Pathlight- Posted August 23, 2013 Share Posted August 23, 2013 I'm currently level 17 and starting to get frustrated in pvp. The only warzone where I can really make a difference is huttball. In the other warzones I put guard on the healer and follow him around. However, I feel severely lacking in terms of tools to protect and peel off the healer. And that's the best case scenario since I'm often in wz with no healer where I feel completely useless. My main is a deception sin and I'm used to have a much bigger impact on the game with him. I'm looking for input from high level defense guardian pvpers. Should I stick with the class, will I eventually feel more useful in wz ? There is also the fact that I'm a noob with this class (been playing my sin for a year) which may play a role. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maelael Posted August 23, 2013 Share Posted August 23, 2013 I'm currently level 17 and starting to get frustrated in pvp. Welcome to pre-51 guardian I love PvP. On multiple ACs. But tank guardian really sucked imo until 51 when I had enough talent points to really fill out the class. It gets better after 30 but only marginally. TBH, just do a build that gives lots of rage and does damage, and just guard people and concentrate on DPS. I assure you, it gets night and day better 45+, and AMAZING 51+. Right now do a: http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#5000MZcMz.3 And work towards: http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#5000MZcMMZb.3 http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#500RMkZcMMZb.3 http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#500RrR0zZcMMZb.3 And just shoot up the defense tree from there. Later on at 45 when you can fill out the tree, respec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadecounty Posted August 23, 2013 Share Posted August 23, 2013 Honestly, if you want to level through PvP just play Vigilance or Focus for a while. At level 30 you can consider switching back over as at that point you'll have 2 hard stuns (Stasis and Hilt Strike) along with Force Push, or you can stay DPS until 51 as the other poster said, when we have every tool we could need (Guardian Slash for better damage, lowered cooldowns on Saber Ward and Warding Call, Saber Reflect, Guardian Leap etc). That's the only negative about the Guardian imo, a lot of our utility doesn't come until higher levels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maelael Posted August 23, 2013 Share Posted August 23, 2013 Honestly, if you want to level through PvP just play Vigilance or Focus for a while. At level 30 you can consider switching back over as at that point you'll have 2 hard stuns (Stasis and Hilt Strike) along with Force Push, or you can stay DPS until 51 as the other poster said, when we have every tool we could need (Guardian Slash for better damage, lowered cooldowns on Saber Ward and Warding Call, Saber Reflect, Guardian Leap etc). That's the only negative about the Guardian imo, a lot of our utility doesn't come until higher levels. While sound advice, Im going to counter this with: I got way more medals guarding, healing through focused defense, and putting out some damage during lower levels. While I did more damage in Vigil and and Focus trees, I was able to score more medals through diversity. The damage difference really was not that large till I got closer to 50. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadecounty Posted August 23, 2013 Share Posted August 23, 2013 While sound advice, Im going to counter this with: I got way more medals guarding, healing through focused defense, and putting out some damage during lower levels. While I did more damage in Vigil and and Focus trees, I was able to score more medals through diversity. The damage difference really was not that large till I got closer to 50. I think you can get more medals but that's purely because protection medals are easy to get. Contrarily, you will likely help your team less as you still lack utility (until Push, Stasis and Hilt Strike all come into play) and lowbies is generally less organized than higher level gameplay, meaning your guard will be less likely to be utilized well. Also, if you're good with taunting, you can typically still get the first few protection medals even as a DPS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maelael Posted August 23, 2013 Share Posted August 23, 2013 I think you can get more medals but that's purely because protection medals are easy to get. Contrarily, you will likely help your team less as you still lack utility (until Push, Stasis and Hilt Strike all come into play) and lowbies is generally less organized than higher level gameplay, meaning your guard will be less likely to be utilized well. Also, if you're good with taunting, you can typically still get the first few protection medals even as a DPS. Super lowbies, you can run around and swing regular assault and do more than most people. Really as long as you pay attention to objectives you're light years ahead. Hell I had a level 18 BH (no AC chosen yet) and I'd regularly top damage, objective play, etc. 30+ I disagree, a guarded healer helps A LOT. Push stasis and hilt strike are nice, but at the same time simple guard + taunts will make a world of difference of keeping a healer up (and aren't on CD as long as those three). In terms of people not knowing how to work with guard well....that happens in 55s about the same amount I notice (and why I don't solo queue a lot). In the end? Both should be viable in your 30s, and really as long as you aren't standing around eating paste in the pre 30 queue you're fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helig Posted August 25, 2013 Share Posted August 25, 2013 To echo other posters, I agree, lowlevel Guardian/Juggernaut is a sad experience in PvP. But once you get a bit of control (push/choke) things will start to look up. When you talent your to hilt strike and instant stasis, master strikes will become very easy to set up. But then again, for full Guardian experience, get to 51. You'll get friendly leap that helps you get out of the oven if it gets too hot, and you'll get Saber Reflect, which is one of my absolute favourite skills in the entire game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TLCuddy Posted August 25, 2013 Share Posted August 25, 2013 It really is kind of funny, how the knight/warrior classes, regardless of AC, are pretty underpowered in lowbie PvP at first. Both don't come around till about late 30s early 40s! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfourcustom Posted August 25, 2013 Share Posted August 25, 2013 I'm currently level 17 and starting to get frustrated in pvp. The only warzone where I can really make a difference is huttball. In the other warzones I put guard on the healer and follow him around. However, I feel severely lacking in terms of tools to protect and peel off the healer. And that's the best case scenario since I'm often in wz with no healer where I feel completely useless. My main is a deception sin and I'm used to have a much bigger impact on the game with him. I'm looking for input from high level defense guardian pvpers. Should I stick with the class, will I eventually feel more useful in wz ? There is also the fact that I'm a noob with this class (been playing my sin for a year) which may play a role. The class matures VERY late in its leveling life span but once you are 51 you'll have all the tools you need to be a good tank and at 55 your one of the devs favorite class to buff, buff and give more buffs too. You'll be fine. Just stick with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helig Posted August 25, 2013 Share Posted August 25, 2013 The class matures VERY late in its leveling life span but once you are 51 you'll have all the tools you need to be a good tank and at 55 your one of the devs favorite class to buff, buff and give more buffs too. You'll be fine. Just stick with it. I believe class preference is a, badum-pssh, matter of perception. Also, I seem to have a perception problem - when did Guards get significant buffs (aside the much-needed 2.0 changes)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadecounty Posted August 25, 2013 Share Posted August 25, 2013 I believe class preference is a, badum-pssh, matter of perception. Also, I seem to have a perception problem - when did Guards get significant buffs (aside the much-needed 2.0 changes)? Look at the poster. He's a former Assault Vanguard... you know, the class that was OP from launch until 2.0. Which I'm fairly sure is a longer period of time than 2.0 to now. Or, as they say, the grass is always greener... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfourcustom Posted August 25, 2013 Share Posted August 25, 2013 (edited) Look at the poster. He's a former Assault Vanguard... you know, the class that was OP from launch until 2.0. Which I'm fairly sure is a longer period of time than 2.0 to now. Or, as they say, the grass is always greener... Yaaa cause its not like your class has been king of PVP with your smash spec since launch right?? The grass is always greener with 8k smashes since launch and loads of cool downs your class has had since launch. :rak_03:1.4 balanced vanguards bro:rak_03: But why try to fight it your one of the devs golden boy classes i should just be banned for posting here in the house of one of the god classes. I bow down to you guardians! Edited August 25, 2013 by mfourcustom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadecounty Posted August 26, 2013 Share Posted August 26, 2013 (edited) :rak_03:1.4 balanced vanguards bro:rak_03: lol Nevermind that Pyros/Assault were still the #1 DPS choice for serious Ranked teams, seriously there were teams without Smashers (a spec I don't even play) but you never saw a team without a Pyro or Assault. Oh, and you got to be the easiest to play PvE DPS class as well too, the cherry on top if you will. Now you have to learn to play Tactics, boohoo. And if you'd read the posts on here, you'd see some of us (including myself) have actually suggested nerfs to Focus spec. Not to mention this thread is about Defense Guardians, which were awful for most of the game's lifespan up to 2.0, not Smash/Focus. You can go back to crying now. Edited August 26, 2013 by wadecounty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helig Posted August 26, 2013 Share Posted August 26, 2013 Yaaa cause its not like your class has been king of PVP with your smash spec since launch right?? The grass is always greener with 8k smashes since launch and loads of cool downs your class has had since launch. :rak_03:1.4 balanced vanguards bro:rak_03: But why try to fight it your one of the devs golden boy classes i should just be banned for posting here in the house of one of the god classes. I bow down to you guardians! Dongcleave>smash. Might even respec my PT out of shield tech to have a wee bit of fun with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pathlight- Posted August 26, 2013 Author Share Posted August 26, 2013 Quick update, I'm now lvl 28 and starting to see the beauty of this AC. I guess it'll only get better. I'm geared for maximum survivability and my wz quality of life has susbstantially increased since I got force push which is a wonderful talent to use. I made it a habit to spot good healers, invite them to queue with me in pvp with the following deal: I guard you and peel off you, you keep me alive. I have played swtor since launch but tanking 6 ennemies in wz for 3 minutes with a pocket healer is a thing of beauty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfourcustom Posted August 26, 2013 Share Posted August 26, 2013 lol Nevermind that Pyros/Assault were still the #1 DPS choice for serious Ranked teams, seriously there were teams without Smashers (a spec I don't even play) but you never saw a team without a Pyro or Assault. Oh, and you got to be the easiest to play PvE DPS class as well too, the cherry on top if you will. Now you have to learn to play Tactics, boohoo. And if you'd read the posts on here, you'd see some of us (including myself) have actually suggested nerfs to Focus spec. Not to mention this thread is about Defense Guardians, which were awful for most of the game's lifespan up to 2.0, not Smash/Focus. You can go back to crying now. /bow to one of the god classes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfourcustom Posted August 26, 2013 Share Posted August 26, 2013 Quick update, I'm now lvl 28 and starting to see the beauty of this AC. I guess it'll only get better. I'm geared for maximum survivability and my wz quality of life has susbstantially increased since I got force push which is a wonderful talent to use. I made it a habit to spot good healers, invite them to queue with me in pvp with the following deal: I guard you and peel off you, you keep me alive. I have played swtor since launch but tanking 6 ennemies in wz for 3 minutes with a pocket healer is a thing of beauty. Glad things got better for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serondil Posted August 30, 2013 Share Posted August 30, 2013 Or, as they say, the grass is always greener... ...because it's poisoned Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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