NEW WZ EXPLOIT -- Scamper FTW

[-Hunterx-]

Whatcha' wanna bet this guy is running multiple pieces of third-party software?

 

You have me confused with edra or zardozz,thanks anyhow.

[Lexlo]

Btw,same lexlo from bria? How are those nightsister armbands holding up?

 

Never had a female character so I don't think I ever had or wanted NS armbands. Then again, I sold all of my stuff and gave the money to credit farmers before the game closing was announced so.....

[ryuzo]

While I agree that this ability needs some reworking and bugs like the one referenced in this thread need to be fixed, a lot of the venom aimed at scamper is misplaced due to poor comparisons to force speed and misconceptions of what Scamper is and what Hightail It is.

 

First and foremost:

Theres an 18 meter roll btw

The 18m roll is Hightail, which is the gunslinger version of scamper. The notable differences are:

- It has a 20 second cooldown (cannot be spammed).

- It costs no energy.

- It does break movement-impairing effects.

 

Hightail It would be a better comparison to Force Speed, since they both are not impacted by movement-impairing effects and have a 20 second cooldown.

 

As for scamper, it is true that scoundrels are now the fastest on the map when not snared or rooted. A snare makes scamper borderline useless, and a root makes scamper unusable for it's duration.

 

The key distinguishing features of Scamper:

- It has no cooldown, and can therefore be spammed within the limitations of it's energy cost...

- It has an energy cost of 25

- It does not break movement-impairing effects (snare results in the distance being halved and root makes the ability unusable).

 

Many people make the argument that it's OP because they move faster than any other class. While this is true, it is tempered by the fact that:

- It has a large energy cost. If you spam it, you will be unable to do anything but use your free attack at the end.

- It is rendered 90% useless by a snare.

- Scoundrel has no ability to pair with our scamper to provide immunity to movement-impairing abilities and stuns (a la Shadow and Resilience).

- The speed is not such that it makes you untouchable on a cap. On civil war, a shadow can close the distance before the cap will be complete (as can a scoundrel). On Hypergates, the node doesn't even open by the time you'd get to the node. It is purposefully delayed such that you cannot cap it freely. This is obviously not considering CC to stop them from stopping the cap.

- On Huttball, slowing the scoundrel is the name of the game. If you properly slow/snare/pull/push/root/stun a scoundrel, you can make them useless as a ball carrier. As is, this ability just made scoundrels finally relevant in huttball and able to compete with the Shadow/Guardian.

 

What absolutely needs to be done with this ability:

- More testing of scenarios like the bug discussed in this thread to ensure it can't be used to bypass parts of the warzone.

- Reworking of the animation, as is it's all jacked up.

- Fixing of the permanently-immobilized bug that can arise from it's use. This typically arises when you're getting hit by multiple movement-impairing abilities and scampering/hightailing it at the same time.

 

Many think it needs a cooldown. If this ability were given a cooldown, it would need to be made a mirror of Hightail It, otherwise it is made useless. I would be fine with this, as it would actually fit my uses as a healer better than it's current incarnation.

[ShatteredVision]

Lol @ the claim that force speed can keep up with op roll. Like, BIG lol. Thanks.

[-Hunterx-]

Never had a female character so I don't think I ever had or wanted NS armbands. Then again, I sold all of my stuff and gave the money to credit farmers before the game closing was announced so.....

 

Thought i remembered you grabbing some dirt cheap a couple months before the announced shutdown.

[ryuzo]

Lol @ the claim that force speed can keep up with op roll. Like, BIG lol. Thanks.

If this is in reference to my post, where did I say it will keep up? I said it will keep up such that it's not a free cap barring someone CCing you; big difference there.

As for scamper, it is true that scoundrels are now the fastest on the map when not snared or rooted.

Work on your reading comprehension or learn to quote posts.

Edited May 5, 2013 by ryuzo

[Lexlo]

Yeah,i hate it when i see people rolling off something higher and landing further then i feel they should to.I hope they one day make a game and take my feelings into the matter before rudely making abilities that do stuff like this.

 

Begging a guildie to come make a post in your thread -1

That guildie ignoring the fact other abilities do the same -1

 

It's not so much that they should change it because "I feel like it". The game can't really handle rapid moving characters or animations. If the engine was built like Tribes or GA, maybe. But at the moment, the game appears to treat rolls and leaps as teleports to "X" location instead of actually moving the character through a path. It's kinda wonky and awkward.

 

And I'm not really posting on Soulcaster's request. There are plenty of things we don't agree about. Can't speak for him but he probably wants it removed, I only want the animation glitch fixed.

[foxmob]

Hightail It would be a better comparison to Force Speed, since they both are not impacted by movement-impairing effects and have a 20 second cooldown..

well that's not true. my sin gets rooted all the time and force speed is wasted. there's a talent that allows the abil to break movement impairing effects, if that's what you mean.

 

regarding your other stuff: it's all but impossible to target someone who scampers. I've been right in front of a dude (across the fire pit). he's the only one in front of me, and I can't tab him. then he moves so quickly that, on my screen, it's like a port. there's no way to click him. it's almost pure rng whether I can even target the guy. I don't know what to say here, except that isn't a problem when someone force speeds. I think it's cuz the abil is spammed. it might just be the animation.

 

on another note, what's with all the speed buffs to just about every class in 2.0? it was bad enough with just predation and the force sprinters. now every class seems to have something, and scoundrels get two.

Edited May 5, 2013 by foxmob

[-Hunterx-]

It's not so much that they should change it because "I feel like it". The game can't really handle rapid moving characters or animations. If the engine was built like Tribes or GA, maybe. But at the moment, the game appears to treat rolls and leaps as teleports to "X" location instead of actually moving the character through a path. It's kinda wonky and awkward.

 

And I'm not really posting on Soulcaster's request. There are plenty of things we don't agree about. Can't speak for him but he probably wants it removed, I only want the animation glitch fixed.

 

Still not ringing a bell with the nightsister sale?

[Seireeni]

on another note, what's with all the speed buffs to just about every class in 2.0? it was bad enough with just predation and the force sprinters. now every class seems to have something, and scoundrels get two.

 

You referring to the scrapper skill tree speedbuff? Because that really isn't a good speedbuff, the only good thing in it is that it's even more spammable than scamper. Not to mention that it's from skill tree, not every scoundrel gets it.

[-Hunterx-]

Still not ringing a bell with the nightsister sale?

 

Lexlo from foe,the guild who had leadership expoiting and abusing bria.....because it was no longer their main server.I remember a lot even if you and your guildies do not.

[Lexlo]

Lexlo from foe,the guild who had leadership expoiting and abusing bria.....because it was no longer their main server.I remember a lot even if you and your guildies do not.

 

I'm quite impressed that you remember that much about me. The NS armbands aren't really ringing a bell though, sorry.

 

 

And I don't really see myself as a FoE member. I was only part of them for about a month before I went to other servers/Global Agenda.

[-Hunterx-]

I'm quite impressed that you remember that much about me. The NS armbands aren't really ringing a bell though, sorry.

 

 

And I don't really see myself as a FoE member. I was only part of them for about a month before I went to other servers/Global Agenda.

 

War has a few ex-foe I'll let go of the armbands,thought that was you. Btw,my spies name was Jessica.

[SOULCASTER]

War has a few ex-foe I'll let go of the armbands,thought that was you. Btw,my spies name was Jessica.

 

I like how I came back to this thread, several pages longer now, and several other people from both SWTOR and SWG Bria have said they've never heard of you Hunterx. You continue to think you're quite important though. HAHaHHA

 

WAR currently has *1* ex-foe.

Edited May 6, 2013 by SOULCASTER

[ryuzo]

well that's not true. my sin gets rooted all the time and force speed is wasted. there's a talent that allows the abil to break movement impairing effects, if that's what you mean.

 

regarding your other stuff: it's all but impossible to target someone who scampers. I've been right in front of a dude (across the fire pit). he's the only one in front of me, and I can't tab him. then he moves so quickly that, on my screen, it's like a port. there's no way to click him. it's almost pure rng whether I can even target the guy. I don't know what to say here, except that isn't a problem when someone force speeds. I think it's cuz the abil is spammed. it might just be the animation.

 

on another note, what's with all the speed buffs to just about every class in 2.0? it was bad enough with just predation and the force sprinters. now every class seems to have something, and scoundrels get two.

The inability to see them / target them is a product of the animation. It seems to be treated as a teleport rather than an increase to run speed, which is what causes the weirdness with figuring out where they went. The animation definitely needs to change.

[SOULCASTER]

The animation definitely needs to change.

 

Yeah its very wonky. Especially when jumping off ledges. They kind of boomerang

[-Hunterx-]

I like how I came back to this thread, several pages longer now, and several other people from both SWTOR and SWG Bria have said they've never heard of you Hunterx. You continue to think you're quite important though. HAHaHHA

 

WAR currently has *1* ex-foe.

 

Multiple names from foe are carrying your tag,same person?.Didn't realize sword -saint and lexlo were one and the same. I'm also quite sure no one has ever heard of -Hunterx- outside of esf and a few ato people when the game started considering it was created at that time.I could also find some people who can say they never heard of t'az much less toadee or jessica but i'm sure there is a lot that do remember.Say hello to anna and midah,couple of your guildiesand yeah im sure if you have others in their from midah's and anna's time then you have others who remember t'az Quote me as saying im quite important or just plainly say you feel i think i am ,somehow i don't remember typing that.

[Pistols]

The inability to see them / target them is a product of the animation. It seems to be treated as a teleport rather than an increase to run speed, which is what causes the weirdness with figuring out where they went. The animation definitely needs to change.

 

This I agree with, as the crappy engine simply cannot handle this type of fail of that magnitude, lol.

 

I've never seen what the OP describes, but if it is indeed possible (which I believe the OP's word), obviously needs to be fixed ASAP.

 

And peeps, we don't have a worthy Q/A-Development team committed to making PvP excellence, game is left with rudimentary development skills at best, and I say that not to troll the team but what they've shown the community with their updates. It should be a no-brainer to spam these issues on the forums, cause it's literally the only way anything gets done within a 6 month time frame.

[Astarica]

Scamper is treated as a teleport as far as the game is concerned. You can roll across acid or fire without taking any damage. Try to do that with Force Speed without jumping. It just won't work.

 

This also means attempting to grapple someone rolling can outright fail. What can happen is you grapple somoene in mid roll, so they get pulled to you, and as they finish the roll, they teleport back to their destination and completely negated your pull. That's a rather nasty surprise when you're trying to chase them down.

[-Hunterx-]

This I agree with, as the crappy engine simply cannot handle this type of fail of that magnitude, lol.

 

I've never seen what the OP describes, but if it is indeed possible (which I believe the OP's word), obviously needs to be fixed ASAP.

 

And peeps, we don't have a worthy Q/A-Development team committed to making PvP excellence, game is left with rudimentary development skills at best, and I say that not to troll the team but what they've shown the community with their updates. It should be a no-brainer to spam these issues on the forums, cause it's literally the only way anything gets done within a 6 month time frame.

 

I just somehow don't see spamming how the devs are useless and someone feels a exploit is being abused WHILE also already having posts started at a earlier point asking for the ability to be nerfed (clearly his agenda ) is ever a great idea but hey to each their own?

[Darth_Dreselus]

Thanks for the tip.

[Jeeses]

I just somehow don't see spamming how the devs are useless and someone feels a exploit is being abused WHILE also already having posts started at a earlier point asking for the ability to be nerfed (clearly his agenda ) is ever a great idea but hey to each their own?

 

 

How is it relevant to the issue of the ability that he earlier cried nerf?

 

If what he is suggesting is indeed possible it needs to be fixed, asap.

Scamper being used as he is describing destroys VZ.

 

At first I called for a nerf, because I feel that the ability provides too much movement in comparison to other speed boost abilities, does that make my opinion regarding the issue of scampering over walls invalid?

[-Hunterx-]

Edit....

 

How is it relevant to the issue of the ability that he earlier cried nerf?

 

If what he is suggesting is indeed possible it needs to be fixed, asap.

Scamper being used as he is describing destroys VZ.

 

At first I called for a nerf, because I feel that the ability provides too much movement in comparison to other speed boost abilities, does that make my opinion regarding the issue of scampering over walls invalid?

 

It is relevant because he is still calling for nerfs to it.Sure they should fix voidstar and maybe even make it so in hutball it's no longer a ball match but instead a death match so speed boosts don't matter eh? How about looking at options before crying nerf regardless how it's disguised. I'm not arguing the exploit,which is the area,should be fixed.I also do not remember it being clarified which class was being used.Makes a difference.You yourself are not even describing which one.

Edited May 6, 2013 by -Hunterx-
Wrong post.

[Pistols]

I just somehow don't see spamming how the devs are useless and someone feels a exploit is being abused WHILE also already having posts started at a earlier point asking for the ability to be nerfed (clearly his agenda ) is ever a great idea but hey to each their own?

 

Whoever said anyone was trying to formulate a "great idea"? Players post feedback all the time, and to be brutally honest, where in my evaluation of said Dev team was I wrong? I'm not trying to be one of those guys who lolrage for not having /emotes or anything lol, but I have no qualms calling out broken crap in PvP. FYI: The bolster sham has been sitting on live servers for a month now, and a few months since their implementation to PTS, this is one of the worst turn-offs to PvP in quite some time.

 

As for the issue the OP brought up, it's a very legitimate concern if in fact it works as he describes, even droolers understand that would not be working as intended. The only agenda in this thread is awareness, and you seem to think it's some hidden tongue in cheek to the actual skill, which clearly it isn't.

Edited May 6, 2013 by Pistols

[Jeeses]

Edit....

 

 

 

It is relevant because he is still calling for nerfs to it.Sure they should fix voidstar and maybe even make it so in hutball it's no longer a ball match but instead a death match so speed boosts don't matter eh? How about looking at options before crying nerf regardless how it's disguised. I'm not arguing the exploit,which is the area,should be fixed.I also do not remember it being clarified which class was being used.Makes a difference.You yourself are not even describing which one.

 

 

Why does he need to clarify which class is being used? He named the ability, scamper, as the issue. See below.

 

"When attacking in a voidstar, at the last cloner with the 3 force fields, you can /scamper from the top ledge over the force field (bypassing it entirely) and plant on the other side on the last door before anyone can get to you."

 

Not once did he ask for a nerf, or a change, or anything similar. He purely stated that the ability to jump over the wall obviously not an intentional feature, and needs to be fixed. Regardless of the agenda that you believe is contributing to this thread there is no evidence to back up such a belief in the post he made.

 

I dislike the ability, I'm not going to deny that fact. I've been posting asking for a change in some respect because I believe it gives them far too much of a mobility advantage in comparison to other classes. However I'm looking at this specific issue objectively.

 

The ability to jump across a wall is without a doubt, unfair. Sure Ops are now incredibly fast, however they can be countered to a degree, but when they can leap to areas that nobody else can its just wrong.

 

Sure, the situation would have to be absolutely perfect for them to come away with an unstoppable advantage, however there shouldn't be the opportunity for it to occur.