MajikMyst Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Need proof that the vast "majority" are with you. Please provide source. Well?? Have you read this thread lately?? No.. Of course you haven't.. That is the problem.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TridusSWTOR Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 1.) Follow the rules. You should do that. 2.) You are actively trying to insist that everyone else adhere to your notion of fun. Hypocrite much? AC change is a choice. If you don't like it, you can choose not to do it. You offer no choice. Hypocrite much? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 .....Petulant diatribe Shenanigans. Looks like your iceskating uphill again. Take your own advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TridusSWTOR Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 I debunked your Sprint logic several pages ago. But here goes again. EVERYONE would have naturally earned Sprint at level 14. There is NO mechanism at any level for anyone to AC swap. So, please stop using the sprint fallacy. It is without question a straw-man argument. Ah it's a straw-man because it's debunks your entire position. Go figure. Good job at missing the entire point of bringing it up. Re-read the thread if you need to, I'm not here to hold your hand in this discussion. If you can't act like an adult on the next reply, I accept you concede on all points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TridusSWTOR Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Except the part where you are advocating a change in the actual rules to accommodate the way you want to play. NO one is trying to force you to play their way, other than BW. It's game mechanics. I love how you keep falling back on the idea that MMO's never change. This shows that you are new to MMO's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TridusSWTOR Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 You should do the same. No one here is telling you how to PLAY the game. We are just saying that you need to play within the current rules and stop trying to get them changed simply because you don't like that particular aspect. Back to sprint not being at level 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TridusSWTOR Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 But I suppose the world does in fact revolve around you? Don't like your AC? YOu already have the same option as everyone else. Roll a new toon. Just because you don't want to do that, doesn't negate it as a perfectly viable option. If a person changed their AC, how would it affect your gameplay? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImperialSun Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Who said they didn't? Being opposed to it per se is not irrational. Trying to turn "opinion" into "objective fact" is irrational. If you're not doing that, then you're not being irrational about this. Face it. BWEA can change the game to allow AC swap any time they want. Like others, you are offering "It's always been this way" as a reason why it should always be this way. That is irrational. The way it is and has been has nothing to do with whether or not changing it is a good idea. You should reply to what someone actually writes rather spinning it so that it makes your reply easier. You know it as well as I do. Its just a game dude It is just a game, dude. Which is why there is no rational reason for people to get so angry over this. You are absolutely correct...BW can change it any time they like. For clarity I have never said dont change it because its always been like that...i am dealing with this specific request...which BW considered before launch and decided it was a bad idea....they then considered it again post launch and guess what...they still chose not to add it. I think AC swapping is a bad idea for a number of reasons and BW seem to agree...otherwise they would have added it at any one of the previous opportunities... Driz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MajikMyst Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 (edited) So no one should ever lobby to get game mechanics changed. Well, at least we're clear on your attitude. It is one thing to lobby to get the mechanics changed.. It is quite another to insult, belittle and harass those that disagree with you.. The few people in this thread that are Pro-AC are less than civil and less than honest.. Our words are constantly being miss represented, we are constantly being insulted, we spend most of our time have to re-explain our own words because they have been twisted to say things we never said.. You want proof or reasons or explanations.. Try reading for a change... Type less and read more.. You do not want to acknowledge any reason or point made by the people that do not want AC swapping.. You blow them off and then accuse us of doing things we did not do.. Like tell you how to play your game.. You want to lobby for something.. Then learn to defend your views without being a jerk to those that disagree with you.. The people that do not want AC swapping have put up with insult after insult.. Our words are twisted, we have to repeat ourselves over and over again.. We have to make the same points over and over again.. We are constantly asked for proof or reasons when they were given over 100 times in this thread alone.. Try not ignoring them for a change.. Try to actually understand what is being said.. This post was directed in general to the few people that are pro-AC.. Nobody specific is being singled out.. Edited July 28, 2013 by MajikMyst Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImperialSun Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Yes, no one can stop you from being a petulant child if you so choose. So when you want something we have to accept it....and are not allowed to challenge it.... If we disagree or dont like the idea we are petulent children...riiiigghht... An interesting point of view... Im still waiting for somebody to present any form of proof that AC switching is even on the table for inclusion.....a soft no from months ago constitutes nothing and BW dont seem to have ever mentioned it again... Driz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 This thread in no way represents a majority on either side. I also think that a portion of reasonable folks in this thread have presented reasons they personally oppose or support AC change without demanding everyone else agree with their views. It is only a small portion of this discussion's participants that require compliance with their opinions....and by constant bickering back and forth do next to nothing, IMO, to further their positions. I think I have demonstrated that, though I do not support AC change I am willing to discuss, and even in some cases begrudgingly accept it's addition with the Pro change side. I have even posted examples of AC change that folks have suggested so everyone can clearly see what is being proposed, with my slant of course as a follow on. In the end it is truly Bioware's decision. I for one hope they choose to keep it out of the game. I would like to see MORE meaning applied to AC in fact. But again, I have to digress to the majority if this is something the playerbase would desire. I would not force my play desire on others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
branmakmuffin Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 You are absolutely correct...BW can change it any time they like. For clarity I have never said dont change it because its always been like that...i am dealing with this specific request...which BW considered before launch and decided it was a bad idea....they then considered it again post launch and guess what...they still chose not to add it. And you are still offering "because it's always been this way" as a reason to not change it. I think AC swapping is a bad idea for a number of reasons and BW seem to agree...otherwise they would have added it at any one of the previous opportunities. You have no idea why they have not added it. Maybe it's technically difficult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadessaWayland Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Reroll is very normal by alot of mmorpg they sell item ad cash shop and you can change your class and trust me alot of pll do that becouse most dont like what they pick first also bring some cash to the companie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MajikMyst Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 (edited) You are absolutely correct...BW can change it any time they like. For clarity I have never said dont change it because its always been like that...i am dealing with this specific request...which BW considered before launch and decided it was a bad idea....they then considered it again post launch and guess what...they still chose not to add it. And you are still offering "because it's always been this way" as a reason to not change it. See.. This is exactly what I am talking about.. No bran.. Sun is not offering a 'because it's always been this way..' reason not to change it.. Read his post.. It is right there... Like I said.. We spend so much time having to re-explain what we said.. Edited July 28, 2013 by MajikMyst Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DAMossimo Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 I have yet to read a compelling reason for the devs to devote time and money into this feature for any other reason that does not end with the tagline: "...because I don't want to roll another character". The question to ask is: Will it make EA more money? Maybe, but they will also make money reselling unlocks when you have to roll a new character, as well as character slots from the CM in some cases. With this in mind, I fail to see the upside for them to offer such a shortcut, unless it was prohibitively expensive. To date, I've seen a laundry list of reasons people claim as reasons to unsub/quit from the game, but not once have I seen someone claiming they will do so over the lack of AC switching. If they did, no one would take them seriously anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
branmakmuffin Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 The question to ask is: Will it make EA more money? Exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImperialSun Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 (edited) And you are still offering "because it's always been this way" as a reason to not change it. You have no idea why they have not added it. Maybe it's technically difficult. Please point me to the post from me that says this? You can't, so I will accept the fact that you simply have no better rebuttal that actually making things up that I have never said. My point is that the current implementation should not be changed because allowing AC swapping is a bad idea for a number of reasons outlined in this thread. I am also saying it's BWs game and THEY have the metrics. THEY obviously dont want to change it either...either for technical reasons or because they dont want it in their game. Take your pick... As above, BW came out said "no" not in their game before launch, then they considered it again during beta and guess what, said "no" again....maybe they still say no, maybe its a technical problem, take your pick. I simply state it would not be good for the game and the flat out "no" in the beginning plus the complete silence from BW recently would seem to agree with this appraisal. Whereas you have to resort to blantant lying be actually claiming I am saying things I am clearly not....you also freely admit in this thread you dont care if AC sawpping is added or it isnt, but you only want it bacause you feel it will annoy the anti crowd....you said it in your own words.... Good. Game. Champ. Driz Edited July 28, 2013 by ImperialSun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImperialSun Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 I have yet to read a compelling reason for the devs to devote time and money into this feature for any other reason that does not end with the tagline: "...because I don't want to roll another character". The question to ask is: Will it make EA more money? Maybe, but they will also make money reselling unlocks when you have to roll a new character, as well as character slots from the CM in some cases. With this in mind, I fail to see the upside for them to offer such a shortcut, unless it was prohibitively expensive. To date, I've seen a laundry list of reasons people claim as reasons to unsub/quit from the game, but not once have I seen someone claiming they will do so over the lack of AC switching. If they did, no one would take them seriously anyway. This ^^^ Doesn't matter which way you slice it, spin it or whatver...this is what it boils down to in essence... This is no reason to add it either imo. Driz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 A bioware dev most recently stated that not only had they been having serious discussions about adding AC change to the game, that he believed it was something we would likely see added eventually. That is actually the most recent comment from them on the issue after the change in development staff. I would guess that most of the folks that either opposed the change or supported the lack of the ability to change AC are gone from the staff....considering many of the recent changes made to the game that the original staff either contended would NEVER happen, could not be done based on the engine or they felt was contrary to the design intent of the game. I feel their behavior clearly demonstrates that almost anything is on the table. But I do think it is noteworthy that despite the comment he made nothing further has been said, and the race change option he mentioned has already been added to the game. I leave it up to others to determine if there is any meaning that can be gleaned from that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 (edited) Well, the reason I would support a change early on (and note, I would rather not support even that) is that if there was to be any impact on the game that would be negative as a result (debatable naturally) it would be negligible, IMO, early on since the game has you make a choice early anyway. In other words, just from my perspective, any negative impact would be limited if the choice is allowed prior to level 20 as opposed to later on in the leveling process. I do, however, understand why some folks would not care for this option. The one idea I did kind of like was the ability to change AC for a character once you have leveled that AC to level 50...an unlock as it were. In other words, if you wanted to change your Scoundrel to a Gunslinger you would have to have already leveled a gunslinger to maximum level in the past. Edited July 28, 2013 by LordArtemis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaceMatai Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 We need a gold reply on this one. Thousands of views and no BW posts could mean two things: One, They could be passing this on and waiting for a reply (Which they should notify us of anyway), or two, they aren't paying attention to this (Which they should be, because I recall a post from an Employee saying "He thinks this one will happen." (Which is unacceptable.). PLEASE notify us on the state of the ACC option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soluss Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Well, the reason I would support a change early on (and note, I would rather not support even that) is that if there was to be any impact on the game that would be negative as a result (debatable naturally) it would be negligible, IMO, early on since the game has you make a choice early anyway. In other words, just from my perspective, any negative impact would be limited if the choice is allowed prior to level 20 as opposed to later on in the leveling process. I do, however, understand why some folks would not care for this option. The only reason that I am against, even a one time change, is because then we would get this same thread asking for more. You know it, I know, everyone knows it. The second that something is allowed is the second that someone wants more. There will be people that switch because they think the grass is greener, they will realize it is not greener and want to switch back. The one idea I did kind of like was the ability to change AC for a character once you have leveled that AC to level 50...an unlock as it were. In other words, if you wanted to change your Scoundrel to a Gunslinger you would have to have already leveled a gunslinger to maximum level in the past. In my opinion, this would be a waste of time to even bother to code. Not many people need 2 of the same class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MajikMyst Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 A bioware dev most recently stated that not only had they been having serious discussions about adding AC change to the game, that he believed it was something we would likely see added eventually. Source?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Source?? You must be joking. The source has been posted ad infinitum in this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soluss Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Source?? It was an interview with Damion Schubert that happened about 9 months ago. 18. Will be there any faction or Advanced Class change option available for purchase in the future? We have had serious talks recently about offering an Advanced Class change option – I think that one will likely happen eventually. Species is likely as well. Doing a faction switch is considerably more difficult for us, though, due to the various quest flags set throughout the level up process, so this isn’t on the horizon anytime soon. pulled from Dulfy website. However, Stephen Reid had also said this in an earlier interview: Absolutely anything in the game is potentially open to change in the future. That’s part of what an MMO is about. Your feedback on those changes is absolutely welcome, but just because we say that yes, something may potentially happen in the future… that doesn’t make it a certainty Bolded the important part that some people would like to ignore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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