Trying to decide on a tank class

[waynemolina]

I recently decided to resub and try the game out again after having pre-ordered and played it briefly at launch, but ultimately deciding to stick with WoW.

 

I have normally tanked in games (played a Protection Paladin and a Protection Warrior in WoW during Wrath and Cataclysm, and played a Warrior tank in RIFT) and I'm probably going to want to the same in SWTOR. However, I'm not quite sure which class to choose. Now, being a big Star Wars fan I am most drawn to Force users, and Jedi/The Force/Lightsabers are a big part of what "makes" Star Wars for me. That basically narrows it down to 4 choices for me for a class: Jedi Knight (Guardian), Jedi Consular (Shadow), Sith Warrior (Juggernaut) and Sith Inquisitor (Assassin). That said I have a few questions regarding the storyline and playstyle for each (I believe the playstyles are the same for each pair?):

 

1) How is the general storyline for each class? Doing a bit of research it seems like the Consular storyline is thought to be boring; the Jedi Knight storyline is what would have been KOTOR 3; the Sith Warrior storyline is being a total ****** (sounds good to me! lol); I haven't actually seen that much about the Inquisitor's story, but I know from early access I wasn't too thrilled with being a "slave", although I don't know if that factors at all into the story later.

 

2) From a playstyle perspective, is one more in demand for general group and endgame content? There usually is never a "best" class, but guilds tend to favor certain combinations for PVE nonetheless.

 

2a) If I decided to not tank but DPS instead, how viable is Guardian/Juggernaut and Shadow/Assassin in the DPS role, and are DPS of those classes desired? Is the content like many other MMOs where melee is always at a severe disadvantage in fights?

 

3) How is the general playstyle for each, with regards to tanking? From what I've read, Shadow/Assassin seems to be more complicated than the others, with a lot of cooldown watching to help their survivability. Is the Guardian/Juggernaut more straightforward then in terms of complexity? I am not a big fan of very complex priority systems/rotations or having to watch a dozen things as a tank (to give you some more insight, I stopped tanking in WoW after they introduced the "active mitigation" mechanics for all tanks in Mists of Pandaria because I felt it was needless complexity that made tanking a lot less appealing). Also, as I level I would probably do so with a tanking build -- is one or the other of the classes able to tank effectively at lower levels or do they all have to wait until higher level to hold aggro?

 

Thank you for any suggestions/advice.

[Slivovidze]

1) Jedi Knight storyline is overally a "full out hero" type of story. You save worlds and pursue really huge goals. Lots of fun replies available (though not so much as Smuggler or BH). You are front line fighter and your actions would impact whole galaxy.

 

Consulars on the other hand are more subtle, they don't affect whole planets, they save individuals and their story is overally "behind the scenes". Their conversations are more filled with the Jedi stuff, there is less humour.

 

I have played each Jedi story twice, each once pure lightsided and once neutral. Knight's story is more catching in my opinion.

 

I sadly can't tell much about Sith since I am mostly Republic player, my Sith are lv21 and 31.

 

2) I don't think there is any "demand" unless you are in hardcore part of playerbase. My raiding experience is that "we need 2 tanks" and if they aren't the same class, we are set to go. Also in group finder instances there is no quitting if tank is Shadow/Guardian/Vanguard. They all can perfrom well if played well.

 

2a) From what I see on my server... There are more DPS Guardians in PvE than DPS Shadows. I am quite sure that again, both can perform really well, but I have little personal opinion that Guardians are more of a PvE DPS, while Shadows are better suited for PvP DPS. But again, if you play your DPS well, you should never be kicked just because you queued for HM flashpoint as a Shadow DPS.

 

In SWTOR PvE, melees aren't really in disadvantage. Both melees and ranged people need to care about different mechanics. It is generally good to stay behind the boss because of cleaves and stuff, but I have never seen melees kicked from groups because they are melees. Of course you need to be aware because there is a potential threat of some splash damage happening around the tank which operates close to you, but no, there is no "severe disadvantage".

 

3) Shadow wears a light armor and thus is very vulnerable to enemy damage spikes. On the other hand they have self-heals and amazing defensive cooldowns. They are often looked on as the most difficult tank to play, but if you play and learn it, you can and will perform well without struggle. Shadows have very good area threat generation and longer range attacks (lots of 10m abilities), making trash pulls easier to tank. Good knowledge of encounters comes handy so you know when to activate your cooldowns and prepare to react quickly. Thing I hate on Shadow is that they don't have a leap ability, just a force speed and a pull, which does not work on all enemies. Shadows have resource with steady regeneration which does not require much management after you get used to the regeneration rate and the cost of your abilities. Watching the buff bar is also recomended as there are some procs/buffs you want to use and abuse.

 

Guardians on the other hand wear heavy armor so their passive mitigation is better, and they still run around with awesome set of defensive cooldowns. They are considered the middle difficulty tank, with poorest area threat. Compared to Shadow I find Guardian a lot easier, but still it is no faceroll. They have a leap as the only gap closer, which I find great. Their range is very limited, they are only a 4m sword fighters, save for a 30m saber throw. Their resource is generated by some attacks and spent by other ones, you need to keep an eye on it during battle and you need to plan a little bit ahead. They have some buffs that come up by executing attacks, but they are really easy to keep up as you do these attacks anyways.

 

My main is a Guardian tank and I would absolutely recomend to play one, because I suspect Shadow's cooldown gameplay would fit in the "active mitigation" from WoW you talk about, but I dunno, never played WoW. On my charts Guardian wins all the way. But that might be just me.

 

As for levelling, it is hardly possible to tank until level 20-ish, we get a taunt at level 16 (IIRC), but still it is not enough sometimes. Newbies do lots of silly things in low level flashpoint and unless you really know what to do, you will have trouble tanking. I don't mean to discourage you from it, I just warn you. Things get a lot better as you level up. You will be able (or not be able) to hold aggro with all classes equally.

 

Bottom line, I remember people saying that in WoW, tanks tank everything. Here, we tank the most dangerous mobs, while DPS should (and the good do) handle the trash. That doesn't mean to tank only one mob, we just collect elites and strongs, the weaks are usually DPS work.

 

All said above are notes from a somehow casual raiding person who has all 3 tank classes at level 50 or higher, and at least small raiding experience with all of them. I don't have any numbers here saying what is the best, just my personal opinions and feelings.

[darkov]

Shadows definitely fall into active mitigation group, we have a buff that we must maintain to be effective at tanking, it can drop from time or from charges expiring, plus you must use of cool downs actively throughout fights, rather than saving them for "Oh Crap" moments like the other tanks can do.

 

There is plenty about the three tanks in the role forum, but basically you'll find the Shadow tank:

• Takes longer to get all their tank skills whilst leveling up
  
• Has the most complicated rotation of the three tanks
  
• Must use their "cool downs" during a fight, rather than save them for when things go wrong
  
• Uses active mitigation through a buff that must be maintained, it can expire from time or charges
  
• Is most reliant on the shield chance, which introduces an element of luck to how well things go
  
• Can be very spiky in the amount of damage they take because of the reliance on shield chance
  

 

As far as the aesthetics go, the Guardian could be considered the martial tank, they primarily use melee abilities and whilst the Shadow fights in melee range, they have a healthy mix of melee and force abilities.

 

Guardian story is, as said by the above poster, your typical hero, though is theatrically over the top. I found it ridiculous and completely out of sync with the exploits of everyone else in the game. Shadow story isn't quite as mentioned, you are a hero, you work behind the scenes and whilst you do spend some time saving individuals in the end you accomplish something much larger and of benefit to the Republic.

 

The Empire is completely different when it comes to story, whilst the classes will play the same. you will find that the Republic stories focus on saving the Republic, where as the Imperial stories focus on your own personal agendas. The Assassin's story for example is strongly tied to their first element of being a slave and the personal journey your character takes to the end (it was a bit rubbish imo). On the other hand, the Juggernaut is so far proving to be what you'd expect from a prodigal apprentice attempting to rise through the ranks of the Sith (I've not completed it yet).

 

I can't tell you which class you should choose to play, but I would never trade my Shadow tank for one of the other two tanks. The only thing I don't like about the Shadow is the reliance on luck, otherwise I think everything about it is superior to the Guardian (though technically neither is better or worse at actual tanking).

 

I do however recommend you do two things before you make a decision.

1. Play a Sith Juggernaut to 15 to see if you like the combat mechanic (Rage) and the Imperial stories
   
2. Play a Jedi Shadow to 15 to see if you like the combat mechanic (Force) and the Republic stories
   

 

I found the Rage/Focus mechanic to be the worst thing about the Knight/Warrior classes by far.

[Elyx]

I don't play my Powertech much, it doesn't appeal to my playstyle. I have leveled and tanked end game content with both Shadow and Juggernaut. the two posters above me pretty much covered it all. Just thought I'd throw in a few pennies:

 

I prefer the jugg over the guard due to combat animations. they are very different, and the jugg imparts a feel to the class that I simply enjoy more. they feel like they are pounding their opponent into the ground. Story is good too...you are following your sith masters orders on a huge plan unfolding as the sith leadership fight each other for power and control in the wake of a new war. lots of domination, difficult choices, and sacrifice...and even betrayal. Like the "holy crud I can't believe he did that" kind of betrayal. won't spoil any more though.

 

the assassin is the mirror for the Shadow. they are less involved in empirical domination like the warrior is, and more involved in personal exploration, and discovering their ancient ties to some very powerful sith. i won't reveal too much, but they have some very suprising and fun twists to their story that make you go "wow...***?".

 

if your looking for story, I'd say overall that the Sith versions have a slight edge in just "story". But im a big fan of being the good guy (it's my nature), and so dealing with some of the decisions that rock the sith world were tough. like killing the slaves instead of torturing them. I didn't have an option to free them.....so i decided on a quick death for them. lots of choices like that. repub side it's allot easier to do both good and dark choices, whereas with the sith stories, you pay a heavier price for doing "good", but it also feels better at the same time.

 

Play wise, they are both viable In their DPS as well as Tank roles. Shadows do great DPS, but with the changes in 2.0, many of the original shadow players were put off a bit. but those that are still doing it are posting good numbers (they simplified the rotation...it's easier now). but Jugg's also can do DPS easier now, so i see them allot. the single saber is very iconic in the SW realm, and I think that imparts some popularity to the class.

 

Play-wise, the shadow zips around allot with a speed buff, and drops force bombs, and goes sneaky-stabby (they get stealth). The jugg leaps around allot, throws their opponents into walls, off bridges...and gets to choke them. they are both fun, but different in those ways. try both. You may end up (like I did) playing them both to level cap. my Jugg did get there first though.

[Rikiu]

Pretty much everything's been covered. Only point I'd add is that Jugg/Guard is similar to WoW's warrior in mechanics/playstyle and Shadows/Assassins are closer to Paladins.

[GeckoOBac]

Consulars on the other hand are more subtle, they don't affect whole planets, they save individuals and their story is overally "behind the scenes". Their conversations are more filled with the Jedi stuff, there is less humour.

 

Going to go slightly OT here but I wonder how is it that

 

 

people keep forgetting stuff... Consular is hardly the best story, true, but I wouldn't say that it's "subtle" in the slightest way.

I mean, you swing the favour of a whole COALITION OF PLANETS, we only see representatives from few of them but there's tens (if not hundreds) of worlds in that coalition.

And also, how can you forget the fact that Corellia was mostly taken back through the actions of the Consular? All the other classes, except perhaps the Trooper, have fairly minor objectives on Corellia, and while the Consular has a different objective, he/she brings a whole ARMY with him, conquers all of the major strongholds of the empire, including what was going to be used as an HQ (IIRC). I would say that's a major and not at all subtle thing to do, and the fun thing is that it's only the "side" objective.

 

 

 

but back on topic...

I wouldn't say that the assassin is similar to paladins in wow. Assassins wear light armor and have quite small passive mitigation. Now, I haven't played wow in a long time, but that's basically the opposite of a paladin? I'd say a pt/vanguard seems closer to that.

Edited June 3, 2013 by GeckoOBac

[Lowyjowylof]

I play a Shadow Tank and would say either go with a Vanguard or Shadow if you plan on Tanking Raids. They have easier threat generation plus a little more utility. Force Pull and Tow Cable along with a gap closer (Force Speed and Storm). Passive Mitigation on a Vanguard is just as good if not better than Guardian, and most of it's core abilities are within 10M.

 

As a Shadow, the only active piece is Kinetic Ward in which if you have a programmable keyboard you can bind it and it'll always be up unless you run out of charges. Shadow is also the only Tank Class with a cleanse, a CC, and Stealth.

 

Also, Vanguards and Guardians rely on Defense as their primary defensive stat and then shield. Shadows are Shield/Absorption. My Shadow which isn't really that well geared with Kinetic Ward is at 55% Shield Chance along with 46%ish Absorption. Then add the 22%ish defense. You won't get remotely that close on shield and absorption from the other 2 classes but your defense will be higher.

 

If you plan to DPS more, Vigilance Guardian is Complex is complex but can put out amazing dps in the right hands. Focus is absurdly easy and the damage is just as absurd. I have a Focus Guardian in only 63/66s and sweep hits for 7500-8500 every time Combat Focus is up. Follow that by either a 8-10k master strike or 5k blade Storm and everything melts. I don't even PvP either.

[Grumpftard]

Pretty much everything's been covered. Only point I'd add is that Jugg/Guard is similar to WoW's warrior in mechanics/playstyle and Shadows/Assassins are closer to Paladins.

 

I'll have to disagree, slightly. While yes Jugg/Guard = Warrior....I would have to give Pally to the Powertech/Vanguards.

Assassin/Shadow is *definitely* = Blood DK.

Force Pull = Death Grip

Wither = Death and Decay

Discharge = Blood Boil

Dark Ward = Bone Shield

3 Stacking you Force lightnings for healing = rune management for Death Strike blood shields/healing

This is where your active mitigation comes in to play.

It's DEFINITELY a Death Knight

[Scorecard]

I recently decided to resub and try the game out again after having pre-ordered and played it briefly at launch, but ultimately deciding to stick with WoW.

 

I have normally tanked in games (played a Protection Paladin and a Protection Warrior in WoW during Wrath and Cataclysm, and played a Warrior tank in RIFT) and I'm probably going to want to the same in SWTOR. However, I'm not quite sure which class to choose. Now, being a big Star Wars fan I am most drawn to Force users, and Jedi/The Force/Lightsabers are a big part of what "makes" Star Wars for me. That basically narrows it down to 4 choices for me for a class: Jedi Knight (Guardian), Jedi Consular (Shadow), Sith Warrior (Juggernaut) and Sith Inquisitor (Assassin). That said I have a few questions regarding the storyline and playstyle for each (I believe the playstyles are the same for each pair?):

 

1) How is the general storyline for each class? Doing a bit of research it seems like the Consular storyline is thought to be boring; the Jedi Knight storyline is what would have been KOTOR 3; the Sith Warrior storyline is being a total ****** (sounds good to me! lol); I haven't actually seen that much about the Inquisitor's story, but I know from early access I wasn't too thrilled with being a "slave", although I don't know if that factors at all into the story later.

 

2) From a playstyle perspective, is one more in demand for general group and endgame content? There usually is never a "best" class, but guilds tend to favor certain combinations for PVE nonetheless.

 

2a) If I decided to not tank but DPS instead, how viable is Guardian/Juggernaut and Shadow/Assassin in the DPS role, and are DPS of those classes desired? Is the content like many other MMOs where melee is always at a severe disadvantage in fights?

 

3) How is the general playstyle for each, with regards to tanking? From what I've read, Shadow/Assassin seems to be more complicated than the others, with a lot of cooldown watching to help their survivability. Is the Guardian/Juggernaut more straightforward then in terms of complexity? I am not a big fan of very complex priority systems/rotations or having to watch a dozen things as a tank (to give you some more insight, I stopped tanking in WoW after they introduced the "active mitigation" mechanics for all tanks in Mists of Pandaria because I felt it was needless complexity that made tanking a lot less appealing). Also, as I level I would probably do so with a tanking build -- is one or the other of the classes able to tank effectively at lower levels or do they all have to wait until higher level to hold aggro?

 

Thank you for any suggestions/advice.

 

 

OP, I know what you mean. I just resubbed myself and am trying to decide on which class to tank with, juggernaut or assassin. I like the flexibility(stealth, CC, range attacks, and etc.) of the assassin, but the juggernaut reminds me of my favorite archetype from City of Heroes, the brute. I've leveled both to 15 and still can't decide as I like them both......