And some people try to claim Powertechs are fine

[kjkdollarbanny]

I just entered a warzone near the end with my Gunslinger. I found my team losing so I decided to go try to solo a point as it was really all there was left to do. As I approached the point I saw they had 2 powertechs guarding it, so I knew it was not a likely opportunity for success but hey, what else is there to do but give it a go?

 

As soon as I got anywhere near it, one of the powertechs got his thermal detonator on me and the other was running over, so I popped every single defensive cooldown I had - which are off the GCD, btw - and proceded to fire a single instant cast shot before literally dying.

 

That's right, 2 powertechs were able to nuke my 16k HP - not all the way there, by any means, but not terrible by any stretch of the imagination, either - in a basically a single GCD.

 

So yes, pay no attention to powertechs. They're completely fine and in no need whatsoever of a nerf.

 

you playing ranged dps with 16k(its full bm?) and whinin that 2 melee dps killed you in few seconds?

cmon you are pathetic

i have full WH Gs and PTs is not a problem for me.

But in this game if you standing against 2 good melee dps for 10 secs - you are hero.

 

try reverse situation. set 2 GS on 16k PT. He will die in GCD. so all is ok.

[Rogoo]

Powertech are amazing because:

 

- they wear heavy armor

- they can hit up to 30m

 

They do very good damage because:

 

- they can kite like crazy

- that gives them the best ToT (Time On Target), which translates to great DPS overall

 

Overall they can beat pretty much every other class in the game because they kite melee and melee ranged classes.

 

Also, every single class dies to 2 vs 1. Very often without doing a lot of damage to one of those 2.

Edited July 20, 2012 by Rogoo

[Twor]

I've never said otherwise. Yes, the total encounter was quite possibly 7 seconds long. However, there were only 1, 2, or at most 3 GCDs over which time they were actually inflicting damage on me. All those seconds when I was walking from one place to the next and not being shot or damaged in any way? I don't care about that, of course, and it's entirely irrelevant to the discussion. What matters is what happened as soon as they started actually shooting.

 

So instead of 1GCD they killed you in 3. With two people. And you find that amazing?

 

Btw as several people have already said, you contradicted yourself countless times in this thread (regard the post quoted and the opener alone, in the OP you saw 2 pyros, later the 2nd one became visible only later).

 

To sum it up since you said you expefcted to die- well you did.

And not in the 1 GCD you claimed but like you admitted in probably 3. So what is the point of this thread?

 

Sorry but your way of presenting the subjact has made you very unbelievable. Adding informations on the fly and contradicting yourself.

Now lets see, if you'd titled the thread "2 pyros killed me in 7 seconds"- what you admitted in the quoted post. Yes thats not much of a catcher.

Yellow press mentality.

[Missandei]

 

Sorry but your way of presenting the subjact has made you very unbelievable. Adding informations on the fly and contradicting yourself.

Now lets see, if you'd titled the thread "2 pyros killed me in 7 seconds"- what you admitted in the quoted post. Yes thats not much of a catcher.

Yellow press mentality.

 

Lol.. how you are living without a bit of imagination?

What is changed if it was not 1 GCD but 2? lol..

Dont be so pedantic.. PT are overpowered. all knows that.

The subject to discuss is how much overpowered they are - «immensely» or a simply «very»

Edited July 20, 2012 by Missandei

[Twor]

Lol.. how you are living without a bit of imagination?

What is changed if it was not 1 GCD but 2? lol..

Dont be so pedantic.. PT are overpowered. all knows that.

The subject to discuss is how much overpowered they are - «immensely» or a simply «very»

 

Yes it is hard to see what is changed if he lives double or trice as long as he originally stated. And adds bits of information about the fight as he seems to "remember" them.

 

To discuss something you need a base. There is no base provided by the OP but gross exxageration and missleading informations.

 

Oh and in your language:

lol...

Yes everyone knows it... that pyros have great offense and no defense to speak of. lol...

Thanks for providing another prime example of the people who think pyros are OP and base it around... many lols and not a single fact or argument. Tiresome.

Edited July 20, 2012 by Twor

[Ewgal]

Powertech are amazing because:

 

- they wear heavy armor

- they can hit up to 30m

 

They do very good damage because:

 

- they can kite like crazy

- that gives them the best ToT (Time On Target), which translates to great DPS overall

 

Overall they can beat pretty much every other class in the game because they kite melee and melee ranged classes.

 

Also, every single class dies to 2 vs 1. Very often without doing a lot of damage to one of those 2.

 

Bioware really need to tone down Powertech dps, they are really OP class right now.

[Theagg]

Powertech are amazing because:

 

- they wear heavy armor

- they can hit up to 30m

 

They do very good damage because:

 

- they can kite like crazy

- that gives them the best ToT (Time On Target), which translates to great DPS overall

 

Overall they can beat pretty much every other class in the game because they kite melee and melee ranged classes.

 

Also, every single class dies to 2 vs 1. Very often without doing a lot of damage to one of those 2.

 

And they can instant spam a hefty chunk of elemental damage ( Flameburst, which ignores everything, armor, shield and defense). That alone makes for a rather nice advantage.

[Gnugthreeonefive]

Were they both even pyros as if one used thermol detonator he wasn't pyro.

Huh wha? TD is standard for a PT Pyro 4/6/31 build.

[vojinsa]

pyrotechs are fine. L2 not run into a 1v2 wearing medium armor expecting to last a gcd.

[Twor]

And they can instant spam a hefty chunk of elemental damage ( Flameburst, which ignores everything, armor, shield and defense). That alone makes for a rather nice advantage.

 

- Doesn't crit over 2k, usually not over 1,5k on equally equipped targets

- Requires 10m range

- Only spammable attack beside default attack that does not cost 1/4 of the ressource pool (it costs 1/6)

- Pyrotech has elemental attacks? Next we complain that force users have force attacks?

 

Beside listing heavy armor as an advantage this thread has a high entertainment value. KBISP tried it with logic, that failed as always when faced with uninformed ranters.

Edited July 20, 2012 by Twor

[LightForse]

Look they have a post on their class forums about how much dps they do .http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=507103 ..they are tanks. PT's and Vanguards should not be able to do as much or more dps then " PURE" dps AC's period. Edited July 20, 2012 by LightForse

[Alkiii]

Look they have a post on their class forums about how much dps they do .http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=507103 ..they are tanks. PT's and Vanguards should not be able to do as much or more dps then " PURE" dps AC's period.

 

Here's where I stand on the issue.

 

If a class can spec into a pure DPS role, I am fine with that. I have no issues with Pyrotechs putting up good numbers.

 

What I do have a problem with is the fact that they have higher mitigation than that of a light armor wearing class.

I have always been under the assumption that if you wear light armor, you sacrifice some defense for more offense.

 

In this game, it is the opposite. The less defense you have, the less powerful you are. The more defense you have, the more powerful you are.

 

Sages and Sorcerers are struggling right now. All the heavy armor classes are hitting like trucks. It's very disheartening.

 

 

What exactly do DPS Sages and Sorcerers get to offset their light armor and low defenses? It surely isn't damage and their crowd control is easily countered by these classes.

[iphobia]

Here's where I stand on the issue.

 

If a class can spec into a pure DPS role, I am fine with that. I have no issues with Pyrotechs putting up good numbers.

 

What I do have a problem with is the fact that they have higher mitigation than that of a light armor wearing class.

I have always been under the assumption that if you wear light armor, you sacrifice some defense for more offense.

 

In this game, it is the opposite. The less defense you have, the less powerful you are. The more defense you have, the more powerful you are.

 

Sages and Sorcerers are struggling right now. All the heavy armor classes are hitting like trucks. It's very disheartening.

 

 

What exactly do DPS Sages and Sorcerers get to offset their light armor and low defenses? It surely isn't damage and their crowd control is easily countered by these classes.

 

I guess some troll will respond with "bubble" or "234512 cc's".

Edited July 20, 2012 by iphobia

[LightForse]

Here's where I stand on the issue.

 

If a class can spec into a pure DPS role, I am fine with that. I have no issues with Pyrotechs putting up good numbers.

 

What I do have a problem with is the fact that they have higher mitigation than that of a light armor wearing class.

I have always been under the assumption that if you wear light armor, you sacrifice some defense for more offense.

 

In this game, it is the opposite. The less defense you have, the less powerful you are. The more defense you have, the more powerful you are

 

 

What exactly do DPS Sages and Sorcerers get to offset their light armor and low defenses? It surely isn't damage and their crowd control is easily countered by these classes.

 

 

I agree 100%..for a tank class with all the mitigation etc..they shouldn't be able to have it all. Maybe when tanks spec into a dps spec..the should lose some survivability .

Edited July 20, 2012 by LightForse

[DCVAN]

The gunslinger wasn't going to win the 2 v 1, and he didn't expect to. But burst dmg of that magnitude is unhealable. If it were 2 v 2 and the gunslinger had a healer with him, it still wouldn't have mattered. He would have died before the healer could even react and cast a big heal. The time to kill in this game is way too low.

 

Yes powertechs are op. They always have been, and theres no denying it. Its pretty obvious when a large chunk of the pvp population abandons their mains and start to reroll powertechs and marauders. Flame me all you want to and I understand your just trying to defend your class. No one likes nerfs.

[KBSIP]

for the love of god... having a tank specialization doesn't make you a tank AC, because otherwise you'd best nerf juggernaut DPS further, commando DPS, operative DPS, sorcerer DPS (MORE) and assassin DPS. they all have healing and tanking options, and by your logic should thus take those.

 

the difference in mitigation from heavy to light armor is a paltry 10% extra mitigated off energy and kinetic attacks. 5% difference from medium armor.

 

let's look at our light armor users;

 

assassins - stealth based class, decent burster, has a good mix of defensive cooldowns and escape mechanisms

 

sorcerers - ranged class, fantastic kiting capability.

 

 

also; if heavy armor is such a big deal, why don't I see QQ about commando/merc survival, or juggernaut/guardian DPS survival? its because its not a big deal. hell, commandos and mercs even have the EXACT SAME DEFENSIVE COOLDOWN as powertechs, and yet they melt damn fast outside of healing spec. difference between them and powertechs in terms of raw survival numbers? essentially zero.

[KBSIP]

The gunslinger wasn't going to win the 2 v 1, and he didn't expect to. But burst dmg of that magnitude is unhealable. If it were 2 v 2 and the gunslinger had a healer with him, it still wouldn't have mattered. He would have died before the healer could even react and cast a big heal. The time to kill in this game is way too low.

 

Yes powertechs are op. They always have been, and theres no denying it. Its pretty obvious when a large chunk of the pvp population abandons their mains and start to reroll powertechs and marauders. Flame me all you want to and I understand your just trying to defend your class. No one likes nerfs.

 

everyone started out with OP sorcerers, and operatives. QQ about asssassins was in there too.

 

so; the OP classes -

 

sorcerers (nerfed)

mercenaries (nerfed)

operatives (nerfed)

powertechs

marauders

snipers (QQ is starting and will pick up more)

assassins (nerfed)

juggernauts (in smash spec)

 

 

seems to me if nerfs were left out the game would be damn near perfectly balanced. there hasn't been any major changes to make classes more powerful except snipers, powertechs saw a big NERF in 1.2 to burst potential, and marauders saw a mild buff to carnage to make the spec actually competetive with the DoT spec.

[bumpy_anderson]

I'm not denying that this guy got burned down rather quickly; however, that 1.5 seconds is a little unbelievable. The real burst of PT/VG comes from TD/AP being coupled and timed with RS/HIB. Its all about how you time the abilities. Other classes has similar damage but they can't timie them so that they go off at the same time. The powertechs has the same range on those two abilities that the sniper has on his abilities. He claims that he was in range to get a shot off. If I were the powertechs, I would be spamming my TD as he ran in. Once my TD left my toon, I would follow up with a RS. Its highly unlikely that the OP had time to get into cover and get all his cool downs off before the RS got off. If both PTs did this, of course the guy was dead. Consider this and the fact that the PTs may have outgeared him by a whole gear set, of course this was going to happen.

 

I am an assault VG. I went assault after stockstrike took the hit. I had to regear my toon in order to do this. I also consider myself a fairly decent player. With that being said, a good sniper with equal gear has a really good chance of taking me down 1v1. I can give you names of snipers on my server that can make this happen. I don't care what people say. VGs and PTs can be kited. Most people just don't have the skill to make it happen. If one pulls yu in, he burns his only gap closer. If you get pulled in, stun his ***. When he uses his CC breaker, he will probably stun you. After this, all you do is use your cc breaker and stun him again. If you stay 10m from him, you have him kited. This is assuming you have dots or can attack at range of courseEveryone talks about players stacking groups with PTs/VGs. On my server, we see ranked groups stacking "bombing" classes. However, you never hear of players complaining about them. Not only do these guys take out one player, but they also seriously **** up other toons around said player. Basically, there are several classes out there that does serous damage.

[LightForse]

for the love of god... having a tank specialization doesn't make you a tank AC, because otherwise you'd best nerf juggernaut DPS further, commando DPS, operative DPS, sorcerer DPS (MORE) and assassin DPS. they all have healing and tanking options, and by your logic should thus take those.

 

the difference in mitigation from heavy to light armor is a paltry 10% extra mitigated off energy and kinetic attacks. 5% difference from medium armor.

 

let's look at our light armor users;

 

assassins - stealth based class, decent burster, has a good mix of defensive cooldowns and escape mechanisms

 

sorcerers - ranged class, fantastic kiting capability.

 

 

also; if heavy armor is such a big deal, why don't I see QQ about commando/merc survival, or juggernaut/guardian DPS survival? its because its not a big deal. hell, commandos and mercs even have the EXACT SAME DEFENSIVE COOLDOWN as powertechs, and yet they melt damn fast outside of healing spec. difference between them and powertechs in terms of raw survival numbers? essentially zero.

 

for a tank to spec dps and use their tank stance and use guard and out dps everyone is wrong....make it so they cant use those abilties while in dps spec so they lose some survivability and lose guard. Im still looking for my tank stance on my merc...wheres my guard..not the same defensive cooldowns!!

Edited July 20, 2012 by LightForse

[KBSIP]

for a tank to spec dps and use their tank stance and use guard and out dps everyone is wrong....make it so they cant use those abilties while in dps spec so they lose some survivability and lose guard.

 

the post they referred to was people using AP/Tactics and Pyro DPS, so he was lying. those were not tank DPS numbers. they also can't guard without giving up their CGC proc, their PPA proc, and their heat venting. a good pyro will almost never bounce over to IGC and guard, unless they're medal farming. powertechs already have the most gimped cross stance access in the game compared to juggernauts/guardians, who can instantly stance dance and apply guard. powertechs must do a 1.5 second cast, which if interrupted leaves them with no stance and no access to guard OR PPA.

[Skolops]

Here's where I stand on the issue.

 

If a class can spec into a pure DPS role, I am fine with that. I have no issues with Pyrotechs putting up good numbers.

 

What I do have a problem with is the fact that they have higher mitigation than that of a light armor wearing class.

I have always been under the assumption that if you wear light armor, you sacrifice some defense for more offense.

 

In this game, it is the opposite. The less defense you have, the less powerful you are. The more defense you have, the more powerful you are.

 

Sages and Sorcerers are struggling right now. All the heavy armor classes are hitting like trucks. It's very disheartening.

 

 

What exactly do DPS Sages and Sorcerers get to offset their light armor and low defenses? It surely isn't damage and their crowd control is easily countered by these classes.

 

I appreciate your agreement that PTs are silly, but do you have any idea how absurdly good your bubble is? It's utter frustration for DPS classes trying to attack you. Put it on every single chance you get - it's crazy good stuff.

[Theagg]

- Doesn't crit over 2k, usually not over 1,5k on equally equipped targets

- Requires 10m range

- Only spammable attack beside default attack that does not cost 1/4 of the ressource pool (it costs 1/6)

- Pyrotech has elemental attacks? Next we complain that force users have force attacks?

 

Beside listing heavy armor as an advantage this thread has a high entertainment value. KBISP tried it with logic, that failed as always when faced with uninformed ranters.

 

MY Ion Pulse on my Vanguard regularily crits (31%) at over 2k (2.5k being a good estimate) and I'm still largely in BM gear. (with my damage capability still well below what it could be once my gear is full WH and custom modded to my liking, my current primary damage being over 150 less than my Scoundrel at the moment. Those crits will just keep getting better) With High Energy Cell loaded I can happily spam that attack forever and a day with just a few other attacks weaved in.

 

10m range is fine, in fact that's a boon as I can still kite melee classes and push out that attack (with added slow it just gets better)

 

The point was not that it was an elemental attack, the point was that it was an instant cast, spammable elemental attack. Easy money.

 

Heavy armour is an advantage over other armour types, against quite a few attacks .

[KBSIP]

MY Ion Pulse on my Vanguard regularily crits (31%) at over 2k (2.5k being a good estimate) and I'm still largely in BM gear. (with my damage capability still well below what it could be once my gear is full WH and custom modded to my liking, my current primary damage being over 150 less than my Scoundrel at the moment. Those crits will just keep getting better) With High Energy Cell loaded I can happily spam that attack forever and a day with just a few other attacks weaved in.

 

10m range is fine, in fact that's a boon as I can still kite melee classes and push out that attack (with added slow it just gets better)

 

The point was not that it was an elemental attack, the point was that it was an instant cast, spammable elemental attack. Easy money.

 

Heavy armour is an advantage over other armour types, against quite a few attacks .

 

if the discussion is about pyrotech powertechs, and thus assault vanguards, you shouldn't include your tactics vanguard, which has 10-15% extra fire damage, and 30% EXTRA surge for ion pulse, along with GUARANTEED heat venting every 6 seconds as supposed to the MUST RAILSHOT TO VENT mechanic of pyros and assault. fact is; ion pulse and flame burst spam DOES overheat pyros/assault because they don't have the passive venting of tactics/advanced prototype.

 

unless, of course, you're accessing a 27/27 spec, in which case I'd like to know how you're also simultaneously using CGC/plasma cell and HEGC

[Keypek]

Huh wha? TD is standard for a PT Pyro 4/6/31 build.

 

Yes I already touched on that comment once after the first three or four people commented on it.... read more then the first post of a thread before you make a comment maybe?

[Sildanar]

To the OP.

 

Be sure to check your combat log after events like this.

There are Damage hacks out there that MAY explain what happened, especially as you had popped all your defensive cd's.

 

I was in a novare coast a while ago and a guy got hit for 18k in one hit.. Twice in the same match.

Each time it showed up in the personal combat log, but not in the scoreboard log at the end of the game.

Just a heads up on that possible issue.

 

On topic I certainly think PT's/Vanguards are OP they out burst what you would think would be the burst classes ie Scoundrels and Shadows.

 

Just not sure that this is an example of that or something else.

Combat log ftw.

 

Finally, people who have trolled you mercilessly in this thread need to grow up and certainly be more respectful.