SW:TOR 4th biggest Sub MMO in the world

[Anaesha]

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=752472

[DarthDymond]

And that is what I find so disappointing about it.

 

Bioware got it so well in 2013, by having the CZ-198 FP's offer both tactical and traditional. Comes 2014 and they offer tactical ONLY.

 

In other words, instead of going for the option that values further one's money, they do the EXACT opposite. Worse, I'm fairly sure that the ones that follow the next chapters of Forged Alliances will be the same.

Disclaimer: I am not saying I agree with the decision to not include HMs for KDY, Tython or Korriban, this is just my understanding of why they probably made that choice.

 

With the level cap increase coming up, I am guessing they are holding back so they have a sufficient supply of FPs to use as the level 60 HMs, the same way they used Cademimu(sp?), Hammer Station, etc. as level 55 HMs when RotHC came out. If the Manaan FP comes out prior to the cap increase, I'm guessing it will also be Tactical only.

 

If KDY had come with a legitimate HM, I personally wouldn't have minded Tython and Korriban having their HMs delayed until lvl 60, as it stands I agree that there has been too long a gap in that particular niche (especially when coupled with the too-long gap in SM/HM Ops as well).

Edited July 18, 2014 by DarthDymond

[t-darko]

http://massively.joystiq.com/2014/07/18/report-swtor-fourth-biggest-sub-mmo-elder-scrolls-has-over-770/

 

Not bad...

Considering all the Doom and Gloom that the forum sees and people that didn't like the game spread...

 

*smiles*

[Darth_Wicked]

Disclaimer: I am not saying I agree with the decision to not include HMs for KDY, Tython or Korriban, this is just my understanding of why they probably made that choice.

 

With the level cap increase coming up, I am guessing they are holding back so they have a sufficient supply of FPs to use as the level 60 HMs, the same way they used Cademimu(sp?), Hammer Station, etc. as level 55 HMs when RotHC came out. If the Manaan FP comes out prior to the cap increase, I'm guessing it will also be Tactical only.

 

If KDY had come with a legitimate HM, I wouldn't have minded Tython and Korriban having their HMs delayed until lvl 60, as it stands I agree that there has been too long a gap in that particular niche.

 

Not sure why you're telling me that, since I've been saying it myself for ages(!) now.

 

Plus, doesn't exactly change I'm trying to say: Instead of going for the option that further values one's money in the short-run, they do the EXACT opposite, notwithstanding what they had done in the past already.

 

It's disappointing no matter how you slice it.

 

EDIT:

 

Especially when you ALSO consider the total lack of new content, pertaining operations and daily areas.

Edited July 18, 2014 by Darth_Wicked

[Tsillah]

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=752472

 

Yeh I read that.

 

Looks like a new planet...so what? There's no indication of anything more than that so for all I know it could be just another daily area. Could be nice but till I hear more about WHAT you can do there and WHEN this is coming out, this is yet another flimsy carrot that I'm not sure if it looks appetizing or not.

[Darth_Wicked]

Yeh I read that.

 

Looks like a new planet...so what? There's no indication of anything more than that so for all I know it could be just another daily area. Could be nice but till I hear more about WHAT you can do there and WHEN this is coming out, this is yet another flimsy carrot that I'm not sure if it looks appetizing or not.

 

 

It's not a new planet. It's just a flashpoint.

 

[Anaesha]

Yeh I read that.

 

Looks like a new planet...so what? There's no indication of anything more than that so for all I know it could be just another daily area. Could be nice but till I hear more about WHAT you can do there and WHEN this is coming out, this is yet another flimsy carrot that I'm not sure if it looks appetizing or not.

 

I'm not that fond of Carrots could we change it to something like shrimp scampi instead?

[DarthDymond]

Not sure why you're telling me that, since I've been saying it myself for ages(!) now.

 

Plus, doesn't exactly change I'm trying to say: Instead of going for the option that further values one's money in the short-run, they do the EXACT opposite, notwithstanding what they had done in the past already.

 

It's disappointing no matter how you slice it.

 

EDIT:

 

Especially when you ALSO consider the total lack of new content, pertaining operations and daily areas.

Wasn't telling you personally, and wasn't disagreeing with your point that it is disappointing, I was interjecting it into the conversation as a whole, not everyone participating in this thread has been in those other threads.

 

(Also, great minds think alike, I added my own edit about the lack of OPs making it even worse.)

Edited July 18, 2014 by DarthDymond

[Tsillah]

It's not a new planet. It's just a flashpoint.

 

 

A tactical flashpoint?

 

 

Well that would be even more disappointing.

[Dokar]

Is that sub revenue only meaning they made $139 mil (cash shop revenue reported in February) + $165 mil (subs) =$304 mil

or is it combine which means $165 mil - $139 mil( Cash shop) = $36 mil from subs.

[Darth_Wicked]

Wasn't telling you personally, and wasn't disagreeing with your point that it is disappointing, I was interjecting it into the conversation as a whole, not everyone participating in this thread has been in those other threads.

 

(Also, great minds think alike, I added my own edit about the lack of OPs making it even worse.)

 

Yeah.

 

I wasn't exactly trying to disagree either but merely point out as well that it is an old topic, especially considering what Bioware did with Hammer Station, Athiss, Mandalorian Raiders and Cademimu.

 

Even so, I really didn't have an issue with it since we had plenty of HM LV50 Flashpoints.

 

In this case though, when we got the first level bump from LV50 to LV55, the only new HM FP's we got were the CZ-198 ones. All the others were retooled...

 

In other words, is this bound to happen again with 3.0? Retooled content passing off as supposedly "NEW" content?

 

Again, doesn't add up for the greater bang for your buck so to speak.

[Darth_Wicked]

A tactical flashpoint?

 

 

Well that would be even more disappointing.

 

I don't expect anything else.

 

As DarthDymond pointed out in this thread, it is likely they are holding out on us right now, only to decide and release the HM versions once 3.0 hits.

Edited July 18, 2014 by Darth_Wicked

[Anaesha]

Is that sub revenue only meaning they made $139 mil (cash shop revenue reported in February) + $165 mil (subs) =$304 mil

or is it combine which means $165 mil - $139 mil( Cash shop) = $36 mil from subs.

 

I'm not 100% sure but I believe the $139 mil was CC purchases only.

[Infernixx]

Yeah.

 

I wasn't exactly trying to disagree either but merely point out as well that it is an old topic, especially considering what Bioware did with Hammer Station, Athiss, Mandalorian Raiders and Cademimu.

 

Even so, I really didn't have an issue with it since we had plenty of HM LV50 Flashpoints.

 

In this case though, when we got the first level bump from LV50 to LV55, the only new HM FP's we got were the CZ-198 ones. All the others were retooled...

 

In other words, is this bound to happen again with 3.0? Retooled content passing off as supposedly "NEW" content?

 

Again, doesn't add up for the greater bang for your buck so to speak.

 

I find myself amused lately...

 

"We're getting new stuff in 2.9!"

 

"Pfft...it's only a 'tactical' FP, not a HM."

 

"We're getting new stuff in 3.0!"

 

"Pfft, probably retooled old HM FPs."

 

Apparently, content only counts when it's brand new and geared solely toward end-game grinding. It must get tiring dragging those goal posts everywhere.

[Aries_cz]

2014 ( As of July ):

Daily Areas: ZERO

Flashpoints: ZERO

Operations: ZERO

 

Wrong. We got 3 flashpoints in 2014 (KDY, first 2 Forged Alliances), we will get more soon (Part 2 of Forged Alliances), we also got several updates to a whole new gameplay feature (GSF), including Deathmatch, new ship class, etc.

[Darth_Wicked]

Wrong. We got 3 flashpoints in 2014 (KDY, first 2 Forged Alliances), we will get more soon (Part 2 of Forged Alliances), we also got several updates to a whole new gameplay feature (GSF), including Deathmatch, new ship class, etc.

 

Context is important.

No.

 

He probably expects them to work on a schedule that greatly benefits the game and a significant(?) portion of the player base, namely by NOT allowing a full year to go by without a single new flashpoint outside the tactical ones, daily area or operation.

 

That is what is bound to happen around August and October respectively. Just a thought.

 

But then again, I doubt you were ever that interested in getting the full picture, before starting your little post with the word "wrong".

 

While at it, do add to that list that a new ship for GSF was delayed indefinitely. Link below...

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showpost.php?p=7386025&postcount=1

Edited July 18, 2014 by Darth_Wicked

[DarthDymond]

Wrong. We got 3 flashpoints in 2014 (KDY, first 2 Forged Alliances), we will get more soon (Part 2 of Forged Alliances), we also got several updates to a whole new gameplay feature (GSF), including Deathmatch, new ship class, etc.

Regardless of how he articulated his point, the matter is still that some pretty significant aspects of the game (HM FPs, Daily Areas, and SM/HM Ops) look like they'll be going a full year without any updates.

 

I am the first to roll my eyes whenever someone complains "Why the heck are BioWare wasting their time making [game aspect X]! What the players want is [game aspect Y]!" This game is designed to cater to a large base, and not every patch is going to have everyone's favorite aspect represented. But Daily Areas and brand new Operations are fairly significant segments to be leaving off the schedule for a full 12 months or more.

 

(I know Wicked and plenty of others say this is a "not enough content" issue, personally I think it's a "they screwed up the pacing of their content" issue.)

Edited July 18, 2014 by DarthDymond

[Aries_cz]

Context is important.

 

 

But then again, I doubt you were ever that interested in getting the full picture, before starting your little post with the word "wrong".

 

While at it, do add to that list that a new ship for GSF was delayed indefinitely. Link below...

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showpost.php?p=7386025&postcount=1

 

If you want people to read context spread across the entire topic, do not use bullet points, they tend to lead people to not read the rest, especially at 11PM

 

However, Flashpoints are Flashpoints, regardless of your personal opinion on Tactical Flashpoints is, which are necessity, because we have tons of DPS crying that they cannot get queue to pop, because nobody wants to play with them. And there is no way around that, because tanks and healers will not play with horrible players no matter what rewards you offer (or at least not a significant number of them to make difference).

 

And I was talking about the bomber, not the indefinitely delayed ship type

[OddballEasyEight]

Is that sub revenue only meaning they made $139 mil (cash shop revenue reported in February) + $165 mil (subs) =$304 mil

or is it combine which means $165 mil - $139 mil( Cash shop) = $36 mil from subs.

 

Good question.

I'd be very surprised if it was sub only tho.

[Infernixx]

Regardless of how he articulated his point, the matter is still that some pretty significant aspects of the game (HM FPs, Daily Areas, and SM/HM Ops) look like they'll be going a full year without any updates.

 

I am the first to roll my eyes whenever someone complains "Why the heck are BioWare wasting their time making [game aspect X]! What the players want is [game aspect Y]!" This game is designed to cater to a large base, and not every patch is going to have everyone's favorite aspect represented. But Daily Areas and brand new Operations are fairly significant segments to be leaving off the schedule for a full 12 months or more.

 

(I know Wicked and plenty of others say this is a "not enough content" issue, personally I think it's a "they screwed up the pacing of their content" issue.)

 

It would hardly be the first time a MMO made their players wait a while for particular kinds of content release. I can think of one in particular that will end up making their players wait over a year before they get 'any' new content of any kind. And they're doing remarkably well in the player base department.

 

My point is that compared to most other games, TOR is either on par or doing better when it comes to releasing content even as they wind down from the HC expansion and build toward the new expansion.

[Deewe]

Is that sub revenue only meaning they made $139 mil (cash shop revenue reported in February) + $165 mil (subs) =$304 mil

or is it combine which means $165 mil - $139 mil( Cash shop) = $36 mil from subs.

$36 mil from subs is like 200k subscribers for a year which is more consistent with how we see the server loaded than $165 mil, roughly 917K subscribers.

 

Which should look more like this: clicky

[DarthDymond]

It would hardly be the first time a MMO made their players wait a while for particular kinds of content release. I can think of one in particular that will end up making their players wait over a year before they get 'any' new content of any kind. And they're doing remarkably well in the player base department.

 

My point is that compared to most other games, TOR is either on par or doing better when it comes to releasing content even as they wind down from the HC expansion and build toward the new expansion.

I agree that SWTOR is doing well in releasing a sufficient quantity of content overall (patch 2.8 aside, I think it was very lackluster - but it's the first lackluster one so I'm not too worked up about that). But there are some "bread and butter" aspects that, if they're going to be doing a nine-week cycle, it would be better if we saw with some regularity.

 

I really do think that it was a mistake on their part when they went 10 months without any new WarZones, and I think it's a mistake now that we're in what looks to be a 12+ month stretch with no new SM Operations or Daily Areas (since we are getting some Tactical FlashPoints, I'm not so concerned about the lack of HM FPs, but I can understand someone disagreeing and thinking that's a bread-and-butter aspect too).

 

Again, they don't need to be in every patch, and it is fine when other stuff is added in, but if you're going to do a nine-week content cycle, 10-12 months is a bit too much.

Edited July 18, 2014 by DarthDymond

[Darth_Wicked]

(...) (I know Wicked and plenty of others say this is a "not enough content" issue, personally I think it's a "they screwed up the pacing of their content" issue.)

 

This is partly untrue, if you take into account what I said here.

 

Again, 2012 and 2013 were fairly similar, as far as new flashpoints, operations and daily areas are concerned, regarldess of the release cadence.

 

2014 is the one year that has been underwhelming on that front.

 

If you want people to read context spread across the entire topic, do not use bullet points, they tend to lead people to not read the rest, especially at 11PM

 

Not my fault it's that late in Czech Republic(?).

 

However, Flashpoints are Flashpoints, regardless of your personal opinion on Tactical Flashpoints is, which are necessity, because we have tons of DPS crying that they cannot get queue to pop, because nobody wants to play with them. And there is no way around that, because tanks and healers will not play with horrible players no matter what rewards you offer (or at least not a significant number of them to make difference).

 

Did anyone say otherwise? Again, context is important.

 

And that is what I find so disappointing about it.

 

Bioware got it so well in 2013, by having the CZ-198 FP's offer both tactical and traditional. Comes 2014 and they offer tactical ONLY.

 

In other words, instead of going for the option that values further one's money, they do the EXACT opposite. Worse, I'm fairly sure that the ones that follow the next chapters of Forged Alliances will be the same.

 

The issue is NOT if tactical flashpoints are content but rather the fact they backtracked considering what they had done in the recent past.

 

Once more, context.

 

And I was talking about the bomber, not the indefinitely delayed ship type

 

And I was talking about the ship that was delayed indefinitely. Dunno if it was a bomber or anything else, since I really don't play GSF.

Edited July 18, 2014 by Darth_Wicked

[JimG]

Weird. I could have sworn I've read dozens of times in the forums that SWTOR was nearing a shutdown, right after the next new MMO was going to be released, lol.

[Kalfear]

Eve isn't more popular it just happens to have a very dedicated fan base.

 

EVE is interesting that it never really hit that high on meters but never is really looked at as a bad thing.

 

Yup, Eves always been a small market niche game with fanatically loyal player base

 

I often compare Eves playerbase to that of SWG, PVPers or Raiders.

They make up the smallest percentage of market and player bases but have the most vocal communities that make them look much larger then they really are.

 

Eve wasnt for me personally but some folks I know absolutely loved that game with a passion.