spawncamped. Right now, they die on entry after a few seconds, in the worst case scenario. If the turrets get turned on again, then they will die as soon as they exit turret range (i.e. this scenario in a domination game). If they don't exit turret range, both sides will just wait out the clock and it becomes a waste of everyone's time. And, honestly, if the team imbalance were that bad... well, let's just say I've poached people from the turrets before. A vote-to-end match would be better, but I could see that being abused for conquest points. Otherwise, ending the match as quickly as possible is the least frustrating ending for everyone. Again - only real solution - increase the player pool with cross server, more ground-game tie-in incentives, or more rewards for newer pilots. Then turn on matchmaking. Everything else is a secondary concern. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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