PvP Healing, by far the worst experience I've ever had as a gamer

[Ganymedea]

Healing was out of control in WoW. I can only comment about pvp during Wotlk and not Cataclysm, but healers were stupid op if the player was good.

 

My assassination or subtlety spec rogue literally could not kill a geared resto druid, had to be perfect on interrupts and cc's to kill a good resto sham and no way in hell kill a good disc priest. I'm talking about 2200+ level arena players, not scrubs.

 

Some people think a healer should be this nigh unkillable being. As if that's balanced...

 

I do believe that a healer 1v1 against another should "barely" be capable of keep himself topped off if he devotes all his time and resources to healing himself. A healer should also be able to keep a player 100% while fighting just one other guy. Anything more than that and healers enter the realm of op.

 

If you can tank 2 people as a healer or keep one guy going strong against 2 or more people then the balance is out of wack.

 

Healers and tanks in SWTOR are abit underappreciated atm. Alot of people don't realize how crucial these specs are and won't for awhile.

 

My immortal jugg gets an mvp vote maybe 1 in 3 games and that's dealing +50k damage while spamming taunt, aoe slow and guarding for +50k damage at level 20. That may not sound like much when you have Bounty Hunters aoe spamming 200k, but I can assure you I did a hell of alot more for the team. Same goes for healers. When I've had a decent healer watch my back while I guard him for 55% damage reduction we have rolled people.

 

People don't realize yet, but they will. WoW had nothing even close to comparable to a tank with a 55% damage reduction shield for an ally + a 30% damage dealing reduction if the taunted player attacks the guarded ally. I've caught jedi shadows beating down an imperial player and my team mate has 20% hp while the shadow has +80% and then I guard my team mate and taunt the enemy. The enemy's damage is now reduced effectively by 85% which basically neuters his damage. It's funny watching the almost dead guy then proceed to kill while I just use taunt, aoe slow etc.

 

I don't play a healer, but I assume it's much the same.

I agree to an extent, but realize that there really is no stalemate with healing. Healers run out of mana/force power. DPSers by and large have an infinite supply.

 

In most of the duels I've been in, I run out of force power well before the DPSer is no longer able to DPS. I even used a pot. Thus, 1v1 healer can never win. That's kind of ******.

Edited December 26, 2011 by Ganymedea

[Blizark]

Healer survivability is more dependent on your team than it is in wow. If the enemy team is coordinated you're going to get destroyed unless your own team is coordinated. Having just one tank protect you is a huge boon to survivability.

 

Actually its not really any different than rated bgs or high level arena in wow.

Edited December 26, 2011 by Blizark

[Chiricahua]

Honestly, it's not even fun.

 

I'm hardly bad or a beginner (2700 exp Resto Druid), but I can't even begin to describe how awful PvP healing is in this game. I won't even get into the raid frames and totally unresponsive targeting system. Right now my Operative is 44 so I have all my abilities and it's still crap. Every single random DPS baddie can easily knock off 30-50% of my health in a global so it's impossible to keep up and then you just get interrupted/cc'ed to hell. Juking the interrupt? Good luck figuring that out!

 

It's not a positioning issue. It's not a l2p issue either.

 

It's just not fun being completely helpless without serious peels and even then healing is totally underwhelming.

 

You are right. Healing needs to be uninteruptible, and the heals need to be AOE. In fact, one of the 3 heals for each class needs to be tweeked to make it larger.

[Sarkahorus]

It all comes with leveling up. After around lvl 38, some gear adjustment and a good 40 k worth of credits spendt respeccing my commado medic really started to make a difference in warfronts.

[Vinushka]

You might be 50 now, OP, but when you're not capped, there's a lot of things you might not notice before becoming more familiarized with them. Hell I'm not capped, but just now getting into my mid 30's I'm starting to see a lot of crazy **** that blows my mind. Such as the different gimmicks of other classes and specs. I think it's Mercs or one of the BH types who spams you with rockets on like a 1 or 1.5 sec cast that debuffs your Armor repeatedly and stacks. All they do is just perch and spam that crap over and over until you're ready to be annihilated by their big hitter. I -heard- it was a -20% armor debuff too per stack, but I haven't confirmed that. It probably is though. Insane amounts of skill to play that class, right?

 

 

You might be saying "What does that have to do with me getting blown up healing?" Well by themselves, you can probably heal through it. However, if even a lowbie JK or Sith Juggernaut rolls up on you and hits you with Ravage right after that, you're gonna take insane amounts of dmg. Likewise for something like a Concealment Operative's Hidden Strike (That will floor you on your *** for 3 secs too) or an Acid coated Backstab. And forget about what happens if a Sniper locks on you after your armor's all gone. Basically, if you hear what sounds like an RPG/Rocket going off around you, and explosions are going off on you, consider yourself debuffed.

 

 

It's not so much the abilities that're ****** you 1v1, as it is what happens when certain things are stacked on you. If you don't get someone off you fast, and let them get these debuffs on you, you're basically paddling up ****'s creek. The only thing that can probably save you is having a tank class on you, spamming his guard, and -30% dmg buffs on you while you're rolling those heals out on yourself. Even then it'd still be wise to throw your CCs at whoever's attacking you in melee, and LOS anyone who's ranged blasting you. Being 2700 in WoW, you should know all about LOSing.

 

 

You really can't just go Healer + DPS in this game and expect to dominate easily. A tank helps sooo much to round out the power playing setup, that it's almost manditory you have one working with you and your partner. That's one of the only PVP things they did right in this game (making Tanks have a purpose.) They forgot to make the Tank actually be able to do stuff on his own though (Unless of course you're a Bounty Hunter or Trooper in which case you're golden. No love for the JKs and SW though.)

 

 

The other thing is gear and gear difference. Gear quality is making all the difference now in PVP now that people are hitting 50 left and right. If you're fighting people who're 50 and have it, and you don't, don't expect to win. The odds are stacked against you. There's a particular Concealment Op on my server who's been 50 for awhile, and is rocking some insane gear already. Some of my friends say he floors them for 5K on a hidden strike. (Though I'm thinking it's probably that + an Acid Coated Backstab. I can't be sure.) Guy single handedly wins games though. When you have that type of item level, you can expect your healing to be far more effective. The high Alacrity should make your direct heals and HoTs roll out way faster, and the increased crit rate will make them count. The other thing you could try (and I don't know if it works) is purging any armor debuffs you have with that crap we get as Operatives. I don't remember the name, but I know it says it removes 2 negative tech (and something else) effects. It's instant cast, so it doesn't hurt to try. Same goes for any slows people might throw on you. You probably know more about what it can do than me though since you're 44 and going at the PVP hard. Me, not so much.

 

 

The main problem coming from WoW to this is you really don't feel like you have full control of your character at any given micro-second like we did in that game. That, and it lags to all hell in Warzones. It'll take some getting used to. Just don't try to play with the same mindset as that game, where you can try to psyche people out with canceling casts and whatnot. It won't work. Some Sage tried that on me, and all she got for it was me putting foot to ***, and not letting her get more than one heal off. But I found it entertaining, cause she tried to do all she could with what she had against me. This engine just doesn't allow it. If it makes ya feel better, I did fight a 50 Jedi Sage as a 21 Juggernaut, and unloaded everything on him to still see him with 90% HP. I was like "O_O" His entire team was that durable too. All 50s. That's pretty much when I realized I had to hit max level and get geared up on my Operative to do work on these people.

[Nightfocus]

Dude we care a **** , at Begin wow hadnt arena and such stuff , it was a complete chaos like this , AND IT WAS THE BEST TIMES , then arena came , they changed classes via arena matters and the game became the biggest **** ever

 

So **** off with ur 2700 exp ^^ and manage , i mean , i love healing in the battle its simply awesome its chaos ye , but thats good , its even mostly balanced .

 

 

Thats one of the best pvp systems , except that lvl seperation should maybe get introduced , like 50s vs 50s , but atm there aint enough 50s , etc , the game is new , let it grow jeez

[-Kazim-]

l2p...........

[Oghier]

After healing on my Sith Inquisitor since level 10 I think these things would make PVP healing much, much better:

 

1) Raid frames not bugging out and showing people about to die at 100%.

 

2) Raid frames graying out if a target is out of range OR out of line of sight.

 

3) If smart camera could be disabled (always fun to healing on the move and be completely unable to see what's behind you).

 

4) Target of target unit frame.

 

5) More medals for healing.

 

There's a few more but they pale in comparison to these (for me).

 

My experience with an operative leads me to the same list.

 

In the meantime, my tank-specced BH feels *far* more capable and fun in PvP.

[Nightfocus]

and something more , im Operative lvl 21 , i tanked 3 dpsers last time , i played wow til 2k on TBC as Ret pala .

 

 

I mean , how can u have real problems ? why are CC there ? Why is positioning good etc ? ... rly , it is a ltp issue^^

[iluran]

As a 42 Sorc Healer, I can Bullshiat on you, I am easily one of the most valuable players in a Warzone. But, I am in Vent with 2-3 others from my clan, and working as a team.

 

Even in a pug, I an capping the ball, planting or stopping the Bomb from being planted, and capturing control points. I am very happy, being top Healer 99.9% of the time and Making the difference in the game, and my team winning or losing.

 

opps, deleted 1 -4 as I dont want to tell people my little secrets, to my success.

 

5) Don't just heal bot. Rotate in some damage and all the CC you can lay out.

 

6) Spending your time, here on the forums whinning about how bad you play SWTOR, cause your were so UBER FRACKING AWESOME SAUCE in WoW, is not making you better at SWTOR.

 

7) And yes, as a healer standing still healing in a Warzone, your gonna FING die, sometimes a lot. The other team is going to search you out and kill you. Its funny sometimes I have 4 enemies chasing me around the whole Huttball map to kill me. But, guess what WE JUST SCORED. You job is to help the TEAM win. By, CC. By, Heals. By, Damage, or by Dying. What ever leads to victory.

 

Enjoy you stay in SWTOR, if you cand handle the heat of a lazer blaster in the arse, there is always your 2700 Retardo Druid....

 

Only one thing to say - get rid of the shield sorc are spamming at the moment and see what the qq will be about.

[big_aug]

I just heal with my DPS spec. Problem solved. Pretty effective too.

[Jerlot]

Honestly, it's not even fun.

 

I'm hardly bad or a beginner (2700 exp Resto Druid), but I can't even begin to describe how awful PvP healing is in this game. I won't even get into the raid frames and totally unresponsive targeting system. Right now my Operative is 44 so I have all my abilities and it's still crap. Every single random DPS baddie can easily knock off 30-50% of my health in a global so it's impossible to keep up and then you just get interrupted/cc'ed to hell. Juking the interrupt? Good luck figuring that out!

 

It's not a positioning issue. It's not a l2p issue either.

 

It's just not fun being completely helpless without serious peels and even then healing is totally underwhelming.

 

Ummmm, ya.... i know you say your are experienced but I think you might be doing something wrong. My lvl 24 Operative rocks in PvP. Its actually the first time ever I preferred to play a healing class or a dmg class in PvP. i dont want to sit here and say "L2P" but come on. Healers rock in pvp right now. As a matter of fact, it looks like the team with the healers is the winning team.

[Jerlot]

I abandoned my commando in part because of this. Healers in pvp contribute next to nothing 90% of the time. I think I ran into one pair of level 50 commandos thatgave us a little trouble in huttball once and that was it.

 

While wows healers are ridiculous this game is the other extreme. There is next to no point bringing in a healer into a warzone.

 

Seriously? I seen 5 people take over a warzone just because two of them were healers. Guys need to learn how to play them is all. I'm not even that good at healing and we win more then lose when i bring my healer.

[indelible]

From what I can tell, healers aren't supposed to be able to out heal damage.

 

I think that it's pretty clear that healers are supposed to make killing them take a long, long time. I've come up against some pretty good healers in PvP and the best of them make killing them so very tedious and lengthy... that it just isn't worth the hassle, unless you're purposefully removing them from a fight.

 

Yeah, the CC is a problem... but all that means is that you need to learn how to efficiently apply your CC breaker. I see loads and loads of people just pop their anti-CC at the first sign of CC... on full health... with full resources... with loads of back up. It's a ridiculous thing to do. If you're on full health and CCd... stay CCd. You can save the break for a much more crucial moment.

 

I fear saying it but it does sound like an L2P issue to me

[indelible]

Only one thing to say - get rid of the shield sorc are spamming at the moment and see what the qq will be about.

 

LOL

 

That shield absorbs very little damage. EVERY class I've encountered has some kind of "immunity" buff that they can pop that reduces incoming damage, or increases avoidance, or whatever. EVERY. SINGLE. ONE.

 

Just because people don't know how to deal with sorcerers doesn't mean they need nerfing

 

It's going to happen though. I can see the mounting QQ.

[Repefe]

The issue with healers is at lower levels without instant heals and defense cooldowns they are not very effective ... later on they are game changing.

[Chalta]

After healing on my Sith Inquisitor since level 10 I think these things would make PVP healing much, much better:

 

1) Raid frames not bugging out and showing people about to die at 100%.

 

2) Raid frames graying out if a target is out of range OR out of line of sight.

 

3) If smart camera could be disabled (always fun to healing on the move and be completely unable to see what's behind you).

 

4) Target of target unit frame.

 

5) More medals for healing.

 

There's a few more but they pale in comparison to these (for me).

 

This. This! One hundred times this.

 

Also the fact that "T" cannot be bound to set/switch focus target. Well it can be bound, but don't expect it to work.

Edited December 26, 2011 by Chalta

[CynicalByDesign]

Cynical,

I've been reading a lot about tanks in pvp lately, maybe more of them would balance out the play a bit? Not sure if it would, but with a sort of paper, rock, scissors approach to pvp it seems like we have a million scissors (dps), a few, papers (heals), and maybe 1 rock (tank) if any. Maybe once people start feeling out the dynamics of the strategies and teamwork needed, they'll spec more tank so that the pvp population is more 1/3 of each hopefully and more varied, and poor healers won't feel dps wraith as much.

 

Sadly, tanks are probably going to be the rarest class, just like any MMO, and from what I've seen its true.

 

Its not that I die quickly. I don't. Its that my heals are not worth casting. If someone is being targeted they are taking far more damage than I can heal for. Which is on average 1800-2200. Basically, I can heal them for one hit every 3 seconds. Are you serious? Or I can reroll as DPS(or apparently a sith inq) and actually contribute. Its pointless to heal myself. I just meditate afterwards, or die. Its a much faster way to recuperate. I've never thought that in any other game. Does that seem like a problem?

 

Healers do not do enough to justify rolling that class for PvP. They especially do not get any love for casting interrupts or shields.

 

However, clearly, this thread is filled with DPS who just want to run a muck. That's fine. Just don't whine when there are no healers left.

[Mhak]

lmao, I read up until the point where he said he was a resto druid, then clicked reply to type this -

 

Healing in this game is hard. You can't keep one person alive through an entire cataclysmic genocide brought on by a million-man army here like you can in WoW.

 

That's your issue OP. Healing in this game doesn't mean you can keep anybody you want to alive forever. Just doesn't work that way. Mechanics are different, and if your target gets focused, unless he's a tank chances are you can't keep him up by yourself.

 

Get used to it. This game requires a little but more skill then healing someone eternally while hoping he can burn people down.

Edited December 26, 2011 by Mhak

[Roycus]

Agree with raidframes not showing accurate health.

And yes being a healer takes actaully some skills in SWTOR

[Azraelor]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAAHHAHA OP thinks he can just heal with nothing but HoT's drood style.

 

 

OP - this is a l2p scenario.

If you play a healer class and you cannot keep someone alive in a 1v1 scenario - chances are you are doing it wrong.

 

 

 

BTW - nice job on trolling, I LOL'ed. Hard.

[tonykart]

Besides the frame issues, i've hearrd only good things from healers on SWTOR. But, then again, I only know good healers, so you probably suck. If something is too hard for you, don't blame the game. It's people like you who ruin games for people like me, because eventually as my skill grows and grows to its limitless potential, yours wallows down in the bowels of terribleness. Then people like you band together, stard threads and idiot companies listen and respond and then take all the skill out of the game.

 

Nothing is worse than easy and/or overpowered healing. A good healer makes a HUGE impact. if you choose a class that takes intelligence and savvy, first make sure those two features are part of your arsenal of talents. If they aren't, choose ranged DPS.

[Chalta]

... as my skill grows and grows to its limitless potential, yours wallows down in the bowels of terribleness. Then people like you band together, stard threads and idiot companies listen and respond and then take all the skill out of the game.

 

Wow. Humble much?

 

Trust me. As a healer who is often MVP of the match, healing is incredibly painful at times, especially in PVP. Much of it is the UI experience, a lot of it is in-game score tracking and rewards, and for me, some of it is class balance, and some of it is warzone design.

 

Some warzone game types really punish a healer quite significantly if the team doesn't gel immediately.

 

I quit Huttball upon joining unless I'm in a pre-made group. The damage can't be healed through on the carrier, and it's constant respawning every 2 minutes against a decent team. Not to mention being tossed and pulled around like a ragdoll.

Edited December 26, 2011 by Chalta

[MrOuija]

WoW has overpowered healing. SWTOR won't have that.

L2p

[tonykart]

Wow. Humble much?

 

Trust me. As a healer who is often MVP of the match, healing is incredibly painful at times, especially in PVP. Much of it is the UI experience, a lot of it is in-game score tracking and rewards, and for me, some of it is class balance, and some of it is warzone design.

 

Some warzone game types really punish a healer quite significantly if the team doesn't gel immediately.

 

I quit Huttball upon joining unless I'm in a pre-made group. The damage can't be healed through on the carrier, and it's constant respawning every 2 minutes against a decent team. Not to mention being tossed and pulled around like a ragdoll.

 

I don't doubt that healing an unorganized bunch of ******e is beyond challenging in this game... but shouldn't it be? Do you really want it to be different? Think about it.