Caelrie Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 Hopefully, the combat log will only show your data, so you can only see your own dps. Personal parsers are beneficial tools. Group meters, do more harm than good. Oh come on, the quote SPECIFICALLY says being able to see your GROUP'S performance is necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AHierophant Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 The Anti-Meter faction always states ominous "detrimental effects on the community" since apparently meters automatically turn everyone into a DPS-whoring 13 year old. It doesn't do that. It works like alcohol - alcohol doesn't turn you into an ***, but it allows people who already are asses to act on it. People won't do much bragging until they have a meter to prove it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KippTabor Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 I have no problem with logs and meters but when did gaming become "work"? Where's my paycheck from BW? Where's all my back pay from Origin, Sony, EA, Cryptic, Blizz, etc.? "work". Oh the DRAMA! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battyone Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 (edited) It doesn't do that. It works like alcohol - alcohol doesn't turn you into an ***, but it allows people who already are asses to act on it. People won't do much bragging until they have a meter to prove it. I brag about my PvP healing but that's because generally i'm the only one healing in a warzone which means lots of targets to heal/practice reactive healing on, and generally all the MVP votes Edited December 24, 2011 by Battyone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caelrie Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 And BTW, I'm glad to see the quote I found and put on these forums is gaining popularity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caelrie Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 It doesn't do that. It works like alcohol - alcohol doesn't turn you into an ***, but it allows people who already are asses to act on it. People won't do much bragging until they have a meter to prove it. So does that mean we ban alcohol? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battyone Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 So does that mean we ban alcohol? We all know how well that worked last time... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FerrusPA Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 So does that mean we ban alcohol? America once did and look what happened to them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DevonDs Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 How sad for those of us that have been enjoying the "game" nature of the game and were hoping to avoid the endless swirl of hypercompetitive semi professional spreadsheets and formula, spam abilities in this pattern every moment because it is 3% more efficient than any other pattern…level of play I know this will make it more fun for those desperate for an edge, but for me it will make things much less enjoyable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ituhata Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 How can you say minmaxing is not playing the game to enjoy what it has to offer? That's like saying overclocking is not enjoying the computer you purchased for what it had to offer. Or *insert car analogy since I don't know **** about cars*. Some people seriously enjoy deep theorycraft and numbers games, as always it will be optional but just because you do not see the joy in it does not mean that there is no joy to be had. Because this game has so much more to offer than just theorycrafting. Its like overclocking your computer so you can listen to your jazz mp3 collection, or buying a car with all the bells and whistles and never using the cruise control. This game in presentation is offering so much more than a silly numbers game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caelrie Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 How sad for those of us that have been enjoying the "game" nature of the game and were hoping to avoid the endless swirl of hypercompetitive semi professional spreadsheets and formula, spam abilities in this pattern every moment because it is 3% more efficient than any other pattern…level of play I know this will make it more fun for those desperate for an edge, but for me it will make things much less enjoyable. How would you be forced to play that way if you don't want to? Tell me because I don't understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AHierophant Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 So does that mean we ban alcohol? No, but it does mean we don't give it away for free to every person we see. Give the parse, not the meter. Let everyone that wants to min/max do so through trial and error. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caelrie Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 Because this game has so much more to offer than just theorycrafting. Its like overclocking your computer so you can listen to your jazz mp3 collection, or buying a car with all the bells and whistles and never using the cruise control. This game in presentation is offering so much more than a silly numbers game. What things does min-maxing prevent you from doing in this game? I would like some specifics, please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AHierophant Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 How would you be forced to play that way if you don't want to? Tell me because I don't understand. Because what good is being pro if you aren't spreading your benevolence around? Like I said - go into WoW with a slightly different build, and you'll have plenty of people hoping to save you from yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FerrusPA Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 What things does min-maxing prevent you from doing in this game? I would like some specifics, please. It ruins "the community". Probably in the same way "capitalism ruined Christmas". vOv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caelrie Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 No, but it does mean we don't give it away for free to every person we see. Give the parse, not the meter. Let everyone that wants to min/max do so through trial and error. That actually doesn't make any sense. All it takes is a combat log and player coders will make the meters whether UI addons are in or not. If they are, here comes recount. If they're not, here comes ACT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battyone Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 Because this game has so much more to offer than just theorycrafting. Its like overclocking your computer so you can listen to your jazz mp3 collection, or buying a car with all the bells and whistles and never using the cruise control. This game in presentation is offering so much more than a silly numbers game. I agree, but when you're a nightmare raider you are not min/maxing for no reason. I do not overclock my computer for no reason, I push it to it's limits with video editing, streaming, compiling code, virtual machines so that I can learn more about my field, and so on. I minmax because it increases my chances, and my groups chances, in downing content and progressing since that is what makes me (and people like me) happy. We're still enjoying the game I am not powering through the content, I am a GIGANTIC star wars nerd. I fricken RP'ed on Jedi Academy for 5 years! Yes I minmax, but I still get a lot of joy from this game one way or another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caelrie Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 Because what good is being pro if you aren't spreading your benevolence around? Like I said - go into WoW with a slightly different build, and you'll have plenty of people hoping to save you from yourself. The word "no" isn't in your personal lexicon? You're seriously wanting a ban on meters because you're afraid people might talk to you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FerrusPA Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 (edited) Because what good is being pro if you aren't spreading your benevolence around? Like I said - go into WoW with a slightly different build, and you'll have plenty of people hoping to save you from yourself. I played WoW for a long time and the only people who *****ed about my build or playstyle had no clue what they were talking about in the first place ("My guildie said you gotta do X"). Most of them were just glad to have a decent DD or tank. Edited December 24, 2011 by FerrusPA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AHierophant Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 That actually doesn't make any sense. All it takes is a combat log and player coders will make the meters whether UI addons are in or not. If they are, here comes recount. If they're not, here comes ACT. So what you're saying is that people really want the real-time damage meter and will do whatever is necessary to get it, and all the talk of using a parse to improve one's play is bunk? The only reason to absolutely need information about other people's combat is if you wish to reform them. Otherwise, you'd ask for parses of your own combat and then make people who join your raid or guild use them as a condition of joining. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caelrie Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 So what you're saying is that people really want the real-time damage meter and will do whatever is necessary to get it, and all the talk of using a parse to improve one's play is bunk? That's not a logical conclusion. I honestly don't see how you got from A to B there. The only reason to absolutely need information about other people's combat is if you wish to reform them. Otherwise, you'd ask for parses of your own combat and then make people who join your raid or guild use them as a condition of joining. I don't want to reform people who don't learn. If they have a bad attitude about their low DPS, I want them gone from the group and replaced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ituhata Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 What things does min-maxing prevent you from doing in this game? I would like some specifics, please. It doesn't prevent anything, but when you start looking at the game from a numbers standpoint, it loses its soul. You can argue about it all you like but you and I both know when you reach that point you aren't playing that class and spec wearing that gear because you like it. You're doing it because it's mathematically superior. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AHierophant Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 The word "no" isn't in your personal lexicon? You're seriously wanting a ban on meters because you're afraid people might talk to you? I don't want to rebuff every skill inquisitor out there any more than I want to tell every Democrat "no" to switching parties. It becomes a tedious and tiresome routine of constantly having people trying to modify your behavior because they think X is the only way to go. Especially when they have no personal experience in grouping with me and assume I am a wayward soul that needs their divine touch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caelrie Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 It doesn't prevent anything, but when you start looking at the game from a numbers standpoint, it loses its soul. You can argue about it all you like but you and I both know when you reach that point you aren't playing that class and spec wearing that gear because you like it. You're doing it because it's mathematically superior. That just isn't true. A class gets BETTER for me when I start playing it to its maximum potential and seeing what I can do with it. My playstyle is different than yours, and you could sure stand to learn a little tolerance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caelrie Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 I don't want to rebuff every skill inquisitor out there any more than I want to tell every Democrat "no" to switching parties. It becomes a tedious and tiresome routine of constantly having people trying to modify your behavior because they think X is the only way to go. Especially when they have no personal experience in grouping with me and assume I am a wayward soul that needs their divine touch. This is silly. There's no way people are talking to you about your playstyle all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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