Tim-ONeil Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 (edited) Assuming they go through with this ********, no you won't. Assuming?! It's set in stone now. We aren't testing it on the PTS to see how the model is received, this is just to give them data on how the boxes function. Come on, be principled if you must but also be rational and start your in game goodbyes. This will surely go down as one of the most pointless 'hunger strikes' ever but more power to you. We'll just keep playing and enjoying the game you apparently like as well. Edited October 25, 2012 by Tim-ONeil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InnerPieces Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 you are... and not just gamers... everything from lotto and casinos down to kids with collectible card games are willing to blow tons of cash on maybe getting what they want Excellent point. Well done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larity Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 Has anyone actually sat down and though "wait a sec, most of this is appearance and social stuff, I don't really need this" and moved on? Other F2P mmos do this and BIND IT AUTOMATICALLY TO YOU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InnerPieces Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 (edited) This will surely go down as one of the most pointless 'hunger strikes' ever but more power to you. LOL! The only thing all the other "hunger strikes" got us was the F2P model. I have to agree with the quoted point. We're already at the bottom of the barrel. There really is no place left to go. It is definitely a deal with it or leave proposition these days. No offense intended to the other guy, but that's really all there is to it at this point. Edited October 25, 2012 by InnerPieces Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim-ONeil Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 Has anyone actually sat down and though "wait a sec, most of this is appearance and social stuff, I don't really need this" and moved on? Other F2P mmos do this and BIND IT AUTOMATICALLY TO YOU Yes actually that has been pointed out countless times. You can also point out that it's available on the GTN as well to no avail. People that want to moan about it will continue to do so Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liquidacid Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 (edited) Excellent point. Well done. lol... hey any sane person knows and will tell you that if you walk into a casino or game of chance you are most likely gonna walk away in the red... yet gambling is one of the oldest pastimes and people still line up for miles to throw down their hard earned money on the table while calling it fun... any company who doesn't see this and capitalize on it would be foolish personally If I'm gonna waste money I prefer strippers and booze but to each their own I suppose Edited October 25, 2012 by Liquidacid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InnerPieces Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 (edited) lol... hey any sane person knows and will tell you that if you walk into a casino or game of chance you are most likely gonna walk away in the red... yet gambling is one of the oldest pastimes and people still line up for miles to throw down their hard earned money on the table while calling it fun personally If I'm gonna waste money I prefer ******s and booze but to each their own I suppose Honestly, I'm just embarrassed I didn't think of that before posting. That's why, when I gamble, I'm at a friend's house drinking their booze and taking their money. Edited October 25, 2012 by InnerPieces Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackavaar Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 Assuming?! It's set in stone now. We aren't testing it on the PTS to see how the model is received, this is just to give them data on how the boxes function. Come on, be principled if you must but also be rational and start your in game goodbyes. This will surely go down as one of the most pointless 'hunger strikes' ever but more power to you. We'll just keep playing and enjoying the game you apparently like as well. Everything seen on the Test Server is subject to change before release. It's NOT set in stone. And pointless hunger strike? I'm saying I'll quit the game if they do this, not MMOs altogether. There ARE other games that don't pull greedy bull like this on their customers, you realize? And goodbye to you. I won't miss your dim witticisms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim-ONeil Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 Everything seen on the Test Server is subject to change before release. It's NOT set in stone. And pointless hunger strike? I'm saying I'll quit the game if they do this, not MMOs altogether. There ARE other games that don't pull greedy bull like this on their customers, you realize? And goodbye to you. I won't miss your dim witticisms. I'm sure that they have decided to completely rework the framework of the F2P model based on your feedback before it goes live. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackavaar Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 I'm sure that they have decided to completely rework the framework of the F2P model based on your feedback before it goes live. I am not the only one who is against these boxes. Stop trying to antagonize (troll) me and let it go. You have your opinion, I have mine. Leave it at that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim-ONeil Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 I am not the only one who is against these boxes. Stop trying to antagonize (troll) me and let it go. You have your opinion, I have mine. Leave it at that. Logical statements can never be trolling. We can agree though that we have completely opposing views on this. And we can also agree that you won't enjoy the end result. Posting that you are quitting over it is the last (nuclear) option you have to try to change the reality of what is to come. By all means I want you to enjoy the game. I think you are determined to make sure that can't happen however because of something purely cosmetic that you have no control over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackavaar Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 Logical statements can never be trolling. We can agree though that we have completely opposing views on this. And we can also agree that you won't enjoy the end result. Posting that you are quitting over it is the last (nuclear) option you have to try to change the reality of what is to come. By all means I want you to enjoy the game. I think you are determined to make sure that can't happen however because of something purely cosmetic that you have no control over. When you continuously and purposely try to goad me into attacking you verbally on an open forum, that is trolling, whether it is logically stated or not. STOP IT! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kadikur Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 (edited) Bubble burster for South Dakota gamblers: SDCL 22 section 25A subsection 8 States: 22-25A-8 Establishment of internet gambling business prohibited. Except as provided in § 22-25A-15, no person may establish a location or site in this state from which to conduct a gambling business on or over the internet or an interactive computer service. (Source: http://legis.state.sd.us/statutes/DisplayStatute.aspx?Statute=22-25A&Type=Statute ) And South Dakota is not alone: Illinois, Indiana, Louisiana, Montana, Nevada, Oregon, South Dakota, and Washington all have anti-ONLINE-gambling laws. edit: possible loophole -> since Bioware is NOT physically in South Dakota the law MAY NOT APPLY. Edited October 25, 2012 by Kadikur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liquidacid Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 (edited) Bubble burster for South Dakota gamblers: SDCL 22 section 25A subsection 8 States: 22-25A-8 Establishment of internet gambling business prohibited. Except as provided in § 22-25A-15, no person may establish a location or site in this state from which to conduct a gambling business on or over the internet or an interactive computer service. (Source: http://legis.state.sd.us/statutes/DisplayStatute.aspx?Statute=22-25A&Type=Statute ) And South Dakota is not alone: Illinois, Indiana, Louisiana, Montana, Nevada, Oregon, South Dakota, and Washington all have anti-ONLINE-gambling laws. edit: possible loophole -> since Bioware is NOT physically in South Dakota the law MAY NOT APPLY. even if they were it wouldn't apply... legally it's not gambling since you can't win actual money or tokens that are directly redeemed for money (or in reality anything of physical value)... if your logic was correct they couldn't sell packs of Magic the gathering or Pokemon cards in said states where gambling is prohibited because it's gambling... just because you are purchasing something that has an element of random chance as to what it contains does not make it legally gambling also your "loophole" isn't a loophole... it's part of the law for a reason... that law and others like it are simply there to stop business that run gambling from being set up in a particular district because they are a pain in the *** to tax and monitor... they don't give a flying rat's *** about people gambling they just don't want to have to monitor it... anyone living in those states/areas can still legally log into say a poker website run out of any where else and gamble till they are hocking their kidneys and they don't care Edited October 25, 2012 by Liquidacid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SawneyRath Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 I really dislike Grab-Bags too. I don't think you should have to gamble for the good stuff. Just let us have it through in-game means or cartel coins. Why make it frustrating to get? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wraiven Posted October 25, 2012 Author Share Posted October 25, 2012 I really dislike Grab-Bags too. I don't think you should have to gamble for the good stuff. Just let us have it through in-game means or cartel coins. Why make it frustrating to get? They obviously think frustrating is fun and keeps players playing. Well, obviously they are correct. Amazing how many people are defending this move, the droves of players who have posted this very thread shows me just how many people love to be frustrated, love to blow their money, love being ripped off. Nothing I can do about it. I would protest and cancel my sub...if I thought it would actually do any good, then come back after things have changed, but I know that in itself is a fantasy and will never happen. So, I guess I stay here, hope things change for the better, and simply refuse to buy in to the physiological mind job that has been placed in game hiding under the guise of grab bags. It's taking advantage of weak minds. It's immoral, it's down right greedy and IMO no different than the cigarette adds that tobacco companies used to use to sucker in kids and get them hooked on smoking, only in this case, they are doing it with these "grab bags". To be quite blunt, I am disgusted. I see what's really going on...and unlike the sheep, I care. Sad thing is, me caring is not going to change a thing. It will continue whether I like it or not. So at this point I have no choice but to leave well enough alone and feel a small bit of comfort that I have made my views crystal clear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 They obviously think frustrating is fun and keeps players playing. Based on internet MMO game forums, all MMOs frustrate all players some way, some how, some time. Hence, nothing unique to see here.... just another of someones frustrations about something in some MMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthSylar Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 It's taking advantage of weak minds. It's immoral, it's down right greedy and IMO no different than the cigarette adds that tobacco companies used to use to sucker in kids and get them hooked on smoking, only in this case, they are doing it with these "grab bags". . This may be the dumbest thing I have ever read on an internet forum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 To be quite blunt, I am disgusted. I see what's really going on...and unlike the sheep, I care. Sad thing is, me caring is not going to change a thing. It will continue whether I like it or not. So at this point I have no choice but to leave well enough alone and feel a small bit of comfort that I have made my views crystal clear. I play/played several MMOs that have shops and sell /chance_bags. Personally, I don't see the economics in them and never buy them. But that's me. Others love them. To each their own. It is after all a game.... for entertainment. You are not forced to buy them, so they are harmless. And you need a credit card to buy coins from Bioware, so that protects the kids (unless their parents are empty plant pots). As for weak minded players..... well.... MMOs are a target rich environment for that. MIght was well monetize it.... just like other MMO producers are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wraiven Posted October 25, 2012 Author Share Posted October 25, 2012 Based on internet MMO game forums, all MMOs frustrate all players some way, some how, some time. Hence, nothing unique to see here.... just another of someones frustrations about something in some MMO. I think even you could agree, this is far different than the typical MMO complaint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MidichIorian Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 Saw one lucky player with both the PP crystal and the banner. I only got junk in my 7 bags (6 big one small). Yeah I got some pets and a speeder but I don't care for those. I guess they think they will sell more bags to people who are looking for and really want a specific item than they would have with single items. Or they simply want some things to remain "rare". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wraiven Posted October 25, 2012 Author Share Posted October 25, 2012 I play/played several MMOs that have shops and sell /chance_bags. Personally, I don't see the economics in them and never buy them. But that's me. Others love them. To each their own. It is after all a game.... for entertainment. You are not forced to buy them, so they are harmless. And you need a credit card to buy coins from Bioware, so that protects the kids (unless their parents are empty plant pots). As for weak minded players..... well.... MMOs are a target rich environment for that. MIght was well monetize it.... just like other MMO producers are. Thing is, I am one of those MMO players that loves the "fluff" (IE that wicked awesome looking outfit) and now some of the best fluff is going to be hiding in these black holes for real life cash. Sure, I *might* get lucky, on top of the small chance somebody else gets what I want, on top of the small chance that person sells that item I want, on top of the other small chance that somebody else does not buy it from the GTN before I see it, on top of the other small chance that I actually have the (you can bet your sweet butt) insanely high credits to buy it with. Those are too many chances that stack the odds against me. For you, I am betting fluff in an MMO is far from important. This is where you have to bare in mind, that not everyone plays an MMO for the same reasons. So since I love fluff in an MMO, especially a Star Wars MMO, I am automatically at a disadvantage since I refuse to indulge Bioware with this online gambling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wraiven Posted October 25, 2012 Author Share Posted October 25, 2012 This may be the dumbest thing I have ever read on an internet forum Then you need to get out more, my dear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kadikur Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 even if they were it wouldn't apply... legally it's not gambling since you can't win actual money or tokens that are directly redeemed for money (or in reality anything of physical value)... if your logic was correct they couldn't sell packs of Magic the gathering or Pokemon cards in said states where gambling is prohibited because it's gambling... just because you are purchasing something that has an element of random chance as to what it contains does not make it legally gambling also your "loophole" isn't a loophole... it's part of the law for a reason... that law and others like it are simply there to stop business that run gambling from being set up in a particular district because they are a pain in the *** to tax and monitor... they don't give a flying rat's *** about people gambling they just don't want to have to monitor it... anyone living in those states/areas can still legally log into say a poker website run out of any where else and gamble till they are hocking their kidneys and they don't care Untrue... due to this part of the law: 22-25A-1. Bet or wager defined. For the purposes of this chapter, the term, bet or wager, means to directly or indirectly take, receive, or accept money or any valuable thing with the understanding or agreement that the money or valuable thing will be paid or delivered to a person if the payment or delivery is contingent upon the result of a race, contest, or game or upon the happening of an event not known to be certain. Bet or wager does not include the purchase, sale, or trade of securities or commodities under state or federal law. Source: SL 2000, ch 106, § 1. We, by the fact that we purchase access to the game (our subscription) assign value to everything in the game, therefore it falls well within this subsection of the law. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaevyn Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 People seem to be forgetting that the $15 subscription doesn't just cover things you can get on the Cartel Market (including and not limited to Grab Bags). Subscribers also get access to unlimited WZs, Ops and the new Section X area on Belsavis as well as other things I cannot quite remember. You aren't just paying $15 for a chance at a rare item, you are paying that money for the additional perks of subscribing stated by Bioware. I really fail to see why people are getting hot under the collar about this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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