The Ewok Fiasco

[Wolfninjajedi]

Let's also not forget though, it wasn't just the Ewoks....people seem to overlook also they had a stolen AT-ST on their side which helped out big time among having Han solo and co with Rebel SpecForce + Renegade Squadron. Edited November 26, 2013 by Wolfninjajedi

[Selenial]

The Vietnamese used guns, and explosives. American soldiers weren't living in terror of slingshots and bows and arrows. To get an equivalent to Endor you'd need to like...replace the French at Agincourt with a modern Infantry Battallion, and still have them lose because of those darn English super longbows.

 

One word.

 

Zulu.

[jovianus]

If your referring to the crowd that attempts to resolve problems within the Star Wars universe using logic and reason as opposed hating on the franchise they are supposedly fans off then yes, that crowd is so much better.

 

I'd ask you to join but clearly your still intoxicated.

 

Yes, because retroactively deciding that those flimsy Ewok bows we clearly see are actually some kind of hyper-precision super-heavy hitting DOOMBOWS, and that the Ewoks who knock themselves unconscious with their bola's are actually some elite war bears of death is the epitome of logic and reason. Seriously, I know your head might actually explode if you acknowledge the idea that George Lucas is capable of error, but that scene where the Ewok knocks himself out should tell you all you need to know about why Ewok's were put in the movie. Family friendly comic relief, and oh well for how it makes the Imperial military look.

[PraetorianGuard_]

The Vietnam War and the Zulu War aren't really good comparisons...The North Vietnamese got their *** kicked most of the time by US Forces and the British were laughably outnumbered by the Zulu's and still managed to win in the end.

[Beniboybling]

Yes, because retroactively deciding that those flimsy Ewok bows we clearly see are actually some kind of hyper-precision super-heavy hitting DOOMBOWS, and that the Ewoks who knock themselves unconscious with their bola's are actually some elite war bears of death is the epitome of logic and reason. Seriously, I know your head might actually explode if you acknowledge the idea that George Lucas is capable of error, but that scene where the Ewok knocks himself out should tell you all you need to know about why Ewok's were put in the movie. Family friendly comic relief, and oh well for how it makes the Imperial military look.

You really do hate teddy bears don't you? Edited November 26, 2013 by Beniboybling

[CaulderBenson]

I've had this post in my archives for years. It's not mine, but I loved it so much I kept it. Enjoy.

 

I'll go ahead and rationalize the Ewoks taking on the Empire like I'm doing a History Channel documentary.

 

Ewoks are an aggressive hunter/gatherer species that live at treetop canopy level despite lacking tails or prehensile feet. Obviously they live up there because the ground floor is littered with large mammalian predators. The logs, snares, bolos, rams etc ala are all standard for primitive species that trap and herd huge prey creatures (their nets are built large enough to ensnare 2 humans, 2 droids and a wookie); they could be using the logs to trap 20-foot tall timberwolves and merely lured the Empire into their traditional kill areas. What's odd, is despite all of these tools, the Ewoks' primary weapons are short spears... meaning to actually kill their prey they have to expose themselves to danger. Probably a mark of bravery. Ewoks are hardcore.

 

They build permanent homes and wear clothing which means civilization and implies tribal warfare with neighboring Ewoks. The use of siege catapults, arrows and gliders supports this.

 

Ewok weapons are well-suited to forest combat against the Empire. Sometime around the 90-minute mark you can actually see an arrow (non-CG'd, practical effect) penetrate clear through the back of a Stormtrooper's armor. The weapons penetrate armor. Their bolos use stones weighing at least 2 pounds and they throw them as easily as a midget in a fursuit would throw a foam prop. Conclusion: Ewoks possess chimpanzee-equivalent arm strength and are physically tougher than humans.

 

Surprisingly, Ewoks are superior when it comes to tactics as well. They open the attack by infiltrating their primary striking force to within 60 yards of the Imperial force, and begin the attack with a multi-coordinated surprise assault. They employ textbook guerrilla concepts straight from Mao, hitting the Empire at its weakest (dismounted infantry) and fleeing from its strongest (armored walkers). Attacks that fail (catapults, gliders, hand-to-hand combat) are abandoned and replaced by better options (armor is neutralized by terrain, Ewoks begin using Imperial equipment such as bikes, captured walkers and Stormtrooper blasters).

 

Contrast all of this with the Empire, which sends a Legion of its "finest" but not necessarily most-suitable troops to Endor. Stormtroopers are designed around shock attacks in areas where superior firepower dominates areas of little concealment: Leia's ship in Episode 4 is perfect Stormtrooper terrain. Place them in a low-visibility wilderness where their armor is more a hindrance than a benefit and you'll see their firepower doesn't matter. Armored walkers are best employed in areas of wide, flat terrain where they can blast targets at range and rapidly close with the enemy: in other words, Hoth. Simply put, you don't put armor in dense terrain with poor maneuverability where the enemy can choose to strike first and in 3-dimensional zones your weapons cannot cover. Once the battle started the Empire scattered its troops, with the AT-STs running off unsupported by infantry to be picked off one-by-one. They lost the one remaining tactical advantage of Stormtroopers, massed ranks, when they let their men chase the Ewoks deeper into the forest.

 

The Empire came prepared to fight the wrong battle and the Ewoks came ready to fight the right one. It's that simple.

 

Will this explanation work for you?

Edited November 26, 2013 by CaulderBenson

[Beniboybling]

Nice analysis, just shows how easy it is to explain that battle.

 

Also the Ewoks are tiny. The Stormtroopers probably couldn't even see them.

[StarMagus]

One word.

 

Zulu.

 

They made a nice movie about that where a small force of guys with rifles slaughtered them by the thousands.

[jovianus]

You really do hate teddy bears don't you?

 

I really hate people who try to hype teddy bears up as uber death machines because they just can't accept that Endor was a spectacular failure on the part of the 'elite' Imperial military.

 

Ewoks are hardcore.

 

Except when they hit themselves in the face with their own weapons and get knocked out cold. And pointing out how hilariously the 'finest' of the Imperial Military failed to do anything to secure their positions, and how they just randomly scattered into the forest the minute they came under attack, is not really a great way of arguing that Endor wasn't a hilarious failure on the part of the Imperial Military. The Ewoks should have been exterminated or driven back into the forest with ease, handful of rebels with pistols or no.

 

Forget plastoid body armor and AT-ST's. Give me one modern US infantry company at Endor, and I'll give you one doomed rebellion.

 

They made a nice movie about that where a small force of guys with rifles slaughtered them by the thousands.

 

I assume he means Isandlwana. Which ignores A. That the Zulu had guns, B. That they outnumbered the Brits more than 10 to 1, and C. That 'state of the art' firearms at the time were breech loading rifles capable of a whopping 12 rounds a minute.

Edited November 26, 2013 by jovianus

[StarMagus]

Ah, I was thinking of the time a force of around 150 guys with rifles held off a Zulu army of 3,000-4,000 troops.

 

Hint: The guys with the rifles won. And the Zulus weren't knocking themselves out with their own weapons.

[CaulderBenson]

Except when they hit themselves in the face with their own weapons and get knocked out cold. And pointing out how hilariously the 'finest' of the Imperial Military failed to do anything to secure their positions, and how they just randomly scattered into the forest the minute they came under attack, is not really a great way of arguing that Endor wasn't a hilarious failure on the part of the Imperial Military.

 

You're talking to the wrong person here. I'm not arguing the Imperials weren't laughably incompetent on Endor. I'm merely of the mind that ewoks are more than stupid teddy bears. You can disagree, but ROTJ shows ewoks to be very deadly combatants in their forest.

 

Secondly, your example is flawed. It was Wicket who hit himself in the face with the sling. Wicket was a child, so he's not the best representation of an experienced adult ewok warrior.

 

That moment was also put in for humor; something Star Wars had always incorporated.

 

/I like ewoks.

Edited November 26, 2013 by CaulderBenson

[Beniboybling]

I really hate people who try to hype teddy bears up as uber death machines because they just can't accept that Endor was a spectacular failure on the part of the 'elite' Imperial military.

So let me get this straight, you hate Ewoks and people who resist your attempts to crack down on their intellectual freedoms? You might want to get that looked at...

[Savej]

I hate Ewoks. I like seeing Imps having Ewok companions on Ilum because then I get to kill them. We also need Gungan companions.

 

If this game gets a Save Naboo or Save Endor expansion i will take the darkside hits and sabotage all efforts.