Simple idea to balance Distortion Field

[Flearos]

Simple fix? Easy, evasion as a whole shouldn't protect your shields.

Shield penetration should only penetrate 1 layer deep too. Both layers up? Penetration damage hits the inner ring. outer ring down? It goes through to the hull.

 

Yes this. Also at a minimum if you not moving your evasion should be 0%.

Edited January 23, 2014 by Flearos

[Sharee]

Then your aim sucks or your not close enough to use them in optimal range.

 

That absolutely didn't make sense.

 

You say he kills twice as fast as me.

I say he does not.

You say 'try a burst laser'

I say i am already using it (that's the reason why he does not kill twice as fast as me, i kill just as fast)

 

And to that you reply what? Your aim sucks?

[Elly_Dawn]

going head to head aka Jousting is part of dogfights it's gonna happen...

 

if you can't hit a stationary target i feel sorry for your team... DF only lasts a few seconds, fly past them, make them waste it, then decelerate (crazy i know ) and flip the script on them and nail em to the wall... nerfs don't need to be made to cover for ones lack of skill or strategy...

Edited January 23, 2014 by Elly_Dawn

[Therael]

Yes this. Also at a minimum if you not moving your evasion should be 0%.

 

It brings light armor/evasion builds in line with the rest; a hull's armor shouldn't provide protection for shields, the other two (+hull health and hull dr) don't and provides a hard counter in missles (and a counter-counter build in df's missle lock).

[Altheran]

Shield penetration should only penetrate 1 layer deep too. Both layers up? Penetration damage hits the inner ring. outer ring down? It goes through to the hull.

 

While it sounds nice, the problem I see with this idea, is that I guess that in reality the inner and outer shields are nothing but an eye-pleasing display, and is no actual mechanic.

 

0% < X < 12.5% = Red/-

12.5% < X < 25% = Orange/-

25% < X < 37.5% = Yellow/-

37.5% < X < 50% = Green/-

50% < X < 62.5% = Green/Red

62.5% < X < 75% = Green/Orange

75% < X < 87.5% = Green/Yellow

87.5% < X < 100% = Green/Green

100% < X = Green/Blue (Overcharged shields)

[JadedJasper]

I am really not seeing anyone run quickcharge, and I super don't think that's good advice at all. While the enemy pilot can disengage during your distortion, it at least costs him a run he was planning on dpsing during. Then in the brief window from the end of distortion to the next availability of it, you can use all manner of scout tricks- systems, copilot, boost, engine- to ensure that you are not a tasty target, in addition to the common ones available to everyone (run behind a space potato).

I use Quick Charge on my Flash all the time. The extra Thrust regen helps offset having Blaster Overcharge instead of Booster Recharge. And it's much more handy in a close dogfight.

 

I do like Distortion Field on my Nova, which is usually fast enough to just disengage rather than got into a dogfight. It's handy for quickly smoking players who like to play dig in and play turret around a Satellite, new players not savvy enough to avoid trading blasters while it's up, turrets, or gunships with a bead on you as your close. However when I face an experienced player with Quick Charge it means my best bet is typically to run, which is why I'd now rather have Quick Charge there too -- it's nice to have the option to dogfight without being at a disadvantage.

[JadedJasper]

Oh, and when Nova Dives get EMP Field in 2.6 I'm definitely going to want the extra Thrust Regen from Quick Charge shields. That ability just looks brutal! Might even make Sabotage Probe worthwhile.

[mr_sim]

going head to head aka Jousting is part of dogfights it's gonna happen...

 

if you can't hit a stationary target i feel sorry for your team... DF only lasts a few seconds, fly past them, make them waste it, then decelerate (crazy i know ) and flip the script on them and nail em to the wall... nerfs don't need to be made to cover for ones lack of skill or strategy...

 

Yup and scouts could still head to head with distortion field even if the change I'm proposing occurs and things woild be exactly as you say.

 

Things are not as you say though at them moment, at the moment you don't survive the head to head because of the scouts High Burst dps.

 

Simple fact Distortion field is an option so a nerf that affects it so it can't be used offensively is not a major nerf not by any means. Many players in this forum agree that scouts fill too many roles. Nerfing Distortion fields as a offensive move Will by no means what so ever cheapen or break the class. It merely closes an exploit that I'm confident that Bioware does not want to exist.

[JadedJasper]

Actually, some of us survive head to head vs. Distortion Field all the time. Pretty much every match. It's really not that difficult to make someone closing miss.

 

And if you can't use Distortion Field offensively it's immediately 3rd rate -- nobody would use it over Quick Charge.

Edited January 23, 2014 by JadedJasper

[mr_sim]

And if you can't use Distortion Field offensively it's immediately 3rd rate -- nobody would use it over Quick Charge.

 

You point is?

 

Also your wrong too, It gives missile break too, and you can use it to get an approach on GS.

 

Head to head and stand still turreting violates everything a scout should be.

 

Scouts are quick nimble glass cannons.

 

I'm a sniper in Ground game do you think I'm happy my AOE is about to get nerfed and become third rate. I'll still play on though.

[Verain]

It merely closes an exploit that I'm confident that Bioware does not want to exist.

 

LOL why on earth would you assume this?

 

Calling "pressing 2" an exploit? Are you HIGH?

[Elly_Dawn]

i would only agree if DF was in fact a problem, as it stands it really is not... if you don't have the skill to pull off the little maneuver i described above then you can always break off to another target and come back to the original one after about 6 seconds... if you can't target cycle to find a certain pilot and fly effectively, practice you'll get better... but really DF is not a problem if you know what you're doing, it's short with a fairly long cool-down, too long in my opinion... if you latch onto them and don't let go they always go down before they can pop another... resource management is a major part of this game you have to psych your opponent into wasting theirs early, usually when they have someone dug into them they burn resources just trying to get away...

[JadedJasper]

You point is?

Well, if you're going to be like that I guess I'll stop beating around the bush...

 

My point is: Learn to Play -- Distortion Field just isn't as good as you think it is. This isn't some blatantly overpowered and difficult to avoid effect like Ion Rail tap lock down.

 

Again, while certain people have trouble avoiding Distortion Field head to head, plenty don't (funny how you ignored that part of my argument!). Such people would do well to figure out what they're doing wrong before crying Nerf.

[Sharee]

As a FF pilot I don't anticipate you agreeing with any attempted changes to your beloved scout though.

 

Dude i just told you a few posts higher that i am using quickcharge shield on my Flashfire.

[Therael]

While it sounds nice, the problem I see with this idea, is that I guess that in reality the inner and outer shields are nothing but an eye-pleasing display, and is no actual mechanic.

 

0% < X < 12.5% = Red/-

12.5% < X < 25% = Orange/-

25% < X < 37.5% = Yellow/-

37.5% < X < 50% = Green/-

50% < X < 62.5% = Green/Red

62.5% < X < 75% = Green/Orange

75% < X < 87.5% = Green/Yellow

87.5% < X < 100% = Green/Green

100% < X = Green/Blue (Overcharged shields)

 

Well, that's unfortunate. seemed like a nice way to buff strikes and make charged plating usable.

[Flearos]

That absolutely didn't make sense.

 

You say he kills twice as fast as me.

I say he does not.

You say 'try a burst laser'

I say i am already using it (that's the reason why he does not kill twice as fast as me, i kill just as fast)

 

And to that you reply what? Your aim sucks?

 

I was under the impression you were talking about fighting a distortion scout from a strike. I was wrong. Given your stalwart defense of the skill i suppose i should have known.

 

My point still stands that scouts kill twice as any other ship. So claiming distortion is balanced because the window to kill a scout is twice as long as distortion lasts (6 up, 14 down) is a ridiculous statement. You cant have faster speed, faster yaw and roll, faster ttk (time to kill), and superior defenses all at the same time.

[JadedJasper]

Hilarious. Sharee's pointed out several times now that he's not using Distortion Field, because he likes Quick Charge Shield better, and you're still insinuating he's merely trying to protect his favorite toy... Edited January 23, 2014 by JadedJasper

[Gavin_Kelvar]

Yup and scouts could still head to head with distortion field even if the change I'm proposing occurs and things woild be exactly as you say.

 

Things are not as you say though at them moment, at the moment you don't survive the head to head because of the scouts High Burst dps.

 

Simple fact Distortion field is an option so a nerf that affects it so it can't be used offensively is not a major nerf not by any means. Many players in this forum agree that scouts fill too many roles. Nerfing Distortion fields as a offensive move Will by no means what so ever cheapen or break the class. It merely closes an exploit that I'm confident that Bioware does not want to exist.

 

Agreed. Currently no shield other than this (for dogfighting ship classes) gives you 100% offensive invulnerability. Even charged plating only mitigates without fully nullifying damage and that powerful mitigation comes at the high cost of shield bleedthrough + having a 100% counter with armor piercing weapons.

 

As you said it would leave the defensive utility in place while removing some offensive capability so they can't fill nearly as many offensive roles as they currently do. (and arguably the 100% offensive invulnerability is one reason they currently are unbalanced by filling so many offensive roles).

[Ramalina]

You cant have faster speed, faster yaw and roll, faster ttk (time to kill), and superior defenses all at the same time.

 

Sure you can, just fly a Flashfire.

 

Honestly, as someone that prefers flying strike fighters, defensive cooldowns don't bother me much.

 

As a strike pilot my quality of life nerf menu wishlist would look something like this:

 

• Reduce Ion Cannon splash effect, and engine power drain.
  
• Reduce peak burst dps in Flashfire/Sting/Cartel scouts when cooldowns are stacked.
  
• At least for strike fighters, further reduce missile lock times or increase range and firing arc. Especially a problem on the strikes with two secondary weapons systems. Getting a lock is difficult enough with anything other than cluster missiles that it's somewhat gimping the missile strike fighters' dps potential compared to other ships.
  
• A plate of braised nerf medallions with some pasta and a salad. (Hey, this is Star Wars, we have to include the other kind of nerf on any nerf list.)
  

 

Basically I don't see a real problem with the temporary invulnerability, it's the extreme burst damage. An interceptor build scout should be able to get on your tail and be unshakable. Flight style wise they should really be more of a sustained dps build than a strike fighter. Where are they finding room on the spaceframe for the hardware you need to generate that kind of high output anyhow?

 

Of couse, that wouldn't work because bioware broke close range dogfighting by making it almost impossible to hit at close range. 250 m behind a target and in a turning battle is what A-wing style space fighters are for, trust the SWTOR designers to make sure that's not a feasible option.

Edited January 23, 2014 by Ramalina

[Altheran]

Well, that's unfortunate. seemed like a nice way to buff strikes and make charged plating usable.

 

I admit it was a good idea. Maybe the devs can make so that it's more than a dispaly...

 

I think the simpliest way to make Charged Plating useful would be to just remove it's innate bleedthrough. Very strong shields, but a one trick pony. Once destroyed there would only be the activable ability to buy time.

 

But then that would be Directional Shields that would be subpar compared to Charged Plating.

 

But whatever, i think Directional Shields also has to change, it's too clunky.

I'd change it into "Shield Inverter" that would instantly swap the front and back, without trying to favoritize one side's regen or the other. I also think that one of the upgrades should be that front and back shields have a independent regen delay (if it's not already the case). As result, used efficiently you can have up to 200% capacity on one side, and the emptied side starts to refill immediately if it hasn't been touched recently.

It may or not have a 6s effect where damage don't stop shield regeneration so that it increases further its capacity. The downside is would be that it doesn't do well against attacks that come from both sides, and once the shields are emptied, no further tricks.

 

As result, we'd have :

• Distortion Field : The "Oh crap !" avoid attacks.
  
• Quick-charge Shields : Regen tactics
  
• Charged Plating : Strait all-purpose tankiness
  
• Shield Inverter : Super jousting-tankiness.
  

Edited January 23, 2014 by Altheran

[Flearos]

Sure you can, just fly a Flashfire.

 

Touche well played.

 

What i meant was, in the interest of balance i don't think one ship should have all that. I fly a strike too (unless someone burst/bypasses me then i jump on my flashfire and kindly return the favor, only to them, for the rest of the game) and missiles are pretty close to fine. Clusters are in a good spot, i would like to see protons increased to 15,000m with range "trait", and concussions maybe shave off .2 seconds on the lock on but add probably .5 to the cd.

 

O and charge platting.. fix the armor pierce bug half the weapons having 100% pierce... someone must have missed a decimal point and increase skill duration by 5-10 seconds and maybe.. maybe its useful.. but this isthe wrong thread for such topics..

Edited January 23, 2014 by Flearos

[Nemarus]

The issue isn't with Distortion Field's active ability.... it's with the passive 41% evasion you can get with it.

[Armonddd]

The issue isn't with Distortion Field's active ability.... it's with the passive 41% evasion you can get with it.

 

I agree. I think Distortion Field would be a reasonably balanced ability if it and engine abilities were the only source of evasion in the game, and both granted 100% evasion for the duration.