Unbound skill in carnage tree is bugged

[Zadtro]

I don't know if anyone else has had a similar issue but when someone uses the electronet against me i cant use force camo to get out of it when it clearly says in the unbound skill which i put my points in :increase 100% chance for force camo to break all imparing movement effects or along those lines but it doesnt work against the electronet.

 

I hate to be annoying and say it but why give us a talent if it isn't going to work. I can agree if the electronet can work against all classes but 1 its not too big a nerf, i mean lets face it pvp is already ridiculously unbalanced with the 37k tanks running around with damage reduction + burst damage + healing + stun + heavy armor so this is one of the smaller problems but considering how fast marauder's die being able to disappear for grand total of 5 seconds should be usable against anything. Also i think it should break combat because in 5 seconds sometimes you can't actually go anywhere because you get stunned as soon as you camo so the talent should last until the effect runs out.

[Memo-]

I don't know if anyone else has had a similar issue but when someone uses the electronet against me i cant use force camo to get out of it when it clearly says in the unbound skill which i put my points in :increase 100% chance for force camo to break all imparing movement effects or along those lines but it doesnt work against the electronet.

 

I hate to be annoying and say it but why give us a talent if it isn't going to work. I can agree if the electronet can work against all classes but 1 its not too big a nerf, i mean lets face it pvp is already ridiculously unbalanced with the 37k tanks running around with damage reduction + burst damage + healing + stun + heavy armor so this is one of the smaller problems but considering how fast marauder's die being able to disappear for grand total of 5 seconds should be usable against anything. Also i think it should break combat because in 5 seconds sometimes you can't actually go anywhere because you get stunned as soon as you camo so the talent should last until the effect runs out.

 

It works against everything.

 

Except Electronet. Because that skill cancels all escapes in the game. Stealthers cannot combat stealth, Consulars cannot Force Speed, Smugglers cannot roll - and Marauders cannot use Force Camouflage.

[KettleBelll]

Should work for Electronet. +1 this thread.

[Zadtro]

It is a little OP against marauders because we die within 5 seconds of being attacked so we need force camo to give us a fighting chance against a class that has heavy armor and ranged attack, how can we close the gap? cant force charge either so it is basically a stun for any melee class.

[Aetrus]

It's called Undying Rage. Or any of the other eight thousand nine hundred ninety nine defensive CDs Marauders have. Learn to use them?

[Zadtro]

Yeah undying rage would be really useful in this situation, it takes half your HP so you know you only do 12-15k damage to yourself for 4 seconds of damage reduction which no one person could do in 4 seconds unless they have all there procs going. so effectively useless. The fact remains that they have a skill called unbound and it doesn't do what it says so they should either change the wording or make it passive.

[Omophorus]

I don't know if anyone else has had a similar issue but when someone uses the electronet against me i cant use force camo to get out of it when it clearly says in the unbound skill which i put my points in :increase 100% chance for force camo to break all imparing movement effects or along those lines but it doesnt work against the electronet.

 

I hate to be annoying and say it but why give us a talent if it isn't going to work. I can agree if the electronet can work against all classes but 1 its not too big a nerf, i mean lets face it pvp is already ridiculously unbalanced with the 37k tanks running around with damage reduction + burst damage + healing + stun + heavy armor so this is one of the smaller problems but considering how fast marauder's die being able to disappear for grand total of 5 seconds should be usable against anything. Also i think it should break combat because in 5 seconds sometimes you can't actually go anywhere because you get stunned as soon as you camo so the talent should last until the effect runs out.

 

Is there something more forceful than a /facepalm?

 

Electronet gets ultimate priority because Mercenary needed it. The class was hard-countered by everything, had basically no mobility or escape options, and Marauders, more than almost anyone, just ate them for lunch.

 

On the upside, Force Camo is on half the CD of Electronet, so there's that.

 

On the anecdotal hyperbole side, you're full of it and a whiner. PVP is not balanced entirely but it's not as bad as you make it out to be. Right now the biggest imbalance is that people are still mixing gear slots with mods that have Expertise and mods that don't (Bad Idea™). If they ever actually fix the Bolster system, it'll be surprisingly decent in the balance department, all current QQing aside. Not perfect, mind you, but surprisingly decent.

 

More importantly, tanks are NOT in some crazy OP state. They're viable. For the first time in a long time. Their DPS is mediocre but their TTK is huge. If you're up against one solo it's going to be a dice roll, the way it should be if gear & skill are equal. Moreso than ever before, skill decides 1v1s rather than class/role.

 

I won't lie that full-tree tanks in actual defensive gear are incredibly *annoying*, but they certainly aren't some OP god-mode combination of survival, healing, and DPS. Then again, tanks are supposed to be annoying. That's one of their main jobs in PVP.

Edited May 7, 2013 by Omophorus

[Valdrius]

It is a little OP against marauders because we die within 5 seconds of being attacked

Yeah undying rage would be really useful in this situation, it takes half your HP so you know you only do 12-15k damage to yourself for 4 seconds of damage reduction which no one person could do in 4 seconds

So you can take 24-30k damage within 5 seconds but not half as much in 4 seconds? Make your mind up.

[Choffware]

Electro net is working as intended. I play both classes extensively. People are just waking up to the fact that Mercs are no longer an easy kill. Electro net has an extremely long cool down that justifies it's "OP". Chasing a Merc is unwise 1v1 they have to tools now to keep you at range.

[Zadtro]

Ok the school boy insults from Omophorus not really needed but hey some people just don't how to defend a point maturely and read the thread title its not about electronet its about the skill tree saying it does something it doesn't.

 

What i am telling you is that marauders die within seconds so we can only escape to defend our selves so electronet stops us from jumping or moving around so its ridiculously OP against marauders.

 

Valdrius 2 different posts so read through everything before word twisting. If there are 2 people attacking 1 marauder he doesn't have a hope so if we pop undying rage it takes half our HP so against 1 or 2 people its not very useful. The only case you can use it is just before you are about to die but if you are about to die you try to use camo then medpac and jump back in before using it.

 

Choffware you just supported the fact its OP because it can constantly keep us at range, i agree with a bit of kiting to slow people down but no that extensive. My original post wasn't against the electronet, it is about the skill tree stating it does something it doesn't. If the unbound talent was removed from the skill tree then fine its not a problem but if we are going to spend our skill points in the tree it should do what it says.

[Choffware]

Well I disagree on the OP part that's why I put it in quotes... Yes if you chase a Merc now with all cool downs up you will have a very difficult time. Before you could shut them down instantly and kill them with very little effort. But a merc can now defend against 1 attacker but once they burn Electro net or HO ( that glowing gear icon at their feet) they are pretty vulnerable. Attack them make them blow cool downs use your defense cool downs to survive... then stealth and then come back and kick their butts. I kill everyone on my Merc that tries to chase me. If I get away and you chase you are dead... if you bail and come back I'm pretty exposed. Plus doesn't the cc breaker drop the EN also? I thought I popped it and got out of a net last night. So I wouldn't attack a merc unless that's on cool down at least. If I'm wrong just stand still and eat the damage bail and come back. Edited May 7, 2013 by Choffware

[Zadtro]

Marauders cant eat the damage. The pvp break is always on CD because for some reason every class needs a stun and a slow in this game which i dont understand. I am saying if you use EN there is nothing i can do and i am guaranteed to die which is why its too OP against marauders, if we go into the carnage tree for pvp and use our skill points in unbound which says '100% chance of breaking any movement effect' then it should do it without fail. My issue isn't with the net it is with the 2 wasted skill points i used. It is fair for one class to have a weakness.

 

Marauders are week against guardians and shadow tanks which i except because its not fair if i could run around and kill everything. Everyone's class should have a class it is weak against but with this ability it kinda stops the whole lets kite a little bit so i can avoid getting hit but not being able to force jump and camo means i cant catch up to you and by the time EN runs out we are already dead because marauders have no health regen we do have damage reduction i admit but its not enough to eat a constant onslaught whilst not being able to do damage.

[Omophorus]

Ok the school boy insults from Omophorus not really needed but hey some people just don't how to defend a point maturely and read the thread title its not about electronet its about the skill tree saying it does something it doesn't.

 

What i am telling you is that marauders die within seconds so we can only escape to defend our selves so electronet stops us from jumping or moving around so its ridiculously OP against marauders.

 

Electronet does EXACTLY what it says on the tin. It explicitly blocks vanishes. That's exactly what Force Camo is. When people QQ about abilities working exactly as described and then hyperbolizing about getting blown up, it irks me.

 

Marauders do not die any faster than anyone else. Marauders still have some of the best CDs in the game. Mercenaries are no longer free kills, especially with all their CDs up, so Marauders can no longer Rambo them for the lulz. In fact, no class is really a free kill to any other class.

Edited May 8, 2013 by Omophorus

[Zadtro]

Marauders cant kill a tank so to a tank i accept i am fodder which i can deal with. Again you haven't read the post title, my problem is i have spent 2 kill points in a talent that doesn't work regardless that this move is OP against marauders in my opinion. You cast net i die and this is fair? You cast one move then i am dead, i have never survived the duration of EN which is why i feel it is unfair. Camo cant break stuns because it would be OP but any movement slow we should be able to break.

 

If you want to put your opinion forward on EN not being over powered even though it is go to a different post, this post is for the marauder skill tree and i am looking to see if other people agree or not or if Bioware will acknowledge that this talent either needs to be updated/made passive or they can put some small print at the bottom like (does not work against electronet) for example.

 

A class having a move which can slow you and stop you from breaking the slow which gives you no chance to defend yourself should have a weakness. If a marauder could use force choke without casting it would be insanely OP against any class so it has a casting bar this is no different, it either needs a time nerf or a weakness.

 

I think the reason you care so much about EN is you are scared of having your major OP move finally having a weakness against 1 class. Everything needs a weakness in pvp, if you play rock paper scissors, rock doesn't beat everything which is the basis of balance, everything needs a weakness. PVP requires team work which is why there should be one person who can break it.

 

Sorry for the ramble post

[Omophorus]

Marauders cant kill a tank so to a tank i accept i am fodder which i can deal with. Again you haven't read the post title, my problem is i have spent 2 kill points in a talent that doesn't work regardless that this move is OP against marauders in my opinion. You cast net i die and this is fair? You cast one move then i am dead, i have never survived the duration of EN which is why i feel it is unfair. Camo cant break stuns because it would be OP but any movement slow we should be able to break.

 

If you want to put your opinion forward on EN not being over powered even though it is go to a different post, this post is for the marauder skill tree and i am looking to see if other people agree or not or if Bioware will acknowledge that this talent either needs to be updated/made passive or they can put some small print at the bottom like (does not work against electronet) for example.

 

A class having a move which can slow you and stop you from breaking the slow which gives you no chance to defend yourself should have a weakness. If a marauder could use force choke without casting it would be insanely OP against any class so it has a casting bar this is no different, it either needs a time nerf or a weakness.

 

I think the reason you care so much about EN is you are scared of having your major OP move finally having a weakness against 1 class. Everything needs a weakness in pvp, if you play rock paper scissors, rock doesn't beat everything which is the basis of balance, everything needs a weakness. PVP requires team work which is why there should be one person who can break it.

 

Sorry for the ramble post

 

What is this I don't even...

 

Two little notes here that might be relevant up front:

1) I have played Marauder, in both PVP and PVE, since launch. It remains my favorite DPS AC and my second favorite AC behind Assassin. Given a choice between playing Mercenary in PVP and Marauder, I'll usually go Marauder.

2) I have played Mercenary, in both PVP and PVE, for over a year. It used to be so horrifically underpowered and vulnerable in PVP that it wasn't worth the effort unless you switched to healing (which was still a pain in the butt).

 

Like I said in my previous post... no one is a free kill anymore, for anyone. Tanks can mitigate enough damage, if they are competent, that their meager DPS can be sufficient. Healers can heal through enough damage, if they are competent, that their meager DPS (or teammates) can save them. DPS can deal enough damage, if they are competent, to kill a tank or a healer faster than they die.

 

There are certain more or less advantageous matchups, and different classes/specs have different strengths and weaknesses, but any class' ability or inability to win a given 1v1 (which is a poor metric in PVP anyway) comes down to player skill moreso than class or spec.

 

If you go and attempt to Rambo a Mercenary without having any support or idea about whether their CDs are available or not, you're being silly. EVERYONE used to focus target Mercenaries because they simply couldn't defend themselves or put out respectable DPS under pressure. This has changed in 2.0, and it is a good change.

 

In fact, there really isn't a class that any other class can consistently Rambo (although Sniper vs. melee is about as close as it gets, but approaching a Sniper in an open field is the definition of incompetence for a melee). Rambo'ing is dead, and it won't be missed.

 

Stealth, as a PVP mechanic, has been horrifically overpowered since launch. It has always had counters, but it has always conveyed an extreme advantage to its possessors. The formerly-weakest PVP class in the game has been given a hard-counter to the generally-strongest PVP classes. Rock/paper/scissors in action.

 

Electronet has an extremely long CD for PVP, it's rarely going to be used on a Marauder in real play (it's far more valuable to use against an Operative or Assassin), and if you're running repeatedly into situations where you're getting hit with it, the problem is your tactics, not class balance.

 

Again, and I cannot reiterate this enough, there is a big difference between "no longer a free kill" and "OP". No one in their right mind tries to duel a Marauder when they know the Marauder has their CDs available (or even if they're unsure, they tend not to force the issue). Now, no one in their right mind should try to duel a Mercenary when all their CDs are available (or even if you're unsure). Up until 2.0 there was never a bad time to go club a baby Mercenary seal, and there wasn't a damn thing a Mercenary could do about it. That has changed. It's called game balance, and for once Mercenary isn't a total red-headed stepchild.

 

Fear not, every ranked PVP team will still take at least 1 Marauder for their buffs & burst. Very few, if any, will be knocking on a DPS Merc's door, with or without Electronet. If you want to know what is balanced, what is OP, and what is UP, look at what ranked teams do. They try to leverage every advantage they can to win, and quickly sort through what *looks* good and what *is* good.

Edited May 8, 2013 by Omophorus

[Zadtro]

Not rock paper scissors in action it is rock can take paper and scissors.

 

Anyway for the millionth time i will say this to you. THIS THREAD WAS CREATED FOR THE POINTS IN SKILL TREES NOT DOING WHAT THEY SAID THEY WOULD DO!! Now if that wasn't clear enough message to you i don't know what is. Stop being afraid that you might get nerfed because lets face half the stuff you are talking about isn't actually true you are just trying to justify having a weakness. If you have a move that can guarantee whatever marauder you put it on will die then it is OP deal with it. We have the skill 'Unbound' for a reason, because in carnage pvp spec it is our only defense against slow so if we put skill points in there it should work against anything because that's what it says.

 

There is nothing wrong with my tactics, someone see's me attacking a healer then comes EN then i'm dead. Its simple thought to protect the healers and its impossible to know people's cooldown timers so that is irrelevant. With EN marauder's are now a free kill so there is such thing as a free kill and tanks, no matter how good someone is, going up against a 37k tank in pvp is a stupid thing for a marauder to do when in full partisian we have 25.5k HP which is alot less. Guardian damage is decent with healiing and heavy armor and damage reduction and shadow have stealth and shields so marauders dont go for tanks.

 

You are going to have to accept having a weakness and if you die so much without EN maybe its your tacts that don't work.

[Omophorus]

Not rock paper scissors in action it is rock can take paper and scissors.

 

Anyway for the millionth time i will say this to you. THIS THREAD WAS CREATED FOR THE POINTS IN SKILL TREES NOT DOING WHAT THEY SAID THEY WOULD DO!! Now if that wasn't clear enough message to you i don't know what is. Stop being afraid that you might get nerfed because lets face half the stuff you are talking about isn't actually true you are just trying to justify having a weakness. If you have a move that can guarantee whatever marauder you put it on will die then it is OP deal with it. We have the skill 'Unbound' for a reason, because in carnage pvp spec it is our only defense against slow so if we put skill points in there it should work against anything because that's what it says.

 

There is nothing wrong with my tactics, someone see's me attacking a healer then comes EN then i'm dead. Its simple thought to protect the healers and its impossible to know people's cooldown timers so that is irrelevant. With EN marauder's are now a free kill so there is such thing as a free kill and tanks, no matter how good someone is, going up against a 37k tank in pvp is a stupid thing for a marauder to do when in full partisian we have 25.5k HP which is alot less. Guardian damage is decent with healiing and heavy armor and damage reduction and shadow have stealth and shields so marauders dont go for tanks.

 

You are going to have to accept having a weakness and if you die so much without EN maybe its your tacts that don't work.

 

The skill tree does exactly what it says it does, too. You're just complaining because it doesn't do what you want it to do.

 

When you are Carnage, Force Camo breaks all movement impairing effects. It does exactly that.

 

Electronet prevents you from using Force Camo, which is exactly what Electronet says it does.

 

I don't know why you're expecting Force Camo to break movement impairing effects which prevent you from using Force Camo at all...

[Zadtro]

But does force camo have 100% chance of removing ALL movement impairing effects?.... NO which is why i am saying that we spend 2 skill points in something that doesn't work. Would you read the title of this thread PLEASE.

 

Deal with having a nerf dam it. You can't have a move which is OP against every melee class, to have 1 weakness is a blessing instead of everyone being able to break it.

Edited May 9, 2013 by Zadtro

[Valdrius]

I wasn't twisting your words, in both posts of yours i quoted, you were talking about being attacked by a enemy, or by one enemy. Instead of attempting to rectify their meaning you should perhaps accept the error of your rage induced post, instead of attempting to blame others for misinterpreting a post clearly designed to belittle the user above your post. If you take 12k-15k damage from using undying rage, then your clearly using it wrong.

[Zadtro]

It's not rage, it is people commenting on this post when they shouldn't be. Simply jumping to conclusions and not thinking. Mentioning one cool down then saying thats the end of it when they clearly don't know what the side effects are, 99% damage reduction for 4 seconds at the cost of half your HP so if i used it as soon as electronet hit i would loose half my hp which is 12-15k hp if i was at full health which is when it is normally used.

 

Read the title of this post, it applies to the skill UNBOUND so please take your talk about anything else which isn't about the skill tree to the right forum.

[Domatron]

I understand your point but as others have said merc net takes priority over all abilities including sorc invulnerable, assassin shroud, and all vanishes.

 

To be honest you should be happy if a merc blows such an important CD on you because that means he's not using it on a healer.

 

If it's a 1v1 use cc break as this is by far the most deadly cc they have. If its in the zerg use saber ward, cloak of pain, or a wz adrenal and wait a few secs to move to keep the dot from stacking too high. Try to find a closer target to attack until it wears off. If you have decent heals you'll be fine.

 

I play both classes and I would only use net on a warrior in a 1v1, if he's a ball carrier, or if he's very dangerous. On my Marauder getting net on me means I'm doing my job and eating the most powerful snare in game for one of my heals.

Edited May 10, 2013 by Domatron

[Shatterstar]

It seems the OP is failing to understand something very basic here. There is nothing broken in Unbound, it is working as intended, just as Electronet is. Unbound requires Force Camo to activate, and Electronet PREVENTS all escapes (charges, speed boosts, or vanishes). Here, let me post it up for you:

Electro Net

Instant

Energy: 8

Cooldown: 90s

Range: 30 m

Fires an electro net that ensnares the target, reducing its movement speed by 50% and dealing 1758 energy damage over 9 seconds. The damage dealt by the electro net increases by 20% for every second that the target remains moving. This effect stacks up to 10 times on enemy players or up to 5 times on any other target. Additionally, the electro net hinders the target, preventing the use of high mobility actions and escapes such as charges, vanishes, and speed boosts. Lasts 9 seconds.

 

So, if the merc hits you with it, you can't force charge, you can't camo, and you can't use predation, because it prevents all those. Your best bet would to slowly crawl behind a nearby rock to wait it out, and if you are a believer, pray to survive. Everything is working as intended here, no issue except the one in your head.

Edited May 10, 2013 by Shatterstar

[KettleBelll]

It seems the OP is failing to understand something very basic here. There is nothing broken in Unbound, it is working as intended, just as Electronet is. Unbound requires Force Camo to activate, and Electronet PREVENTS all escapes (charges, speed boosts, or vanishes). Here, let me post it up for you:

Electro Net

Instant

Energy: 8

Cooldown: 90s

Range: 30 m

Fires an electro net that ensnares the target, reducing its movement speed by 50% and dealing 1758 energy damage over 9 seconds. The damage dealt by the electro net increases by 20% for every second that the target remains moving. This effect stacks up to 10 times on enemy players or up to 5 times on any other target. Additionally, the electro net hinders the target, preventing the use of high mobility actions and escapes such as charges, vanishes, and speed boosts. Lasts 9 seconds.

 

So, if the merc hits you with it, you can't force charge, you can't camo, and you can't use predation, because it prevents all those. Your best bet would to slowly crawl behind a nearby rock to wait it out, and if you are a believer, pray to survive. Everything is working as intended here, no issue except the one in your head.

 

 

Expect Electronet is free, and the escape when Force Camo is something you spend talent points in. It should clear Electronet.

[Shatterstar]

It can't clear electronet, because the net prevents you from using camo in the first place. Not sure what is difficult to understand about that. (No, before you say it, I do not have a merc.) Sure, it is a "free skill", that the merc gets to use once every 1.5 minutes.

By your own logic, Undying Rage shouldn't prevent damage from their Thermal Detonator, Incendiary, Tracer or Heatseeker Missiles, because they spent talent points to get them, and they say they cause damage, and yours is a "free skill".

[jillun]

I don't know if anyone else has had a similar issue but when someone uses the electronet against me i cant use force camo to get out of it when it clearly says in the unbound skill which i put my points in :increase 100% chance for force camo to break all imparing movement effects or along those lines but it doesnt work against the electronet.

 

I hate to be annoying and say it but why give us a talent if it isn't going to work. I can agree if the electronet can work against all classes but 1 its not too big a nerf, i mean lets face it pvp is already ridiculously unbalanced with the 37k tanks running around with damage reduction + burst damage + healing + stun + heavy armor so this is one of the smaller problems but considering how fast marauder's die being able to disappear for grand total of 5 seconds should be usable against anything. Also i think it should break combat because in 5 seconds sometimes you can't actually go anywhere because you get stunned as soon as you camo so the talent should last until the effect runs out.

 

Electro net is not a movement impairing effect.

 

/troll off

Edited May 10, 2013 by jillun