Announcing a Free-to-Play Option

[PlayLoud]

Basically they are going F2P cuz they think their losing money so they want more people to play they havnt seem to figure out that they can GET MUCH MORE SUBSCRIBERS if they just FIXED THE GAME and LISTENED TO THEIR consumers but its more for the instant cash grab of were losing money make it f2p and focus only on making cash its sad that video game companies care so *********** little for the players and only about how much cash they can rake in. IF IT IS A GOOD GAME THE PEOPLE WILL PAY TO PLAY BUT IF YOU MAKE IT **** PEOPLE WILL BE HESITANT ON PAYING and then you get the f2p model to grab more payers cuz they dont want to work on the game

 

Yeah, that really had nothing to do with my post.

 

I don't think their game is really "broken". I can't really comment on PvP, since I don't play it much, but PvE seems to be working very well. They have been releasing new content and features, and yes, the argument can be made they should have had those features at launch. However, the state the game is in now is good IMHO.

[Neocorteqz]

My only experience with subscription to F2P conversion was with Cryptic and Star Trek: Online, which was a severely negative experience that led to my abandoning the game and I still have hard feelings against them and will never play anything else made by them.

 

#1 Don't screw over people who have played a year (by that time) by doing what Cryptic did - convert to a new currency and only give you 2/3rd the value of the currency vs what doing the exact same thing gets you after F2P conversion, and don't hike prices by 30% to 200%.

 

#2 Don't make another Cryptic mistake of introducing lockboxes or other elements of gambling.

 

#3 Don't make another Cryptic mistake of sliding into pay to win, starting with cosmetic items and ending with buying new powers you can't compete against as a free player.

 

#4 Don't make another Cryptic mistake of distracting developers with the constant focus on lame gimmicks to bring in cash. I'm ok with offering legacy benefits for cash alternative to game currency ($1 per 100k credits would be fair to me) so long as it doesn't result in enormous price hikes.

 

#5 Don't make another Cryptic mistake of selling individual items that cost as much as or even four times as much as a month's subscription previously did.

 

That said, I would have been all for nixing the box cost and introducing cash options for legacy stuff to make up the difference, but given how severely I was burned by Cryptic's F2P move I am leery of what is coming. Regarding their Cartel coins, I hope they have something worth spending on given how completely lackluster the game enhancements for buying the Digital and Collectors editions were - the speeder was really the only benefit. When Legacy came out I was really hoping that Dexlue and Collectors edition owners would get discounted rates for paying extra real money, but that didn't happen.

 

Depending on what "some restrictions" there will be on F2P, I can easily see myself still subscribing to the game and even purchasing a lifetime subscription if offered.

 

What they are doing in August with a box cost of $15 w/1mo free time is what I think ALL MMO's should do, there shouldn't be a large box cost that provides barrier of entry. Paying for additional content levels I can certainly see, For example you get Act 1 for free, Act 2 for $10, Act 3 for $10, etc. with acts 2 & 3 being enhanced to have the same density of story progression/interaction that Act 1 has.

 

P.S. Something I would ABSOLUTELY pay for is decorating my ship interior. This is something I REALLY loved about the game "Star Wars: X-Wing Alliance". Another great thing would be the guild capital ships that were discussed pre-launch and make them customizable. Star Trek Online just introduced Fleet Starbases which are esssentially the same thing and since then I've been logging in daily to help my old guild construct their Starbase, which is the only part of the game I participate in, because that was such a major goal of our guild prior to F2P when I was still playing.

 

 

Totally agree with you here. I too Have stopped playing because of what PW did to that game. I can not afford to buy the latest and great ships, nor can I afford the Keys to unlock all the Lock boxes they drop in hopes of getting what they broadcast purposely to make more money (by server wide broadcasting of who gets X ship right on the screen). I find it ridiculous and down right crappy to do this to someone who can not afford something like that.

I do log in occasionally to help my Fleet level up their starbases by helping contribute to the needs, but even then you can't get off totally free either, need more doffs, well we sell the packs. Need more <insert items>, we sell that too. My main point is I refuse to support any game that is Pay to win or advance. so i do what i can with the limited resources I have, and when they are gone, so am I again.

 

I will gladly accept and continue to support SWTOR as long as they do not fall the way of some of the other F2P games I have played in the past. If they do anything resembling PW and Star Trek Online's model, then I'm no longer going to play. But I will wait and see what happens and what is going to be done with the cartel coins, as to what you can buy and how inflated these prices are.

 

For those of you who complain about cartel coins and having to buy more to get what you want.... This is to be expected, If they were to give you enough coins a month to buy the more popular items, then what why would you want to buy more if you can get what you want for nothing? They can't make money that way, they need to to supplement what you already have in order to make any kind of profit. it boils down to this i a business in the Business of making money to support the further endeavors. If you think they are gonna give everything to you for free, then why are you even paying? They should give you the sub for free too... Ohh wait they have that option now.

 

Bottom line is, F2P can either hurt or help, but we all need to give it time to see where it goes before we all make our decisions, Or you can cancel now and go play another F2P with real money auction house. which is essentially the same damn thing your playing now. The Model may be different but the end results are all the same when you break it down. so quit complaining and wait and see. If you don't like it and complain, THEN you have right to, until then it's all speculation and you can't complain about something that hasn't even come to light yet.

 

I've said my peace.

 

See you all in game.

[Magicmind]

Gotta say Im not thrilled by this announcement. I think F2P will kill SWTOR in multiple ways, including pissing off the subscribers by now allowing the pain in the asses of the world hop on the game, screw with everyone, then leave.

 

Also, what exactly am I paying for? I've been a constant sub since launch, I want to know what exactly is in it for subs, not a vague

 

 

I want to know that flashpoints, operations, warzones, and GTN are subs only. They should not be left open to the public.

 

And I suggest F2P and SUbs be on seperate servers so we dont have to put up with those pains in the asses. THATS how you solve that.

[Ffoeg]

I don't know if this has been discussed or even possible. Can they seperate the servers. One for F2P and one for paid subscribers?

[Ffoeg]

And I suggest F2P and SUbs be on seperate servers so we dont have to put up with those pains in the asses. THATS how you solve that.

 

You beat me to it Magicmind.

[Diusys]

F2P is the way.

 

BUT ! only as all games are going that way. Don't do it for more players, if you want more people to play the game,

FIX IT !!! I've been trying to logon for 6 hours today.

 

As for more options, does this mean I'll finally be able to choose what LS i use ?

Or do you still believe that is your decision ? (Being an adult, I do believe I can make that decision for myself).

 

Why do only CE owners get more credits ? I've got the Deluxe pack, where are my credits ?

Are you punishing me, for not giving you more money ?

 

Will you still be charging people to own the game, or will it be completely free to play ?

If so do we get our money back ? After all if we knew this before most of us would have waited.

 

Not that any of this means much in the grand scheme of things, as I will never buy a product with EA on the cover again (I'm tired of beta testing EA games I've bought believing they are working products).

[thestarjammer]

My only problem is BioWare once again showing it's "Empire Bias" by making all the rewards "Sith" rewards... Where is the Jedi Master's chair? Where are robes that make us look like Jedi and not homeless Egyptian hobo's?? :/

 

YES I sooo agree. Lets get some better features for JEDI. How about a JEDI speeder built like a surf board?

[Twin]

lol, so SWTOR didn't even make 1 year without going F2P, even though completely massive numbers at launch =D

 

Shows how much of an MMO this really is imo....oh how i wish they hadn't shut SWG down in favor of this...

[Diusys]

lol, so SWTOR didn't even make 1 year without going F2P, even though completely massive numbers at launch =D

 

Shows how much of an MMO this really is imo....oh how i wish they hadn't shut SWG down in favor of this...

 

Come back SWG all is forgiven

[SonicViper]

It is kind of funny and sad that about 2 weeks ago my brother and I were talking about not wanting to return to WOW and just staying with SW:TOR. The only thing he and I were unsure of is what was going to happen to this MMO and if it would be around much longer. Well, now that this tragic announcement hit the website I guess we got our answer. It really is a damn shame too cause we were excited about making the full on switch to SW:TOR and dropping WOW but now with this garbage of nickle and dime the players this game is officially dead to us. There is no way that I am going to continue to pay for a second rate game that is free to play and all the attention will be given to trying to nickel and dime people. It is pretty damn obvious what will happen to the future of this MMO and I for one am no longer interested. So, BIOWARE/EA enjoy the large wave of freeloaders that will NOT be buying jack sh*t from your lame store because if they weren't willing to pay a lousy stinking $15 a month think again if they will pay for the garbage your planing for your store. That leaves only one possible direction left for your in game store..."pay to win" in order to make them pay for something. It was clear from the beginning that joining EA was a darn Greek Tragedy and now it looks like that failure is finally complete. Another sad and shameful thing that comes to mind is that Star Wars Galaxies was around much longer that this MMO and better in many respects...I am truly shocked that you couldn't even make it to their level of fail. Goodbye and good riddance.

[Sauska]

I never thought I'd play The Secret World, but I guess I was wrong

 

SWTOR was fun while it lasted. RIP

[Xiuhdragon]

Yust want to say BIG FAIL :(

[Crankyrickroll]

Lucas! I want SWG back!

[SupremeLegate]

I am astonished but not surprised by the amount of negativity this announcement has generated, and to be honest I don't really understand it. Here is how I see things:

 

The 'big difference' between a subscription based game and a F2P based game is where the revenue comes from for generating content, specifically; planets quests, story quests, flashpoints, warzones, and operations. In my mind so long as they keep generating that content I couldn't care-less where the money for it comes from.

 

If anything going F2P makes SWTOR more accessible to myself, and I am sure others, as I can continue to enjoy the game without having to worry about being able to pay for it.

 

Now admittedly a major deciding factor in if this is a good thing for the game will be what exactly they sell in this Cartel Market of theirs, as well as how much they sell the stuff for. And from what I can find, the only stuff we know that will be in the Cartel Market at this point is "customizable gear and convenience features." Though I will bet that things like Bank and Inventory space will be in there as well.

 

So I think this will be great for SWTOR, but I will wait for more details on this Cartel Market, specifically what it will have in it and how much it will cost.

[Kwil]

It is kind of funny and sad that about 2 weeks ago my brother and I were talking about not wanting to return to WOW and just staying with SW:TOR. The only thing he and I were unsure of is what was going to happen to this MMO and if it would be around much longer. Well, now that this tragic announcement hit the website I guess we got our answer. It really is a damn shame too cause we were excited about making the full on switch to SW:TOR and dropping WOW but now with this garbage of nickle and dime the players this game is officially dead to us. There is no way that I am going to continue to pay for a second rate game that is free to play and all the attention will be given to trying to nickel and dime people. It is pretty damn obvious what will happen to the future of this MMO and I for one am no longer interested. So, BIOWARE/EA enjoy the large wave of freeloaders that will NOT be buying jack sh*t from your lame store because if they weren't willing to pay a lousy stinking $15 a month think again if they will pay for the garbage your planing for your store. That leaves only one possible direction left for your in game store..."pay to win" in order to make them pay for something. It was clear from the beginning that joining EA was a darn Greek Tragedy and now it looks like that failure is finally complete. Another sad and shameful thing that comes to mind is that Star Wars Galaxies was around much longer that this MMO and better in many respects...I am truly shocked that you couldn't even make it to their level of fail. Goodbye and good riddance.

 

 

You hit it on the nose.

Every kid whose parents wouldn't pay for a WoW or SWTOR sub. will now be joining this game. They will leave the other F2P in droves to try the new F2P MMO.

I had found a somewhat less immature player base in this game, but now that is surely gone.

If something has no cost or sacrifice to be a part of, then you will end up with the lowest class level of person sure to join up.

Probably heading back to WoW, for all it's faults the subscription does keep some of the trash out.

[Trallnar]

unsubbed yesterday when i heard at work.

 

you give too much to a f2p player to validate my 15 a month, but you dont give enough to f2p for me to keep playing there. i play mainly for operations and i would continue a subscription for them if the cost was reduced to say 5 a month, but 15 is too much since i already have 3 classes stories to 50 and close on the last empire one. already geared in all rakata or better on all 3 50s in both specs.

[Uberhallow]

Woa... swtor f2p.

 

Actually i dont like f2p mmorpg's. I hate them because what i helped get developed with my money, our money goes free to others. Sure i can choose to become a free player, enjoy what ever i am permitted to enjoy but then the new content development will start decaying as there might not be a fair amount of subers to make it possible, and if there are many subers that will make the development of new content availiable then it is just wrong that only a part of the player base will be paying for the other part (the free ones) to enjoy too. Same content made possible with the suber's money for both paying and not paying players is just wrong imo, no kind of cartel credits will amend that. If they put on the store a pay to win option the f2p player base will leave, if they don't spice up the suber's deal, then they all will become f2p players.

 

Additionally the spamming from gold/credit sellers in a free game is a total turn off for me. And they open the doors for them. Usually the economy in f2p games turns awful because of credit sellers. You can ban credit sellers now as it is a p2p game, but when is free there is no way to do that.

 

Yes sure, i could like a f2p game if it is f2p from the start, not after almost a year.

 

i am in favor of constructing criticism. I am against a f2p model but i am not the hand behind bioware's wheel. In order to make that decision bioware had to see their product straight in the eye and i believe that they pain more than we do. So, if i could make the decision for them what could i do?

 

Maybe an AH in the likes of Diablo 3 whould make BIOWARE the extra money they need, or an expansion made availiable to suber's only for a period like 3 or 4 months before making it accessible to f2p players (like AO did) would be preferable. Add housing to subers with drop-able boss trophies to display to others and you have a leverage again.

Of course all that demand people to develop them for us. Maybe is a better option to do so and not follow the easy way out that f2p is.

[testszag]

I am astonished but not surprised by the amount of negativity this announcement has generated, and to be honest I don't really understand it. Here is how I see things:

 

The 'big difference' between a subscription based game and a F2P based game is where the revenue comes from for generating content, specifically; planets quests, story quests, flashpoints, warzones, and operations. In my mind so long as they keep generating that content I couldn't care-less where the money for it comes from.

 

If anything going F2P makes SWTOR more accessible to myself, and I am sure others, as I can continue to enjoy the game without having to worry about being able to pay for it.

 

Now admittedly a major deciding factor in if this is a good thing for the game will be what exactly they sell in this Cartel Market of theirs, as well as how much they sell the stuff for. And from what I can find, the only stuff we know that will be in the Cartel Market at this point is "customizable gear and convenience features." Though I will bet that things like Bank and Inventory space will be in there as well.

 

So I think this will be great for SWTOR, but I will wait for more details on this Cartel Market, specifically what it will have in it and how much it will cost.

 

not sure how many games you have played that have made the switch, but i have played four of them. each time people would say the same things. "It just means more people and more revenue" and all that jazz. it has yet to work out that way. they become pay to win games. even with a sub, you wind up needing to pay for upgrades to stay comepetitive in any way. the only people that do benefit from this are the true casuals.

[Rancidmilkmonkey]

Wow. I have paid for a subscription since launch day. I have the Collector's Edition and this is how I''m rewarded. Myself and many others. After reading the first 20 pages, I have to wonder about something I have not seen addressed. How will this affect the legacy system? All of these boosts mentioned in in the chart sound like something that would have been awarded as legacy perks. Is the legacy system dead? I have not played as much as I would like. I haven't even made level 50 yet. But I paid my sub every month regardless of whether or not I played as I wanted this game to succeed and not go this route. I had to choose between Wow and this game and I chose SWTOR. I miss my toon on WoW, but I have no desire to go back and play with pokemon collectors and Kung Fu Pandas. bForgive my rambling. I have so many thoughts and conflicted emotions with this that I don't even know where to begin.

[uvalancelot]

Dear BioWare/EA:

 

There are two ways to go about business: put a ton of effort into making a superior product and then make it profitable, or make a generic product and then put a ton of effort into making it profitable. I thought you were the former kind of company, at least on the BioWare side. KOTOR, Mass Effect, Dragon Age (Origins...) were all terrific because you made a product better than anything else out there, and I assume each was profitable.

 

The elephant in the room is that at this point, SWTOR is not obviously better than anything else out there. It is a relatively recent arrival to the MMO scene and is not as expansive as WOW.

 

Given your history of making top content, I would have thought you would doubled down and invested in improving the quality of SWTOR and offering features WOW doesn't. (For example, smartphone app interactivity, an area that is ripe for an entrant.) However, all indications point to you choosing the opposite path: deciding that you will try and make SWTOR, as it stands now, as profitable as you can. The negative fan reaction is that we feel like you have decided to just bleed this product dry, wring all the money out of it that you can. Because we know what happens next: you leave it behind.

 

I doubt that you can do much about this decision now, but hopefully this comment will be grouped in with the others you are receiving that basically say we expect the top quality from BioWare, not just products that serve as tools to wring cash out of players. If we wanted to play games like that, we would be zynga or kabam customers.

Edited August 1, 2012 by uvalancelot
misspelled word

[sDSSm]

I have to admit, I have many mixed feelings on the matter of Free-To-Play. And I know that you're having a lot of questions being thrown at you all at once, but I hope a few of mine are seen as valid enough to answer, at least in part via customer service e-mail.

 

You've offered F2P to level 50. Is this a specific limitation meant to hint at the nearby arrival of the level cap increase rumored go into effect before the end of the year? If so, does this mean subscribers are the only ones able to reach the new cap?

 

You mentioned using a new virtual currency to purchase new items. I for one would need a much more specific list than what's been revealed so far. I'm not going to pay the subscription fee so I can buy new mini pets. If it's not worth using in game, then we don't want to pay real money for it.

 

My next concern is the use of the Group Finder. You've made note that F2P will not have access to ops. The wait for players to join Group Finder ops was long as it is. The same concern arrives for the limited number of WZ and FP opportunities. We'll inevitably see a quick increase in wait times as each week progresses. Have you been looking at any changes to account for the significantly smaller pool of subscribing players?

 

You told us before the game had come out that if a game is good enough, people will pay for it. By offering F2P, you've told us your own company isn't convinced its good enough. Yes, it will increase your player base, but at what cost to your loyal players?

 

My continuing subscription isn't guaranteed here, and if there isn't significantly more information available by my recurring payment is available, I won't be coming back. I love Star Wars, and my friends and I are really having a fun time playing the game as it is right now. Please don't give us a reason to leave.

[DarthPrimus]

Defiance comes out in April 2013. I'll give this game that long to prove to me that this isn't going to end badly, and if not convinced by then, I guess I'm out.

 

This can be a very good move if handled correctly, but first BioWare/EA will need to balance things out for those who have remained loyal even through the depression this game has suffered. Founders, Digital Deluxe buyers, people who have given you more than we've actually had to, should also get something, like the Collector's Edition people do. Otherwise all you're saying to us is that we didn't spend enough to please you, so we're not worth your consideration. Not everyone was able to get their hands on a CE, and we already can't access the vendors by any means. Fair enough. Those who were lucky enough to get the CE deserve to be rewarded for it. But you punish those of us who weren't further by only offering extra rewards for this to them rather than also adding in a little something for your Founders and Digital Upgrade subscribers? Not a good move, and frankly downright insulting, but you still have time to remedy that.

 

That said, limiting the access to the F2P crowd is a good idea. Especially not allowing them on Ops. It gives those of us who plan to keep subscribing something to call our own, and it keeps Ops from being dragged down by the incompetence that tends to run rampant with the F2P crowd (especially seeing as there's already plenty of that floating around in the P2P crowd).

 

I don't even have a problem with the cash shop. You can even add pay to win items to it, but remember the ones who are loyal and steadily keeping you in business with their subscriptions first. If you put P2W items in the cash shop, make sure it's something your subscribers can get access to without having to pay extra, since we're already paying you anyway. Otherwise you'll lose a lot of your subscription players, and they will still be your biggest profit base, no matter what you add to the cash shop. Subs are the only steady income the game will have, and are what will keep you afloat.

 

Someone mentioned in one post that the F2P crowd shouldn't be second class citizens. At the risk of sounding elitist, I disagree. That's exactly what they should be. To be a true citizen of a community you have to pay your dues or be born into it, and even then you still pay your dues to keep that right. That's what your subscribers are. They are the first class citizens who have been here from the start and paid their dues, and continue to do so. And if the F2P crowd wants to become first class citizens, then they need to pay their dues as well and buy the subscription. It's only fair, really. If you don't want to contribute, then why should you get special treatment? But those who do contribute should be given privileges for their contributions. It's the way any decent society works. To get something, you have to give something.

 

I'm here, and I remain loyal and go into the next few months maintaining my optimism with the hope that you will listen to us now and make an attempt to do right by those of us who have stood by you despite the game's steady decline because we've believed in you. Don't let us down, because once you chase away your true loyal fan base this game won't last. No game lasts once it alienates those who helped get it off the ground and kept it there, even if just barely. I've been here since Beta, and I intend to stay as long as there's something worth staying for.

 

I guess I'll see if my faith has been misplaced in eight months...

[DTuloJr]

Great. Now every WOW Fanboy, GW2 Fanboy, and SWTOR Hater has won. -_-

 

I wouldn't consider myself a hater of SWTOR by any means. Personally, I *do* like the game, and have recommended it to many friends. Especially since they opened 1-15 as F2P as a demo mode. However, yes, this was absolutely predicted by a very vocal majority of active forum-posting beta testers that had been testing the game and watching its development for over 1 year that we had access to the game in development.

 

We railed against it launching in such a buggy and unready state, and railed against the direction the game took that was counter to what we were promised, repeatedly. We predicted that there would be absolutely no choice on F2P... though I don't for a moment think any of us seriously thought it would be going F2P in under a year. I thought it'd last 1.5 or 2 years.

 

Now, the game has dramatically improved since launch. It's still no where near the original press release vision, but its still very impressive. I hope the F2P model is wildly successful. Because no one else will touch a Star Wars MMO for a very long time. BioWare *AUSTIN* and EA have made too many mistakes.

[Optimus_Ares]

I want my ~60 bucks back for the game that is now going to be free. I don't want virtual coins.

[Diusys]

Dear BioWare/EA:

 

There are two ways to go about business: put a ton of effort into making a superior product and then make it profitable, or make a generic product and then put a ton of effort into making it profitable. I thought you were the former kind of company, at least on the BioWare side. KOTOR, Mass Effect, Dragon Age (Origins...) were all terrific because you made a product better than anything else out there, and I assume each was profitable.

 

The elephant in the room is that at this point, SWTOR is not obviously better than anything else out there. It is a relatively recent arrival to the MMO scene and is not as expansive as WOW.

 

Given your history of making top content, I would have thought you would doubled down and invested in improving the quality of SWTOR and offering features WOW doesn't. (For example, smartphone app interactivity, an area that is ripe for an entrant.) However, all indications point to you choosing the opposite path: deciding that you will try and make SWTOR, as it stands now, as profitable as you can. The negative fan reaction is that we feel like you have decided to just bleed this product dry, wring all the money out of it that you can. Because we know what happens next: you leave it behind.

 

I doubt that you can do much about this decision now, but hopefully this comment will be grouped in with the others you are receiving that basically say we expect the top quality from BioWare, not just products that serve as tools to wring cash out of players. If we wanted to play games like that, we would be zynga or kabam customers.

 

Well said... But that's what happens when EA get involved, the company goes downhill.

Just watch DiCE, they are going the same way with Battlefield