ETA on Advanced Class change?

[Jeweledleah]

If I am so unwilling to compromise, then those who want to play another class can level the other class and stop asking for a class change, especially since they knew up front that the choice was PERMANENT and acknowledged that they KNEW the choice was PERMANENT.

 

If you leveled an assassin, your already existing class is assassin, not sorcerer, so asking to change that charactger to a sorcerer IS asking for a class change. It makes no difference if you've leveled a sage, so you think you know how to play a sorcerer. The fact is that assassin is an assassin, not a sorcerer.

 

I do not know anyone who plays WOW, guild wars 2 or any other MMO on the market that does not have a stable full of alts. I know that is only my personal experience, but it is just as valid as your claim that many players of other games do not have many alts, as if this is the only game on the market in which people play alts.

 

IF they allow class changes, they need to do it in such a way that it will give those wishing to change their class serious cause for thought if they wish to have any hope of retaining the subs of those against allowing class changes. Restrictions are not going to be enough to keep those who are against class changes playing if they allow class changes.

 

You want to be able to change your class at any level with no drawbacks, and even LordArtemis' suggestions are not enough for you. If it doesn't fit in with exactly the way you want it to be, it's not good enough and not even a reasonable compromise.

 

Compromise does not mean "Do it the way I want". It means give and take.

 

1. its NOT a class change.

2. sorcerer and sage play exactly the same, only animations and icon appearance is different.

3. I've actually accepted plenty of Lord Artemis's suggestions as potential compromises. its your suggestions that I find laughable. you are only willing to allow it on condition that its basically useless so that people won't take it anyways. that's not a compromise

 

you and I have gone head to head before, uch to same results. so I'm done with you. I'm not ignoring your account outright, because you are not a troll, just someone who feels strongly about your beliefs, and I can respect that. but you are pointless to have this discussion with, so this will be my last reply to you specifically in this thread.

[Vhaegrant]

thats no different then saying they should just give a max level toon of every class but you do not have to take it.

 

Giving people a new max level character is not a quality of life change its a pay to win option.

 

The sad thing is you guys do not know the difference in quality of life option and giving someone the option of skipping the game. Quality of life like making a UI change so something is easier to see, that is far and away different then giving someone a class they have never played at max level.

 

Okay I've bolded the bit I don't understand.

 

With an AC change you are not getting a new character, you are altering an existing characters skill set.

With an AC change you are not getting any BIS gear.

With an AC change you are not getting any additional character slots, inventory slots, or class buffs.

 

The only aspect of the game an AC change would facilitate is a reduction in time to accomplish the same feat of levelling a second character. While I can understand a certain reluctance to allow a second wave of players a chance to accomplish something you have achieved but in less time, you have to accept this is pretty much a part of the MMO lifecycle. All that time spent grinding end game gear prior to 2.0 pretty much wasted a new player can get that stuff (or better in some cases) pretty easily.

 

Still at the end of the day you can't use ability set A AND B, you can still only use ability set A OR B. The class utility has increased not its power.

 

Even then it's more about supporting a player base and allowing them more ways of playing the character they have identified with.

 

It's not really a point I've gone into in much detail as it is very subjective. With Bioware's focus on storytelling, the full voice over and the cinematic cutscenes, people who have identified strongly with their character on the first play through start to struggle on the second playthrough. Now this is somewhat of a problem on any class with regards to the world quests but at least the class quests give some sense of identity and relate directly to the companions, another integral aspect of the PvE experience. Take that away and your first character is lessened.

 

Allowing for AC changing helps to forge a stronger sense of connection/ ownership with the character and a greater chance the player will try out a new style of play rather than put the game down altogether.

 

While much is made is made of the difference between class and advanced class, Bioware have chosen to blur the lines significantly with their choice to blend the two Advanced classes around one core class/ story. In many peoples mind a Powertech is just a Mercenary who uses one pistol and carries a shield generator, or a Mercenary is just a Powertech that uses two guns. This is the power of the story. It convinces you the character is more than just a set of arbitrary mechanics.

 

While I understand how some other MMOs have set up their Class structure I feel it a shame to want SWTOR to follow it as rigorously.

 

I honestly feel the Class Story forms the core class experience. For example this would be the Bounty Hunter. The Advanced Class is a subset that is a game mechanic to keep two skill sets exclusive from each other at any particular time (you really don't want tank and heal abilities on the action bar at the same time) so you have the tanking abilities with the Powertech and the healing abilities with the Mercenary. Both Advanced classes have further skill trees that allow them to fine tune their role/ playstyle.

 

I see the advanced class as a form of specialisation and a step that should be retrainable at a slightly higher cost than that of a regular respec.

Edited June 25, 2013 by Vhaegrant

[Ratajack]

1. its NOT a class change.

2. sorcerer and sage play exactly the same, only animations and icon appearance is different.

3. I've actually accepted plenty of Lord Artemis's suggestions as potential compromises. its your suggestions that I find laughable. you are only willing to allow it on condition that its basically useless so that people won't take it anyways. that's not a compromise

 

you and I have gone head to head before, uch to same results. so I'm done with you. I'm not ignoring your account outright, because you are not a troll, just someone who feels strongly about your beliefs, and I can respect that. but you are pointless to have this discussion with, so this will be my last reply to you specifically in this thread.

 

 

It IS a class change. A sage may play the same, with different animations, but it is NOT a sorcerer. If you wish to claim that a sage and a sorcerer are the same class, then why can we not change from a sage to a sorcerer? They are, after all, the same class according to you.

 

You never did answer my question regarding how the current restrictions on allowing class changes are working? Are the current restrictions on class changes keeping people from clamoring on the forums for BW to lift those restrictions and allow them to change their class?

[Ratajack]

Okay I've bolded the bit I don't understand.

 

With an AC change you are not getting a new character, you are altering an existing characters skill set.

With an AC change you are not getting any BIS gear.

With an AC change you are not getting any additional character slots, inventory slots, or class buffs.

 

The only aspect of the game an AC change would facilitate is a reduction in time to accomplish the same feat of levelling a second character. While I can understand a certain reluctance to allow a second wave of players a chance to accomplish something you have achieved but in less time, you have to accept this is pretty much a part of the MMO lifecycle. All that time spent grinding end game gear prior to 2.0 pretty much wasted a new player can get that stuff (or better in some cases) pretty easily.

 

Still at the end of the day you can't use ability set A AND B, you can still only use ability set A OR B. The class utility has increased not its power.

 

Even then it's more about supporting a player base and allowing them more ways of playing the character they have identified with.

 

It's not really a point I've gone into in much detail as it is very subjective. With Bioware's focus on storytelling, the full voice over and the cinematic cutscenes, people who have identified strongly with their character on the first play through start to struggle on the second playthrough. Now this is somewhat of a problem on any class with regards to the world quests but at least the class quests give some sense of identity and relate directly to the companions, another integral aspect of the PvE experience. Take that away and your first character is lessened.

 

Allowing for AC changing helps to forge a stronger sense of connection/ ownership with the character and a greater chance the player will try out a new style of play rather than put the game down altogether.

 

While much is made is made of the difference between class and advanced class, Bioware have chosen to blur the lines significantly with their choice to blend the two Advanced classes around one core class/ story. In many peoples mind a Powertech is just a Mercenary who uses one pistol and carries a shield generator, or a Mercenary is just a Powertech that uses two guns. This is the power of the story. It convinces you the character is more than just a set of arbitrary mechanics.

 

BW has made it easier and quicker to level that other class. They allow sprint at level 1, speeder training at lower levels, XP boosts and even the new double XP weekends, which stack with those XP boosts.

 

They have done everything short of allowing players to change their class, (which would directly go against their design intent of NOT allowing a single character to fill all three roles, and the ac's being fundamentally different class designs), to make it easier for players to fill any role they wish and play any class they wish.

[Vhaegrant]

BW has made it easier and quicker to level that other class. They allow sprint at level 1, speeder training at lower levels, XP boosts and even the new double XP weekends, which stack with those XP boosts.

 

They have done everything short of allowing players to change their class, (which would directly go against their design intent of NOT allowing a single character to fill all three roles, and the ac's being fundamentally different class designs), to make it easier for players to fill any role they wish and play any class they wish.

 

Even with an AC change, as long as it operates under the restrictions I outlined (fixed location, timed lockout, reasonable cost), you would not have a class that could cover all roles.

 

Bounty hunter, Powertech can Tank OR DPS, Mercenary can Heal OR DPS.

 

At no point would my idea of an AC change allow a Bounty Hunter to Tank AND DPS AND Heal at the same time.

 

The utility of the class is extended the power is not.

[Ratajack]

Even with an AC change, as long as it operates under the restrictions I outlined (fixed location, timed lockout, reasonable cost), you would not have a class that could cover all roles.

 

Bounty hunter, Powertech can Tank OR DPS, Mercenary can Heal OR DPS.

 

At no point would my idea of an AC change allow a Bounty Hunter to Tank AND DPS AND Heal at the same time.

 

The utility of the class is extended the power is not.

 

 

Allowing class changes would still allow a single character to fill all three roles, which goes directly against the devs design intents.

[LordArtemis]

Updated with new options suggested, no new pros and cons I could find mentioned by anyone.

 

 

Option 1

Level 10 to 15 - Allow AC Change - max 2 changes allowed - reduction to level 10 with change - 24 hour cooldown - once you reach level 16 AC is permanent - everything except XP and quests are unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 2

Level 10 to 55 - Allow AC Change - max 1 change allowed - reduction to level 10 with change - no cooldown - no level gate for permanent AC choice - everything except XP and quests are unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 3

 

Level 10 to 55 - Allow AC Change - max 2 changes allowed - no reduction in level - one month cooldown - no level gate for permanent AC choice - everything is unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 4

 

Level 10 to 30 - Allow AC Change - max 1 change allowed - no reduction in level - no cooldown - no level gate for permanent AC choice - everything is unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 5

Level 10 to 46 - Allow AC Change - no maximum changes, can change at will up to 46 - no reduction in level - no cooldown - once you reach level 47 AC is permanent - everything is unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 6

Level 10 to 55 - Allow AC Change - no maximum changes, can change at will - no reduction in level - no cooldown - no level gate for permanent AC choice - everything is unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 7

Level 10 to 55 - Allow AC Change - no maximum changes, can change at will - no reduction in level - no cooldown - no level gate for permanent AC choice - Must level one character to max level in an AC to unlock legacy ability to switch AC for that class - everything is unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 8

Level 10 to 55 - Allow AC Change - maximum 8 changes per account, can change at will - no reduction in level - no cooldown - no level gate for permanent AC choice - everything is unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 9

 

Level 10 to 55 - Allow AC Change - no maximum number of changes - must change at AC trainers on fleet - 1 Week cooldown - Option for AC change unlocked as Character Perk for 600 cartel Coins (or 1.5 million credits) - Each subsequent AC change costs 40 cartel coins (or 100,000 credits).

 

Option 10

 

No AC change allowed.

 

 

 

And this is the pro and con list as it stands right now. It is certainly open for more additions or corrections.

 

 

PROS

 

1. breathing life into characters that may have been abandoned and thus extending someone's stay in game, their enjoyment in game.

2. allowing people who only have fun playing through a story once - experiment with their character without having to suffer through the story they already know and aren't having fun replaying.

3. allowing people to keep using unique, no longer acquirable items, that include pets, speeders, crystals, armor shells, as well as legacy perk unlocks on a character they have grown attached to, while enjoying the game play style that works better for them, within the same archetype, rather than having to reroll from scratch and lose all the investment they made into a character.

4. making extra money for bioware by making ac switch purchasable with cartel coins.

 

 

CONS

 

1) I would expect that many folks are not going to react well to this change if implemented.

2) They flirted with the idea before launch, even talked about it publicly, but in the end decided not to allow it. At the time folks were pretty dead set against it. I don't think it's likely the current environment has changed much since then.

3) Some classes could end up underrepresented due to bad design. Right now some folks stick with an AC they choose because they would have to reroll and do not wish to do so I would guess.

4) If restrictions are not in place this could end up being abused or exploited.

5) This will likely further demean AC choice.

6) Could cause FOTM issues.

7) If late game AC change is allowed it could end up causing folks that have an AC but do not know how to properly play it running Raids and Operations, making an existing problem worse.

 

 

I have decided to support option 1, option 7 but would prefer option 10. I like the idea of option 7...you have to level an AC to max level to get a legacy unlock you can use to switch to that AC inside the class for another character account wide.

 

I still prefer no AC change, but I'm open to support 1 and 7.

Edited June 25, 2013 by LordArtemis

[LordArtemis]

Allowing class changes would still allow a single character to fill all three roles, which goes directly against the devs design intents.

 

In all fairness so did cross class armor appearance, which they very clearly dictated was against their design intent and would never be allowed. They wanted a players class to be visually represented by gear.

 

That, of course, is no longer the case.

 

Just something to point out.

[Vhaegrant]

My Option as formatted for LordArtemis

 

Level 10 to 55 - Allow AC Change - no maximum number of changes - must change at AC trainers on fleet - 1 Week cooldown - Option for AC change unlocked as Character Perk for 600 cartel Coins (or 1.5 million credits) - Each subsequent AC change costs 40 cartel coins (or 100,000 credits).

[Vhaegrant]

Allowing class changes would still allow a single character to fill all three roles, which goes directly against the devs design intents.

 

There are many things that have come to pass that go directly against the devs original design intent. I don't think they ever thought they'd need to implement a cartel shop and F2P but here we are.

 

The whole idea of a forum is an open discussion of features, are they working as intended, could they be improved, what would we the players like to be considered.

 

The main issue with Advanced class change is to retain the same power within the class and not increase it or alter the spread of abilities available within a class. The biggest threat to power balance within class design as I understand it is to allow for Tanking and Healing abilities at the same time. I have made sure any of my suggestions to the idea of an AC change avoid this scenario.

 

I am open to discussion but I feel implementing an Advanced Class change in this way makes it a viable prospect for medium duration to permanent changes.

This may appeal to players wanting to try out a new play style (and lets be honest most only come into effect once you have a full rotation available somewhere in the late 40s) while not abandoning their character.

It may appeal to roleplayers who consider the class storyline to be the history of their character and don't want to see it happening again, they may want to play their Bounty Hunter as a bodyguard type alternating between a healing role and a tanking role (but never able to do both at the same time).

It may also appeal to hardcore gamers who burnout and want to change their game for a while without stepping completely away from guild activities (still able to participate in end game flashpoints, probably not OPs).

 

In short it covers a lot of bases in giving players a little more flexibility to their character without throwing it out of the window and have to level a new one from scratch, repeating all the exact same content again.

 

You may find this difficult to comprehend but games should be a fun pursuit and something done as a leisure activity, not a chore to be pursued as a second job and woe betide the person that makes a poor decision in their class choice 3 months back.

 

(edit: on typing the time scale at 3 months I'm sure I'll get a lot of comments to the effect of 'Level faster'. I'll take my friends 7~12 hours a week as a guide and my first characters 6 days playtime to max level, that puts an average time to level a new character at 3 months (optimum with no unforeseen circumstances), I see many players being in this sort of timeframe. Oh, and double xp weekends are no real use to either of us as family comes first and weekends are family time)

Edited June 25, 2013 by Vhaegrant

[LordArtemis]

My Option as formatted for LordArtemis

 

Level 10 to 55 - Allow AC Change - no maximum number of changes - must change at AC trainers on fleet - 1 Week cooldown - Option for AC change unlocked as Character Perk for 600 cartel Coins (or 1.5 million credits) - Each subsequent AC change costs 40 cartel coins (or 100,000 credits).

 

I'll add it to my post for now and it will be in the list from now on. Thanks.

[branmakmuffin]

The main issue with Advanced class change is to retain the same power within the class and not increase it or alter the spread of abilities available within a class. The biggest threat to power balance within class design as I understand it is to allow for Tanking and Healing abilities at the same time. I have made sure any of my suggestions to the idea of an AC change avoid this scenario.

The game's mechanics prevent this. No need to implement anything new along those lines.

[Hizoka]

Okay I've bolded the bit I don't understand.

 

With an AC change you are not getting a new character, you are altering an existing characters skill set.

With an AC change you are not getting any BIS gear.

With an AC change you are not getting any additional character slots, inventory slots, or class buffs.

 

The only aspect of the game an AC change would facilitate is a reduction in time to accomplish the same feat of levelling a second character. While I can understand a certain reluctance to allow a second wave of players a chance to accomplish something you have achieved but in less time, you have to accept this is pretty much a part of the MMO lifecycle. All that time spent grinding end game gear prior to 2.0 pretty much wasted a new player can get that stuff (or better in some cases) pretty easily.

 

Still at the end of the day you can't use ability set A AND B, you can still only use ability set A OR B. The class utility has increased not its power.

 

Even then it's more about supporting a player base and allowing them more ways of playing the character they have identified with.

 

It's not really a point I've gone into in much detail as it is very subjective. With Bioware's focus on storytelling, the full voice over and the cinematic cutscenes, people who have identified strongly with their character on the first play through start to struggle on the second playthrough. Now this is somewhat of a problem on any class with regards to the world quests but at least the class quests give some sense of identity and relate directly to the companions, another integral aspect of the PvE experience. Take that away and your first character is lessened.

 

Allowing for AC changing helps to forge a stronger sense of connection/ ownership with the character and a greater chance the player will try out a new style of play rather than put the game down altogether.

 

While much is made is made of the difference between class and advanced class, Bioware have chosen to blur the lines significantly with their choice to blend the two Advanced classes around one core class/ story. In many peoples mind a Powertech is just a Mercenary who uses one pistol and carries a shield generator, or a Mercenary is just a Powertech that uses two guns. This is the power of the story. It convinces you the character is more than just a set of arbitrary mechanics.

 

While I understand how some other MMOs have set up their Class structure I feel it a shame to want SWTOR to follow it as rigorously.

 

I honestly feel the Class Story forms the core class experience. For example this would be the Bounty Hunter. The Advanced Class is a subset that is a game mechanic to keep two skill sets exclusive from each other at any particular time (you really don't want tank and heal abilities on the action bar at the same time) so you have the tanking abilities with the Powertech and the healing abilities with the Mercenary. Both Advanced classes have further skill trees that allow them to fine tune their role/ playstyle.

 

I see the advanced class as a form of specialisation and a step that should be retrainable at a slightly higher cost than that of a regular respec.

it is a class change. You are getting a class YOU DID NOT LEVEL at max level. That is a pay to win option. It does not matter how you see it the devs (the people who matter) see it as different classes.

 

ON your PT vs Merc idea... a PT is a melee class regardless of what tree you sec and merc is a ranged class regardless of how you spec. That is a fundamental play style change. If you have ever played a melee class you would know it takes a much more attentive person to play one then it takes to play a ranged class. Merc and PTs do not play anything remotely alike.

 

The story excuse is such a pathetic one. This is one of the only MMOs that actually has multiple stories. So just claiming you have different stories so that is your class is ignorant at best. What defines the class is HOW it plays and no 2 ACs play the exact same.

[branmakmuffin]

it is a class change. You are getting a class YOU DID NOT LEVEL at max level. That is a pay to win option. It does not matter how you see it the devs (the people who matter) see it as different classes.

It is not a new class, it is not P2W. You can keep repeating both of those until the game grinds to a halt but neither will ever be true.

 

We can assume you will happily accept it if the game is changed to allow it, because if the devs (the people who matter) make the change, that will be how the game will work and it won't matter how you see it.

[LordArtemis]

This is one of the reasons why I kind of like the legacy unlock AC change option suggested. You have to level that AC to max level to get the unlock...so you do earn that AC.

 

Like any other unlock, you have to earn it first before you can use it across your account.

[Hizoka]

It is not a new class, it is not P2W. You can keep repeating both of those until the game grinds to a halt but neither will ever be true.

 

We can assume you will happily accept it if the game is changed to allow it, because if the devs (the people who matter) make the change, that will be how the game will work and it won't matter how you see it.

it is a new class... an assassin is not the same thing as a sorcerer. EVERYONE knows this.

 

It is a new class, the devs have said they are different classes, there is no argument you can mount that changes the FACT the devs have said they are fundamentally different classes.

 

Just because you leveled a ranged class (sorcerer) does not mean you earned the right to have a max level stealthing melee class (assassin) for no reason.

 

They are different class saying they are not different only make you look dumb. You go into general char on any fleet on any server and ask if an assassin and sorcerer are the same class you will not find anyone telling you they are the same thing.

 

I just cannot comprehend how anyone is so daft as to think that 2 polar opposite classes like that could possibly be the same thing.

[Jeweledleah]

This is one of the reasons why I kind of like the legacy unlock AC change option suggested. You have to level that AC to max level to get the unlock...so you do earn that AC.

 

Like any other unlock, you have to earn it first before you can use it across your account.

 

as long as mirror AC count ( like they do for class buffs - which are shared by both AC's btw, further adding evidence of AC not being a separate class), then I can see it as possible compromise. not my favorite option for several reasons, but it IS a compromise that among other things, takes into account people who prefer not to replay the same story twice.

[branmakmuffin]

it is a new class... an assassin is not the same thing as a sorcerer. EVERYONE knows this.

Yeah, everyone knows it.

 

[Hizoka]

as long as mirror AC count ( like they do for class buffs - which are shared by both AC's btw, further adding evidence of AC not being a separate class), then I can see it as possible compromise. not my favorite option for several reasons, but it IS a compromise that among other things, takes into account people who prefer not to replay the same story twice.

 

wow that is a lame rationale right there...

 

You really think an assassin is the same thing as sorcerer then you simply do not belong.

[LordArtemis]

as long as mirror AC count ( like they do for class buffs - which are shared by both AC's btw, further adding evidence of AC not being a separate class), then I can see it as possible compromise. not my favorite option for several reasons, but it IS a compromise that among other things, takes into account people who prefer not to replay the same story twice.

 

Yea, I mean let me give an example of how this might work.

 

Lets say you have two characters....a Smuggler/Gunslinger, level 55 and a Smuggler/Scoundrel, level 15.

 

Note, the scoundrel level is just an arbitrary point...there is no limit on level as far as the change is concerned. Also, they can be on the same server, different servers, doesn't matter....

 

So, you have leveled a Smuggler up all the way to 55 in the Gunslinger AC. Your finished, and when you finish you unlock the ability to purchase a legacy Gunslinger unlock.

 

You pay for the unlock, and then you can log in your Scoundrel and change it's AC to a Gunslinger. You have a cooldown naturally...perhaps say one week.

 

I'm not sure if there should be limits on how many times you can switch....you can't switch back to Scoundrel though, until you level a Scoundrel to max level.

 

So there you are. That is how I think this option would work. A legacy unlock is an interesting idea IMO.

[Jeweledleah]

Yea, I mean let me give an example of how this might work.

 

Lets say you have two characters....a Smuggler/Gunslinger, level 55 and a Smuggler/Scoundrel, level 15.

 

Note, the scoundrel level is just an arbitrary point...there is no limit on level as far as the change is concerned. Also, they can be on the same server, different servers, doesn't matter....

 

So, you have leveled a Smuggler up all the way to 55 in the Gunslinger AC. Your finished, and when you finish you unlock the ability to purchase a legacy Gunslinger unlock.

 

You pay for the unlock, and then you can log in your Scoundrel and change it's AC to a Gunslinger. You have a cooldown naturally...perhaps say one week.

 

I'm not sure if there should be limits on how many times you can switch....you can't switch back to Scoundrel though, until you level a Scoundrel to max level.

 

So there you are. That is how I think this option would work. A legacy unlock is an interesting idea IMO.

 

ah, so it would unlock gunslinger but NOT the sniper? in that case, I'll have to say pass. one of the reasons to allow for AC change is for people who don't enjoy repeating the story... not to repeat the story.

 

I like the general idea, just not implementation you are proposing, the way I understand it. even with my adjustment its still not something I would personally prefer.

 

(when I say mirror classes, I mean faction mirrors. they are not identical, but differences are mainly cosmetic, rather than mechanical)

 

in general though, the more I think about it, the more I have to agree with Vhaegrant. his views very much match mine. but like I said - I view class as base class. I don't view AC as a separate unique class. separate unique playstyle, yes, but so are the specs within any single AC. separate unique playstyles, with unique abilities, distinct rotations etc. which is why I honestly don't see the difference between spec switch and AC switch other than arbitrary - no you cannot do it. to me its on the same level as which species can play which class restriction. its there at first but it can be unlocked and then it doesn't matter anymore.

Edited June 25, 2013 by Jeweledleah

[LordArtemis]

ah, so it would unlock gunslinger but NOT the sniper? in that case, I'll have to say pass. one of the reasons to allow for AC change is for people who don't enjoy repeating the story... not to repeat the story.

 

I like the idea, just not implementation you are proposing, the way I understand it.

 

(when I say mirror classes, I mean faction mirrors. they are not identical, but differences are mainly cosmetic, rather than mechanical)

 

Well, it's not a lock...perhaps it could offer the faction mirror. That would be up to the folks discussing this here.

 

That was just my idea how it would work. You unlock the AC you earn, and from that point forward, inside that class you have the ability to change to that AC. Perhaps they could even have legacy levels that would shorten the cooldown time.

[Hizoka]

Well, it's not a lock...perhaps it could offer the faction mirror. That would be up to the folks discussing this here.

 

That was just my idea how it would work. You unlock the AC you earn, and from that point forward, inside that class you have the ability to change to that AC. Perhaps they could even have legacy levels that would shorten the cooldown time.

all he want is max level toons hes never played because he wants to skip the leveling process. Its not a matter of "picking the wrong AC" he was new classes without leveling them and nothing short of the option of "max level AC XXXX cartel coins" will suit him.

[LordArtemis]

all he want is max level toons hes never played because he wants to skip the leveling process. Its not a matter of "picking the wrong AC" he was new classes without leveling them and nothing short of the option of "max level AC XXXX cartel coins" will suit him.

 

......

 

Hizoka, I want you to be able to express your views here and discuss them. I think everyone's opinion is important as long as they follow the forum rules. But....

 

I thought I made it pretty clear that you and I will never have anything to discuss.

 

Never means not ever...not now, not soon....NOT EVER.

 

It would really be easier for you and I both if you can remember that fact. I am not quoting nor responding to your posts. If you wish to comment on something I have said, fine, but DO NOT QUOTE MY POST.

 

We have nothing to discuss. I really can't stress that enough.

Edited June 25, 2013 by LordArtemis

[Jeweledleah]

my suggestion is to utilize ignore function. its not 100% effective since you can still see the posts by ignored people IF they are quoted by someone else, but it still helps.

 

and because there's only so much self control I have, I feel like I should post this as a reminder. I have 14 alts. I may end up rolling 2 more, I have plenty of character slots still left after all. among those 14 alts, I have all base classes covered and the only AC's that I don't have are commando (I do have mercenary though) and guardian (however my jugg is still my favorite to tank on, even if my vanguard sees more action). but I may end up getting them too. there are some interesting things in both class stories that happen to males that don't work out the same way with females that I might end up wanting to see for myself (my knight and trooper are both female). and I'm pretty happy with their AC choices in and out of character.

 

in other words? if AC change doesn't get implemented - I won't lose any sleep over it. if it DOES get implemented, I won't be utilizing it. I'm not supporting the idea for personal gain. so I would appreciate it if people would stop claiming as if I am. ok?