23/17/1 New best PvP Build?

[PowerReaper]

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#200rIMs0zskfZfzrR.2 - still my favorite hybrid of all. Edited October 17, 2012 by PowerReaper

[ScrubinMuhTub]

Power Reaper: The 1 point in Insulation isn't doing you any good, as you are (hopefully) using tank stance. Also, I would at the very least recommend pulling one point out of nerve-wracking and pick up Darkswell for another tank cooldown.

 

I like it though

[PowerReaper]

Power Reaper: The 1 point in Insulation isn't doing you any good, as you are (hopefully) using tank stance. Also, I would at the very least recommend pulling one point out of nerve-wracking and pick up Darkswell for another tank cooldown.

 

I like it though

 

The 1 point in insulation is simple to get to the next tier, you wanna be able to get Surging Charge and the skill that comes with it. This spec is not a tanking spec its dps and the dps is amazing imho. It takes the best of each spec, pull, surging charge, Harnessed Darkness, etc.

Edited October 17, 2012 by PowerReaper

[Xethis]

Been running this since 1.4. Crazy defense with fade and maul is nasty.

discuss......

 

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#200rIMozdskZfhbRkbZo.2

 

Ive tied this, as well as 23-15-3 and 23-18-0, I prefer to run these in Dark Charge just because the defense and healing is so nice. Also just fyi, Dark Charge will out dps Surging Charge because of the proc rate. So if you are not impressed with your discharge from Surging Charge then I would strongly recommend running in tank stance. All these specs do amazing opening dps with Dark Embrace up. I was getting above 2k dps with just Maul spam exploiting Darkswell talent for the force regen. But if you get cc'd or cant get position on your target then your opener will be hurt really bad.

 

Lately Ive been running http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#200ZfhbRzZfMfRrMkbM.2 (Arika/Mad Maul) and I have to say this spec is far superior. not only will your Mauls hit for the max possible amount of damage through UK, you are not situationally bound to do your dps. Force Pull is one of my favorite abilities in this game, but I think instant Whirlwind and DF are better for objective based pvp. DF is so awesome for stopping caps from a distance, Force Pull can stop caps too but only one person, your screwed if more than one are on a door or cap. But the damage is just insane. You get lots of sustained damage with your dot and Thrash, and your burst is about as good as it gets with Raze and Exploit Weakness procs. Now this spec's dps was pretty much the same pre 1.4 but its survivability was horrible because your heals from the madness tree are minimal. But with the new Darkswell you can manage 12-24 seconds of 50% increased damage reduction which gives this spec the survivability to be viable.

 

I strongly recommend giving this spec a try.

[DarthMaulUK]

Ive tied this, as well as 23-15-3 and 23-18-0, I prefer to run these in Dark Charge just because the defense and healing is so nice. Also just fyi, Dark Charge will out dps Surging Charge because of the proc rate. So if you are not impressed with your discharge from Surging Charge then I would strongly recommend running in tank stance. All these specs do amazing opening dps with Dark Embrace up. I was getting above 2k dps with just Maul spam exploiting Darkswell talent for the force regen. But if you get cc'd or cant get position on your target then your opener will be hurt really bad.

 

Lately Ive been running http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#200ZfhbRzZfMfRrMkbM.2 (Arika/Mad Maul) and I have to say this spec is far superior. not only will your Mauls hit for the max possible amount of damage through UK, you are not situationally bound to do your dps. Force Pull is one of my favorite abilities in this game, but I think instant Whirlwind and DF are better for objective based pvp. DF is so awesome for stopping caps from a distance, Force Pull can stop caps too but only one person, your screwed if more than one are on a door or cap. But the damage is just insane. You get lots of sustained damage with your dot and Thrash, and your burst is about as good as it gets with Raze and Exploit Weakness procs. Now this spec's dps was pretty much the same pre 1.4 but its survivability was horrible because your heals from the madness tree are minimal. But with the new Darkswell you can manage 12-24 seconds of 50% increased damage reduction which gives this spec the survivability to be viable.

 

I strongly recommend giving this spec a try.

 

What charge are you using?

[Xethis]

What charge are you using?

 

Lightning Charge is what I use. I find that with out the Crackling Blast talent out of the Deception tree the Discharge from Surging Charge is pretty bad. Infact DF hits way harder. Also the base damage from Lightning Charge will actually out dps the Surging Charge just based off of the proc rate. And the main reason I use Lightning Charge is for Raze procs which I find far superior to Shock.

[DarthMaulUK]

cool. I will give it a try, once the client decides to actually download the game and not have so many errors

[gpassucc]

I switched to the 0/14/27 hybrid from the 23/1/17 and the only thing I miss is pull. Besides that this spec does absolutely insane dps in pvp. I recently switched from using surging charge to using lightning charge and raze as instant crushing darkness with death marks just does crazy damage. The consistent dps from the dots puts a lot more pressure on people vs the burst from surging charge. The force management is incredible with force regen from dark embrace coupled with constantly consuming death marks. The only thing with not running surging charge is losing the force decrease on shock but this is completely made up for by having dots consuming the death marks. Also as the previous poster stated, instant crushing darkness does a lot more damage than shock. I pretty much just use shock for the melee damage bonus as my thrash will hit for 3k ish total and maul averages about 6k with the melee bonus damage up. Just a fantastic build, so awesome.

[DropbearSW]

Im levelling with a very close off-shoot of this build at the moment ,doing Deception first then filling in the Darkness Tree. More often than not I'm finishing top of the medals table. DPS totals arn't fantastic but the burst is there when you need it, especially from the opener.. Survivability is awesome so far.

 

I've also been able to tank the flashpoints as I level, which is awesome for gearing up and staying in touch, as tanks tend to get insta-pops on the server I am on now.

Edited October 23, 2012 by DropbearSW

[Xethis]

I switched to the 0/14/27 hybrid from the 23/1/17 and the only thing I miss is pull. Besides that this spec does absolutely insane dps in pvp. I recently switched from using surging charge to using lightning charge and raze as instant crushing darkness with death marks just does crazy damage. The consistent dps from the dots puts a lot more pressure on people vs the burst from surging charge. The force management is incredible with force regen from dark embrace coupled with constantly consuming death marks. The only thing with not running surging charge is losing the force decrease on shock but this is completely made up for by having dots consuming the death marks. Also as the previous poster stated, instant crushing darkness does a lot more damage than shock. I pretty much just use shock for the melee damage bonus as my thrash will hit for 3k ish total and maul averages about 6k with the melee bonus damage up. Just a fantastic build, so awesome.

Personally I would skip the Calculating Mind talent and put those two points some where else. This spec is already very efficient with force management. I also Shock to keep up UK and I usually do it at the beginning of the encounter so I am in Dark Embrace where force regen is insane. Other than Shock, everything is free or only costs 25 force, pretty sexy. I don't think that Calculating Mind will even be missed if you drop it. I am assuming you don't have any points into Creeping Death or Devour, I personally cannot choose between the two for my last two points. Doubling the healing I get back from my dot and DF or 20% more crit on DF and my dots. Either way you go its a win in my book.

Edited October 24, 2012 by Xethis

[gpassucc]

I do have points in creeping death. Since I run this in lightning charge and have dots on people anyways why wouldn't I put two points in for 20 extra force every time death field is up? I don't know about you but I often find myself in combat for several minutes at a time and having that extra boost of force let's me save blackout for when I am focusing a healer.

[MedinHolliday]

Why does everyone want to put point into Shroud of Darkness? That's three points that can be spent on increasing the proc rate of Dark Charge and increasing it's damage. If you have 20k health, you're only getting an extra 200 out of Shroud of Darkness. ROI people.

[Xethis]

I do have points in creeping death. Since I run this in lightning charge and have dots on people anyways why wouldn't I put two points in for 20 extra force every time death field is up? I don't know about you but I often find myself in combat for several minutes at a time and having that extra boost of force let's me save blackout for when I am focusing a healer.

 

Extra force is never a bad way to go so I would not consider my spec better than yours. I just personally never find myself force starved for anything, so based off of my play style the 20 extra force for me would not be needed. I exploit Dark Embrace as much as possible, I use it once or twice on just about every encounter. Between that and all the time that I am CC'd I find that there is never a need for force.

[PowerReaper]

This is the Arika build i've been using, http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#2000cZfMrRzZfbcRrr0b.2 this specs dps is so superior its insane. I'm only about half Wh and using this spec have gotten 600k+ dps twice.

[Xethis]

This is the Arika build i've been using, http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#2000cZfMrRzZfbcRrr0b.2 this specs dps is so superior its insane. I'm only about half Wh and using this spec have gotten 600k+ dps twice.

 

If you like this spec, then you should really read Eatenbydistances thread on his Wakajinn spec, 0-27-14. Putting 3 points into Charge Mastery is kind of a waste for Surging Charge. 9% armor penetration might sound good, but our Insulation talent ups our armor by 30% and its only about 4% increased damage mitigation. 9% armor is about 1.5% actual damage. Your also going to trade Unearthed Knowledge for 50% increase crit to Shock and Discharge which is a win. Given how frequently you Shock, you will do far more damage than the 4-5% increase in damage to Maul and Thrash from UK. You will trade your instant Whirlwind for Low Blow which is a very underrated ability. You will also trade Corrupted Flesh for Entropic field. 6% reduction to all damage is slightly better than 15% reduction to only dot damage, even though the dot specs are running rampant nowadays. On top of all that you will get Fade, which is even more added defense against aoe damage and reduction of cooldown on a couple of your most powerful abilities. You should check it out.

Edited October 28, 2012 by Xethis

[PlagaNerezza]

Been running this since 1.4. Crazy defense with fade and maul is nasty.

discuss......

 

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#200rIMozdskZfhbRkbZo.2

 

Excellent build.

 

I use dark ward and a shield. It might be the best off-tank node guard build. You get a lot of mitigation and still can hit hard and heavy. The key is to guard and use your guard. It definately can survive incoming dps.

 

I still run x3 recklessness stalker armor. I'd rather have more critical hits than a 5% damage increase while guarding. You are also going to use force lightning more when played correctly.

 

Guarding

Please switch your guards with spikes. This build has and is built to mitigate incoming dps, even when its absorbed through the guard mechanism. You have a lot of ways to increase damage mitigation! Dark Embrace and then pvp defense adernals.

 

On Shields for This Spec:

Dismissing the shield outright as a guard in 1.4 is very short-sighted. Now that you can run a shield with power/surge/crit you no longer take out your top end DPS (maul) since the difference between a focus and shield only effects force based attacks. Your are still able to maul like a deception built player..

 

Commentary on Charges:

You run dark charge. You have surging charge because you want induction. While you don't gain induction's shock cost reduction you still get the 30% critical maul damage increase.

 

Possible tweaks

I could see someone wanting to leverage x3 Harnesses Darkness on this build with how it plays properly in warzones. Especially when the derpsmash nerf comes down and having that AOE reduction isn't delivering the value. Right now I would keep the AOE, but you might really like FL x3 because its a fantastic skill with recklessness and range when you are guarding just beyond the fray of the fighting.

[kookookacha]

Ok, I am new to Assassin and only have one up to lvl 41....I am starting to understand the different builds and am a little overwhelmed with the amount of abilities they have.....my main was a Vangaurd trooper, all I had to do was roll my face on the keyboard and I would get 400K+ consistently in WZs.

 

Anyway, having tons of fun playing the Assassin (escape mechanisms are insane) but I am wondering what gear to focus on in the end....Do I want stalker for pure DPS, or the survivor set (think that's the name) for these hybrid dps/tank builds. I've looked through the forums and consistently see Stalker...just don't know if this gear set up is for full dps or not. I imagine you would always want a shield generator in the offhand though

 

Thanks ahead for any advice!

[Xethis]

Ok, I am new to Assassin and only have one up to lvl 41....I am starting to understand the different builds and am a little overwhelmed with the amount of abilities they have.....my main was a Vangaurd trooper, all I had to do was roll my face on the keyboard and I would get 400K+ consistently in WZs.

 

Anyway, having tons of fun playing the Assassin (escape mechanisms are insane) but I am wondering what gear to focus on in the end....Do I want stalker for pure DPS, or the survivor set (think that's the name) for these hybrid dps/tank builds. I've looked through the forums and consistently see Stalker...just don't know if this gear set up is for full dps or not. I imagine you would always want a shield generator in the offhand though

 

Thanks ahead for any advice!

Go Stalker, it is a nice set that will compliment all three specs for pvp. You can always switch out mods to min/max your stats.

[ScrubinMuhTub]

PlagaNerezza, just wanted to pop in and say that I thought you did a great job of summarizing the strengths of the 23/17/1 build. I've been rolling it (with shield) for quite a while now and have been using it in exactly that capacity to great effect.

 

Personal preference changes I have made: I switched from 3p stalker to 4p survivor. I'm still not sold on the 4p bonus, but the -10 seconds on kick from 2p survivor is something I'm not willing to give up. It wasn't often that I was fully utilizing the 3rd hit off of [Force Potency], and I run this spec with high crit rating, due to there being no other 'natural' way of increasing maul crits (which are amazing).

 

At any rate, just wanted to chime in and say thanks for doing a good job relating what the build is all about.

[PlagaNerezza]

PlagaNerezza, just wanted to pop in and say that I thought you did a great job of summarizing the strengths of the 23/17/1 build. I've been rolling it (with shield) for quite a while now and have been using it in exactly that capacity to great effect.

 

Personal preference changes I have made: I switched from 3p stalker to 4p survivor. I'm still not sold on the 4p bonus, but the -10 seconds on kick from 2p survivor is something I'm not willing to give up. It wasn't often that I was fully utilizing the 3rd hit off of [Force Potency], and I run this spec with high crit rating, due to there being no other 'natural' way of increasing maul crits (which are amazing).

 

At any rate, just wanted to chime in and say thanks for doing a good job relating what the build is all about.

 

Thank you.

 

Recklessness

On a note about recklessness. Understand as a guard tank you should be getting heals and recklessness also gives inbound healing a percentage to crit. So when you are running low on health recklessness charges are very nice. Stalker armor reduces the cooldown of recklessness as well as gives you one more charge.

 

Playing This in Alderaan and Denova

A tanksin's job in this build beyond guarding a healer is to allow your DPS to push back the enemy. As you attack an objective you'll be guarding your healer. A close range DPS is going to challenge your back row, which will consist of your ranged dps, healers and guards. You want to prevent that incoming initial spike and be ready. Your groups close range is going to extend. They are looking to take out the healers and ranged dps players. This means those players are exposed and hard for your own healer to heal. Assuming your healer is holding their own you want to find that DPS player and put your guard on them while hitting the other teams dps player. Most likely that ranged dps from the other team will leap back as he's taking dps and your healer(s) are able to survive. Now your teams healers can switch up and catch the teams ranged dps to heal and you. With this build we have self healing to help the healers out.

 

You and the DPS are then pushing the other teams back row. If the other team over extends you teams ranged dps should be able to punish them. Below is some X's and O's.

 

NODE 1

GUARD

 

NODE 2

rDPS

--------------- Tank----------------- ( DPS )

Healer ------------------------------ ( DPS )

----------------Tanksin

Healer

 

*The brackets are whose getting guarded optimally as you extend. *

 

Lets say your getting countered and a healer is getting spiked by the other team.

 

 

rDPS

---------------Tank

(Healer ) --- Enemy 1&2 ----- DPS --------- ( DPS )

---------------------------Tanksin

Healer

 

Again the same concept is true if your ranged dps players get targeted. The positioning is also about limiting incoming AOE spikes and not stacking and takes into account the other team is going to attempt to burst your healers. You must be aware of taunting and guard switching in this build. It is a very powerful team build because it still gives you the ability to punish a player because maul is so powerful.

 

You should be seeing roughly 75k-100k protection per match when played and you will still be able to hit 3.5k+ mauls.

Edited November 12, 2012 by PlagaNerezza

[PlagaNerezza]

Playing This in Huttball

This build should be called the Running Back.

 

Start of the Match:

Get lined up to be able to run straight to the ball. You should be using a shield, endurance buffs and have your darkward active before the start of the game. Do not guard opening. Please keep up darkward. Remember dark embrace activates on blackout.

 

Charge towards the ball but do not sprint until you are on your way down the ramps. You can sprint and clear the acid pit and want to be able to do that to reach the ball before the other team. Its all about timing so practice it until you can do it every respawn. Hopefully your team gave you a predation to start the match. Grab the ball.

 

If things went correctly you have the ball and are in some state of CC, slowed, stunned or mezzed. Save force shroud, but get your defensive mitigation skills up as soon as you can activate them. Use your pvp defense adernal. Head slowly for the bottom pit on either the right or left of the acid pit. Stay near the wall by the air traps. You won't be moving fast.

 

Once the team white bars you pop your cc breaker, force shroud, overcharge saber and/or pvp heal and sprint. Try and get the sprint bonus at the bottom of the pit. If your reading this and play a marauder if you see a ball carrier whitebarred give me predation.

 

Now you are in position to move for the scoring pass or get force pulled. You should still have a white resolve bar and not be able to be pulled back down into the pit. Your team should have been able to cross the fire traps to the end zone since you pulled most of the group into the pit with you.

 

If someone pulls you up toward the endzone you should score. A pass is more risky since the guy your passing to likely doesn't have a full resolve bar. The half back pass sucks. But if that is your only choice do it. A friendly marauder near you could work since they have leap, but its very risky passing in this area.

 

Once in endzone /flex as everyone loves that.

 

Your up 1-0.

 

Head back to the ball or respawn. You likely need to help dps to retake the middle. Don't forget to guard the healers and taunt the enemies.

 

Ramps and Balls:

I highly recommend avoiding ramps with the ball. I find it to be barriers to reaching the endzone you can easily avoid. Your team is in a bad spot trying to cross the ramp mazes. There is huge damage fire and ramps that make staying together difficult. When your in the pit you elimanate all those cheap kils and make it harder for the annoying ranged dps to fire on you from those good spots on the maps.

 

Its easy to get pulled, leap to, or pass to the goal line from below. (I know assassins don't have leap.) Your other teammates should be able to cross the ramps solo. Also if someone might knockdown your puller/receiver you can pull them to you first.

 

Whoops I am getting Messed Up!:

Stealth resets the ball. If you are getting burned hard and have no place to go with that ball reset the thing. Don't let the other team get control of it. If you have the ball and are not getting heals and/or guard I find it universally better to push it deep to allow your team to capture mid and then stealth. It really puts the enemy teams out of position by using the course. You'd be surprised at how many lemmings follow you to get an obvious kill as opposed to get into better position.

Edited November 12, 2012 by PlagaNerezza