[E] Hardcore Raiding

[Nex-soulshatter]

General Purpose:

 

Upon my return from an extended leave of absence, the first thing I noticed is that the Empire has fallen behind in terms of PvE progression. The intention of this thread is to discover if there is a desire on the Empire to fill that gap, or at the very least, an underlying potential. Throughout the week I'll maintain this thread, as well as mentioning the idea to several active/inactive, skilled players on JC. If by the end of the week there appears to be a consensus then I'll reactivate <Sai tok>, produce a recruitment application and begin resurrecting what few of the original <Sai tok> core that I can. The specific goal of <Sai tok> would once again be to complete all server first HM/NiM Ops content on the day of release.

 

Who Is This Guy?

 

For those of you who were not active in the lvl50 raiding community, I am the former leader of <Sai tok> an 8m raiding guild that resided on JC during lvl50. We were comprised of incredibly talented players who were at the forefront of their class' theory crafting. Our specialties as a group were an abundance of freakish coordination and ingenuity that allowed us to bypass or battle through the numerous "impossible" fights that Bioware presented. We took all server first HM/NiM kills on JC (as well as a few world firsts) until a dispute that led to the dissolution of the guild on the night HM EC released. We were ranked World #3 at the time of our disbanding.

 

Proof of validity:

http://s1170.photobucket.com/user/Soulsworn29/library/?sort=3&page=1

 

What I Want From You:

 

If you're interested please respond to this post in a timely, cordial fashion. You may wish to add any information about the server or yourself that you find pertinent. If you have any particularly detailed inquiries, I'm available in-game.

 

Results:

 

I'm pleased to announce that I received numerous responses via whispers, private forum messages, and in-game mail which yielded valuable statistics. I'll begin resurrecting the <Sai tok> website, contacting what core members that I can, and constructing a recruitment application immediately. Keep an eye in the guild recruitment subsection of the Jedi Covenant forums; I should have something up by the end of next week. I apologize for the delay but I'm limited on time at the moment.

 

Edited September 18, 2013 by Nex-soulshatter

[SnickerJew]

Just thought I should point out the "Guild Recruitment" tab is above.

[Icebergy]

Hmm...If your guild had all the HM/NiM server firsts I think I would remember your guild's name...

[Sylvane]

Hmm...If your guild had all the HM/NiM server firsts I think I would remember your guild's name...

 

How can you not remember them, they had Ddouble the glorious body type 4 marauder.

[Nex-soulshatter]

Just thought I should point out the "Guild Recruitment" tab is above.

 

The intention of this thread is to discover if there is a desire on the Empire to fill that gap, or at the very least, an underlying potential.

 

This is a probing survey to see if the niche I'm aiming for exists, not a recruitment thread. I don't have the luxury of devoting resources to the restoration a flagship guild if there's no interest/population to draw from. Some of us have value attached to our time. However, despite your efforts to the contrary, you've managed to high-light a comprehensive concern that I felt needed to be addressed.

 

Hmm...If your guild had all the HM/NiM server firsts I think I would remember your guild's name...

 

On the incredibly minute chance that this is a serious inquiry... The SWTOR.com servers were wiped and all data of the lvl50 era was lost. There is a post in the PvE progression thread requesting the re-acknowledgement of our kills. I would forward you to <Republic Gentlemen> or any other credible guild that was active during that time period as a reference to my validity. Although I'm assuming intent in parallel to the first individual, you too have high-lighted another issue that could use supplement.

 

How can you not remember them, they had Ddouble the glorious body type 4 marauder.

 

Ddouble was the OG of the body type 4 people; he was fat before other characters were mildly obese.

[nlashbrook]

I remember running some stuff with you guys way back in the day, had a good group if I recall. Edited September 9, 2013 by nlashbrook

[Icebergy]

 

On the incredibly minute chance that this is a serious inquiry... The SWTOR.com servers were wiped and all data of the lvl50 era was lost. There is a post in the PvE progression thread requesting the re-acknowledgement of our kills. I would forward you to <Republic Gentlemen> or any other credible guild that was active during that time period as a reference to my validity. Although I'm assuming intent in parallel to the first individual, you too have high-lighted another issue that could use supplement.

 

We are at an impasse here, since I don't remember you, and you apparently don't remember <Contraband Inc>, the guild that actually had most of the server firsts back in EV and KP. I would also refer you to <Republic Gentlemen> as CI and RG have always had a very good relationship.

 

How can you not remember them, they had Ddouble the glorious body type 4 marauder.

 

I do actually remember Ddouble's Donut Shop...

Edited September 9, 2013 by Icebergy

[Nex-soulshatter]

We are at an impasse here, since I don't remember you, and you apparently don't remember <Contraband Inc>, the guild that actually had most of the server firsts back in EV and KP. I would also refer you to <Republic Gentlemen> as CI and RG have always had a very good relationship.

 

First let me start by linking my photobucket account with all of the screens of the actual server first kills:

http://s1170.photobucket.com/user/Soulsworn29/library/?sort=3&page=1

Feel free to look at the upload dates for each picture in the URL. Checkmate..

 

Rough Detailing of Our Kill Dates:

 

HM EV (aside from Soa) was downed the 2nd or 3rd week of release by a pug of the only lvl50s on server. The group was tagged as "JC Puggers" in the forum records. To my knowledge, we downed NiM EV before <Contraband Inc> had been created (when Soa was still "impossible" due to bugs). We got the world first NiM kill of Bonethrasher when he was "impossible" due to bugs, we just didn't report it for fear of getting banned. NiM KP was downed the day of release in under an hour (we got the title on our first run), every single fight was killed in one attempt. HM EC was downed the night of release (aside from Kephess who was impossible due to a bug that required two Assassin tanks to bypass), HM Kephess was downed the day after by <Ddouble's Donut Shop> which was comprised of 6/8 <Sai tok> members. After that <Sai tok> was no longer active. Not only were you not responsible for any of the server first HM/NiM kills while we were active, you were nearly a month behind us at all times.

 

I actually recall <Contraband Inc> falsely claiming server first NiM Karagga at one point. I responded by linking a photo with the at least half of the <Sai tok> raid team sitting in the grey Kessler mounts from NiM Karagga. Ergo we had downed it at least 4 times prior to you, which would be where I derived the "month" estimation I put forth earlier.

Edited September 11, 2013 by Nex-soulshatter

[iimagiicii]

This can't be real? Talking about EV + KP server firsts in serious mode.

[Simmerr]

In all seriousness, without 8/8 being in the same guild, and without uploading kills, (for whatever reason) OP can't claim to be server first as the guild <Sai Tok>

 

Lets examine:

 

Rough Detailing of Our Kill Dates:

 

HM EV (aside from Soa) was downed the 2nd or 3rd week of release by a pug of the only lvl50s on server.

 

To my knowledge, we downed NiM EV before <Contraband Inc> had been created (when Soa was still "impossible" due to bugs).

 

We got the world first NiM kill of Bonethrasher when he was "impossible" due to bugs, we just didn't report it for fear of getting banned.

 

NiM KP was downed the day of release in under an hour (we got the title on our first run), every single fight was killed in one attempt.

 

HM EC was downed the night of release (aside from Kephess who was impossible due to a bug that required two Assassin tanks to bypass), HM Kephess was downed the day after by <Ddouble's Donut Shop> which was comprised of 6/8 <Sai tok> members.

 

 

Afaik, the only reasonable claim is the NiM KP.

NiM EV was bugged to the point that progression can't be tracked for it.

 

This post isn't supposed to be meant as an insult, just regards from a third party

Edited September 9, 2013 by Simmerr

[Nex-soulshatter]

In all seriousness, without 8/8 being in the same guild, and without uploading kills, (for whatever reason) OP can't claim to be server first as the guild <Sai Tok>

 

Lets examine:

 

Afaik, the only reasonable claim is the NiM KP.

NiM EV was bugged to the point that progression can't be tracked for it.

 

This post isn't supposed to be meant as an insult, just regards from a third party

 

You conveniently omitted the photobucket link to all of the validated screens/kill dates. You can always track progression via kill dates.

 

 

Secondly, the purpose of this thread is to test the viability of a hardcore raiding community on the server. I really didn't want this to turn into a "who killed what" thread. I have edited the first post to contain a link validating all of our kills. Let's continue discussing the potential of a hardcore raiding guild on this server now.

[Icebergy]

First let me start by linking my photobucket account with all of the screens of the actual server first kills:

http://s1170.photobucket.com/

Feel free to look at the upload dates for each picture in the URL. Checkmate..

 

Rough Detailing of Our Kill Dates:

 

HM EV (aside from Soa) was downed the 2nd or 3rd week of release by a pug of the only lvl50s on server. The group was tagged as "JC Puggers" in the forum records. To my knowledge, we downed NiM EV before <Contraband Inc> had been created (when Soa was still "impossible" due to bugs). We got the world first NiM kill of Bonethrasher when he was "impossible" due to bugs, we just didn't report it for fear of getting banned. NiM KP was downed the day of release in under an hour (we got the title on our first run), every single fight was killed in one attempt. HM EC was downed the night of release (aside from Kephess who was impossible due to a bug that required two Assassin tanks to bypass), HM Kephess was downed the day after by <Ddouble's Donut Shop> which was comprised of 6/8 <Sai tok> members. After that <Sai tok> was no longer active. Not only were you not responsible for any of the server first HM/NiM kills while we were active, you were nearly a month behind us at all times.

 

I actually recall <Contraband Inc> falsely claiming server first NiM Karagga at one point. I responded by linking a photo with the at least half of the <Sai tok> raid team sitting in the grey Kessler mounts from NiM Karagga. Ergo we had downed it at least 4 times prior to you, which would be where I derived the "month" estimation I put forth earlier.

 

That link does not work, so I guess we'll have to wait till you provide actual dates for your kills to compare. But I will tell you that Contraband has been on this server since launch, so your claim that you killed them before we even existed is false.

 

EDIT: After thinking about it for a while, I think maybe I do remember that guild name in the server progression thread. I never saw any of you in game ever, but I think it was on the progression thread. Maybe you had the final bosses server firsts, I really don't remember. But I am almost positive Contraband had a couple of the middle bosses before anyone else on the server at least.

Edited September 11, 2013 by Icebergy

[Nex-soulshatter]

That link does not work, so I guess we'll have to wait till you provide actual dates for your kills to compare. But I will tell you that Contraband has been on this server since launch, so your claim that you killed them before we even existed is false.

 

EDIT: After thinking about it for a while, I think maybe I do remember that guild name in the server progression thread. I never saw any of you in game ever, but I think it was on the progression thread. Maybe you had the final bosses server firsts, I really don't remember. But I am almost positive Contraband had a couple of the middle bosses before anyone else on the server at least.

 

That was a mistake on my part, I linked my personal page and not my Library; It's been edited so that it works now. While it does not have all of the kills, it has enough to substantiate my credibility. You can check the NiM Karagga kill, the HM EC kills. The Soa one is the first time we killed it legitimately. Since all previous kills had been done with the resurrection glitch I don't believe we ever officially registered him as down until they fixed him to be do-able without the bug.

 

Although I believe I've located the source of your misinformation. <Contraband Inc> was the first 16m raid group to down most of the content (Athos' guild had a few of the bosses first on HM if I remember correctly). However, we had a substantial lead on the "first kills" of the bosses (we were an 8m guild though). No one liked Invalid's degrading point system for progression on the original PvE progression thread so someone went and made a new thread at one point and split the 8m and 16m progression for whatever reason. The new thread was horridly mismanaged and the individual running it refused to acknowledge any 8m kills/dates. It caused a lot of historical inaccuracies for quite some time; we had 2 PvE Progression threads on JC for a while.

 

It's not like I have any issue accrediting anyone who was actually able to beat us to the punch. However, to my knowledge, no one ever did -- at least they never submitted any documentation on the PvE progression thread. The only guilds that I know of that beat us to the NiM KP and NiM EV kills were on The Fatman server and two of them were professional organizations from WoW (vodka and For The Horde).

[Icebergy]

While I don't really agree with you using the word misinformation, I think you are correct. Either way I'll stop derailing the thread now.

[Sylvane]

He already covered it but yeah Sai Tok was an 8 man guild, they had the server first kill for pretty much all of that content since we were normally trudging along behind them for server 2nd's 8 man wise. They were always a fairly helpful bunch so it would be nice to see them come back and take a swing at the new content, always nice to see more people competing.

[JMagee]

I remember Sai Tok, and seeing them on the leader boards. I never really played Imp side during their heyday, but will lend some credence to the fact that they were an impressive 8man guild during the EV/KP/EC days.

 

That being said, I'm kind of unsure what you're looking to find out regarding the raiding community. I think JC has some pretty "competitive" progression guilds, Ascension, RG, CI, etc (not remotely all inclusive). but as of late, no one that's been successful in competing on the World First front, for whatever that's worth.

 

But I think the high end guilds are pretty stable, and seem to have pretty good understanding on how they work together. Assuming you do reform Sai Tok, without anyone but yourself, your posturing suggests one of the following.

 

1. You're going to recruit un-guilded characters and hope to mold them into elite raiders.

2. You hope other Sai Tok members will see the guild is re-formed and you get the old band back together.

3. You hope the allure of Sai Tok will help you recruit "scabs" from other guilds who may be less than 100% happy in their current guilds and see the grass being greener with you.

4. You think the reformation of your guild will grant you some sort of preferential pick'em status amongst the best players in the best guilds currently on JC.

 

I'm not assuming any of the above are true, but am assuming there has to be some truth in at least one of them. So while I welcome back another HC raiding guild back to JC (I'm just progressing into NiM TFB/SV myself, so semi-casual, no dog in this race), I just don't understand exactly what your motives are.

 

If you want to be the best, just be the best, who the hell cares about what anyone else does/says/think.

Edited September 12, 2013 by JMagee

[Nex-soulshatter]

I remember Sai Tok, and seeing them on the leader boards. I never really played Imp side during their heyday, but will lend some credence to the fact that they were an impressive 8man guild during the EV/KP/EC days.

 

That being said, I'm kind of unsure what you're looking to find out regarding the raiding community. I think JC has some pretty "competitive" progression guilds, Ascension, RG, CI, etc (not remotely all inclusive). but as of late, no one that's been successful in competing on the World First front, for whatever that's worth.

 

But I think the high end guilds are pretty stable, and seem to have pretty good understanding on how they work together. Assuming you do reform Sai Tok, without anyone but yourself, your posturing suggests one of the following.

 

1. You're going to recruit un-guilded characters and hope to mold them into elite raiders.

2. You hope other Sai Tok members will see the guild is re-formed and you get the old band back together.

3. You hope the allure of Sai Tok will help you recruit "scabs" from other guilds who may be less than 100% happy in their current guilds and see the grass being greener with you.

4. You think the reformation of your guild will grant you some sort of preferential pick'em status amongst the best players in the best guilds currently on JC.

 

I'm not assuming any of the above are true, but am assuming there has to be some truth in at least one of them. So while I welcome back another HC raiding guild back to JC (I'm just progressing into NiM TFB/SV myself, so semi-casual, no dog in this race), I just don't understand exactly what your motives are.

 

If you want to be the best, just be the best, who the hell cares about what anyone else does/says/think.

 

You sir, get a cookie.

 

As far as my motivations and recruitment strategies, I've had quite a few people contact me since my return to SWTOR about the possibility of me forming up a hardcore raid team again. I have a decent recruitment pool within the game as a lot of my friends and a lot of the people who would sub in for <Sai tok> members during their absences still play. I also had been speaking to a few <Sai tok> guys on Steam and various other platforms prior to returning as a few of them are quite bored. I also have a massive recruitment pool I can draw from from years of competitive/professional play on WoW.

 

For example, I'm confident I could resurrect 3 other <Sai tok> members immediately. I may have to facilitate their return somewhat but they'd be more than willing once I greased their palms. There are 3 other <Sai tok> members whom are currently playing; however, I do not know their feelings towards re-grouping since they were the portion of the raid that had a falling out with my aggressive nature on the day EC released. And to be fair, some of their reasons were rather justified; I'm a raid Nazi. In a best case scenario, that would leave only 1 core member retired, Metal our PT tank.

 

However I'm currently planning around having 3 players return and recruiting the rest from active friends/contacts on-server.

 

A rough roster of what I currently have would be:

 

Tanks: 1

DPS: 3

Heals: 2

 

However, a lot of the individuals wanted to see I had put things into motion prior to dedicating themselves to the project. Hence, the efforts you see in this thread.

[Goldenstar]

Played through all of the nHM + NiM content available by around Aug 2012 with EE before I quit the game. Just getting back into things now after 1 year of GW2 and I'm interested in getting back into a progression guild.

 

Have level 50 Sin (tank + dps gearsets) and Sniper (rdps gearset) and working on leveling up a few healers. Hit me up if you do decide to form (or find somewhere else looking for a few new people). In the meantime I'll be working on getting up to 55!

[Nex-soulshatter]

I've received numerous whispers in game, various private messages, and a few mails detailing that I should have what I need to operate on JC again. I'll begin resurrecting the <Sai tok> webpage, talking to my contacts, and hammering out a recruitment application immediately. Keep an eye on the guild recruitment section as I should have something coherent by the end of next week. I would have it ready sooner, but I'm a busy guy.

 

I would like to thank those of you who understood the purpose of this thread as an exploratory probe and responded with pertinent information. I'll edit the original post to prevent TL;DR.

[JMagee]

Glad to see you back up and running. Contrary to the slight irony and sarcasm in my initial post (which you brilliantly cleared up and responded to) hope everything gets up and running for you and you start wrecking Ops again.