Gorastor Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Hey guys, my vanguard hit 50 a few days ago and now I need some help in how to gear up (especially for pvp). I want to tank in pvp so I got the Supercommando Recruit Gear. Stupid as I am, I entered the forums after that... I read a couple times that vanguards don't use the tank gear, even if they are tank-specced. So my question is: Which recruit gear should I get, and later on which battlemaster gear? And if someone still has time: Which is the best way to get geared up in PvE? Doing the normal 50s first? (I just have green-blue pve-gear). Can I run the first 50s in recruit gear? Thanks in advance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kanonlohen Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Vanguard tank to not use tank gear in PvP, I don't get that, I'm using supercommando gear, used supercommando recruit gear too. Can someone explain why is it not advisable to use tank gear? Because for me, if you're a tank and would really want to boost your tanking role in PvP then that's the best way to go, tank spec, tank gear and tank stims. correct me if I'm wrong... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZeroPlus Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Vanguard tank to not use tank gear in PvP, I don't get that, I'm using supercommando gear, used supercommando recruit gear too. Can someone explain why is it not advisable to use tank gear? Because for me, if you're a tank and would really want to boost your tanking role in PvP then that's the best way to go, tank spec, tank gear and tank stims. correct me if I'm wrong... Basically because you cannot kill anything in tank gear and the tank gear doesn't really mitigate the damage you are taking (most damage in PvP bypasses armor and shield). So being a tank with tank gear really doesn't give you the survivability you would expect it to. You are better off in DPS gear because it allows you to at least kill something before dying in blazing glory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitru Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Basically because you cannot kill anything in tank gear and the tank gear doesn't really mitigate the damage you are taking (most damage in PvP bypasses armor and shield). Let me elaborate on that a bit. First off, it's important to note that there are 2 distinct and separate portions of your primary survivability that you gain through gearing: armor rating and secondary stats. You get armor rating based upon the armor level and armor type that you're wearing. Whether it's for DPS or tank, it doesn't matter; you get the exact same amount of armor from a 136 grade Supercommando chest that you get from a 136 grade Combat Tech chest, so, even if you're wearing a piece of DPS gear, you're still packing the same amount of armor that you would have with a tank piece. Your armor rating provides you with K/E damage reduction which, while it's still in the majority in PvP, the majority that it has is much less overwhelming than it is in PvE. The I/E damage that is more common with player attacks isn't affected one whit by your stats. The only things that augment it are your spec and buffs (like Force Valor). You get secondary stats (shield, defense, absorb) based upon the mods, enhancements, and augs that you choose to use and they make up a substantial amount of your mitigation in PvE. However, the attributes that these augment (defense chance, shield chance, and shield absorption) are only applied to melee/ranged attacks (as opposed to Force/Tech attacks, that ignore those attributes). In PvE, a vast majority of attacks are M/R (generally in the realm of 70-80% to 20-30%). In PvP, on the other hand, because of the way that player abilities were set up, the split errs roughly on the side of F/T (such that slightly more than half of the damage you can expect to take is gonna be F/T). Since so much of the damage coming at you is going to ignore your tanking stats by virtue of being F/T based, tank stats are generally seen as being largely useless. Combine these 2 facts (armor rating is applied regardless of tank or DPS gear and most tank stats being largely worthless in PvP) and you come to the conclusion that, as a tank, you're better off just going with DPS gear; if you're going to have secondary stats on your gear, you might as well go with the secondary stats that actually provide you with some tangible benefit rather than simply being avoided by a majority of the attacks and damage coming at your face. Until the developers do something to allow tank stats to be applied to F/T attacks, that's pretty much how it's gonna be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorastor Posted October 29, 2012 Author Share Posted October 29, 2012 So, it's Combat Tech then? (just saw a Vanguard with Eliminator Gear ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evuo Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 So, it's Combat Tech then? (just saw a Vanguard with Eliminator Gear ) Eliminator is for assault specialist, as they benefit from the +15% high impact bolt crit chance with the Ionic Accelerator talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theagg Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 (edited) Basically because you cannot kill anything in tank gear and the tank gear doesn't really mitigate the damage you are taking (most damage in PvP bypasses armor and shield). So being a tank with tank gear really doesn't give you the survivability you would expect it to. You are better off in DPS gear because it allows you to at least kill something before dying in blazing glory. Just to clarfiy further, it's not true that 'most' damage in PVP bypasses armor, in the sense that armor is all but useless. It depends on who you are facing and the kind of damage they dish out. Armor mitigates against Kinetic and Energy damage but does not protect against Internal and Elemental damage. So, if you are going toe to toe with a Pyro for example, with a large part of the damage they deal being elemental, your armor is ineffectual. However, against an Operative, whose main damage type is Kinetic, your armor is effective. Likewise, a sizable amount of the damage dished out by Force users is either energy or kinetic in nature and again, armor is effective in these cases. What complicates matters is not that most damage bypasses armor, it doesn't, its the number of skills and buffs that increase armor penetration.(Compared to the comparatively few that increase armor resistance to a similar degree) Edited October 30, 2012 by Theagg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZeroPlus Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 Thanks Kitru and Theagg for your additional input. I tried to keep things simple. You guys gave the "deep dive" information behind the basic concept. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Usefulidiots Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 Well damn. My vanguard is just for pvp. I am tank/hybrid (up to storm)spec I bought the BM supercommando tank set. (4 piece bonus) and the shield. The hands, weapon and everything else is dps. I am currently working on WH gear. So, i guess i would have to save up again and buy the BM dps (5 pieces) before i could get the WH. In my case, is it worth re buying the BM dps gear and then buying the WH just for those 5 pieces? Am i gimped that much? I do kill slowly but i was hoping having those 4 or 5 pieces of supercommando would help keep me and my guard up longer. Thanks for any advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TipsyDrow Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 I've ran a vanguard pvp tank since launch. I have found that using 4 pieces of the super commando set for the bonus damage while guarding, supercommando weapon and shield and all else dps gear is the best set up for me. I run a strange build though. 10/31 shield/tactics. I ended up grinding out the super commando set and a dps set, tried many different builds. This is what works for me. All augments are reflex augs. I know folks who go all dps gear with the ironfist build. I know folks who go 31 points in the shield tree with a mix of gear. It all really depends on your playstyle. The main thing to remember in pvp tanking is your there to mitigate damage for your team. Aoe taunt,single target taunt every time they're off CD, switch guard as needed and you'll do fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spatology Posted November 3, 2012 Share Posted November 3, 2012 id take combat tech mods with the super commando shell for the set bonuses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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