36/3/7 Sharpshooter Guide [UPDATED]

[diadox]

Power Augment wouldn't be better than cunning augment ?

 

Nope. One point of power adds 0.23 bonus damage. One point of cunning adds 0.228 bonus damage when taking cunning talent and consular buff into account. The 0.002 bonus damage difference is outweighed by the extra crit from cunning.

Edited November 16, 2013 by diadox

[ender_md]

How important is the 2-pc pvp set bonus for sharpshooters?

[JaydedHunter]

What is the consensus now for Relics since the patch?

[paowee]

How important is the 2-pc pvp set bonus for sharpshooters?

 

Very important. At the moment it produces the highest single target parses. Get 2-pc pvp set bonus unless you are planning on running Dirty Fighting most of the time.

[paowee]

What is the consensus now for Relics since the patch?

 

I've been using SA and BA. haven't gotten the chance to test other relics. Maybe others can shed some light on BIS relics >_<

[greg_biochem]

The SA relic is still 1st BiS. The "bugged" mainstat relics are 2nd BiS right now - they're proccing every 20 sec instead of every 40 as the tool-tip says. The Boundless Ages relic is a pretty close 3rd, so you aren't losing too much by sticking with BA.

[ender_md]

Very important. At the moment it produces the highest single target parses. Get 2-pc pvp set bonus unless you are planning on running Dirty Fighting most of the time.

 

so the bonus makes up for the loss in cunning/endurance ?

[ArchangelLBC]

so the bonus makes up for the loss in cunning/endurance ?

 

Yes.

 

/5char

[ender_md]

Yes.

 

/5char

 

 

Is it still worth the point in cool under pressure with the SA fix?

[ArchangelLBC]

Is it still worth the point in cool under pressure with the SA fix?

 

No.

 

/5char

Edited November 18, 2013 by ArchangelLBC

[Ardarell_Solo]

For Kell Dragon SA Cool under Pressure should still be good, I think, as that one still procs from heals as well (whereas Dread Forged does not). Right?

[paowee]

Shameless bump.

 

I haven't been playing MM/SS for a while.. and wanted to ask/point out one thing.

 

Does anyone use a q or a pattern for keeping CD/VS up? Something that helps QoL?

 

I know my and this guide never talked about it, but i remember a few days back I tried to count how many Followthroughts / Trickshots i did before having to reapply CD / VS again. It came out to something like 4 or 5.

 

So apply your DoT, count 4 or i think 5 FTs / TSs and then reapply DoT again. Is this accurate?

[JaydedHunter]

Is this accurate?

 

Yup. It's usually 5 Trickshots for me.

Edited November 28, 2013 by JaydedHunter

[SamuelAU]

Shameless bump.

 

I haven't been playing MM/SS for a while.. and wanted to ask/point out one thing.

 

Does anyone use a q or a pattern for keeping CD/VS up? Something that helps QoL?

 

I know my and this guide never talked about it, but i remember a few days back I tried to count how many Followthroughts / Trickshots i did before having to reapply CD / VS again. It came out to something like 4 or 5.

 

So apply your DoT, count 4 or i think 5 FTs / TSs and then reapply DoT again. Is this accurate?

Sounds about right, I'd want to check. It's something I'll sit down and play around with once 2.5 is released, at which point I'll make a newer, tidier thread with some more info. Counting your Trickshots will prove to be unreliable in two instances, being a) When Orbital Strike and Burst Volley come around and b) Sub-30% execution range, with more regular Trickshots procced from Quickdraw interrupting the flow (forcing you to refresh Vital Shot more often that what would be necessary).

Edited November 28, 2013 by SamuelAU

[paowee]

Sounds about right, I'd want to check. It's something I'll sit down and play around with once 2.5 is released, at which point I'll make a newer, tidier thread with some more info. Counting your Trickshots will prove to be unreliable in two instances, being a) When Orbital Strike and Burst Volley come around and b) Sub-30% execution range, with more regular Trickshots procced from Quickdraw interrupting the flow (forcing you to refresh Vital Shot more often that what would be necessary).

 

Yea we'll just have to estimate when we do non TS rotations. Reason I asked Is when I tried to run SS again I get confused with all the VS up on the target and would constantly overlap them :|. Then I started counting TS and I think it helped a little bit.

[Falver]

Vital shot has a near-100% uptime in my rotation, where I use it thrice per flyby. Flyby isn't a bad way to measure it if there are a lot of other people putting up CD/VS. 15s mark, 30s mark, flyby is ready, or that sort of thing. I don't personally do this but it's certainly an idea.

[paowee]

Vital shot has a near-100% uptime in my rotation, where I use it thrice per flyby. Flyby isn't a bad way to measure it if there are a lot of other people putting up CD/VS. 15s mark, 30s mark, flyby is ready, or that sort of thing. I don't personally do this but it's certainly an idea.

 

Hmm so Flyby -> VS (opener), then remember to cast a 2nd VS, then 3rd VS (Flyby is up). Could work:) I've been on my newly 55 Sage recently so

Edited December 2, 2013 by paowee

[Kaos_KidSWTOR]

Hmm, this build is a bit baffeling to me, I feel like when i dont have the Cover Heal and 10 extra energy i feel less useful. My build for when i hit 55 is 36/10/0 or, http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#700rsrbdRkRMfkzzZrI.3

 

The extra damage on Fly-by, Sab Charge, and Thermal Grenade (abilities i use in my rotation) Is really nice because it increases my damage, i would have to parse it in 55 BIS gear to see how it's DPS output is but my Gunslinger is only 48.

[SamuelAU]

Hmm, this build is a bit baffeling to me, I feel like when i dont have the Cover Heal and 10 extra energy i feel less useful. My build for when i hit 55 is 36/10/0 or, http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#700rsrbdRkRMfkzzZrI.3

 

The extra damage on Fly-by, Sab Charge, and Thermal Grenade (abilities i use in my rotation) Is really nice because it increases my damage, i would have to parse it in 55 BIS gear to see how it's DPS output is but my Gunslinger is only 48.

The only thing is the extra 7 points in Saboteur are unnecessary; an extra 10 energy does nothing and heal in cover is only good for proccing relics.

 

Not sure if my numbers are 100% accurate, but in my situation taking +15% flyby and sab charge damage would give me (at best) a 45 DPS increase with the 2-pc PvP set bonus. The 25% chance for an extra tick on Vital Shot will prove somewhere around a 60 DPS increase.

 

Not to mention with the massive surge bonuses to your main damage dealing abilities (Quickdraw, Trickshot, Speed Shot), missing out on a free +3% crit chance is gimping yourself of even more DPS.

 

Lastly, 2% alacrity may not seem like a lot (and it isn't) but over a 5 minute fight you're going to be able to get in an extra 4 GCDs over having no alacrity.

 

Not to piss all over the spec you want to try out but it's far inferior, except in a few AoE situations; however the current tier of content isn't heavily dependent on AoE damage apart from one or two mechanics within a few of the fights, which can easily be completed with the vital shot spec.

 

(See an update to this thread within maybe a week; the plan is to create another thread for 2.5 and onwards to tidy things up a bit and make the first few pages of replies more recent and relevant)

Edited December 6, 2013 by SamuelAU

[Falver]

I'm making a note for HP-dummy parsing, using quickdraw everytime it's available is NOT a DPS increase. I'll be experimenting more in a bit but

a) using Quickdraw means either delaying Charged Burst or swapping it out with Vital shot

b) Delaying Charged Burst means hard-casting Aimed Shot, which is simple absurdity

c) Vital shot talented in Mortal Wound does more DPS than Quickdraw (so long as Vital shot isn't clipped TOO early. 3~4/5 ticks still about equal to or superior to the average Quickdraw).

 

This doesn't hold true in boss fights because often Quickdraw is used to finish off adds and such, making QD -> TS a valuable asset in-raid. On the dummy though, the results are less than spectacular.

[paowee]

I'm making a note for HP-dummy parsing, using quickdraw everytime it's available is NOT a DPS increase. I'll be experimenting more in a bit but

a) using Quickdraw means either delaying Charged Burst or swapping it out with Vital shot

b) Delaying Charged Burst means hard-casting Aimed Shot, which is simple absurdity

c) Vital shot talented in Mortal Wound does more DPS than Quickdraw (so long as Vital shot isn't clipped TOO early. 3~4/5 ticks still about equal to or superior to the average Quickdraw).

 

This doesn't hold true in boss fights because often Quickdraw is used to finish off adds and such, making QD -> TS a valuable asset in-raid. On the dummy though, the results are less than spectacular.

 

I had this theory as well but could never parse it out since we didn't have sub 30% dummy before. But what i do in raids is replace Ambush entirely with Quickdraw during execute range. Not sure if it's a DPS increase though. Can you test it for us?

[lkrzeminski]

Hello all,

 

Just wanted to check which relics are Bis these days ? I use Boundles ages and SA but the new one with cunning proc seems very tempting.

[Falver]

I had this theory as well but could never parse it out since we didn't have sub 30% dummy before. But what i do in raids is replace Ambush entirely with Quickdraw during execute range. Not sure if it's a DPS increase though. Can you test it for us?

 

Tried it, the gain is nil. Theoretically Quickdraw should do more DPS than Aimed Shot but in-practice I've found the results hardly an asset. Your best bet in the 30% execute range is to substitute Trickshot for Quickdraw whenever energy makes it possible.

[paowee]

Tried it, the gain is nil. Theoretically Quickdraw should do more DPS than Aimed Shot but in-practice I've found the results hardly an asset. Your best bet in the 30% execute range is to substitute Trickshot for Quickdraw whenever energy makes it possible.

 

Interesting. So its a DPS loss substituting QD for AS huh. If what you say is right then at sub 30% rotation changes to

 

Snipe Snipe - (QD/FT) - Aimed Shot - (QD/FT) - Speed Shot - (QD/FT) repeat

[Falver]

Interesting. So its a DPS loss substituting QD for AS huh. If what you say is right then at sub 30% rotation changes to

 

Snipe Snipe - (QD/FT) - Aimed Shot - (QD/FT) - Speed Shot - (QD/FT) repeat

 

Not a loss, but not a gain. Given the surge and crit talents for QD, it theoretically should be superior but given the dependence on RNG, it's really not a gain or loss in practice.

 

But yeah, I found the best results swapping out followthrough for quickdraw.

Here's an example parse of where I do that: http://www.torparse.com/a/520968/1/0/Damage+Dealt

 

You can see there,

24.74 DPS per activation of QD, 3/6 Mainhand crits.

28.56 DPS per activation of AS. 8/17 Mainhand crits.

Given the crits, the variation in the two is pretty close to 0. In a typical fight, you wouldn't expect that many AS to crit so you could expect it to fall a little bit, even closer to the statistic for QD

 

More data analysis:

15.70 DPS per activation of TS 13/52 Mainhand crits. Very typical crits for trickshot. Keep in mind though that this parse in particular was one with QD swapped in but I highly doubt you'd really see different numbers. What does the difference in TS and QD mean? Well, considering the difference is 9.04 DPS. What this means is that my swapping out TS for QD yielded a DPS increase of 54.24 in that particular parse.

 

This parse by Berry has similar results.

29.35 DPS/activation of Quickdraw (small sample size, high crit ratio. 3/4 mainhand crits)

26.27 DPS/activation AS (closer to the projected mean in crits)

16.33 DPS/activation of Trickshot.

 

This one as well by Lumine for good measure.

22.23 DPS/activation of Takedown.

22.97 DPS/activation of AS.

16.43 DPS/activation of Trickshot.

Kind of a bizarre parse to me. This one may not be as useful for this idea because of then number of rifle shots compared to my and Berry's parses, but the raw numbers you can see are still supportive of QD>TS.

 

Given these numbers, I'd say there is statistical support for swapping out TS for QD, if energy allows. The energy cost is equal with the 4pc but that won't make up for flyby being... flyby.

 

Big picture: Trickshot isn't that great damage-wise. It's a great use of energy, and if we're modelling energy:DPS, it's the best out there. But, that's not what were doing. Subbing out trickshots for quickdraw will have superior effects across the board in regards to raw damage output and expect criticals (surge is the same). One important thing to note for this math is that the 4pc still holds merit for Sharpshooters/Marksmen. In fact, in fights where flyby isn't always viable (I'm looking at you Dread Council), swapping out the 2pc for the 4pc might even be superior.

Edited December 13, 2013 by Falver