Revan vs Darth Maul

[Aurbere]

I don't think Star Wars makes a distinction. It certainly hasn't been confirmed as canon and given that it was never completed I'd assume not. You can watch it

if you like.

 

Interesting. Well, I would assume that it is non canon as well.

[XSUPREMESKILLZX]

The reason TCW Maul is his prime, is because he displays a lot more Force Powers than TPM Maul.

 

He displays somewhat better TK, but their difference in power overall is minimal.

[Darkelefantos]

He displays somewhat better TK, but their difference in power overall is minimal.

 

Considering he's been storing up his rage and hatred for Kenobi for years and was then brought together with his brother who he gets emotionally attached to, which all supports the Dark Side, I'd say the power difference is significant enough.

[Excise]

Revan Reborn vs. TPM Darth Maul, who wins and why? Takes place on a flat open terrain.

 

The audience wins.

[Selenial]

Revans destruction of Nyriss is not a case we can use to determine his own power, he used hers.

 

 

I'd put Revan below maul, I'd say maul would win, I'd rather we not count that filth-on-a-page we call the Revan Novel entirely, but he'd still win.

[LadyKulvax]

He displays somewhat better TK, but their difference in power overall is minimal.

 

No it isnt, Darth Maul displays Force Scream, powerful Force Choke, Dark Rage, Dark Channel and very powerful telekinesis enough to pull down an eta-class shuttle.

 

All of this is in TCW, not in anything beforehand.

[Selenial]

The audience wins.

 

In a revan debate, any observers automatically get trolled into submission...

[Selenial]

No it isnt, Darth Maul displays Force Scream, powerful Force Choke, Dark Rage, Dark Channel and very powerful telekinesis enough to pull down an eta-class shuttle.

 

All of this is in TCW, not in anything beforehand.

 

So.

 

Much.

 

This.

[XSUPREMESKILLZX]

Alright, I can concur with what you're saying. However, about the Nyriss thing, I believe it's credited that Revan's raw power is what destroyed Nyriss, unless that's what they're using to describe tutaminis.

[Selenial]

Alright, I can concur with what you're saying. However, about the Nyriss thing, I believe it's credited that Revan's raw power is what destroyed Nyriss, unless that's what they're using to describe tutaminis.

 

It's tutaminis, and I'd even be wary of counting that...

[Wolfninjajedi]

I guess were overlooking the fact that Maul is much faster than Revan? He would be able to close the gap pretty well and also his reaction time, should be well enough to evade some TK barrages....lighting...why is this a factor now? Reborn Revan didn't use Force Lighting did he? Regardless, I don't see how it would be really helpful seeing as Maul has tanked some lighting in the past, sure it was against a Nightsister but he still did it and the only other instance that I can recall with lighting is against Sidious...but that is a given he wouldn't be able to withstand it.

 

In regards to TK....how powerful is Revan in that area? Not saying TPM Maul has any like WOW feats with TK, but he does have something in it.

 

- Hurling stones/other things

 

- Showing Force Choke

 

- Slammed someone down on a table so hard, their spine snapped

 

- Able to shatter doors

 

Again nothing really Wow, but /shrug. I'm pretty sure with Maul's speed and reaction he can make this into a close quators fight and best Revan fairly easy.

Edited November 26, 2013 by Wolfninjajedi

[Beniboybling]

Alright, I can concur with what you're saying. However, about the Nyriss thing, I believe it's credited that Revan's raw power is what destroyed Nyriss, unless that's what they're using to describe tutaminis.

Tutanimis = contest of raw Force power. Now it was Nyriss' lightining that killed her, but given that Revan overcame it he should technically be capable of the same if not greater.

 

And given that Maul can't even deflect lightning I'd say he'd be a little roasted.

Edited November 26, 2013 by Beniboybling

[Selenial]

Tutanimis = contest of raw Force power. Now it was Nyriss' lightining that killed her, but given that Revan overcame it he should technically be capable of the same if not greater.

 

And given that Maul can't even deflect lightning I'd say he'd be a little roasted.

 

Complete assumption.

 

Tutaminjs makes more sense being more like a conduit, not battle of raw power. That's the whole reason things are ever re-directed...

 

Oh, and by the way, Nyriss was weakened from making the blast herself, it's likely that revan couldn't have done it as easily himself. He was also amped by his sudden surge of memories, he regained them all at once including all his emotions, enough to amp someone's power considerably.

[Beniboybling]

I guess were overlooking the fact that Maul is much faster than Revan? He would be able to close the gap pretty well and also his reaction time, should be well enough to evade some TK barrages....lighting...why is this a factor now? Reborn Revan didn't use Force Lighting did he? Regardless, I don't see how it would be really helpful seeing as Maul has tanked some lighting in the past, sure it was against a Nightsister but he still did it and the only other instance that I can recall with lighting is against Sidious...but that is a given he wouldn't be able to withstand it.

 

In regards to TK....how powerful is Revan in that area? Not saying TPM Maul has any like WOW feats with TK, but he does have something in it.

 

- Hurling stones/other things

 

- Showing Force Choke

 

- Slammed someone down on a table so hard, their spine snapped

 

- Able to shatter doors

 

Again nothing really Wow, but /shrug. I'm pretty sure with Maul's speed and reaction he can make this into a close quators fight and best Revan fairly easy.

Is he? Do we have any evidence to support this? Force Speed and Force power are strongly interrelated, if anything Revan is likely to be faster.

 

And Revan did use Force lightning, when pressed. And his lightning makes Mighella's look like a parlor trick. I seriously doubt Maul could tank the lightning of any accomplished Sith Lord. Its just unlikely.

 

Revan was capable of lifting giant rocks and launching them simultaneously, as well as collapsing large structures. He is also Revan, the 7th most powerful Jedi eveeerrrr. Hint: Maul doesn't make the Sith list.

 

And finally, Revan is a highly accomplished duelist, given that Maul could not even best Padawan Kenobi 'quickly' - which isn't necessarily a point against him but just some proof he isn't a saber demon - I doubt he could Revan.

 

I mean come on is this the same crowd that thought Ventress could beat Maul? I should start taking names...

[Beniboybling]

Complete assumption.

 

Tutaminjs makes more sense being more like a conduit, not battle of raw power. That's the whole reason things are ever re-directed...

 

Oh, and by the way, Nyriss was weakened from making the blast herself, it's likely that revan couldn't have done it as easily himself. He was also amped by his sudden surge of memories, he regained them all at once including all his emotions, enough to amp someone's power considerably.

What's yours, canon fact?

 

Tutanimis involves absorbing the Force attacks of ones opponents and redirecting them, in order to do so one has to be a stronger Force wielder than their opponent. Because they are effectively stopping that energy, and turning it around. Take a look at the examples, Sidious vs Yoda, Sidious vs Marek, Dooku vs Yoda, Revan vs Vitiate - its evident from these outcomes that these are raw contests of strength.

 

Anyway I'm not going to go into why the hell Nyriss was burnt to a crisp by her own Force attack, cause I kinda see that as a bit dumb, but altogether it shows that Revan > Nyriss and Nyriss' lightning is pretty damn powerful.

 

And yeah, emotions, memories, wait who are we dealing with here? Oh yeah Darth Maul.

Edited November 26, 2013 by Beniboybling

[Selenial]

No mine isn't canon fact, hence the word seems. An = sign is a definitive term.

 

Not going to reply to the rest of it, because that's still complete assumption. A conduit doesn't need more power than what it's redirecting. Marek let the spire on Kamino flow through him, are you telling me he could have flat out absorbed or contained that power?

 

You missed the point of the last part, revan was still amped in his duel with Nyriss.

 

Overall, no real evidence in that fight whatsoever, other than Karpyshyn really needs to follow a new career, so let's move on.

 

Ps: that was TPM maul, and I made it abundantly clear beforehand I simply followed ventress for the fan girl in me. You were beating me with the maul arguments, until you turned.

[Darkelefantos]

He is also Revan, the 7th most powerful Jedi eveeerrrr. Hint: Maul doesn't make the Sith list.

 

This would only be a point if #1 Jedi = #1 Sith and so forth, but they have no direct relationship, nothing scales them. I took a look at those lists, #7 for the Jedi is Revan, #7 for Sith is Darth Krayt. The fact that someone as powerful as Krayt ranks in #7 should show you that this is no demerit for Maul. Au contraire, the power differences between the Jedi seem much more extreme - #7 is Revan, #8 is Meetra Surik, who is a weakling compared to Revan.

Not to mention, isn't Maul like #6 in that Sith Lightsaber Duelist thread nobody ever bothered finishing?

 

Anyway, for all my love for Darth Maul, we are talking about Revan Reborn here, which is probably Revan's actual prime - the powers of light and dark side, using the Force in balance. And his immense Force potential is well noted. Revan wins this, he will probably not beat Maul in a Lightsaber duel outright, but his Force usage is superior.

[Aurbere]

Has anyone considered that Nyriss was empowered by the dark side nexus of Dromund Kaas (and that Revan likely was as well, considering how poorly Surik performed in comparison even though pre-Revan novel she could have been considered his equal)?

 

Rambling in parenthesis...

[Beniboybling]

No mine isn't canon fact, hence the word seems. An = sign is a definitive term.

 

Not going to reply to the rest of it, because that's still complete assumption. A conduit doesn't need more power than what it's redirecting. Marek let the spire on Kamino flow through him, are you telling me he could have flat out absorbed or contained that power?

 

You missed the point of the last part, revan was still amped in his duel with Nyriss.

 

Overall, no real evidence in that fight whatsoever, other than Karpyshyn really needs to follow a new career, so let's move on.

 

Ps: that was TPM maul, and I made it abundantly clear beforehand I simply followed ventress for the fan girl in me. You were beating me with the maul arguments, until you turned.

Galen Marek can take a lot more than just a bolt of lightning, he's an extremely powerful Force user - regardless its not a very accurate comparison as it is not strictly Force energy.

 

Conduits have limits, if they are charged with more than they can handle, they are destroyed, the same applies here.

 

Anyway I didn't miss anything, all I'm saying is its not very relevant is Revan is just considerably more powerful than Maul. No real room for debate their I'm afraid...

 

P.S. And yeah, that wasn't necessarily directed at you. What I'm really saying is that if Ventress has the slightest chance of defeating Maul, Revan kinda takes the ticket - he's a more powerful Force user and probably better duelist.

[Beniboybling]

This would only be a point if #1 Jedi = #1 Sith and so forth, but they have no direct relationship, nothing scales them. I took a look at those lists, #7 for the Jedi is Revan, #7 for Sith is Darth Krayt. The fact that someone as powerful as Krayt ranks in #7 should show you that this is no demerit for Maul. Au contraire, the power differences between the Jedi seem much more extreme - #7 is Revan, #8 is Meetra Surik, who is a weakling compared to Revan.

Not to mention, isn't Maul like #6 in that Sith Lightsaber Duelist thread nobody ever bothered finishing?

 

Anyway, for all my love for Darth Maul, we are talking about Revan Reborn here, which is probably Revan's actual prime - the powers of light and dark side, using the Force in balance. And his immense Force potential is well noted. Revan wins this, he will probably not beat Maul in a Lightsaber duel outright, but his Force usage is superior.

I know, I know - just trying to make the point clear that 1. Revan is immensely powerful in the Force 2. Maul is not so much. But anyway I think Revan could give Krayt a run for his money in terms of Force ability - not sure exactly where they would stand if compared - so it does have some level of accuracy, some level.

 

And Meetra is no weakling, that's just the mess Drew left that we've been trying to clear up... she's actually quite powerful indeed - what being at the least Traya's equal and all.

 

And yeah! I should try and get that thread rebooted again, but in lost traction.

[sell-dog]

Oh, and by the way, Nyriss was weakened from making the blast herself, it's likely that revan couldn't have done it as easily himself. He was also amped by his sudden surge of memories, he regained them all at once including all his emotions, enough to amp someone's power considerably.

 

He was almost unconscious by the sudden flow of memories and had been constantly drugged for 3 years. The novel just says that he finally gathered himself in time to face Nyriss thus wasn't 100% or amped. I think one of the indirect reasons why the trio takes a few hours break before going against the Emperor is to let Revan fully get in the zone.

[LadyKulvax]

TCW Maul would beat Revan IMO, Revan might be a skilled duellist, but Darth Maul is an assassin trained to perfection by Darth Sidious himself, he tanked both Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon, both are powerful Jedi even if they weren't in their prime.

 

Let us not forget that Maul schooled Obi-Wan in their second engagement and managed to stand up to Sidious for a considerable amount of time, for awhile I thought Sidious was playing with them, but the literary version of the events makes it clear, that he was focusing entirely on Maul and playing with Savage.

 

So we know this: Maul is a much better duellist than Kit Fisto, Saesee Tiin and Agen Kolar, all high class swordsmen of the Jedi High Council, they lasted seconds against Sidious, Maul lasted a very considerable amount of time by comparison.

 

Revan might have been considered a highly skilled duellist in his time, but we all know that the best duellists were around in Maul's time and Maul could compete with the best Form III duellist ever and hold his own against one of the best Sith duellists ever, Darth Sidious.

 

Darth Maul is clearly the better duellist here by a large margin.

Edited November 26, 2013 by LadyKulvax

[Darkelefantos]

And Meetra is no weakling, that's just the mess Drew left that we've been trying to clear up... she's actually quite powerful indeed - what being at the least Traya's equal and all.

 

Well, even you can't change canon, Beni

 

And I was comparing her to Revan, specifically. She's obviously not weak in general. If Revan goes all out though, the gap in power between him and Meetra is immense. The power gap between Darth Krayt and Darth Traya (I assume you changed Traya to #8 like you wanted to) wouldn't seem so incredible.

 

At any rate, Maul, TPM Maul especially (although that one at least gets to use his favorite weapon), doesn't defeat Revan Reborn.

[Beniboybling]

Well, even you can't change canon, Beni

 

And I was comparing her to Revan, specifically. She's obviously not weak in general. If Revan goes all out though, the gap in power between him and Meetra is immense. The power gap between Darth Krayt and Darth Traya (I assume you changed Traya to #8 like you wanted to) wouldn't seem so incredible.

 

At any rate, Maul, TPM Maul especially (although that one at least gets to use his favorite weapon), doesn't defeat Revan Reborn.

Well actually we tried, and were pretty successful.

 

Anyways I don't think the power gap between Revan and Meetra is at all 'immense' - I'd agree that Revan is more powerful, but not greatly so. Drew may present it as such with the whole Nyriss buisness but there are a lot of exceptional circumstances and it doesn't exactly fit with existing canon.

 

But yes you have a point.

 

P.S. I haven't actually changed Traya's position yet, not sure I got enough opinions/support on that - perhaps it will be revisited in the BattleZone are at some other time. For now it remains ambiguous.

[Selenial]

Well, even you can't change canon, Beni

 

And I was comparing her to Revan, specifically. She's obviously not weak in general. If Revan goes all out though, the gap in power between him and Meetra is immense. The power gap between Darth Krayt and Darth Traya (I assume you changed Traya to #8 like you wanted to) wouldn't seem so incredible.

 

At any rate, Maul, TPM Maul especially (although that one at least gets to use his favorite weapon), doesn't defeat Revan Reborn.

 

I find it pretty funny that you think Meetra is weaker than Revan...

 

I personally think someone so engrossed in the Light Side of the force was stronger than Revan, especially since she was an equal to the Reborn Revan, and the Reborn Revan shouldn't be the Revan we consider for that list.