Shadows/assassins need a rebalance

[sithBracer]

Double maul should simply not be possible... adding a cooldown to it would go a long way to reduce the amount of frustration there is when the worst possible assassin ever double maul you and waste all his energy then proceed to a third maul due to energy regen from blackout or w/e the name and the tactic reduction to the first maul.

It's completely dumb and retarded to do that but it still does crazy amount of damage.

 

Adding a cooldown to maul will hurt terrible assassins but do nothing against good assassins.

 

I'm fine with that, it would actually help bad assassins since using 2 mauls is a bad idea. Even in the best case scenario he gets 2 crits from recklessness on his mauls that is 18k damage to me, his third one only has a 1/4 chance to crit and I will popped my adrenal and my medpac (maybe my DCD). So he is now stuck with no energy, no cc, no way to regain it and I still have everything and a decent rotation. So far not one assassin has been able to kill me by double mauling me from the start (but oooooh so many tried).

Edited October 21, 2013 by sithBracer

[Tankqull]

I'm fine with that, it would actually help bad assassins since using 2 mauls is a bad idea. Even in the best case scenario he gets 2 crits from recklessness on his mauls that is 18k damage to me, his third one only has a 1/4 chance to crit and I will popped my adrenal and my medpac (maybe my DCD). So he is now stuck with no energy, no cc, no way to regain it and I still have everything and a decent rotation. So far not one assassin has been able to kill me by double mauling me from the start (but oooooh so many tried).

 

maul is not a force attack and thus not affected by recklessness

[sithBracer]

maul is not a force attack and thus not affected by recklessness

 

In that case the attack they learn at 50 (forgot what it's called, I just know which key I bound it to lol, battle readiness I think).

[Tankqull]

battle readiness is a lvl 50 defensive/offensive cooldown healing you for a moderate amount of live that additionally allows your stance to ignore the lockout timer of the dmg proc it has and doubles its dmg (then hitting for stance depending up to 500dmg) does not effect the lockout timer of forcebreach procs.

the assasine pendant overcharge sabre is once more is not effecting maul.

Edited October 21, 2013 by Tankqull

[snaplemouton]

Yeah the good ones only maul with duplicity. Make help make bad assassins not so bad since the class is ripe with crappy deception players who don't even know what a taunt is let alone how to manage force by spamming a certain ability.

 

It wouldn't help bad assassin. It would only leave them spamming clairvoyant strike instead, reducing their damage output by a bazilion.

[sithBracer]

battle readiness is a lvl 50 defensive/offensive cooldown healing you for a moderate amount of live that additionally allows your stance to ignore the lockout timer of the dmg proc it has and doubles its dmg (then hitting for stance depending up to 500dmg) does not effect the lockout timer of forcebreach procs.

maul once more is not affected by that skill.

 

I am sooo not reading xinika's guide anymore.

[Tankqull]

I am sooo not reading xinika's guide anymore.

 

making it short there is no ability beside "exploitive strike" to increase the critchance of melee attacks including maul. and it only increases it by 9%. so you normally will see with ES proced crit chances of maul around 25% +/-2-3% equip depending.

Edited October 21, 2013 by Tankqull

[Fozy]

Biofail still planning on buffing this class? What a slap in the face to pvpers. Mind as well re-roll to a assassin now because the whole damn fleet is filled to the brim already with them.

[Fozy]

3/10 obvious troll is obvious

Still funny tho

 

And I see your main is an assassin. Thats just too funny. Of course anyone saying something about "nerf" is obviously a troll, right?

[JP_Legatus]

And I see your main is an assassin. Thats just too funny. Of course anyone saying something about "nerf" is obviously a troll, right?

 

No, but saying 9k 3 globals in a row happens is an obvious blatant lie. Most mauls don't crit (30% max crit WITH bonus) and you can't get the proc 3x in a row. Discharge definitively does not do 9k and while shock can get close to 9k, you've got 55% chance to not get the extra-shock proc, and the charge has to also crit (20%) WITH overcharge active. All this and shock might hit 8.5k.

 

And it'd still be less burst than carnage, more squishy than carnage (deception is the #1 best peel target) and available less often than carnage burst phase AND requires positioning behind the target.

 

So yes, saying 3x 9k crits occurs, therefor sins are fine is a troll.

Edited October 23, 2013 by JP_Legatus

[sithBracer]

And I see your main is an assassin. Thats just too funny. Of course anyone saying something about "nerf" is obviously a troll, right?

 

Wait you mean you weren't trolling?

 

Please show me which magical assassin can do 3 9ks in a row?

[JP_Legatus]

Wait you mean you weren't trolling?

 

Please show me which magical assassin can do 3 9ks in a row?

 

My thoughts exactly lol

 

Oddly enough you don't see him whining about carnage, a spec that CAN do that burst (and more) is vastly tankier and doesn't require backside positioning.

 

Even if maul damage got a 30% increase sins still won't be taken as dps slot.

 

What else was I supposed to think if not troll?

Edited October 23, 2013 by JP_Legatus

[Ottoattack]

No, but saying 9k 3 globals in a row happens is an obvious blatant lie. Most mauls don't crit (30% max crit WITH bonus) and you can't get the proc 3x in a row. Discharge definitively does not do 9k and while shock can get close to 9k, you've got 55% chance to not get the extra-shock proc, and the charge has to also crit (20%) WITH overcharge active. All this and shock might hit 8.5k.

 

And it'd still be less burst than carnage, more squishy than carnage (deception is the #1 best peel target) and available less often than carnage burst phase AND requires positioning behind the target.

 

So yes, saying 3x 9k crits occurs, therefor sins are fine is a troll.

 

While carnage fairs somewhat better than deception sin, it is not even remotely questionable that deception has better control on burst. Heck half of it happens while the target is CCed and there is no way to stop breach and shock critic. The problem is after the initial burst, sin lacks the ability to provide strong burst or sustained damage. That's why buffing maul is just silly and buffing voltaic slash and thrash "slightly" is not sufficient. These changes would not make the class any better. Just more of annoyance and OP in regular WZs and still undesirable in ranked seen.

[Fozy]

You guys do realize this is a STEALTH class right? How much more dense do you have to get? This is an abomination to mmo's and should be nerfd, plain and simple.

[JP_Legatus]

While carnage fairs somewhat better than deception sin, it is not even remotely questionable that deception has better control on burst. Heck half of it happens while the target is CCed and there is no way to stop breach and shock critic. The problem is after the initial burst, sin lacks the ability to provide strong burst or sustained damage. That's why buffing maul is just silly and buffing voltaic slash and thrash "slightly" is not sufficient. These changes would not make the class any better. Just more of annoyance and OP in regular WZs and still undesirable in ranked seen.

 

Idk, it's apples and oranges imo. What I can say is that if a good healer has the option of healing for a deception sin or a carnage mara... which do you think he'd choose?

 

I do think it was retarded for them to buff maul as I've been saying for weeks. However, given that sins are the squishiest melee in the game, they should have the highest burst/damage. Right now they don't even have THAT.

 

The "extra control" people talk about doesn't really amount to much. Low slash and spike both amount to 1 extra global, and if it's not a 1v1, you often don't even want to use low slash or spike because it gives the target more time to call for help/get heals/get guard + taunts. Best way to kill someone as a deception sin in arenas is to pop out with discharge, shock, maul, and hope that all 3 crit so you can be in execute range. Odds are that won't work so you'll just be useless space for the next 90s, but it's not like low slash or spike is helping you out on bursting that target down.

Honestly the best use for low slash from my experience is to hit the tank or healer and move back to the target with the actual damage.

Edited October 24, 2013 by JP_Legatus

[JP_Legatus]

You guys do realize this is a STEALTH class right? How much more dense do you have to get? This is an abomination to mmo's and should be nerfd, plain and simple.

 

How does being a stealth class even matter in arenas? Are you saying deception is overpowered in open world pvp? Because I'd probably agree with you, but unfortunately in this game that doesn't exist. Stealth is a gimmick in this game, nothing more. That's why stealth classes guard nodes and stay out of fights.

Edited October 24, 2013 by JP_Legatus

[Helig]

Bit hard go justify when there are 9 and 10k ambushes hitting like a stomper

To be quite fair, contrary to the name, you can see an Ambush coming from a mile away.

[JP_Legatus]

To be quite fair, contrary to the name, you can see an Ambush coming from a mile away.

 

Course it doesn't matter that you see it, since it's coming from a class that is immune to interrupts and stuns

The name thing is kind of funny though. Maybe they should call it "kamehameha" or "spirit bomb"

 

"Hold on guys, I'm charging up my big attack! You'll all be dead by the time it finishes charging, but it's cool cuz we're gonna win and it will look like I did all the work!"

Edited October 24, 2013 by JP_Legatus

[Xanas]

The overall burst damage in this game for some classes is out of order and needs balancing. Shadows included.

[Fozy]

The overall burst damage in this game for some classes is out of order and needs balancing. Shadows included.

 

Completely agree. Its hilarious to see the same assassins come on here and justify not getting a nerf.

[cycao]

Completely agree. Its hilarious to see the same assassins come on here and justify not getting a nerf.

 

While I don't agree with maul getting a buff assassins are fairly balanced. Their burst revolves around recklessness and duplicity. Outside that it's all rng with building stacks for discharge. Terrible sustained damage which is why they're buffing VS. On the opener they can be quite lethal but the spec is for the most part nothing but a regstar spec. You hardly ever saw deception/infiltration in 8v8 rwz and now they're more viable for arenas but you still don't see that class excelling.

 

Plus all the changes made for assassins has more to do with the PvE side of this game than the PvP side. Also since no one is really testing these outside those that have closed beta invites and even then the main focus is the sssp no one knows how these changes will play out on live.

 

Just slow your roll and wait and see how it plays out.

[Brunner_Venda]

The class needs a nerf, it's too effective 1v1.

 

I love tournaments and dueling. Assassins are OP to the point where most tournaments have separate brackets for you.

 

That should tell you something. You don't need a buff. Your burst is too high. If you want sustained damage then something else needs to give, like a nerf to the defensive CD's.

Edited October 24, 2013 by Brunner_Venda

[cycao]

The class needs a nerf, it's too effective 1v1.

 

I love tournaments and dueling. Assassins are OP to the point where most tournaments have separate brackets for you.

 

That should tell you something. You don't need a buff. Your burst is too high. If you want sustained damage then something else needs to give, like a nerf to the defensive CD's.

 

Why is everyone so hung up on 1v1. It rarely plays a part in competitive PvP. And the defensive cooldowns are fine. Shroud lasts 3 seconds outside of darkness, when this happens stop using force tech and go to weapon damage. When they pop deflection use force and tech. It's only OP when bads try using their hard stuns on me or use hard hitting weapon damage when deflection is up. And blackout was something needed to help buff up the survivability of deception.

[Brunner_Venda]

Why is everyone so hung up on 1v1. It rarely plays a part in competitive PvP. And the defensive cooldowns are fine. Shroud lasts 3 seconds outside of darkness, when this happens stop using force tech and go to weapon damage. When they pop deflection use force and tech. It's only OP when bads try using their hard stuns on me or use hard hitting weapon damage when deflection is up. And blackout was something needed to help buff up the survivability of deception.

 

I already explained why 1v1 is important.

 

Tournaments.

Dueling friends.

The gree event.

Guarding a node in regs and getting raped by a sin before help can arrive.

 

A good sin is unbeatable in those situations. What would you do to your class to make it fair to the other people paying the same money you are to play?

 

next thing: sap. Why is the timer so short on this? You should be able to do it once a fight at best, not every 8 seconds.

Edited October 24, 2013 by Brunner_Venda

[cycao]

I already explained why 1v1 is important.

 

Tournaments.

Dueling friends.

The gree event.

Guarding a node in regs and getting raped by a sin before help can arrive.

 

A good sin is unbeatable in those situations. What would you do to your class to make it fair to the other people paying the same money you are to play?

 

next thing: sap. Why is the timer so short on this? You should be able to do it once a fight at best, not every 8 seconds.

 

Who cares about dueling tournaments or dueling friends? They're both player driven and offer nothing outside of whatever the pool is and anyone can enter. This game has nothing to do whatsoever with 1v1 outside of those two situations. The gree event is meant for groups of 4 and is a free for all zone. You're going to be getting ganked if you're running around solo, either by a sin or by other groups of 4 who're participating in this once every few months event. For node guarding, yeah it's regs. Unless it's an actual tank (PT or jug) or another stealth (sin or ops) you're going to be subject to stealth attacks. If you notice a good stealth on the opposing team make it aware to your teammates. If you get blown up instantly part of the blame is on the defender. And it's regs...regstar class.

 

And there is to 'timer' for sap, you can chain sap with sins or ops. It can either be used offensively for stealth capping objectives (which would be all on the defender for standing so close) or defensively for chain sapping attackers until help arrives.