2.0 is here. Force Shroud STILL bugged.

[Aerilas]

It's STILL bugged. Today we played rated games on our server, where I was the assassin.

 

When it was time that the ball reset I made sure every time to be in the middle with force shroud up.

 

But then, whoops, there comes the v-1 Seismic Grenade magically hitting me THROUGH my Force Shroud, knocking me on the floor, not getting a chance to pick up the ball.

A few balls later, same situation, only this time it's Overload which knocks me far away THROUGH Force Shroud and again leaving me in a situation where I cant pick up the ball.

 

I'm sick and tired of Bioware not addressing this issue. Is it that hard to fix a simple bug which can affect so much?

 

 

 

Don't go "yes but legslash can hit yhou through force shroud. So can a root, blablabla". It's not about those techniques.

I know what hit me, I know what shouldn't hit me.

[HoboWithAStick]

Yeah I agree, this issue has been going on for too long now and with the added saber reflect for the jug I feel like shroud should actually be buffed to ignore all damage. Even if it ignored everything it still doesn't reflect damage back to the user. Either way they should fix this.

[stephenalandavie]

I know its broken i have it on my shadow quite regular. Those Grenades what type of dmg are they classed as? tech? I dont expect them to fix it anytime soon i have just about given up with Bw with regards to fixes. Takes them over a week to fix what they knew was broken months a go.

[Simmerr]

It negates the damage you are taking, but not the secondary effect, in your case a knockback. Not necessarily a bug, just depends on which moves they use.

[RankorSSGS]

It negates the damage you are taking, but not the secondary effect, in your case a knockback. Not necessarily a bug, just depends on which moves they use.

 

Incorrect, Shroud is supposed to resist all tech force attacks, including any secondary effects. Currently, it does not.

[MasterFeign]

As far as I know force shroud suffers an accuracy check.

[hate-wizard]

Incorrect, Shroud is supposed to resist all tech force attacks, including any secondary effects. Currently, it does not.

 

Actually, Shroud isn't supposed to stop the damage from a V-1 Seismic Grenade at all - it's kinetic, not tech or force, damage. Following that, the grenade is probably a kinetic attack, and hence Shroud does not protect against it.

[CBRGhostRider]

Actually, Shroud isn't supposed to stop the damage from a V-1 Seismic Grenade at all - it's kinetic, not tech or force, damage. Following that, the grenade is probably a kinetic attack, and hence Shroud does not protect against it.

 

We have

Attack types: melee, ranged, force and tech.

Damage types: Kinetic, energy, internal and elemental.

 

Any combination of attack type can exist against any damage type (technically at least, though SWTOR may not have all combinations).

 

Force shroud: Removes all hostile removable effects and increases your chance to resist Force and tech attacks by 100% for 3 seconds. Does not break Stealth.

 

Therefore, 2 possibilities exist:

1. The grenade is a tech/force, and as such should be resisted by shroud. (I don't know if it goes through a *tech* accuracy check as posted above though... that may explain it).

2. The grenade is a ranged (or even melee attack type). In this case, shroud won't resist it... however surprisingly, deflection (+50% defense) should work and we should be able to resist the grenade w/ deflection up (at least a few times)... which has never happened.

 

Therefore the grenade must be tech, and #1 is the correct scenario.

Edited April 15, 2013 by CBRGhostRider

[Simmerr]

We have

Attack types: melee, ranged, force and tech.

Damage types: Kinetic, energy, internal and elemental.

 

Any combination of attack type can exist against any damage type (technically at least, though SWTOR may not have all combinations).

 

Force shroud: Removes all hostile removable effects and increases your chance to resist Force and tech attacks by 100% for 3 seconds. Does not break Stealth.

 

Therefore, 2 possibilities exist:

1. The grenade is a tech/force, and as such should be resisted by shroud. (I don't know if it goes through a *tech* accuracy check as posted above though... that may explain it).

2. The grenade is a ranged (or even melee attack type). In this case, shroud won't resist it... however surprisingly, deflection (+50% defense) should work and we should be able to resist the grenade w/ deflection up (at least a few times)... which has never happened.

 

Therefore the grenade must be tech, and #1 is the correct scenario.

 

This is all correct.

 

However, we look at scenario 2, the grenades could have an absurd accuracy chance, in which case the acc vs. def roll would always result in the grenade hitting, even with an ~80% defense chance, similar to an instant crit rolling against an instant shield, where the crit takes precedence.

 

That being said, one could also question whether the grenade knockdown is considered an "attack" which should be shroud-able, or an "effect" which would not be shroud-able.

 

A third option could also exist, where the lag between the OP's shroud activation and the triggering of the grenade causes it to seem like shroud is up, when actually the grenade was triggered first.

 

That being said, it would be nice for some official confirmation on this, as the ambiguity leads to threads like this.

[Eternalnight]

Therefore the grenade must be tech,

 

I don't really think those grenades are in any category of four attack types (melee, ranged, force or tech). They are not a player class ability but a crewskill perk and might not have a listed attack type at all, therefore falling into some unnamed fifth category.

 

Similarly to force shroud does not protect against environmental damage like like the burn damage over time effects that you get when running through lava, since those are not abilities and do not have an attack type.

[Eternalnight]

As far as I know force shroud suffers an accuracy check.

 

Now you are onto something.

 

Rather than giving you 100% resistance, force shroud increases your resist chance by 100%.

Enemy player's accuracy rating lowers your resist chance by the amount of force/tech accuracy that goes over 100%.

 

If they have 105% force/tech accuracy and you have 100% resistance, that lowers your resistance by 5% to 95% giving them 5% chance to deal damage on you and so on.

[DarthMaulUK]

Its rare to have force users with over 100% accuracy. Most sit around 95%. Yesterday, I popped FS and was about to charge to the goal line when a sage stopped me in my tracks.

 

Personally, i am sick to the back teeth of biofail not fixing and just adding more problems. It also looks like Low slash doesnt work 100% of the time, either in warzones or in pve.

 

Sub runs out in 10 days and it has been cancelled. If they cant be bothered to at least a) fix this b) explain how FS works, I cant be bothered to give them £9 a month

[Eternalnight]

Its rare to have force users with over 100% accuracy. Most sit around 95%.

 

Uhm, no it isn't.

 

Even without any accuracy rating gear, and without taking accuracy talents in the skill tree, and without 1% legacy buff, the force/tech accuracy starts from 100%.

 

95% force accuracy is not even possible (unless you have some debuff)

 

If someone has 95% accuracy (that is 95% melee basic accuracy), they do in fact have 105% force accuracy.

[Aerilas]

Now you are onto something.

 

Rather than giving you 100% resistance, force shroud increases your resist chance by 100%.

Enemy player's accuracy rating lowers your resist chance by the amount of force/tech accuracy that goes over 100%.

 

If they have 105% force/tech accuracy and you have 100% resistance, that lowers your resistance by 5% to 95% giving them 5% chance to deal damage on you and so on.

 

If this is true, that would explain the Force Shroud bug...

[UnknownDeceased]

force shroud gives 200% Force/tech Resist not 100%

So it is clearly bugged... Funny thing with overload is that you sometimes resist the damage but not the secondary knockback

Edited April 15, 2013 by UnknownDeceased

[Eternalnight]

force shroud gives 200% Force/tech Resist not 100%

 

tooltip clearly says 100%

Edited April 15, 2013 by Eternalnight

[CBRGhostRider]

Several excellent point so far... the accuracy of the grenade being absurdly high, the tech accuracy check, or a new (unlisted) damage type.

 

I've been kicked in the g0nads by scoundrels while I'm glowing white (which is a simple stun from a playable class), so I'm thinking it is simply a matter of tech accuracy checks as elaborated by eternalnight above.

 

Would be nice if the devs chimed in w/ the reasoning, and whether this is working as intended.

[Astarica]

Look at the actual chance to resist. It says 200%, which means it's impossible to penetrate Force Shroud by normal methods. Otherwise anyone wearing the normal default gear should hit through your Force Shroud about 10% of the time which never happens.

 

That said certain attacks are especially accurate. For example taunt is recently made to never miss, probably in response to mobs getting force/tech resistance, so it is possible that grenades are likewise extra-accurate, enough to negate the 200% resistance granted by Force Shroud.

 

If you look at tooltip, they usualy provide things that wouldn't confuse people. For example evasion (dodge all CD) says 'increase chance to dodge by 100%' on tool tip. If that is true, someone wearing normal accuracy gear can connect on someone using evasion about 5% of the time (5% base defense + 100% dodge), but this never happens. If you go to the actual stat screen, you'll also see that Evasion gives something like 200% dodge. Saber Ward gives 150% parry in the first two seconds for Juggs, not 100% as the tooltip claims. These numbers are ensure the 'dodge all' abilities actually dodge everything.

Edited April 15, 2013 by Astarica

[DarthMaulUK]

And still no word from Bioware. What a shock.

[DarthMaulUK]

I dont know why I bother using it now. Didnt work at all in a game of Huttball. Thanks Bioware and your silence only reaffirms the decision to cancel my subscription this month.

[Ishtharo]

I dont know why I bother using it now. Didnt work at all in a game of Huttball. Thanks Bioware and your silence only reaffirms the decision to cancel my subscription this month.

 

You keep flaunting that you unsubbed like BW is going to care. If you go, do so in silence. But maining an assassin, you can add alot to this discussion that is constructive. please do.

 

Im not sure which of the three is true, or if it is a flat out glitch. Likely glitch, as this game has a few, but what game doesnt?

[DarthMaulUK]

You keep flaunting that you unsubbed like BW is going to care. If you go, do so in silence. But maining an assassin, you can add alot to this discussion that is constructive. please do.

 

Im not sure which of the three is true, or if it is a flat out glitch. Likely glitch, as this game has a few, but what game doesnt?

 

Ive still time left until my sub runs out so I will do what I can until Bioware actually say SOMETHING on this issue, instead of being ignorant and just ignore the issue. If you want something constructive, scroll up, or search out my original thread on the issue, which was also ignored.

[ThomasCool]

i just want to say that saber reflect has the same effect on single target abilities. You can reflect the damage and still be knocked back. It's very possible that the two components are distinct. On the other hand it's kinda BS that overload works but slinger and commando knockbacks don't. (IMHO force shroud is kinda OP anyway)

[Simmerr]

(IMHO force shroud is kinda OP anyway)

 

And the amount of stuns an op gets isn't OP? The amount of roots a sniper gets isn't OP? C'mon, honestly.

[CBRGhostRider]

i just want to say that saber reflect has the same effect on single target abilities. You can reflect the damage and still be knocked back. It's very possible that the two components are distinct. On the other hand it's kinda BS that overload works but slinger and commando knockbacks don't. (IMHO force shroud is kinda OP anyway)

 

Saber reflect is supposed to reflect the damage, but not the physics effects or later Dots. Therefore you will be knocked back, stunned, etc.

 

As for shroud being OP, just LOL. Mine lasts for all of 3 seconds every 45 secs. I have a sniper as well, and you can use a 20 sec entrench every 45 seconds or so in marksman spec. Or a vengeance jug can get 4 sec cc immunity every 15 secs.