So...Draxus

[Panzerfire]

Another reason why pugs are failing in addition to the dot bug is that the frontal purple conal attacks from the guardians hit behind them, unlike in HM where they only hit in the indicated area.

 

The tactics are also unknown to the majority of the players and what I often see is that people just start burning down adds instead of leaving 1 alive and pushing the boss to 20%, I believe this is sometime during wave 5-7. The boss doesn't do insignificant damage with his cull move, especially if the healers don't cleanse his corrosive grenade and the tanks are partly undergeared.

 

Once the raids enter a new add phase with everyone at 40-50% health and the boss alive it becomes extremely difficult to heal the raid since at max you'll find 2-3 people stacked up and aoe healing is a pain.

[CommanderKeeva]

Think the difficulty is right to be honest......we had some members in 69 gear with 66 hilts. Make it easier would just be a farming Op. I like the fact that the 2nd boss mechanics and damage is high, it stops pugs running it all the time farming

 

Story mode IS supposed to be a farming run. Story mode is supposed to give casual players the opportunity to actually SEE the story, that's why it's called story mode. A lot of people couldn't care less about raiding and would just like to see how the story arc of the Dread Masters is concluded. A few wipes are expect, of course, but overall a group that has the recommended gear level shouldn't have much difficulty finishing an operation on story.

 

Also, I'm surprised nobody mentioned Calphayus in Dread Palace for being a PuG killer. Since the groups in the past and the future don't actually see each other, Calphayus might be a lot more difficult to kill than Draxus for the average pug group.

[cxten]

Also, I'm surprised nobody mentioned Calphayus in Dread Palace for being a PuG killer. Since the groups in the past and the future don't actually see each other, Calphayus might be a lot more difficult to kill than Draxus for the average pug group.

 

The pugs will need to know the mechanics, but won't need to communicate. In the past on story mode they *show* you which place to plant the seed (glowy green stuff) and which crystal to dps (glows red).

Edited October 7, 2013 by cxten

[Aieranda]

While the affliction bug makes that bit tougher that's not why people are wiping though, the majority of pug groups are failing due to add management. If bioware fixed the bug without nerfing anything else people would still wipe on it in their droves because of the sheer co-ordination required anyway.

 

Please continue to ignore and not address the 6k+ tick on 8m story vs a less damaging tick on other raid sizes/difficulties. It absolutely increases your credibility.

[manchusabre]

More of a check for raid awareness. The sad thing is that the majority of players just don't have the level of awareness to get it done. The lack of raid awareness is why my old guild needed to be level 55 for hm ec. I'm not sure bioware is aware of how many players aren't that raid aware. I'm thinking only the better players are testing the content on pts. Probably why so few people are clearing nim tfb and sv. Sad that now you need near perfection to do any new content when so many players don't play that way.

[Borgbunny]

My guys and I have gone into Story Mode Dread Fortress, with voice comms, and devised a strategy to deal with the adds. We get to the Guardian Phase (wave 7) pretty much intact, with the healers at nearly full resource and Draxus at ~23% health. It got to the point that he just wasn't coming back until mid way through wave 8, and he was coming back enraged. There's a reason that none of the strat guides indicate the same waves for his reappearance. It's all over the place.

 

Dismantlers that can nearly one shot a tank with their follow up? Uninterruptable Guardians, and not much of a "safe area", and a boss that may or may not come back before enrage? Those are not Story Mode Mechanics.

 

I don't mind difficult. If you have the skill and gear for HM and NiM, well, then go kill it. But for me and my guys, in full 69's minimum, we just couldn't get over that last 20%, and we weren't failing to mechanics. (That same group managed to two shot Bestia without having seen a single video of the encounter.) That just makes no sense, in Story Mode. This encounter is, in my opinion, overtuned by a long way. The parsed damage numbers, and raider comments, would seem to bear this out.

[KeyboardNinja]

So yeah that was on us and we adjusted. But healers getting hit with two afflictions during the first Guardians phase effectively eating 12-13k a tick? You can't survive that in 8 man. I'm guessing those who cleared this 8 man story way overgeared the instance and just burned down the Guardians of the Fortress super quick. I just don't see a group with instance appropriate gear getting through this, but that's purely because of the bugged affliction from the Guardians.

 

My guild took a break from our HM progression on Saturday, grabbed our Imp alts (non-mirrors, so no legacy gear) and one-shot everything in both DF and DP SM except the Dread Masters, which I think took three pulls. Neither of our healers were well geared. One of them was in mostly level 50 PvP gear with a few Dread Guard pieces. We had two DPS who were 72 geared and high-parsers, but the rest of the group was very marginally geared and inexperienced with their class.

 

There's no question in my mind that Draxus SM is bugged in 8 man. The damage dealt by Affliction is just obscene. However, it can be avoided. When we cleared it, we didn't have a single Mass Affliction cast complete (the cast is by the Corrupters, not by the Guardians). We knew we had to be tight, so we just treated it like HM in terms of the coordination floor and set interrupt orders and assigned DPS swaps. It's very doable in HM, even under-geared, it's just that the mechanic is far more punishing than it should be. If you miss an interrupt on the Corrupters, it should be a lot of damage, it shouldn't be a near auto-wipe.

[cxten]

When we cleared it, we didn't have a single Mass Affliction cast complete (the cast is by the Corrupters, not by the Guardians).

 

That's not what the thread is about. Mass affliction is force cleansable and can be prevented by interrupting the corrupters.

 

The affliction this thread is about is not cleansable and is cast by the guardians (phases 7 and 9). I'm not exactly sure of the mechanics, but it seems to be an aoe, so if you're spread out you won't get it on as many people.

 

I ran SM with my guild on well geared characters and we hardly noticed a thing. Then I pugged it, still on a reasonably geared character (rest of the group mostly 69/72 with a few 66). After the requisite pug group 2-3 wipes with the dps not knowing what to do/interrupt, we wiped to the guardian's affliction. We then cleared it, but even so people were stacked up during that phase and we had 2 stacks ticking on half the raid (and 1 stack on the remainder), which is 12k a tick with two stacks currently.

[dscount]

KBN.. it's not the Mass Affliction from the Corrupters.. It's the Affliction cast instantly by the Guardians. See my earlier LOG files posted. 6.4k a tick in 8 man SM and 2.5k a tick in 16 man SM

[NoFishing]

When we cleared it, we didn't have a single Mass Affliction cast complete (the cast is by the Corrupters, not by the Guardians).

 

You've made the same mistake as others in this thread - confusing the mass affliction cast by the corruptors with the affliction dot applied by the guardians.

 

Borrowing a combat log posted previously in this thread:

http://www.torparse.com/a/446236/time/1380955586/1380955592/0/Overview

 

 

22:46:26.149 Guardian of the Fortress's Affliction adds effect Affliction to Misbehave.

22:46:26.271 Triixx's Kolto Probe critcally heals Misbehave for 2517*, causing 1133 threat!

22:46:27.947 Misbehave activates Take Cover.

22:46:28.080 Misbehave activates Crouch.

22:46:28.080 Misbehave gains Snap Shot.

22:46:28.081 Misbehave gains Ballistic Dampers.

22:46:28.081 Misbehave loses Cover Screen.

22:46:28.081 Misbehave gains Crouch.

22:46:28.082 Misbehave gains Unshakable.

22:46:28.083 Misbehave gains crouch.

22:46:28.171 Guardian of the Fortress's Affliction hits Misbehave for 6418 internal damage, causing 6418 threat. (962 absorbed)

22:46:28.387 Misbehave activates Shatter Shot.

22:46:28.387 Misbehave spends 10 energy.

22:46:28.387 Misbehave's Shatter Shot adds effect Armor Reduced to Guardian of the Fortress.

22:46:28.388 Misbehave's Shatter Shot adds effect Trauma to Guardian of the Fortress.

22:46:29.186 Misbehave gains Spotter.

22:46:29.239 Misbehave's Shatter Shot hits Guardian of the Fortress for 788 energy damage, causing 788 threat.

22:46:29.384 Triixx's Kolto Probe heals Misbehave for 1431, causing 644 threat.

22:46:29.992 Misbehave activates Shield Probe.

22:46:29.992 Misbehave gains Shield Probe.

22:46:30.201 Misbehave loses Shield Probe.

22:46:30.202 Guardian of the Fortress's Affliction hits Misbehave for 6418 internal damage, causing 6418 threat. (4240 absorbed)

22:46:30.998 Misbehave activates Cover Pulse.

22:46:31.406 Sarcastic's Resurgence adds effect Reconstruct to Misbehave.

22:46:31.406 Sarcastic's Resurgence adds effect Resurgence to Misbehave.

22:46:31.426 Sarcastic's Resurgence critcally heals Misbehave for 2470*, causing 1111 threat!

22:46:32.250 Misbehave loses Ballistic Dampers.

22:46:32.251 Guardian of the Fortress's Affliction hits Misbehave for 6418 internal damage, causing 6418 threat. (962 absorbed)

 

[KeyboardNinja]

You've made the same mistake as others in this thread - confusing the mass affliction cast by the corruptors with the affliction dot applied by the guardians.

 

Hmm, I've never even seen that. My guild has really good DPS (our weaknesses are in other areas), so that might be what has saved us. You're right, I did confuse the two. When does it get applied exactly?

[NoFishing]

Hmm, I've never even seen that. My guild has really good DPS (our weaknesses are in other areas), so that might be what has saved us. You're right, I did confuse the two. When does it get applied exactly?

 

I am not entirely sure. We see it going out to two random raid members when the guardians are up.

 

It *might* be related to interrupts, as in if you interrupt the guardian slam or ravage casts they put out affliction in retaliation, but personally I have to wait until lockouts reset to test that theory. I cleared 8-man SM on 3 alts this week - two of those we interrupted slams and ravages as often as we could. But the one run I did on my tank I mostly avoided interrupting slams (just walked through them), and we let a few ravages complete, and it seemed like we had fewer afflictions going out.

 

But that is only a theory for me at this point, and would be a weird mechanic if true, even if the amount of damage was appropriate for 8m SM.

[KeyboardNinja]

I am not entirely sure. We see it going out to two random raid members when the guardians are up.

 

It *might* be related to interrupts, as in if you interrupt the guardian slam or ravage casts they put out affliction in retaliation, but personally I have to wait until lockouts reset to test that theory. I cleared 8-man SM on 3 alts this week - two of those we interrupted slams and ravages as often as we could. But the one run I did on my tank I mostly avoided interrupting slams (just walked through them), and we let a few ravages complete, and it seemed like we had fewer afflictions going out.

 

But that is only a theory for me at this point, and would be a weird mechanic if true, even if the amount of damage was appropriate for 8m SM.

 

Hmm, that might be why I haven't seen it. The Guardians are uninterruptable on HM, and in order to train people for that mode, we generally don't interrupt them. We'll interrupt things if we feel the healing is tight in the group and they need a bit of a SM-level boost, but generally we just tank them away and stun break the Ravage.

[NoFishing]

Hmm, that might be why I haven't seen it. The Guardians are uninterruptable on HM, and in order to train people for that mode, we generally don't interrupt them. We'll interrupt things if we feel the healing is tight in the group and they need a bit of a SM-level boost, but generally we just tank them away and stun break the Ravage.

 

I can't independently confirm it, since my raid group spent all of our HM progression time in Dread Palace this week, but this post by elidion indicates it still goes out in HM, and deals considerably *less* damage. Your group might not even notice it without careful review of combat logs. :-)

 

EDIT: Ok, I can't confirm it, but

can. :-) At 5:01 you can see affliction applied to Slygar, and then Baladine getting it at 5:26. You can also see the next afflictions from the final wave of guardians at 6:41 and at 7:07, when one member picks up 2 afflictions, presumably one from each of the guardians. Edited October 7, 2013 by NoFishing

[MisterBlackJack]

My guys and I have gone into Story Mode Dread Fortress, with voice comms, and devised a strategy to deal with the adds. We get to the Guardian Phase (wave 7) pretty much intact, with the healers at nearly full resource and Draxus at ~23% health. It got to the point that he just wasn't coming back until mid way through wave 8, and he was coming back enraged. There's a reason that none of the strat guides indicate the same waves for his reappearance. It's all over the place.

 

Dismantlers that can nearly one shot a tank with their follow up? Uninterruptable Guardians, and not much of a "safe area", and a boss that may or may not come back before enrage? Those are not Story Mode Mechanics.

 

I don't mind difficult. If you have the skill and gear for HM and NiM, well, then go kill it. But for me and my guys, in full 69's minimum, we just couldn't get over that last 20%, and we weren't failing to mechanics. (That same group managed to two shot Bestia without having seen a single video of the encounter.) That just makes no sense, in Story Mode. This encounter is, in my opinion, overtuned by a long way. The parsed damage numbers, and raider comments, would seem to bear this out.

 

That's because you didn't burn the adds fast enough. If you don't clear the waves in time before wave 9 after a certain period of time the boss will reappar enraged.

[ELEE]

Looks like Bioware is not fixing the bug:

 

http://www.swtor.com/patchnotes/2.4.0b/1082013

[ELEE]

Right now there is a known issue where the SM version of the fight is putting out 2x the damage the HM encounter does, that's why so many pugs are having trouble. Bioware screwed something up.....not like we haven't heard THAT before.

 

I don't see anywhere that Bioware has acknowledged this issue and it's not on this list known in game issues, which was updated today:

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=403398

[mikebevo]

Hmm, that might be why I haven't seen it. The Guardians are uninterruptable on HM, and in order to train people for that mode, we generally don't interrupt them.

Affliction is in story and hard mode, It does not seem to come from a cast. I did HM first, did SM last night and the rest of the fight the damage is way less than HM, towards the end when affliction goes out SM is actually harder on a healer than HM. We were interested so we were looking for cast, nobody saw a cast, and we tried all the ways we could think of with 2 slingers, a commando, sawbones and a sage to get rid of the DoT, Best you can do is heal through, but be careful stacking for puddle heals or you could end with a large part of the group taking something worse than affliction. People can help out the healers by hitting a defensive cooldowns if they have affliction. Slingers bubble makes it a cake walk.

[Bull_Five_Golf]

New info here:

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=684984

 

They see the problem and say they are going to fix it. Good news. Now my head can heal from beating it against my desk.

Edited October 9, 2013 by Bull_Five_Golf

[ArchangelLBC]

I can't independently confirm it, since my raid group spent all of our HM progression time in Dread Palace this week, but this post by elidion indicates it still goes out in HM, and deals considerably *less* damage. Your group might not even notice it without careful review of combat logs. :-)

 

EDIT: Ok, I can't confirm it, but

can. :-) At 5:01 you can see affliction applied to Slygar, and then Baladine getting it at 5:26. You can also see the next afflictions from the final wave of guardians at 6:41 and at 7:07, when one member picks up 2 afflictions, presumably one from each of the guardians.

 

My experience was that 8 man affliction in story was doing as much damage as the same DoT in 16 man Hard Mode, but in that setting the damage is appropriate.

 

Anyway looks like they're fixing it thank God.