Actual questions posted in the Class Questions thread

[TACeMossie]

To make it easier on Jerc, I went through the class questions thread and pulled out all the posts that were actually questions, instead of the excessive amount of "GIVE ME JET CHARGE" and "DO THIS TO THE SPEC" that had clogged it up. If you see any questions I missed, put them in here. If your gonna make a suggestion, DO NOT PUT IT IN THIS THREAD.

 

Starting with a brief summary of the previous VG/PT questions, the responses, and the result of said questions:

 

QUESTION 1: PVP

Pre 2.4, VGs had poor survivability + untility in comparison to the other 2 tanks for PvP. What is being done to address these issues?

 

ANSWER 1: Perception Problem (Class Rep Resigned!) Questions about if pyros power goes up will the problem dissapear?

 

EFFECT OF ANSWER: PTs got improved Kolto Overload, AP PTs got the slow at all times on PFT and a more powerful immolate, Pyro PTs got significantly better DCDs and burst power. Overall, while the answer was crap, they did respond to it with buffs that made PTs one of the best PvP Classes. Tanks still suck compared to the other 2 though.

 

QUESTION 2: PvE

Based at the Pyro/AP hybrid, it asked if the Devs had any plans to make full trees more viable than the hybrid in PvE

 

Answer 2: They never intended for hybrids to be better than full trees. The 2.4 Update should make full trees better than the hybrid (HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA). States that AP and Pyro should be worse on the dummy because of lack of armor debuff/health.

 

EFFECT OF ANSWER: The Hybrid got completely removed with patch 2.6. Patch 2.5 also gave dummys with health and an armor debuff, which showed that the PT was the worst overall DPS class without the hybrid, tied to the now-buffed Juggernaught. THIS NEEDS TO BE LOOKED AT

 

QUESTION 3: OTHER

Basically asking about a lack of burst, making it difficult for burst phases of boss fights in PvE and harder for PvP in general.

 

ANSWER 3: 2.4 is bringing a DPS upgrade to both PT DPS specs, and a burst upgrade for Pyro + a harder hitting immolate with AP, making them more competitive in PvP and in burst phases of PvE.

 

EFFECT OF ANSWER: This question surprisingly is what brought out all the defensive buffs in 2.4 for PTs. Also PTs are now one of, if not the, best PvP Class

 

Now for the questions:

 

KOOZIE (He typed it out on a phone apparently so that explains the poor formatting, so give him a break)

 

Powertech tanks are very rarely seen in ranked arenas and in regular warzones and we feel it is due to their lack of defensive tools. PTs dont have a knockback, friendly leap, vanish, or force push but do have a pull and hydraulic overrides which is prettt cool and all these things set the different tanks apart. However, two major issues with powertech tanking is their lack of crowd control and inability to mitigate imminent incoming damage. For example, lets say a sorc was casting thundering blast on each three classes. There is an imminent 7k attack about to hit...juggs can hit reflect, sins can shroud or vanish but pts must eat a very large chunk of that damage. Further, one of our cooldowns requires people to be within the targeted area to be affected. This cooldown is a reasonable cooldown but because of the plethora of escapes in the game (sniper roll, carnage mara camo, hydraulic overrides, intercede, force speed) it is very easily escaped from. We believe a cooldown that allows high mitigation for a short period of imminent burst would level pt tanks with other tanks. One suggestion has been an ability that increasea shield chance to 100% and making the powertech immune to critical hits for the duration as one (lasts 5 seconds, 60 sec cooldown). Another thing both other tanks have are crowd control abilties which pts do not. Yes we have a 2.5 second stun but this is used mainly as a peeling tool such as a sin knockback. A single target 6 second mez would allow pts to be a lot more competitive in pvp as havinv utility to cc a healer and assist the team like other tanking clasaes are about to. Please do not make any of these abilities reachable for powertech dps.

 

SCYTHE ELEVEN (also typed on a phone)

 

Question 1: The general consensus regarding PVE DPS is that we are underperforming in comparison to other classes. With the CGC-PVE hybrid gone as a result of the latest patch, the full-36 point builds are still behind. Some concerns in the trees include the alacrity granted by Rapid Venting, which can actually hurt the spec since it functions on a 6-second internal CD. Are there any plans to revisit the full AP and Pyro builds in order to tweak them (and not affect our current PVP state)?

 

MATHEMAGICA:

 

The Shield Tech tree contains several talents - Shield Vents, Hydraulic Shields and Heat Screen to be precise - that are triggered when shielding an attack, but not when an attack is parried, dodged, resisted etc. Increasing the defense value on a Powertech tank decreases the chance of shielding an attack, hence it reduces the chance of triggering these skills.

It is true for every tank that higher defense reduces his/her practical shield chance, because less attacks make it to the point where they can be shielded. However, Powertech tanks suffer more under this effect than the other two tanking trees, since there are several mechanics in the Shield Tech tree that require shielding and not dodging etc. to get triggered.

This becomes even more problematic when theory crafters suggest that, in order to maximize mean mitigation, Powertech tanks need a lot of defense.

In short, the defense stat conflicts with the mechanics of Powertech tanks. Could we see a change to this such that the 'conflict' between defense and shield doesn't interfere with tree mechanics (for example by making the talents mentioned above additionally trigger whenever an attack gets dodged, parried, resisted)?

 

BLITZ-WING:

 

PvP Question

 

PT tanks in PvP lack the burst defensives of Assassins (shroud) and Juggs (reflect). Further, PT tanks have a distinct lack of long CC compared to juggs (intimidating road - 6 sec mez), and sins (whirlwhind - 8 second cc). The classes all have 2 hard stuns but pts have no Mez/CC. To summarise, We neither have a burst defensive cooldown to stop large amounts of incoming damage or a CC/Mez that the other tank classes do and makes them very powerful in PvP. We understand that Powertech tanks are in a good place right now in PvE so a new defensive cooldown is probably out of the question for reasons of game mechanics. But a 6 - 8 second CC will have no bearing on PvE and will increase PT tank viability in PvP (especially Arenas). Both sins and juggs pick up stun talents in their tank tree.

How does the Combat Team justify this in-balance between the Tanking Classes?

 

PvE Question

 

Pyrotech DPS in PvE content is below all other advanced classes DPS, excluding Assassin's. However in PvP content Pyrotech DPS is at a competent level. It has been shown, by a select few, that Pyrotech's can complete with any class in DPS, however for the vast majority of player's Heat Management & Proc RNG are the deciding factors. Heat Management is determined by Proc RNG. Proc RNG is affected by lag, low proc rates & alacrity. The Alacrity in the Rapid Venting talent de-sync's the PPA Proc, reducing DPS & increasing Heat Management.

 

We would like to hear the Combat Team's thoughts on Pyrotech DPS in regards to both the over statement & the fact that other classes have had their RNG mechanics reduced or removed.

 

DURAN'DEL/TheSupaCoopa

 

A nice question to ask would be somewhere along the lines of:

 

Grapple's usefulness as a PT tank against a boss is very low. Shadows are still able to use their pull against a boss effectively due to the large amount of threat gained from using it. Would there be a way to increase threat generated by this ability for tanks without affecting DPS skill trees?

 

ME:

 

PvP BASED - SHIELD SPEC

 

Patch 2.4 did a lot for Powertechs when it came to PvP. Its most noticable thing it brought though, was the horror that was the AP-Shield Spec Hybrid. People hated this because it was a tank that came in as a DPS into arenas, so it threw off team balance and made it much easier to win games. And the worst thing was, if both teams already had a tank it could just swap cells + gear, and prevent being at a disadvantage. The bad thing though, was that when it was removed in patch 2.6, Powertechs lost their Tank spec that actually worked in PvP - the significantly less burst and sustained dps of the tank spec, as well as having far less abilities that can be used to heavily frustrate the opponent (e.g. Knockbacks, mezzes, ect...) mean that if you go in as a PT Tank, the only thing you can do is throw your guard around. No one is going to pay attention to you - and when they do your grand total of 3 DCDs (one which can literally be moved out of) are easily bypassed. So with that in mind, what are the plans for PT Tanks in PvP?

 

PvE BASED - PYROTECH SPEC

 

Another thing Patch 2.6 did, was remove the PvE Hybrid. Now we know you dont like hybrids, but the sad thing is that aside from 1-2 obscenely good Vanguards/Powertechs (e.g. C-tor), Powertechs needed the AP/Pyro hybrid to compete in PvE situations - mainly because of the great resource management, decent sustained damage, and the AoE damage to really help in specific situations. But with 2.6, the hybrid was cut, and we had to go back to full trees, where problems really started to show. In Pyrotechs case, these problems were most obvious in the high RNG Dependencies on its resource management, as well as how a necessary talent (Rapid Venting) gave a stat that would hurt its resource regeneration system (particle proc accelerator's 6 second ICD gets ruined by the 2% alacrity on a stable internet connection). With the 2.7 changes being planned, we can see that RNG is being removed from the aresenal spec on mercs, as well as from all specs of Sorcs - but the real thing seen there is that ICDs are being modified to allow alacrity without it hurting the proc rate (see - 8 second ICD on Barrage). Are there any plans in the future for reducing the RNG behind the Pyrotech Powertechs proc system and getting rid of alacrity problems in the spec?

 

WILDCARD QUESTION - ADVANCED PROTOTYPE SPEC

 

This spec is probably one of the specs that really needs to be looked at. Until patch 2.6 came out, the spec wasn't a spec - it was pieces of a hybrid spec that was half shield spec in PvP and half pyro in PvE. This is confounded by it literally being the lowest parsing dps spec in the game, and the entirety of its viability in the new dread ops come from adds being a little too easy to bunch up, while its PvP Viability is tied entirely to having explosive fuel up, and the slow on Prototype Flamethrower. Are there any plans to really look into improving Advanced Prototype so it no longer becomes second rate to the other specs?

 

This post will be updated as more actual questions get thrown out there, and this thread is mainly for the purposes of making it easier to find the questions in the question thread. There appears to be a lot of agreement on Mathemagica's question right now, but other than that its a mixed bag. I personally would like to see 1 question on each spec though.

Edited March 10, 2014 by TACeMossie

[TACeMossie]

Reserved in case too many questions actually get asked to fit in the OP

[Kooziejr]

Reserved in case too many questions actually get asked to fit in the OP

 

Nice work man. Typing from a computer tonight so grammar/formatting errors cannot be forgiven I think PT tanks should really push the idea about not having a 6 - 8 second mez a lot harder than the extra defensive cooldown. This way it will not interfere with PvE (in which PT tanks seem to be happy with their performance). I wrote the entire question out in the other thread :-)

 

PT tanks in PvP lack the burst defensives of Assassins (shroud) and Juggs (reflect). Further, PT tanks have a distinct lack of long CC compared to juggs (intimidating road - 6 sec mez), and sins (whirlwhind - 8 second cc). The other tank classes all have 2 hard stuns but pts have no Mez/CC. To summarise, We neither have a burst defensive cooldown to stop large amounts of incoming damage or a CC/Mez that the other tank classes do and makes them very powerful in PvP. We understand that Powertech tanks are in a good place right now in PvE so a new defensive cooldown is out of the question for reasons of game mechanics and equality. But a 6 - 8 second CC will have no bearing on PvE and will increase PT tank viability in PvP (especially Arenas). Both sins (out of stealth spike) and jugg tanks (backhand) already pick up stun talents in their tank tree so such a tree specific ability is not unheard of.

 

^^^ found it. This was me

Edited March 4, 2014 by Kooziejr

[Ottoattack]

I think TACeMossie go the PvE and PvP questions. For the wildcard I will quote myself here (something that I do not like to do):

 

I am reverting to theory crafting again, and this is more of a concern than an issue. If you are not aware, in 2.7 smashers are being nerfed to oblivion. In 2.6 orbital strike was also nerfed to being utterly useless. Which only leaves AP is the ONLY viable aoe spec in PvP when 2.7 hits live. While I am suspecting that some of the changes devs made to smash will be reverted before 2.7 hits live, currently AP as aoe spec IMO outperforms smash considering the constant snares, mobility and up time on target. If the trend continues, it is safe to say that PFT is getting nerfed in 2.8. What I can also tell you about the devs is that they are lazy and they have no problem in nerfing spec substantially and ignore balancing it for 6-12 month till the next “major patch.” The question is how can we as PTs position ourselves to get the best out of this situation.

 

I think we should take the initiative and ask for improvements in AP single target damage in favor of lower damage in PFT. This will benefit PvE, also the meta of competitive spec in arena is moving towards single target damage, so it is a win-win situation.

 

If we do not try to guide the devs hand, I think they will nerf AP to oblivion in 2.8. If we just sit and wait, we will get shafted.

 

Also, we can't say the devs buffed PTs in 2.4 cuz of the responses. Did you not see the sorc responses? The H2F and higher skill ceiling... The did not get anything until 2.6, so we can't say bad responses will grant buffs.

Edited March 4, 2014 by Ottoattack

[Kooziejr]

I think TACeMossie go the PvE and PvP questions. For the wildcard I will quote myself here (something that I do not like to do):

 

I am reverting to theory crafting again, and this is more of a concern than an issue. If you are not aware, in 2.7 smashers are being nerfed to oblivion. In 2.6 orbital strike was also nerfed to being utterly useless. Which only leaves AP is the ONLY viable aoe spec in PvP when 2.7 hits live. While I am suspecting that some of the changes devs made to smash will be reverted before 2.7 hits live, currently AP as aoe spec IMO outperforms smash considering the constant snares, mobility and up time on target. If the trend continues, it is safe to say that PFT is getting nerfed in 2.8. What I can also tell you about the devs is that they are lazy and they have no problem in nerfing spec substantially and ignore balancing it for 6-12 month till the next “major patch.” The question is how can we as PTs position ourselves to get the best out of this situation.

 

I think we should take the initiative and ask for improvements in AP single target damage in favor of lower damage in PFT. This will benefit PvE, also the meta of competitive spec in arena is moving towards single target damage, so it is a win-win situation.

 

If we do not try to guide the devs hand, I think they will nerf AP to oblivion in 2.8. If we just sit and wait, we will get shafted.

 

Also, we can't say the devs buffed PTs in 2.4 cuz of the responses. Did you not see the sorc responses? The H2F and higher skill ceiling... The did not get anything until 2.6, so we can't say bad responses will grant buffs.

 

I tend to agree with this even though AP probably isn't overpowered in anything. PFT was pretty good before the 30% crit bonus anyways - I wouldn't like to see that nerfed because it probably isn't necessary but it is good people are aware of the potential dilemma they face from other classes QQing. I agree with the L2P for madness and healing specs on a sidenote.

Edited March 5, 2014 by Kooziejr

[AAntan]

I tend to agree with this even though AP probably isn't overpowered in anything. PFT was pretty good before the 30% crit bonus anyways - I wouldn't like to see that nerfed because it probably isn't necessary but it is good people are aware of the potential dilemma they face from other classes QQing.

 

People exaggerate about AP because the side-effect of AP/Ion hybrid (before that no one knew AP existed on PT skill trees). Now you can see people complaining about the Jugg tank hybrid (Vengeance on Soresu) which is the same story, it's the QQ tendency.

 

The spec itself is ok now (I say ok because it does perform nice on pvp but on pve is meh), not to mention that since 2.4 everyone became an expert and started to use it (usual FotM effect). But no one seems to remember how terrible this spec was Pre 2.0 and Pre 2.4 (I think I was the only full AP on my server until 2.4).

 

@OP: And a small sidenote: AP stands for Adv. Prototype not Adv. Powertech, so I think I have to smack you for dragging that mistake

Edited March 5, 2014 by AAntan

[Kooziejr]

And a small sidenote: AP stands for Adv. Prototype not Adv. Powertech, so I think I have to smack you for dragging that mistake

 

Okay? and when did I say it didn't stand for Advanced Prototype?

 

not to mention that since 2.4 everyone became an expert and started to use it (usual FotM effect). But no one seems to remember how terrible this spec was Pre 2.0 and Pre 2.4 (I think I was the only full AP on my server until 2.4).

 

- video of me playing AP in 1.7-2.0.

- video of me playing AP in 2.2 (please excuse the backpedal - since unbound).

 

Thanks for coming.

Edited March 5, 2014 by Kooziejr

[AAntan]

Okay? and when did I say it didn't stand for Advanced Prototype?

 

Not you man . The OP keeps calling it like that, guess I should edit that.

Edited March 5, 2014 by AAntan

[AAntan]

- video of me playing AP in 1.7-2.0.

- video of me playing AP in 2.2 (please excuse the backpedal - since unbound).

 

Thanks for coming.

 

Also I wasn't attacking you... but you gotta understand the number of people that started using AP increased a lot after 2.4. Don't take everything so serious, it was just an expression.

[TACeMossie]

Not you man . The OP keeps calling it like that, guess I should edit that.

 

Yeah thats my fault... I use a vanguard so for me its just Tactics, and on the forums most people just refer to it as AP.

 

Time to fix it up!

[Kooziejr]

Also I wasn't attacking you... but you gotta understand the number of people that started using AP increased a lot after 2.4. Don't take everything so serious, it was just an expression.

 

Yes it definitely increased (although I think more people play pyro now) But there were still a few people trialing it post 2.0 when it got a proper rotation.

[Brunner_Venda]

Koozie, tanks already get a three second root on our pull that the other specs do not have.

 

The amount of CC in this game is already stupid, I seriously don't want to see anymore added. If you want to control my character so bad, I'll send all of you a bill for my sub. NO MORE CC.

 

Also, AP damage is not nearly up to par when compared to other classes (especially marauders, pyrotechs, mercs, or assassins). It's based on prototype flamethrower, which is a three second channel. The only benefit is the cone AOE, otherwise the damage is underwhelming compared to any two GCD attacks. The spec is NOT balanced when compared to pyrotechs, seriously, AP's are a joke when I'm running pyro. I tear them apart, it's not even remotely a fair fight. AP also has one DOT and slow, and if you kite out of their 4 meter range they can't even use rail shot.

 

AP is my favorite spec, but there's simply no reason to use it when pyro is so much better.

[ScytheEleven]

Koozie, tanks already get a three second root on our pull that the other specs do not have.

 

The amount of CC in this game is already stupid, I seriously don't want to see anymore added. If you want to control my character so bad, I'll send all of you a bill for my sub. NO MORE CC.

 

Also, AP damage is not nearly up to par when compared to other classes (especially marauders, pyrotechs, mercs, or assassins). It's based on prototype flamethrower, which is a three second channel. The only benefit is the cone AOE, otherwise the damage is underwhelming compared to any two GCD attacks. The spec is NOT balanced when compared to pyrotechs, seriously, AP's are a joke when I'm running pyro. I tear them apart, it's not even remotely a fair fight. AP also has one DOT and slow, and if you kite out of their 4 meter range they can't even use rail shot.

 

AP is my favorite spec, but there's simply no reason to use it when pyro is so much better.

 

You generally seem like you know what you're talking about it, so I'm rather confused by this post. AP is awesome in PVP. Seriously. I flip a coin based upon what spec I want to run. I've done my ranked (solo) matches in both AP and Pyro. They're equally great, both with strength and weaknesses.

[Brunner_Venda]

You generally seem like you know what you're talking about it, so I'm rather confused by this post. AP is awesome in PVP. Seriously. I flip a coin based upon what spec I want to run. I've done my ranked (solo) matches in both AP and Pyro. They're equally great, both with strength and weaknesses.

 

For PVE, AP is one of the lowest parsing specs in the game. I think it's second to last.

 

For PVP, it's really mediocre and far too dependent on shoulder cannon and explosive fuel to do any serious damage. It's not bad, but it simply doesn't compare to pyro with the extra rail shot armor pen (8K when fully min maxed), triple dots (CGC, incendiary missile, and thermal det), the six second rail shot reset, and thermal detonator burst (6K) . Pyro melts people with ridiculous efficiency, and at the end of the day AP is still a half-spec in comparison.

 

By 'half spec' I mean the vast majority of people who put points into it were in tank stance or using CGC. Why? Because the HEGC spec doesn't stand as well on its own in PVE or ranked.

[Kooziejr]

Koozie, tanks already get a three second root on our pull that the other specs do not have.

 

The amount of CC in this game is already stupid, I seriously don't want to see anymore added. If you want to control my character so bad, I'll send all of you a bill for my sub. NO MORE CC.

 

Also, AP damage is not nearly up to par when compared to other classes (especially marauders, pyrotechs, mercs, or assassins). It's based on prototype flamethrower, which is a three second channel. The only benefit is the cone AOE, otherwise the damage is underwhelming compared to any two GCD attacks. The spec is NOT balanced when compared to pyrotechs, seriously, AP's are a joke when I'm running pyro. I tear them apart, it's not even remotely a fair fight. AP also has one DOT and slow, and if you kite out of their 4 meter range they can't even use rail shot.

 

AP is my favorite spec, but there's simply no reason to use it when pyro is so much better.

 

Here is my rationale for this. I know there is a lot of CC in the game and it can be annoying but not having the PT tanks on a level playing field doesn't stop the CC because everyone justs plays sin or jugg tank.

Quick calculations (correct me if im wrong I didn't even look up the trees).

 

Jugg Tank gets 42 seconds of CC every 3 minutes.

Sin Tank gets 48 seconds of CC every 3 minutes

PT tank gets 19.5 seconds of CC every 3 minutes

 

Not cool. Defensives are at best the same as the other 2 classes. Can't believe people don't see the insane imbalance in that and wouldn't want to address it as a number one question. I don't even care about tanks but I just think that is so unfair.

 

RE AP: Is fine IMHO. I can beat pyro 1 v 1 as AP (probably not without shoulder cannons though). But that is how the game is. You're not suppose to melt everything with your fav spec. AP is quite balanced for ranked and regs as is Pyro. PvE........

[Brunner_Venda]

Here is my rationale for this. I know there is a lot of CC in the game and it can be annoying but not having the PT tanks on a level playing field doesn't stop the CC because everyone justs plays sin or jugg tank.

Quick calculations (correct me if im wrong I didn't even look up the trees).

 

Jugg Tank gets 42 seconds of CC every 3 minutes.

Sin Tank gets 48 seconds of CC every 3 minutes

PT tank gets 19.5 seconds of CC every 3 minutes

 

Not cool. Defensives are at best the same as the other 2 classes. Can't believe people don't see the insane imbalance in that and wouldn't want to address it as a number one question. I don't even care about tanks but I just think that is so unfair.

 

RE AP: Is fine IMHO. I can beat pyro 1 v 1 as AP (probably not without shoulder cannons though). But that is how the game is. You're not suppose to melt everything with your fav spec. AP is quite balanced for ranked and regs as is Pyro. PvE........

 

1. You would get another 12 seconds of root on your pull with a tank.

 

2. Yes. A pyro/ap fight comes down to who crits more or makes the first mistake when AP has missiles available.

 

Problem is, that ability is on a two minute CD. Assuming I spawn camp you, and you come out every thirty seconds, I'm going to kill your AP three times before it's a fair fight again. Power loaders needs to decrease the SC cooldown by 15/30 seconds. I think that would fix the spec entirely, and it would be as nice a boost as commandos just received with their tech override cooldown fix.

[Ottoattack]

For PVE, AP is one of the lowest parsing specs in the game. I think it's second to last.

 

For PVP, it's really mediocre and far too dependent on shoulder cannon and explosive fuel to do any serious damage. It's not bad, but it simply doesn't compare to pyro with the extra rail shot armor pen (8K when fully min maxed), triple dots (CGC, incendiary missile, and thermal det), the six second rail shot reset, and thermal detonator burst (6K) . Pyro melts people with ridiculous efficiency, and at the end of the day AP is still a half-spec in comparison.

 

By 'half spec' I mean the vast majority of people who put points into it were in tank stance or using CGC. Why? Because the HEGC spec doesn't stand as well on its own in PVE or ranked.

 

Sorry bro, can't support you that AP is mediocre. AP has the damage and the survivability. Best anti aoe spec and great anti melee spec. I would like for AP to stay the same in PvP. The problem is that they may get hit with the nerf bate like all other aoe specs, and that's what we try to avoid (or control). IMO in live as is, it is better than rage. Rage has higher burst, but any competent healer can tell you that smash is no threat, not to mention ranged specs (except merc) laugh at rage. AP on the other hand.. I guess it is relative.

 

On another note, I think PvE wise AP and pyro are equally bad

 

Koozie, I think in solo pyro will have edge, big time on AP (equally geared and skilled of course). The double dipping on damage reduction (85% damage reduction when KOL and shield are aligned) plus armor penetration and range options give pyro a big edge IMO. If you can dot and break LOS especially, AP is toast.

Edited March 5, 2014 by Ottoattack

[Brunner_Venda]

I don't think AP needs damage changes, just a few CD adjustments would do it.

 

I understand that AP damage is mostly elemental (THAT is what makes it so good, elemental can't be shielded and it ignores armor!). It's not like Pyro PT where most of your damage is white.

[Mularky]

I don't think AP needs damage changes, just a few CD adjustments would do it.

 

I understand that AP damage is mostly elemental (THAT is what makes it so good, elemental can't be shielded and it ignores armor!). It's not like Pyro PT where most of your damage is white.

 

In both AP and Pyro you have 1 white damaging attack. Excluding rapidshots.

Edited March 6, 2014 by Mularky

[TheSupaCoopa]

I thought my question about harpoon and threat was something that should have been brought up, too *sniffles*

[Brunner_Venda]

In both AP and Pyro you have 1 white damaging attack. Excluding rapidshots.

 

Actually it's Unload, rapid shots, and rail shot. But who uses the other two except when you're overheated?

 

In pyro's case though, Rail Shot is both your biggest hit AND primary heat management move. If you aren't doing this every single time rail shot is up, you are screwing both your DPS and heat management.

 

Ergo, your most important move as pyro is white damage.

[Kooziejr]

1. You would get another 12 seconds of root on your pull with a tank.

 

2. Yes. A pyro/ap fight comes down to who crits more or makes the first mistake when AP has missiles available.

 

Problem is, that ability is on a two minute CD. Assuming I spawn camp you, and you come out every thirty seconds, I'm going to kill your AP three times before it's a fair fight again. Power loaders needs to decrease the SC cooldown by 15/30 seconds. I think that would fix the spec entirely, and it would be as nice a boost as commandos just received with their tech override cooldown fix.

 

1) root isn't a CC. so many ways to counter that and it is useless in arenas on healers. From a PvP perspective. PT tank is rubbish because it cant CC a healer.

 

2) Just because pyro can kill AP in a 1 v 1 doesn't mean AP needs tweaking??? Why do you think AP should be able to beat pyro? This game is scissors paper rock...not everything is 50/50. Smash beats carnage in a 1 v 1.....but carnage don't complain they need a buff!

[Brunner_Venda]

1) root isn't a CC. so many ways to counter that and it is useless in arenas on healers. From a PvP perspective. PT tank is rubbish because it cant CC a healer.

 

2) Just because pyro can kill AP in a 1 v 1 doesn't mean AP needs tweaking??? Why do you think AP should be able to beat pyro? This game is scissors paper rock...not everything is 50/50. Smash beats carnage in a 1 v 1.....but carnage don't complain they need a buff!

 

I'm firmly in the 'best player should win' camp. Sure every class has their strengths and weaknesses, but in a 1v1 fight you should have a reasonable chance to beat another class, even if some are somewhat harder than others. A friend of mine runs AP and rarely ever wins when we fight, and he's a MUCH better player than I am.

[Kooziejr]

I'm firmly in the 'best player should win' camp. Sure every class has their strengths and weaknesses, but in a 1v1 fight you should have a reasonable chance to beat another class, even if some are somewhat harder than others. A friend of mine runs AP and rarely ever wins when we fight, and he's a MUCH better player than I am.

 

Unfortunately the game doesn't work like that. Smash beats anni/carnage or same skill level. Lethality beats marksmen, madness beats lightening....its just the way it is...pyro beats AP most the time...yes its annoying sometimes but it is not possible to make every single class exactly even in every aspect otherwise the game would be extremely boring and would be just a different skin on the same class.

 

I used to think like you...and I found it very frustrating when I couldn't beat certain classes or they had a big advantage...so I rolled a few of those classes and found that they have weaknesses to other classes or in certain situations where the other was strong. Its how the game is....we can whinge and ***** all we like but in all seriousness as far as MMO quality of life goes for a class...powertechs are looking pretty damn good in all regards at the moment and only deserve buffs if other classes get them.

 

I feel some people lose sight (myself included) that other people are just as passionate about other classes as we are about ours and that just because we want something doesn't mean it makes it fair to other classes. In fact, any buff to AP at the point IMO (unless it was a slight buff to retract blade damage or time added to it) would be excessive and unwarranted. Yes, I understand they have a hard time beating a pyro, but how often do you 1 v 1 against a pyro or even node guard for that matter? This game isn't about 1 v 1s even though they are lots of fun. It is revolved around 4 v 4 and 8 v 8.

 

Most the time the better player will win in any 1 v 1 anyways. If you lose a 1 v 1, that player is fairly similar to your skill level on the given classes.

 

On a sidenote when I heard sorcs were getting buffed I was really happy...but then I was very sad when I realized I like playing PT, Mara, Sniper too. That's how people would feel if AP or Pyro got a buff...they would be think "wow - now how the fk am I going to beat them?"

Edited March 6, 2014 by Kooziejr

[Brunner_Venda]

I used to run AP, and decided to jump in the pyro bandwagon because it is simply a superior 1v1 spec by a long shot. Pyro makes a great node guard, although not quite as well as a tank. With shoulder cannon, pyro shield, and the ability to destroy most sins or DPS ops 1v1, it does fine.

 

My other main class is an MM sniper (the devs favorite beloved child - and not complaining), and as much as I love my assault VG, it's a little bit OP. I know exactly what you 're feeling, especially since my second favorite toon is getting five seconds of god-mode if I spec lethality.

 

Without changing the damage or defense on AP, the best we can do for it is to change a few of the cooldowns, especially shoulder cannon. Retractable blade would help the PVE damage, but wouldn't affect PVP much. Same with changing prototype cylinders (currently 1% DPS increase. Yay).

 

To be honest though, tanks need more quality of life love than AP.