Prettyevilish Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 (edited) When they first announced Makeb, there were only subscribers. They could give it for free, because sub numbers were still decent, and a massive free expansion could have bolstered numbers a little, with some smart marketing. But this has everything to do with F2P, because so many subs have now gone F2P as well. They absolutely have to charge for this content in order for EA to continue investing in this game. Unless you would prefer this to be the last expansion the game sees? Also, I agree that you should be able to pay for it with cartel coins. And subs are still forming the backbone of the IP (subs are the most likely to purchase those horrendous gambling boxes and many have bragged about their multi $100 splurges on them) so they should be able to afford to give it to subs for free and charge anyone who's not subbing (and anyone who goes f2p during the course of its existence, just like the Section X dailies). And that can STILL bolster numbers if marketed properly. In fact, that would probably get MORE people to subscribe than the HK quest, because a WHOLE NEW PLANET! oh, the shiny! No one is arguing that they should give it to f2p players free, just like no one (at least that I saw) argued that they should give Section X to f2p for free. If so many people have turned f2p rather than subbing (actually it seems to be the opposite from what I've seen in gen chat on my server) then a free planet that's only free FOR SUBS would be FAR more beneficial than bleeding the subs for even more money (causing more to quit instead of buy and become f2p, which is exactly what you DON'T want to happen). Yes, things changed with f2p, but not in the way you seem to think. All it did was show EA/BW that they can milk the subs for more than the $15 a month successfully and many will lick their boots in thanks for the opportunity to throw money at them. Edited December 19, 2012 by Prettyevilish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shingara Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 F2P was announced in August. E3 was in June... We knew about F2p long before it was announced, it was leaked, also yet again why are you so obssesed with f2p when this has nothing todo with f2p players. I dont see anyone, anywhere stating that F2P players should get this for nothing, do you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueArab Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 And subs are still forming the backbone of the IP (subs are the most likely to purchase those horrendous gambling boxes and many have bragged about their multi $100 splurges on them) so they should be able to afford to give it to subs for free and charge anyone who's not subbing (and anyone who goes f2p during the course of its existence, just like the Section X dailies). And that can STILL bolster numbers if marketed properly. In fact, that would probably get MORE people to subscribe than the HK quest, because a WHOLE NEW PLANET! oh, the shiny! No one is arguing that they should give it to f2p players free, just like no one (at least that I saw) argued that they should give Section X to f2p for free. If so many people have turned f2p rather than subbing (actually it seems to be the opposite from what I've seen in gen chat on my server) then a free planet that's only free FOR SUBS would be FAR more beneficial than bleeding the subs for even more money (causing more to quit instead of buy and become f2p, which is exactly what you DON'T want to happen). Yes, things changed with f2p, but not in the way you seem to think. All it did was show EA/BW that they can milk the subs for more than the $15 a month successfully and many will lick their boots in thanks for the opportunity to throw money at them. You can't generalise in saying that subs spend the most on this game, without facts. And figures on how money is spent on this game hasn't been released. Listen, I'm not saying that it's right. I'm saying that I understand why it's being done, and here are the reasons why. That for me is good enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erei Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 When they first announced Makeb, there were only subscribers. They could give it for free, because sub numbers were still decent, and a massive free expansion could have bolstered numbers a little, with some smart marketing. But this has everything to do with F2P, because so many subs have now gone F2P as well. They absolutely have to charge for this content in order for EA to continue investing in this game. Unless you would prefer this to be the last expansion the game sees? Also, I agree that you should be able to pay for it with cartel coins. I fail to see your point against the DLC free for subscribers. A free DLC for subs would have probably made a lot of people taking 1 month just for it, and they could have made some marketing about how they gave new content to their loyal fan, or something like that. It could have redeemed them to the eyes of their playerbase, after the T7 ship drama and the cash shop only event. But it seems EA knows their reputation is dead a long time ago, and nothing will bring it back. And believe me, those who went f2p were not the one actively playing. As a f2p you have nothing, not even respect from EA. No instances, no loot, no WZ, not even basic customization and skillbar. It's just slightly better than a trial. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prettyevilish Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 (edited) You can't generalise in saying that subs spend the most on this game, without facts. And figures on how money is spent on this game hasn't been released. Listen, I'm not saying that it's right. I'm saying that I understand why it's being done, and here are the reasons why. That for me is good enough. I said most likely, I did not say definitively. Numbers on the forum, if people are telling the truth, indicate that subs are at least spending large enough amounts to cover giving Makeb for free like they initially promised. That a half-butted explanation of companies are greedy is good enough for you is sad, but whatever, I'm not telling you what to do with your money. Go pre-order it if you want. However, you can't make me stop complaining about it either. I want what I was promised or an acceptable compromise. $10 for the 'joy' of purchasing a planet without any class story is simply NOT acceptable. And I noticed you gave up after I laid out a lovely plan for WHY making it free for subs only would work for the game's bottom line. Edited December 19, 2012 by Prettyevilish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueArab Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 We knew about F2p long before it was announced, it was leaked, also yet again why are you so obssesed with f2p when this has nothing todo with f2p players. I dont see anyone, anywhere stating that F2P players should get this for nothing, do you. A leak is hardly an official confirmation. Also, it has everything to do with F2P. It changed everything, in terms of the way the game is developed, what is given, what isn't, and the future of the game. When they decided to go F2P, the fact is that everything they had announced before that was void. They could do whatever they wanted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dremacilus Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 I fail to see your point against the DLC free for subscribers. A free DLC for subs would have probably made a lot of people taking 1 month just for it, and they could have made some marketing about how they gave new content to their loyal fan, or something like that. It could have redeemed them to the eyes of their playerbase, after the T7 ship drama and the cash shop only event. But it seems EA knows their reputation is dead a long time ago, and nothing will bring it back. And believe me, those who went f2p were not the one actively playing. As a f2p you have nothing, not even respect from EA. No instances, no loot, no WZ, not even basic customization and skillbar. It's just slightly better than a trial. Exactly. They should enchourage people to become subscribers, not try to do rope-ballancing between subscribers and F2Pers...F2P should be a method to draw you to subscribing, but that's gonna happen if they don't actually give perks to subscribers... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prettyevilish Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 A leak is hardly an official confirmation. Also, it has everything to do with F2P. It changed everything, in terms of the way the game is developed, what is given, what isn't, and the future of the game. When they decided to go F2P, the fact is that everything they had announced before that was void. They could do whatever they wanted. LOL. In that case, any promises I made to my BF before we got engaged are null and void. Everything has changed and I can do whatever I want now. Oh wait, he can just break up with me. And players can break up with SWTOR. And numbers have PROVEN that players are more than willing to do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shingara Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 A leak is hardly an official confirmation. Also, it has everything to do with F2P. It changed everything, in terms of the way the game is developed, what is given, what isn't, and the future of the game. When they decided to go F2P, the fact is that everything they had announced before that was void. They could do whatever they wanted. For it to leak they knew about it, for them to have f2p out on the date they will have been working on it when E3 was going on, for ohlen to state that he will have know that f2p was in development and thus his main reason for saying it. They have been working on makeb etc since before e3, they knew it was going f2p, they said it was going tobe part of the subscription. Those are the facts you cannot get away from. the only thing that changed when f2p hit is that a cartel market full of fluff came and people could play for nothin, so again what does that have todo with being a subscriber excatly and what justifys them going back on there word to subscribers. to say again this is nothing todo with f2p players be them full f2p or prefered status who do not pay a monthly subscription. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueArab Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 I said most likely, I did not say definitively. Numbers on the forum, if people are telling the truth, indicate that subs are at least spending large enough amounts to cover giving Makeb for free like they initially promised. That a half-butted explanation of companies are greedy is good enough for you is sad, but whatever, I'm not telling you what to do with your money. Go pre-order it if you want. However, you can't make me stop complaining about it either. I want what I was promised or an acceptable compromise. $10 for the 'joy' of purchasing a planet without any class story is simply NOT acceptable. And I noticed you gave up after I laid out a lovely plan for WHY making it free for subs only would work for the game's bottom line. It would make sense to give it away for free if there was an uproar from the sub population. But it's just the vocal minority, as usual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rogoo Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 (edited) To answer the question posed here about purchasing Rise of the Hutt Cartel: We'd like to clarify that Rise of the Hutt Cartel will be available for purchase through SWTOR.com/buy only, and there won't be an option to purchase it using Cartel Coins. Mistake, after mistake, after mistake... Can't you guys do anything right ? Seems that your reports about what the players are saying simply go nowhere or are being ignored. The sheer amount of negativity on torums should let your superiors know that they fail at pretty much every major decision they make. Edited December 19, 2012 by Rogoo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shingara Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 It would make sense to give it away for free if there was an uproar from the sub population. But it's just the vocal minority, as usual. lol again, give as part of subscription, your obssessed with trying to justify your stance by saying we want it for free. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueArab Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 lol again, give as part of subscription, your obssessed with trying to justify your stance by saying we want it for free. But your subscription costs don't cover the cost of a new expansion (content update, whatever you want to call it), especially when they are now (since F2P) creating so much content to be given away for nothing for F2P players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grombrinda Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 (edited) Remember when a lot of people on these very forums said "With the extra coins you get each month you can buy any expansion they release."I do because a lot of us were concerned over the cartel market and it's gamble packs. Now they have taken even a glimmer of that hope of being able to obtain the content through cartel coins. And yes it is content NOT an expansion. This does not continue the class story as already confirmed on other post. You want to call 5 levels an expansion?? What's that you say, what other mmo out there gives this for free?? Well as far as I know Forsaken World by Perfect World has released free expansion to their game for free since the beginning. I won't list what all it is but it is a fair amount. For starters the highest level when the game started out was level 60, now it is 80 I do believe.But please don't take my word, check it out for yourselves. The point is after a whole year they choose to charge real money to an already paying costumer. Defend how ever much you like , but this is just a ....well I don't wish to use foul language so i'll just stop here. Oh btw they added a new item to the cartel market, they are going to again next Tuesday maintenance. Edited December 19, 2012 by grombrinda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shingara Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 (edited) But your subscription costs don't cover the cost of a new expansion (content update, whatever you want to call it), especially when they are now (since F2P) creating so much content to be given away for nothing for F2P players. £5.99 is 1090 cartel coins, thats 2 months worth of coins given to subscribers on 1 month bolts and that is the price of the 'expansion' for subscribers. That is covered by subscription thus how is was designed to work. you really make me want to faceplant the desk cos we have now stated and quoted and posted james ohlen specifically saying this was part of the subscription. Space project is an expantion if they do it like they have said they are, this aint. Ow and if this is there thinking of expantion worthy i cannot wait for dantooine, dathomir, naboo etc etc etc, gonna get expensive real fast. Edited December 19, 2012 by Shingara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siegedeluxe Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 http://www.examiner.com/article/ea-and-bioware-go-back-on-promise-to-release-makeb-free-to-subscribers this has been posted repeatedly. The video around the 5 minute mark. He specifically starts discussing makeb and says it is going to be the largest "non-expansion piece of content" ever released. The moderator compares it to large, free expansion for other mmos and he confirms that it will rival them (well he says "it's a whole planet" because he can't make any less vague of a promise than that). It was a non-expansion, which by your own admission we are supposed to get for free for our sub money (and bioware stated this too when f2p was released). So to get around this 'free content updates' problem, they slapped expansion on what was originally called a non-expansion, and are charging for it. qft... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prettyevilish Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 It would make sense to give it away for free if there was an uproar from the sub population. But it's just the vocal minority, as usual. Right. And the ME3 ending debacle was just the vocal minority too, right? That's why they actually went and retconned the endings. I don't think minority means what some you people think it means. Just because a small portion of the forum is raging - especially on the first day of announcement, before most have even heard the news - doesn't mean it's going over well with anyone. In any game, only a vocal minority visit the forum at all in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grombrinda Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Boy wait till the other mmo sites catch wind of this....some already have. XD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DAMossimo Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 But your subscription costs don't cover the cost of a new expansion (content update, whatever you want to call it), especially when they are now (since F2P) creating so much content to be given away for nothing for F2P players. So what you are saying is that everyone must pay for Makeb because the subs are financing everything else (including the F2P players)? If that's the case, this game is going to be in real big trouble next month me thinks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shingara Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Right. And the ME3 ending debacle was just the vocal minority too, right? That's why they actually went and retconned the endings. I don't think minority means what some you people think it means. Just because a small portion of the forum is raging - especially on the first day of announcement, before most have even heard the news - doesn't mean it's going over well with anyone. In any game, only a vocal minority visit the forum at all in the first place. there also way more people who came back and got there free coins expecting this to be given to subscribers who will simply turn around and walk away again and not even touch the forums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prettyevilish Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Boy wait till the other mmo sites catch wind of this....some already have. XD Oh do tell, what's going on where? (I don't play any other MMOs but I am curious what they're saying about all this). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taorus Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 It was a content patch. Then it took a Hickman to the knee...and became an expansion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spectreclees Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 To answer the question posed here about purchasing Rise of the Hutt Cartel: We'd like to clarify that Rise of the Hutt Cartel will be available for purchase through SWTOR.com/buy only, and there won't be an option to purchase it using Cartel Coins. So you want me to pay 10 bucks for something that will probably fit in a content patch. Alright. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shingara Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 (edited) It was a content patch. Then it took a Hickman to the knee...and became an expansion. There is on thing for sure, that guy knows how to kill a game, how does he have a job again ? do we see a this time next year hutball will be a standalone f2p game ?? Edited December 19, 2012 by Shingara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siegedeluxe Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 (edited) It was a content patch. Then it took a Hickman to the knee...and became an expansion. We should coin this the "Hickman Effect". Edited December 19, 2012 by siegedeluxe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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