Khevar Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 (edited) Apart from the chances being horrible, I think the most horrible thing is how absolutely pointless it is to reverse engineer for the armor-making professions. Why even do it? Any gear that you can get in that manner requires tons of effort put in, while it will be replaced by MUCH better stuff in a matter of days, even (or especially) at 50. BioWare represented reverse engineering as an exciting way to craft better and worthwhile stuff. It has never been that. The only profession that might benefit from REing in a significant way is cybertech. Having unlocked a number of purple armormech schematics, I have armor ready for my alts and their companions as they level up. And purple armormech gear is cheaper (in terms of crafting materials) than equivalent armoring plus mod plus enhancement. Edited August 17, 2012 by JeffKretz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finelinebob Posted August 17, 2012 Author Share Posted August 17, 2012 (edited) Having unlocked a number of purple armormech schematics, I have armor ready for my alts and their companions as they level up. And purple armormech gear is cheaper (in terms of crafting materials) than equivalent armoring plus mod plus enhancement. True, but it's good for leveling and that's about it. And, unless you level up the same profession over and over, the utility of what you learn is over and done with once you level past it. Start a toon in a new class, or even a different advanced class with a different spec (dps vs tank, for instance), and you are on to grinding out a completely different set of armor you won't use again. I will admit, though, for my Trooper is was very cool to have every member of Havoc Squad in the same uniform armor. We actually looked like a squad, not a bunch of misfits. Edited August 17, 2012 by finelinebob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fdzzaigl Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 Having unlocked a number of purple armormech schematics, I have armor ready for my alts and their companions as they level up. And purple armormech gear is cheaper (in terms of crafting materials) than equivalent armoring plus mod plus enhancement. Al right, you can make useful armor for alts, but that's pretty much it. You could also go for the appropriate flashpoint for your alt and just get gear from there, which saves you the time and gets your alt experience in the process as well. When you hit 50 it becomes absolutely pointless these days. You could say that crafted purples gave you some entry level for hardmodes before tionese in the early days (although you'd still put in an unneeded amount of time and money), but now level 22 mods are dirt cheap on the auction house (due to being dropped in abundance) and certain recruit pieces come very near to the usefulness of crafted gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finelinebob Posted August 17, 2012 Author Share Posted August 17, 2012 ... but now level 22 mods are dirt cheap on the auction house (due to being dropped in abundance) and certain recruit pieces come very near to the usefulness of crafted gear. As an aside, I'd say that abundance is due to the later half of what you said: we get better-than-crafted gear for free at 50. So, people craft the "top of the line" item mods and find they don't really sell because nobody has a use for them ... so they stay on the GTN for cut-rate prices. My point? Another illustration of (1) how crafting is a minigame never meant to compete with quest and commendation rewards for end-game gear, and it's getting even more marginalized as time goes on; and (2) since everyone can craft the exact same quality items and there is no means of improving that quality, any monkey* banging on a keyboard can produce what you see on the GTN. *I don't mean to be putting down monkeys. I spend a good deal of time defending them. But even I can acknowledge monkeys have their limitations, and this crafting system has limited us to the level of monkeys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asbalana Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 (edited) Having unlocked a number of purple armormech schematics, I have armor ready for my alts and their companions as they level up. And purple armormech gear is cheaper (in terms of crafting materials) than equivalent armoring plus mod plus enhancement. Abaolutely true on both counts. A while back, I REed a number of different items for one of my wifes companions that had no use to me. Now I am leveling a Trooper and have schematics for purple gear, mods, etc. sitting and waiting for when I hit any level. To some degree building purple schematics while leveling is a useless process, since you have such limited use for the gear (only a few levels) and unless you plan way ahead, you often get the schematic near the middle or end of it's level range of usefulness. I don't know if others share my view or experience, but it seems to me that below cap level purple gear does not sell very well on the GTN or (with a few exceptions) at a decent / profitable price. The availability of close blues and blue modifications that are free (drops and commendations) combined with the limited time of use seems to depress the market. So I craft for my own and my wife's use and my and her slate of purple recipies sit unused (until we need them). I thought (when reading about crafting pre launch) that would be crafting as part of my participation in the economoy, but that has not happened. As far as modificatons are concerned, you are right on. It is an expensive way to go. If I have four pieces of orange gear, then to bring them to equivalent purple level requires at least three purple modifications each. Each modifcation costs four rare purple mats. So my four pieces of gear take 4 x 3 x 4 = 48 rare mats. The purple mats usually come from a crew skill like UT and each mat there can have a value (whether you obtain it yourself or buy it) of 4K to 10K depending on level and availability / pricing on the GTN. Gear is upgraded every four levels or so. That makes the purple modification route very expensive. Progression can also be blocked by the fact that certain purple mats are just not available, so even though you have the schematic, you cannot craft for want of mats. My Trooper is now level 40 and he has level 41 purple chest and purple bracers sitting in his bag to be mounted when he dings. Each cost two (i believe) purple mats each. BW has indeed made the modification route constly and difficult while leveling. The plus side of the modification route is that (forgetting barrels / hilts and crystals) all I need is three purple schematics (mod, armoring, and enhancement) to upgrade every piece of gear that is orange. I do not have to go through the RE process more than three times and I do not have to worry about hitting a purple with useless secondary stats when I do hit a purple result. As a final observation here, the balance between purple gear and purple modded gear is a bit whacko. I have seen modded gear that is better than purples four levels higher and I have seen purple gear that is better than modded gear four levels higher. There does not seem to have been a lot of thought or effort put into the balance and relationship of crafteed to modded gear. So the cost balance is not the only thing off in the system. Edited August 17, 2012 by asbalana Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClyntKeelan Posted August 18, 2012 Share Posted August 18, 2012 •Was the last item you RE'd the same as the current one? If yes, proceed. •Did you fail on your last attempt? If yes, increase the fail counter by one. Proceed. •Modify the RE success chance by some function based on the fail counter. Linear, geometric, exponential, whatever curve desired. Thank you OP - really excellent suggestion! I really hope that something like this is implemented! And let me just add that even if the incremental increase to one's chances of a successful RE were quite TINY it would still be an ENORMOUS improvement over the surrent system of geting nothing but materials back. The developers have said that they want to encourage REing. They have demonstrated their commitment by getting rid of the horrible old system where you would so frequently get the hated message 'You already know that schematic'. Let them continue to improve the system by modifying the random number generator for REing to reward persistence and not mock it! And while they are about it I think a system whereby you can automatically pre-discard such useless stuff as purple Presence-enhancing versions of things would be very welcome as well! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackardin Posted August 19, 2012 Share Posted August 19, 2012 (edited) - •Was the last item you RE'd the same as the current one? If yes, proceed. •Did you fail on your last attempt? If yes, increase the fail counter by one. Proceed. •Modify the RE success chance by some function based on the fail counter. Linear, geometric, exponential, whatever curve desired. Well stated. I had suggested this two weeks after the game went live. "Crickets". The system is not bad. In fact the basic system is very good. However, without a learning curve it falls short, for all the reasons stated in this thread. Edited August 19, 2012 by Blackardin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongGui Posted August 20, 2012 Share Posted August 20, 2012 (edited) deleted Edited August 20, 2012 by LongGui Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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